Seriously what would you do?

Exactly what the parents are doing.  The high school season is short and the HS coach may never even get around to the drills.  There's no threat of him coming out of the line up.  Stay the course.

Most coaches that try to fix something that isn't broke, are just trying to put thier fingerprints on something, and make it more about themselves than the player...

I would do exactly what the parents are doing in this situation...

I told this story before, of a local kid who ended up getting drafted.  Whenever his HS coach started a drill that conflicted with his knowledge, he suddenly had to "take a dump."  Would come back a few minutes later and the drill would be over. 

I'm with Bolt's, too many coaches want to put "their" style in, maybe it's to brag about the kid later if he goes on to the next level.

But like the others have said, best to stay the course on what he is doing, sounds like a good disciplined hitter to me.

 Golfman25, that is some funny crap! I can't wait to pass that on.

Originally Posted by The Doctor:

…The good news is how well the parent's are taking this, they have instructed JR. to just nod his head and say ok, and told him to get in the box and do what you have been taught…. 

Depending on a lot of things, that just might not be in the best interests of the kid’s future in the game. If a player did that to our HC, chances are there’d come a time he’d regret it. Our HC is very well respected in the area, and scouts listen to him. As a group, coaches aren’t exactly challenging M.E.N.S.A. for group intelligence, but that doesn’t mean they’re stupid. They know when they’re being blown off, and don’t like it any more than anyone else would.

So when they’re asked by a scout or college coach what they think of a player who does that, you can bet there’s a good chance they’ll be told the player is at best hard-headed and at worst not coachable. When either of those tags are put on a player, they’d darn sure better have some pretty awesome numbers to overcome the label.

Tough spot for 15-16 year old kid.  If it was my kid I would have him listen to the high school coach to see if what he is teaching him has merit and can help him further.  If it does, try it.  If not, continue what he was doing.

What I would do is take this post with a large grain of salt. The Doctor  has said that most HS coaches are unqualified to be HS coaches and seems to have a negative agenda about HS coaching and the value of HS baseball in general.  In this situation, first of all, the "issue" is described as having taken place last year.  Maybe last year the coach had a power outage in the middle of the lineup and needed this kid to sacrifice a  bit to get more run production out of him.  So I'd start by waiting to see what the coach asks of the kid this year. Certainly what the doc describes is a great approach, and you could point to Buster Posey as an example of a player who can produce in the 3 hole  while doing it.  But at the same time, it's possible that a kid who has learned to let the ball travel and go oppo could also be letting some inside pitches go by that he can turn on.   Sounds like he's a really good hitter. Maybe the coach is trying to help him be a truly great one. Or maybe the coach actually is one of the mass of unqualified coaches that the Doctor has referred to.  We just don't know.

I would do this.  By the way, a lot of coaches are good, but a lot are not.  The scouts at the next level generally know if the coach at a particular school  is an idiot or not.  If the advice isn't good, don't use it and do as many have stated above. 

Be respectful, nod your head in agreement, smile and hit.400 doing what you've been doing. As long as the kid hits the coach will have him in the lineup and take credit. Coaches who can't see something is good the way it is usually can't tell if the kid is doing what they want him to do. They just think the kid is when its successful.

As for Stats' concern, a coach who is well respected with college coaches and pro scours isn't going to screw up a kid who is swinging properly due to quality instruction. A few years ago I asked some coaches and parents of colleges players what college coaches look for in hitters. The most common response: gap to gap hitters.

My son's high school coach personally detested his hitting coach. When I told him who my son was seeing the conversation ended. But the high school coach was smart enough not to interfere with what was working.

Fenway has a very practical and workable approach, I think.

During Spring Training of our son's 2nd year in Milb, the organizations hitting instructor made it nearly a full time project to have our son adjust, hit the ball in front and with power.  Our son was a gap hitter and he could let the ball travel.  Someplace during his first year, the team tracked the number of fly outs, especially to left field. They concluded he might hit 15-20 HR's by hitting the ball more in front changing the approach of  seeing the ball long.

The discussion with the hitting instructor started with the question of who taught you to see the ball long? When our son said "my Dad," the coach responded "you need a new Dad."  After spending nearly the entire ST trying to make the adjustment, without results, the issue was dropped and our son went back to the style which got him drafted and he proved to have even more success in his 2nd year.

