Radar Gun Revolution

If this thing turns out to be worth diddly (which I doubt) things are about to get even worse.

http://techcrunch.com/2014/09/...e-of-a-fancy-coffee/

It's here to stay.  There are many kids who don't hit 90 who can be very effective, but will be judged on that lack of velocity.  I know there are reasons for 90 being the benchmark mostly because so many kids throw over 90 now a days, so there are plenty of 90+ guys to choose from.  

 

I'm not sure what my son throws right now.  His college does not use radar guns.  I asked him about it the other day and he said his coaches don't care how hard you throw, as long as you are effective.  Unfortunately, this attitude and practice is in the minority.  I'd just like to know because, obviously, to garner interest in the draft, you gotta be 90.  Why try to get there if you're not hitting that?

It looks like you need to be standing in a specific spot for the readings to be accurate, so we probably won't be seeing dads clocking their 9 year olds during the game. Well, not with this at least...

 

MTH....well yeah!  If parents and coaches can get a radar gun for $9.99 for their iPhone 5S that would/could detect up to 100mph then this whole thing is about to get 100 times worse.  The hard core/uneducated parents will have their children in the back yard at age 10 asking kids to hit 70mph...TJ surgeries are already on the rise from the yahoo's who had the money to buy the $1200 radar guns.  If they are available to every tom-dick-and harry for under $10 then this whole velocity issue is about to get 1000 times worse.

 

My son plays 12u and an assistant coach brought a radar gun to practice last week and the head coach flipped out and said NO 12 YEAR OLD WILL BE CLOCKED! GET IT OFF MY FIELD!

 

Gotta love that coach!

Just for the record, we have a radar display in our building.  It has been there for nearly 20 years.  Everyone that has ever pitched on our mound can see the radar reading displayed.  We have not had one single TJ surgery in 20 years.

 

I don't understand why anyone blames the radar gun for producing TJ surgeries.  If we have to blame something, why not put the blame where it belongs... Abuse of pitchers! And it has been going long before TJ was available.  It's just not as likely to end careers now days... Thanks to TJ surgery. Same holds true for hip, knee, heart, kidney, etc. replacements.  Why don't people use the word "epidemic" when describing those surgeries?

 

 

A radar gun CANNOT cause TJ surgeries, or UCL tears more specifically.  People equate the radar gun with the injuries because the fact of the matter is, the harder you throw, the more likely you are to get injured.  The UCL can only take so much force before it snaps - and I believe I read that threshold comes into play at around 85 mph.  So, you take a guy throwing hard and combine it with overuse and pitching while fatigued, and you will have a recipe for disaster.

 

The problem isn't the radar gun, it's the perception that's been created that the harder you throw, the better your chances of getting a big college scholarship or getting drafted.  If there wasn't so much emphasis on throwing 90, 95, 100 mph, kids wouldn't be so obsessed with getting to that velocity.  If you'd start to see more sub-90 guys getting drafted because they know how to pitch, the radar gun would be less important and wouldn't be seen as an issue.

 

In the articles, several scouts noted that the only reason they carry a radar gun is because the scouting forms they have to fill out, ask for velocity.  Maybe if that box was taken off the scouting reports, we'd be better off.

That is exactly where I put the blame on the hard core/uneducated parents that will have their 10 year old trying to hit 70mph.  There are now young teenagers getting TJ surgery, I don't think that can be blamed on the coach's since nearly every younger person tournament has strict pitching rules.  Either the parents are encouraging the abuse of the younger pitcher or allowing the kids to practice too much.

What nonsense.  I wonder if the coach has a speedometer on his car.  Get off my lawn!   Where do coaches get these ideas?

 

While this is a nice thought, we're not going to see it.  Velocity is measurable and trackable.  You can't measure "he knows how to pitch".  Sure you can compare stats on wins/losses/era/etc. but much of that is dependent on the quality of the players on your team and on the competition you face.  It's not easy to use that stuff to compare one guy to another.

