Pragmatic Reasons You Want Your Son to Play College Baseball

So I can brag to people I don't know on the Internet that my kid plays?

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

As I watch kids graduate from college it seems a lot of friend's houses are getting needed renovations.

Great topic question!

I hope my kid can continue to play ball beyond HS because God has granted him an ability to hit a baseball like very few are blessed to hit.  On top of that, his (not mine) passion and determination to practice, challenge himself against the best competition and be the best player he can be is unique. 

On the flip side of that coin, I question the concept of scholar/athlete in today's culture.  Especially with to hyper-inflated cost of college tuition today.  As a former Div1 college football player at an elite academic university in the Midwest (you can narrow that down quickly) on a FULL scholarship, I caution my son not to waste the opportunity to gain a valuable LIFELONG education like I did because sports/girls/beer were more important to me than what I would do with a Bachelors Degree in "whatever I could stay eligible for with a 30+ hour per week time commitment".  Amplify this by out of control tuition inflation and increasing time commitment baseball requires for a 25-50% scholarship and it presents a real dilemma to any honest father.

In all fairness, the respect granted from graduating from an elite academic university with the football experience has opened career doors for me that would never have been available without the athletic experience.  But the academic opportunity wasted was an opportunity cost that I will never regain... of course I never would have been accepted into the university without "athlete" stamped across each page of my application anyway :/

Few parents of HS student athletes with 4.0 GPAs probably hope their son gets drafted (lower rounds/minimal signing bonus) skip college to give their baseball dream a shot but that would be my preference (excluding the unlikely top round high $$).  Here is my reasoning:  I would prefer my son chase his baseball dream while young, and let the game tell him when it is over - AND THEN pursue a university education and career path.  Being more mature - and without the the baseball distraction that is the equivalent of a full time job - would seem to be a better scenario for long term career success than what I experienced.  Just passing along my wisdom/experience.

Enjoy the journey!

I preferred that he be a part of the fraternity of baseball players rather then part of the other college fraternities to reduce his exposure to unsavory environment and events.

younglefty posted:

 

Few parents of HS student athletes with 4.0 GPAs probably hope their son gets drafted (lower rounds/minimal signing bonus) skip college to give their baseball dream a shot but that would be my preference (excluding the unlikely top round high $$).  Here is my reasoning:  I would prefer my son chase his baseball dream while young, and let the game tell him when it is over - AND THEN pursue a university education and career path.  Being more mature - and without the the baseball distraction that is the equivalent of a full time job - would seem to be a better scenario for long term career success than what I experienced.  Just passing along my wisdom/experience.

When my son was drafted out of HS, this was one of the things we discussed and thought about a lot.  I was of the opinion this was the best choice for his baseball career as the proposed contract included the payment of a college education when he finished baseball and he has always been a very disciplined person.    But we also realized that over time life happens and most often gets in the way of going back to school (e.g. finding a girlfriend, getting married, having children, etc.) and it's much harder to adjust to college reestablishing study habits and not really being at the same level socially.  Most people need to find work out of baseball and if all you have is a HS diploma, it's extremely hard to get meaningful employment.  Though at a later date one is more mature and won't have the "baseball distraction", it's just as hard as when one is younger and playing ball due to being older and not as adept to the study habits and being somewhat of an outsider because of the age difference where there are often significant difference in priorities.

 . . . and BTW, if a player finished college or is drafted out in the Jr. year, they're STILL "young" . . . very young (even for basesball) IMHO.  

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

Son is well aware of #1 above. Son appreciates the high academic schools.  He also does not see himself there without the assistance of baseball or BASKETball.  Not that he is only playing those sports to get into the "side door" of admissions of a high academic, he just understands that by continuing to play these sports he loves it will help him gain admittance into a school where normally his grades and test scores (solely) would not.

I have only somewhat jokingly maintained that the purpose of sports is to keep boys busy, tired, out of trouble and in school until the prefrontal cortex develops enough for them to form their own motivation for being in school.

When my son visited colleges in high school, he didn't ask many questions about academics, and he was much more interested in seeing the weight room than the library.

When he was a freshman, nearly all unsolicited information he provided pertained to baseball. As he progressed through school, more and more of what he talked about pertained to his academic work. 

Our pact has always been that I would support the baseball dream as long as he was making what I consider to be solid progress toward a useful degree from a respectable school. Eventually, he formed his own academic motivation, but for a while school was something he had to do well in order to play baseball.