One thing is a near certainty: the further a player  moves up in the game, the more valued power and being a power hitter is.  It sounds like the HS coach might well be looking out for the players longer term interest and seeking to develop something which has potential. If it works, the "stud" may well help his team and open more doors beyond HS.

If the coach is a good one and the player is as good as posted, if the player cannot make the adjustment, he should be able to continue the approach he has been using and be successful.

Personally,I would not be supporting an approach that a 15-16 year old   should not try to learn new approaches and adjustments, and especially that he should ignore input from his coaches. A true "stud" who has power potential and who does not use it is going to face making that adjustment at some point, so long as he stays in baseball.  There is nothing wrong and probably everything to be gained by being a "stud" and a "power hitter."

The above is a key point to me too. Any post is telling one half of the story at best.  How many posts start out with "my 12 yo is cruising high 80s... yada yada yada".  Not doubting The Doctor above specifically, just saying there are two sides to these stories... And there is generally varying degrees of bias and agenda filtering whatever gets presented. Plus, people want to be "right" and want to be perceived as really knowing their stuff. Just human nature and the nature of forum discussions for sure. A lot of supposition gets accepted as fact. It would be interesting to hear all of the same instances described on a "HS coaches bbweb".

So yes... Have to take things with a big grain of salt in cyberland. But yes, I do agree that there are times when players have to take a coaches input with a grain a salt too... It's very difficult to please two different hitting coaches (pvt and school) or two different pitching coaches. Agree players should listen to all input with an open mind, but ultimately must decide what they will and won't incorporate.

In a program such as Cal. State Fullerton, the #3 and #4 hitter better be just as good at bunting as the lead-off and #9 guy. They also better be skilled at moving runners, hitting behind runners and the like. 

One of the winningest coaches in all of college baseball requires a highly disciplined approach, from every player in his line up. More than a few of his players struggle. It is a relatively common theme which gets a fair amount of comment, at least locally, come draft time and how to project his players.

If we all agree the "stud" should listen, be polite with the HS coach and then do it exactly his way, how is he going to handle a college or pro situation like Fullerton or the one I referenced? What is he learning when that happens at the next level?  In my opinion, a HS sophomore or junior very likely does not have the experience or ability to make proper decisions on what they will or won't do at the plate.

Of course we all want our son's to be successful.Sometimes being successful, especially with hitting, is learning to understand the swing and make adjustments as the game gets more challenging and the pitching gets better. Sometimes it is learning adjustments which make our son's better over the longer term. As others posted, we only have one side of this story and I agree with those who are reluctant to support the view to "ignore" the HS coach.

This is called BBCOR... It swept the nation a few seasons ago...

What happened to COMMUNICATION and RESPECT????  Shouldn't that be the first approach?  As a HS coach, I like to know what other instruction my kids are getting.  I like to make sure they are comfortable with what is being taught and are  not too confused by conflicting info.  I often state to the kids that if what I am teaching is different than anything else they are being taught, tell me and we'll make sure you understand the differences and find what works best for you.  On the flip side, if a player hears me ask him to use an approach that is different than what he is being taught by a private instructor, then I would expect him to communicate that with me so we can all work together to help him be the best player he can be.

Now if there is a relationship issue between coach and instructor or if coach is a "my way or highway" type, then you might have to go to plan B, but I don't believe that is true nearly as much as many would like to profess.

I am with Fenway 100%!  Same issues the youngest had with his HC.

Hey Coach:

"Last season as a Sophomore I batted third in YOUR lineup and led YOUR team in Average, Homers, and Doubles..."

And THIS is the guy YOU want to mess with, errr I mean...'fix'?!?!

C'mon, man... work with 1,2 & 4-9 in the lineup...

BTW, our current #3 hitter is VERY strong away.  But he gets tied up fairly easily when pitched inside.  He is capable of HR power if he had a pull approach but more importantly, he should not have holes in his swing.  So, we are working on his ability to effectively attack both sides of the plate.

What about approaching his MLB hitting instructor and ask him to work with him on it as well, get the HS and Private Instructor on the same page.

My son has always been gap to gap as well, and has looked middle out for so long (since that is what has always been pitched to him throughout college) that he stopped seeing the pitches middle in.