 

Velocity though doesn't care if you are pitching on a high school mound in small town middle America, or in game 7 at Yankee Stadium.  It is what it is.

 

That doesn't necessarily mean it is the best way to evaluate pitchers - I don't even know where you would begin to create a "best" way.  However it is an objective way.

 

Until someone creates a set of objective measurables that can be combined to formulate whether a pitcher is any good or not - we're stuck with velocity.

 

 

I know.

I don't think you can blame a player or parent for chasing velocity, what is listed on every scouting report from every service out there - MPH accross the board. a few old time scouts and say it doesn't matter to them but if you look at the data they are obviously wrong. Search recruiting posts on this site - what are colleges looking for 90+ RH and upper 80 LH this is not a secret - it is the game as dictated by the powers that run it.

 

PG there is a kid in the town next mine, he is in your data base as player to follow or whatever you call the highly projectable rating - he plays for a national team that you would know very well, the kid has not been over used by any standard that I am aware of his entire life  and he just had TJ in the last week or 10 days. Why? who knows...maybe sometimes the arm only has so many throws in it and when you hit the number something is going to give.

I don't believe that there is any perception - I believe it is as close a 100% fact as there can be. obviously there are a few outliers but it is a very small number and shrinking. You want to get drafted 90 isn't going to be enough by itself...again none of us make the rules, the blame goes on baseball coaches, excutives and scouts that make evaluations and choices.

 

on the flip side they may be correct and the fallout of the chance to reach the highest levels a lot of broken arms...I don't think anyone knows for sure.

Nope. That's a coach that is closeminded to the many uses of a radar gun in baseball. I'd also say that if I were an AC and the HC screamed at me for bringing it out, me and my kid would be gone. He certainly has the right to make certain decisions about how the team is coached, but not to humiliate me in front of the team. I ain't no juicebox boy!

In addition, when is the NFL going to stop measuring 60m times? This is surely to lead to a hamstring "epidemic."

 I'm not sure what tournaments you have been to. I was watching this 12u tournament on tv. After the game they interviewed the coah. He said if this kid stays healthy , he will be really good. The kid threw a complete game like 126 pitches. But my son is 14 and I have seen these kids put through the meat grinder by these coaches. I'm not saying that the parents shouldn't take some of the blame either. And this is the majority of the teams to different degrees. I have seen parents bring radars since the kids were 10. I just shake my head . Personally I don't think they should be gunned until it is a non factor to them. Nothing like watching a good pitcher start over throwing for the radar. 

Why can't we just accept that arm injury has always accompanied pitching and it's no more a problem than it has ever been? It's just that now, with a media blitz on the subject, we're talking about it more. It's more in our face now. I'm not saying that's a bad thing - it's a good thing. With modern advances in conditioning and medicine there is no reason we can't address these problems, but to act like we just discovered that pitching is damaging to the arm is a little naive.

 

Yes, there are now young pitchers getting TJ surgery. It's not because injuries haven't always plagued young pitchers, it's more a case of being more aware and seeking a solution that wouldn't have been considered 20 years ago. A couple of decades ago, if a kid's arm was hurt pitching he either pitched through it or stopped pitching. He didn't go to a surgeon. Today, that's an option that wasn't previously available.

I gunned kids at every game for years in youth ball.  After 2-3 throws, they no longer pay any attention to you.  I've never seen a kid 'over throwing for the radar'.  What does that mean anyway?

To me this is just more of the typical modern response of everything is something or someone else's fault. Mcdonalds is why I'm fat, TV is why I'm lazy. Radar guns are why kids are hurting their arms. Blah blah blah blah and so on.

I'm sorry I didn't explain the situation clearly. Parents of 10 year old's making a big deal about radar at practices. I'm sure that in game situations they're more focused . You did say it took a couple of pitches to stop paying attention though  . I'm sure when they get older it takes more to get them out of their zone. I will defer to your experiences. Anyway I think its more about the kids getting enough rest and not too many pitches. I know I'm in the minority on this site ,but I'm all about the batter. You can gun every pitcher my son is facing.