His oldest brother was completely different, driven to excel academically almost from the cradle. But there are lots of boys and young men for whom sports provides structure and purpose until they figure out the non-sports parts of their lives.

For me, it's simple.  Without baseball, I have little doubt that he would not pursue education beyond high school.  He's not an academically challenged kid by any means, he simply doesn't enjoy school (the structured learning side of it, he loves the social side).  He's been this way since elementary school.  His older brother loves school and is excelling in college.  Both of his parents have college degrees, so it isn't that it hasn't been a priority in the home, just simply his personality type and how he's wired.  We ride him to stay on top of his work, and for the most part, he does.  He tends to be a B student, but could get A's if he put forth the necessary effort.  Interestingly, his work ethic toward baseball is extreme.  He follows strict nutrition and strength conditioning on his own.  He's always the one to be at voluntary workouts.  He's the first to arrive and the last to leave for practices.  He hits on his own (t-work, swing-a-way, soft toss in cage, BP on field when he can get someone to throw) all the time, so it's not that he's a lazy kid, just not motivated to spend more than required in the classroom.

So my pragmatic reasons:

• Baseball will get him in college (he's verballed to D1 and meets acceptance requirements easily), not because he needs the "athlete discount" on grades, but because without the lure of playing baseball there, he would not have much interest to stay in a classroom learning environment.
• The discipline forced to stay eligible to play will ensure he works on academics (as a student athlete).
• Going through study hall, tutoring, etc., with teammates will help motivate him to do what's necessary to stay on track.
• The resources available to him as an athlete (tutoring, constant monitoring, etc.) will likely help ensure success.
• His stated goal is to make his life career baseball.  It will be to play as long as he's able (and make a living), then to coaching, scouting, or other opportunity in the field.  The connections and relationships he can build in college, as well as additional doors for coaching, or other avenues that will be open to him with a degree are significant.
• If I've read correctly, the average pro career is 2 years.  So, if one assumes he's on the average career track, he has a chance to play 5-6 more years after HS if he goes the college route vs 2 years if he goes pro out of HS.

My concerns:

• Draft may have him interested in foregoing school at a later round than it otherwise should.
• The overall burden of being a student athlete in college may make academics all the more intolerable to him, although his work ethic is truly not in question here.  If it's something he wants, he has no issue putting in the effort.  I'm hoping the difference between the HS and College learning experience as well s the structured academic environment for student athletes will better suit him than HS.
• An injury in college could thwart his dream of playing professionally.
• He could play his way down the draft board in college, although I've told him that if you can't cut it in the SEC, you aren't going to cut it in the pros, so better to learn there and leave with a degree that to try and "catch up" after washing out of the minors.

2017LHPscrewball posted:

If you have no pragmatic reasons why you want your son to play college baseball (I don't really care - it's his dream, not mine), then there is a related thread you can post to.  If you have pragmatic reasons why you want your son to play, please share.  While it should be "his dream", that does not prevent there from being some really good benefits (to either the parent, the kid or both) that could come from participating in college baseball.  While some good points were brought out, I wanted to go beyond the spiritual aspects and concentrate on more concrete benefits (although things like making friends for life is certainly considered a valid concrete benefit).

I will open this up to current and former college parents and allow them to also comment on what aspects of college baseball, in hindsight, they found to be detrimental (again, for either the parent, the kid or both).  Things like too much time devoted to baseball or perhaps baseball played too large a role in school selection.

Consider this thread to document the more concrete pros/cons while assuming "the dream" is always maintained by the kid in question.

As far as pragmatic reasons, I plan to note that my son played in college on my Curriculum Vitae.  The only question is, do I put it in the career accomplishments section, or in other accomplishments at the end of it?

Truman posted:

I preferred that he be a part of the fraternity of baseball players rather then part of the other college fraternities to reduce his exposure to unsavory environment and events.

Not all Fraternities fall into that bucket. My son attended a D3 college and was aprt of the team and also a fraternity. Something that D3 limits allow for. He probably grew ,more as a man and a contributing member of Society through his fraternity than baseball. It forced him into leadership roles that he would have never taken in the past outside of baseball. The charitable acts required by the fraternity also opened his eyes to others in need. Be careful not to judge the Greek system only by the parties they throw. Each chapter on each campus can be different. His chapter required a pretty high GPS to get accepted and stay eligible. House duties were requirted of all the brothers. 

do not paint with too broad of a brush. 