That is the kids wheelhouse, if a pitcher tries to come inside it should get yanked!

I am a proponent of making the adjustment sooner rather then later. Hitting oppo successfully is a difficult skill to execute. If he is getting it done here he should work on middle in and let his true power show up.

JMHO though!

PITCH RECOGNITION, AND KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH IT...

"capable of HR power" is very different than already "leading the team in HR's"... I think...

If the kid is hitting ropes, then I don't know why the coach would try to change him.

Something doesn't make sense. Our coaches may offer subtle changes or suggestions, yet for the most part will not force any new approach for a top player.

To answer the post, I agree with cabbage, to talk with the coach.

He should respect the communication.

Well, I don't know about VERY different.  You're the one that brought up BBCOR.  Leading the team in HR often means you had one

In any case, as I said, the more important issue is eliminating any weakness that can be attacked.  He will continue with an oppo gap approach but will be more capable of doing damage to an inside pitch.

Knowing nothing about this situation, I have never been a... If it ain't broke don't fix it, guy.

There are things that work very well at lower levels of competition, that have very little chance of working at the next levels.  Sometimes what is broken is not always apparent right away. 

Also, don't fix it, is a form of satisfaction.  I try to tell people all the time that satisfaction is a baseball players biggest enemy!  Every player should be striving to improve his knowledge and skill level, even if they are in the Big Leagues.  Most of those that have used the "leave it alone" approach end up wishing they had known sooner.

In no way am I referring to the player in this thread.  We all know there are good and bad coaches.  There are good and bad in just about everything.  I do know that it is impossible to label any coach good or bad based on the information in this thread. At some point, the opposition recognizes a weakness and they exploit it!  Then if the all star high school player isn't ready to make an adjustment we wonder... Should this have been fixed or left alone earlier?

you always hope the HS coach is that smart, i have freshman living it right now...coach hasn't said anything to him yet...but it is coming. he has the same marching orders, listen closely, nod head, say yes sir - and ignore.

 Great reply's, If you noticed I did not bash the coach. I have met him a few times and he is a very nice guy, loves baseball, try's hard, and most people like him, he is probably a little further up the troft Than a nice dad trying to help out.  But this has happened several time's, trying to teach something that probably is not consistent with anyone else in the city. However my angle is this, I must personally amend the wise old dad that say's nothing. I told him I felt like the coach seemed very approachable. And he said why risk the doghouse when HSBB is such a small part of his life. Both of his older boy's had short careers in the minors, and been through the HS program already with 3 different coaches,at two different schools. He say's this is the best way for him to enjoy HSBB.

Only can reply in generalities not knowing the specifics. As others have stated, being incredibly respectful is the key.

Good luck

With the data presented I feel the typical high school coach isn't qualified to alter the hitting mechanics of a good hitter. A college coach didn't get where he is by accident. He's far more qualified. 

A qualified travel coach (former college coach) altered by son's swing after hitting about .340 as a hs soph. My son and I had confidence in what he wanted to change. It was something I had been telling my son to change all soph year.

Ironically the former college coach was trying to get my son to hit gap to gap rather than trying to pull so much. Some grounders and soft flies to the right side turned into line drives the other way. 

RJM,

I think there could be very different "perceptions" of the typical HS coach, and their ability to coach adjustments, as well as their ability to project a hitter to the next level.
Your quote left out the college coach who has a pretty much one size fits all approach for every hitter in his program.  While he does not talk too much about it(or much of anything publicly) my suspicion is he feels the hitters they recruit are good enough to make the adjustments to the way he coaches hitting. He is stubborn to a fault, though.

My main point, though, was if this "stud" player is not willing to work on adjustments proposed to him in HS, how do folks think he is going to approach that mentally, when he gets to college when Mom and Pop aren't there to support him and especially when Mom and Pop saying ignore what the coach is saying does not work with the college coach.  How does anyone know this "stud" might not be a better hitter by adjusting to pull and hit with power rather than gap to gap.  I don't see any data in this thread.

Inf ... The high school coach is ignoring the kid is already working with a qualified hitting instructor and having success. Even if the high school coach knows what he's doing why change what works with a qualified instructor? I'm sure your son encountered the situation at least once in the minors where two people had two different ideas on how he should swing. Its an uncomfortable situation. 