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

Son is well aware of #1 above. Son appreciates the high academic schools.  He also does not see himself there without the assistance of baseball or BASKETball.  Not that he is only playing those sports to get into the "side door" of admissions of a high academic, he just understands that by continuing to play these sports he loves it will help him gain admittance into a school where normally his grades and test scores (solely) would not.

These days, applying to the "High Academic" colleges seem like a crap shoot -- with 10% (or less) admission rate and everyone having 4.0 GPA and 2200 SAT. Even if you qualify academically, you still need a "hook" to make you stand out. IMHO, excel in baseball is better than building habitat in Nicaragua, which is rich kid's way of gaining "leadership experience" without effort.

BishopLeftiesDad posted:

Truman posted:

I preferred that he be a part of the fraternity of baseball players rather then part of the other college fraternities to reduce his exposure to unsavory environment and events.

Not all Fraternities fall into that bucket. My son attended a D3 college and was aprt of the team and also a fraternity. Something that D3 limits allow for. He probably grew ,more as a man and a contributing member of Society through his fraternity than baseball. It forced him into leadership roles that he would have never taken in the past outside of baseball. The charitable acts required by the fraternity also opened his eyes to others in need. Be careful not to judge the Greek system only by the parties they throw. Each chapter on each campus can be different. His chapter required a pretty high GPS to get accepted and stay eligible. House duties were requirted of all the brothers. 

do not paint with too broad of a brush. 

I hate painting with a broad brush and I hoped my specific language wouldn't seem so.

In my son's case, though he was so very busy with baseball and academics at a high profile D-1, he still got invited to a fraternity and did join and participate when time allowed.  The HC wasn't all too pleased with that, particularly when a couple other players followed.   Out of it, I learned to trust my son's integrity even more.   

Bogeyorpar posted:

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

Son is well aware of #1 above. Son appreciates the high academic schools.  He also does not see himself there without the assistance of baseball or BASKETball.  Not that he is only playing those sports to get into the "side door" of admissions of a high academic, he just understands that by continuing to play these sports he loves it will help him gain admittance into a school where normally his grades and test scores (solely) would not.

These days, applying to the "High Academic" colleges seem like a crap shoot -- with 10% (or less) admission rate and everyone having 4.0 GPA and 2200 SAT. Even if you qualify academically, you still need a "hook" to make you stand out. IMHO, excel in baseball is better than building habitat in Nicaragua, which is rich kid's way of gaining "leadership experience" without effort.

My son got to go to his dream school.  If it wasn't for baseball, it would not have happened.   When he signed his National Letter of Intent, he was an envy of a lot of high achievers in his college prep HS who didn't get to go there but wanted to.

One thing that I haven't seen anyone comment on is the potentially negative effect playing in college can have on getting a job.  One concern I have is the summer baseball league requirement.  Specifically, the majority of players will not be drafted and it seems that missing out on internship opportunities to play summer ball doesn't make sense.  With internships being critical to landing jobs in a variety of fields of interest, I am concerned about the importance of these summer league requirements.  At some level, playing baseball in the summer makes less sense than doing an internship that could shape a career.

What I have seen from my son's D1 team for summer ball is about 1/2 to 3/4 of the underclassmen go play summer ball.

Others that are not -  Some are for injury and will stay around school/ rehab/ take a few summer classes (this is my son and 2 others). 2 pitchers this year will not go to summer ball as freshman/ junior because of the inning they are / will put in on college team. 2 are doing a summer intern somewhere, (summer after junior year with no hope of being drafted), 2 that I know of are doing summer interns and then playing in an adult league where they are interning. There are a few others that I am not sure what they are doing, but honestly they will not be drafted, so I could see they do internships if they are available to them.

Generally what I see is Freshmen all play summer ball unless hurt or in the one case pitch to many innings in spring to go (he will end up with about 85-90 innings). Sophomores - most go play summer ball. Juniors- it really depends on their chances of being drafted. This is where I have seen the internships on his team 

Charlie

If the college is a baseball power, the player will be playing summer ball (barring injury or a pitcher maxing out during the season).

My son did not attend a baseball powerhouse (d1). In my experience many of son's teammates did not harbor hope for baseball beyond college and also did not entertain strong summer baseball desires.  These guys were able to play in local adult leagues during their summer jobs. The lesser number who had thoughts of playing beyond college did play in good summer leagues.

My son played after freshman and soph seasons, and got a summer internship in NYC after his junior year. He was offered several good jobs during the interview process beginning of senior year, so his summers playing ball had no impact. Likewise, his teammates who harbored hopes of playing after college also hedged their bets by interviewing for real jobs (these were the guys who also had played in good collegiate summer leagues); each one received several great job offers - despite no relevant summer work experience.

Son used baseball to leverage into a school with a pretty low acceptance rate.  Without baseball, he could not have been admitted (just not passionate about anything other then ball during HS and his essays would not have cut it it competing against regular kids).

Truman posted:

Bogeyorpar posted:

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

Son is well aware of #1 above. Son appreciates the high academic schools.  He also does not see himself there without the assistance of baseball or BASKETball.  Not that he is only playing those sports to get into the "side door" of admissions of a high academic, he just understands that by continuing to play these sports he loves it will help him gain admittance into a school where normally his grades and test scores (solely) would not.

These days, applying to the "High Academic" colleges seem like a crap shoot -- with 10% (or less) admission rate and everyone having 4.0 GPA and 2200 SAT. Even if you qualify academically, you still need a "hook" to make you stand out. IMHO, excel in baseball is better than building habitat in Nicaragua, which is rich kid's way of gaining "leadership experience" without effort.

My son got to go to his dream school.  If it wasn't for baseball, it would not have happened.   When he signed his National Letter of Intent, he was an envy of a lot of high achievers in his college prep HS who didn't get to go there but wanted to.

2018 tells a story: He was in the company of several high academic, high classroom achieving high schoolers from around US recently.  Son was wearing "dream school" high academic T-Shirt.  Girl across room asks him if that's where he wants to go?  Son replied something like, "Sort of...... I really want to play baseball there." Upon hearing that son' primary focus was to be a "baseball player" at the school in question he says the young lady's facial expression soured.   She, like a lot of the hard core, high academic achieving  candidates probably resent having to compete for admission spots with rif-raf athletes. 

"She, like a lot of the hard core, high academic achieving  candidates probably resent having to compete for admission spots with rif-raf athletes." 

The 34-35 male baseball (or football, or basketball, or....) players weren't taking away from HER spot.

My impression is that the high-academic female students tend to not like sports so much.  Players tend to date the "girlfriend from home" or one of the female athletes on campus.  Mostly.

However, there are "cleat chasers" at every school. lol

(off topic, sorry)

Bogeyorpar posted:

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

keewart posted:

Son is a position player.

1)  Son leveraged baseball to get in to a high academic D1 college he may not have gotten in to otherwise.  

2)  Because of #1, he is surrounded by high achievers and therefore is influenced to "stay on track". 

3)  We kept the "HS travel baseball budget" as a line item into college.   We like to travel and the hours of our jobs allow us to attend most of the games. This part of our son's life will only comes around once, so we are making the most of it.   I can renovate the kitchen later.

 

 

 

Son is well aware of #1 above. Son appreciates the high academic schools.  He also does not see himself there without the assistance of baseball or BASKETball.  Not that he is only playing those sports to get into the "side door" of admissions of a high academic, he just understands that by continuing to play these sports he loves it will help him gain admittance into a school where normally his grades and test scores (solely) would not.

These days, applying to the "High Academic" colleges seem like a crap shoot -- with 10% (or less) admission rate and everyone having 4.0 GPA and 2200 SAT. Even if you qualify academically, you still need a "hook" to make you stand out. IMHO, excel in baseball is better than building habitat in Nicaragua, which is rich kid's way of gaining "leadership experience" without effort.

You should be careful how you stereotype. My daughter took a week off from travel softball two times in two years to do volunteer work in Puerto Rico and Appalachia. It had nothing to do with being a rich kid building a resume. It had everything to do with walking the walk on the values she was raised. She saw more value in the trips than the showcases or tournaments she missed.

charliebball posted:

One thing that I haven't seen anyone comment on is the potentially negative effect playing in college can have on getting a job.  One concern I have is the summer baseball league requirement.  Specifically, the majority of players will not be drafted and it seems that missing out on internship opportunities to play summer ball doesn't make sense.  With internships being critical to landing jobs in a variety of fields of interest, I am concerned about the importance of these summer league requirements.  At some level, playing baseball in the summer makes less sense than doing an internship that could shape a career.

My son's coach was extremely ticked off he played in a lower level summer league one year so he could participate in an important internship. He got over it after a few line drives.

keewart posted:

"She, like a lot of the hard core, high academic achieving  candidates probably resent having to compete for admission spots with rif-raf athletes." 

The 34-35 male baseball (or football, or basketball, or....) players weren't taking away from HER spot.

My impression is that the high-academic female students tend to not like sports so much.  Players tend to date the "girlfriend from home" or one of the female athletes on campus.  Mostly.