Even though my son's high school coach played college ball I wouldn't have trusted him to work with my son. Fortunately he recognized the work I did with him and then his paid hitting instructor. 

I completely agree that in season  having 2 different messages from 2 different coaching styles is a challenge for hitters. On the other hand, I understand this HS coach to be talking about drills during the pre-season practice.

As PG said, what works now vs making adjustments to what works over a longer term, and perhaps more effectively now, is one important factor.  The hitting instructor has a repeat customer because what he is teaching, gap to gap, is working well.  There is nothing factually here to lead me to conclude this "stud" cannot adjust to hitting with more power while pulling the ball. Our son could not do it in Milb but they tried it in the pre-season because of the upside they saw with it for him.

The plan laid out of trying drills during the pre-season for the HS season for a "stud" hitter seems like a plausible plan. Heck, our son worked with a HS kid nearly an entire HS season because he believed the swing would fail when the player got to college. He also believed the hitter had the ability to make the adjustment and be a better hitter in HS while he developed for college. The kid was a second round pick who refused to make the adjustment.  He hit below the Mendoza line last year in his 2nd full year of Milb.

Every situation is different.  Every player is different. Every coach is different. Every human being is different.

Whenever people bring up personal instructors, I wonder how good the instructor is. I've seen great instructors and terrible instructors.  Sometimes their credentials don't determine how good they are. IMO you have to see noticeable improvement in a fairly short period of time.  If that isn't happening you don't have a great instructor.

really "infielddad" is right, while this topic might lead to interesting discussion.  There simply is not enough information to help anyone.

The one thing, right or wrong, that I always told my kids to remember and follow it to a T.... THE COACH  IS ALWAYS RIGHT! 

Of course, that isn't always true, but it sure makes everything easier. Bad coaches do not ruin Great players!  I would bet that nearly every MLB player experienced bad coaching at some point.

An observation and a story, picking up on a couple things PGStaff said:

The reason to listen, and communicate clearly with whoever is trying to help you get better, is because the learning can never stop. JP was working out at the cages prior to last season, and in walks Austin Jackson, carrying nothing but a bag and a bat. 

He proceeded to spend nearly three hours hitting off a T and soft toss, taking direction and coaching from JP's hitting coach, whom he has worked with for years. He's also, clearly, worked with many, many others.

He BUSTED HIS $#%!!, apparently trying to fix something that he believed was broken: Too many Ks.

I'm pretty sure he cut down on them last year.

It does not make sense to train a hitter to not pull a ball middle in. A player that becomes so comfortable on letting a pitch get deep in the zone and going the other way will never realize his potential.

We don't have enough information to know exactly what's happening. I agree. A hitter should turn on the inside pitch. The hitting instruction my son received was to keep turning on the inside pitch. But let middle-out get deeper. It didn't affect his ability to pull the ball. It turned some grounders and soft flies to line drives the other way.

I have used this sort of situation with my son as a learning moment.  You are always going to have these situations in life and you have to address them.  There are a lot of good HS coaches and a bunch of crappy ones as well.  My son has the privaledge of working with a MLB hitting coordinator and a current MLB player.  Both have taught him  a ton.  His HS assistant coach last year tried to change what he had been taught. He discussed this with the HS coach and he told the assistant to leave him alone.At some point the results should speak for themselves.

Seriously what would I do?

Mind my own business!

Unless it was my player of course.

My reading of this is that the coach may just want him to look for an inside pitch to drive just a little more in a hitters count. My own son has been taught since he could walk to see it long, stay inside of it and look away since that's where pitchers seem to pitch most. His coaches last year(JC) and his coach this year are working with him to look for that inside pitch in a hitters count and drive it long. And it is working. He bought into it because no one was trying to change his overall approach but to add something to it. And its all pure Charlie Lau. That was his philosophy in hitting. Use the whole field and wait for the inside pitch to drive. Some try to paint him as the advocate of the soft single to right but nothing could be further from the truth. My advise is to embrace what is trying to be taught in the sense of adding a serious weapon to your arsenal. It takes time but is highly effective. My son also was a career .400 plus hitter in high school who batted 3rd since middle of freshman year so I identify with what you are saying. Good luck with it!

Welcome to my world.  

I now have to have my son take batting practice at home to unlearn the bad hitting drills the coach is teaching the team.