However, there are "cleat chasers" at every school. lol

(off topic, sorry)

My high academic daughter (graduated PBK) was an athlete (softball). This month she graduated from a top ranked law school. In high school and the beginning of college she dated baseball players. She never looked down at athletes. She did gravitate to the high academic athletes. She married a non athlete. He's athletic. He just never played team sports. He's more of an X Sports athlete (snowboarding, water skiing, dirt biking).

A lot of the pros and cons I felt about my kids playing in college have been related in this thread already. I related one more thing from my experience. I told my kids the time consumed with the sport and academics will make you feel owned, confined and restricted at times. But not playing will give you more free time than you would ever know what to do with.

Both were top students. But in high school my son did better in the seasons he had sports than the season he didn't. My daughter was so paranoid of being ineligible in college she graduated PBK. After the first year she realized what she was capable of academically. Law school was the same way. She was so paranoid the first year (wouldn't even travel for Thanksgiving) she aced it and realized what she could accomplish (graduated MCL).

You're asking the right questions.  Keep'em coming!

For my son it was simple, college baseball gave him the leverage to consider multiple academic options.  Whether it was a D1 mid-major, high academic D1 or D3.  Baseball gave him (STEM) options that are not typically considered by most.  He found this path through trial and error, and a lot of help from people on this web site and other web sites.

It wasn't until after he graduated college and moved into the "real world" did he realize how much college baseball had affected his work ethic and how difficult his specific path was.   A couple years ago, I read Malcolm Gladwell's book "David and Goliath" and he referenced some of the "Big Pond Little Fish" and "Big Fish Little Pond" scenarios and it really hit home just how difficult it was for him and how difficult it is for others to select their specific schools based on these dynamics that Gladwell does such a good job of drawing out.  Gladwell referenced academics but the same can be said for athletics too. 

When we came to commitment crunch time, I thought we had done our homework and knew exactly what we were getting into.  Not so much.  As it turned out, there was a lot (under the surface) we didn't know both about the school, the baseball program and about our son.  In his case, it was all very positive.  You get to the point where it becomes a leap of faith based upon what you know at that particular point in time.  We DID know a lot about the academic program, and that was the primary decision criteria for him so there was a lot of confidence in our decision there.  Worst case for us what that he'd get into the school with the Coaches help and drop baseball if it had an adverse effect or he determined there wasn't enough time to do both.

As always, JMO.

Fenway and my son took very similar paths, so their stories are similar, so I can't really add to much other than to reaffirm how the work ethic that college baseball DEMANDS (not affords) carry's over to the rest of his life - post college baseball. It is a path that many attempt take but few really complete, particularly as a STEM major.  This puts those kids in a elite group IMO. I did not really know this going into it. I supported my son because this was his passion, not mine. 

I will say this you do not have to play college summer ball every season and in many cases post college jobs come because of summer internships*. My son played one year of "collegiate summer ball"  and then a couple of others where he worked internships and found other part time summer college level games. In the year he transitioned from a position player to a pitcher only he was able to get all of the innings he needed to get him into collegiate pitching shape.  His acceptance into UT Austin very selective Masters program was because of his summer internship there, and his job prospects are because of his summer work. I suggest that only draft potential players have to play summer ball. 

My 2 cents. 

* my son's girl friend who is a finance major also found this to be true, and in fact most finance major jobs at the "big 5" accounting firms are almost exclusively a result of summer internships.

Wonder what percentage of college baseball players consider academics more important than baseball.  Surely it would be different at DIII than DI.  Different at Ivy League than SEC or ACC.  And for sure different at Juco than  4 year school.

Then again, does it really matter?  If sports or baseball was the only or a major reason they ended up with a degree, that is still a great thing.     

To me college baseball is the greatest baseball there is.  A true team game played for keeps with friends that you live with.  Friendships and memories for life.  Lessons learned through the class room and on and off the field.  A full education!

Appreciate the responses about summer ball obligations, glad to know there is flexibility for those who realize that they won't be playing beyond college and need to pursue an internship.

As far as baseball vs academics right now my son's dream is to play as long as possible.  I'm just trying to be a good dad by supporting the dream but at the same time keeping things "real" and hopefully leveraging his talent to land at a place where he will ultimately have a number of options.

My son is going D3 in the fall and study business administration with a sport management concentration. He hopes to take his time on the baseball team and turn into a graduate assist position with either the athletic department or baseball team while getting his masters.