Shoulder Surgery? Yes or no

allbaseball, first off welcome to the HSBBW. If me I would want to be absolutely sure as to the nature of the problem. You didn't mention if there had been any imaging (x-ray, MRI, etc). Not that your doc is wrong, but he's obviously being conservative, and as you mentioned time is a factor here. Is he an ortho? An upper extremity specialist? A second opinion might be wise in any case. If it is a bone spur that's causing impingement, then without surgery your son might be looking at a chronic or re-occcuring problem as long as he's playing/throwing. A therapist can help strengthen the shoulder girdle and teach compensatory techniques, but they can't do much about correcting a biomechanical anomaly such as a spur. Hope this helps.

Yes, there's alot being left out here but we have gone to two doctors. The first did nothing and said it was bursitis. The second one (Dr. Conway-supposed to be one of the best) is the one that saw the bone spur on an X-ray. Then he also saw the impingment on the MRI but these are two separate problems. Both doctors are ortho and I'm very comfortable with Dr. Conways advise. Basically, my understanding is that by getting the inflamation down(he got a shot)and getting rid of the pain for a while he can strengthen it back up and then it might not flare up again. And your right if its the bone spur causing the problem what's to say it won't be chronic.

Another question I have is what happens if he goes ahead and plays his senior year and then maybe we do the surgery in the summer is all hope lost for college ball?

How come your son doesn't have his college ball situation cleared up by now? Spring of senior year is a bit late to get noticed except to walk on.

allbaseball,
Whether the injury ends up being complicated or not, it's probably going to get complicated for him if he is to take on the challenge of overcoming arm trouble AND pursue baseball at the next level- it's not easy for the healthy ones.

How does your son feel about all this? Does he have the talent, desire, and the commitment? Are his expectations commensurate with yours?

If he can play, and he wants it bad enough, there will likely still be limited options even if he delays the surgery. Maybe not his dream school, but possibly a place that fits his needs and vice versa.

Don't get discouraged yourself, as your son may need some stoic support to get through this difficult transition. Besides, if the surgery is somehow not needed, you save yourself a whole bunch of unwarranted grief.

It sounds as if maybe his senior year is very important to him, as it is for most HS seniors. It's a huge time in their lives and facing surgery plus rehab is not normally part of the ritual. Whatever happens, good luck and please keep us posted.

quote:

Originally posted by TG:
How come your son doesn't have his college ball situation cleared up by now? Spring of senior year is a bit late to get noticed except to walk on.

Au contraire. Many players don't have their baseball situation settled until spring of their senior year. Some don't until the summer.

Welcome to the HSBBW.

What you describe is not all that uncommon. Unfortunetly, without surgery, it's hard to tell what is really going on. It's hard to determine if the bone spur is the cause of the problem.

Surgery should always be the LAST option, because any surgery that involves the shoulder could take longer to rehab than originally planned. Sometimes surgery that has been rushed can lead to the end of a baseball career.

IMO, two weeks after a shot and beginning a throwing program seems to be a very short period to give the problem enough time to heal on it's own. My son, a pitcher, had an issue this summer and was shut down for weeks with strengthening excercises before he began just light toss. After two months he is just beginning to pitch, I am not sure if he should have even had longer time to rehab but I am not in control of his health care, you are. The problem with surgery is the rush to find a solution and that is not always the best option.

I understand your dilemma and this is a personal decision, I am not a doctor, but I would do all that is possible first before anyone took a knife to son's shoulder, regardless of his situation or position.

Good luck.

quote:

Originally posted by play baseball:

quote:

Originally posted by TG:
How come your son doesn't have his college ball situation cleared up by now? Spring of senior year is a bit late to get noticed except to walk on.

Au contraire. Many players don't have their baseball situation settled until spring of their senior year. Some don't until the summer.

Most sign their NLI in November or April which is before the senior baseball season, or before it's over. These means they've had offers on the table beforehand. Now we're before the senior season.

Yes there are a handful of leftover rides due to some players who signed NLI's signing pro instead of playing college ball, but it's not a lot.

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Stay away from those nasty leftovers...they're moldy!


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TG,
Only D1 recruits sign an NLI in November, there are many many players who do not play Div 1 baseball.

I understood what you were trying to say to the poster, but don't refer to those who don't sign as leftovers. There are still many opportunities available.

quote:

How come your son doesn't have his college ball situation cleared up by now? Spring of senior year is a bit late to get noticed except to walk on.

In all my time, this is probably the least correct statement I've ever heard regarding the recruitment process......

Between D1-D2-D3, NAIA and JUCO.........recruiting can and often does go on up to and until the classes start in August.........

In the real world of post HS baseball, only the smaller number of players has his situation cleared up by now.......a majority will have well into the senior season........

TPM...


piaa_ump...

I agree with pia ump.

I can see why anxiety runs high this time of year. Any parent or player with no commitment now begins to feel they are part of a smaller group (leftover) when they are actually part of a larger group.

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Might be worth considering (Correct me if I am wrong....)

The timetables for college ball don't begin running until you have enrolled as a full time student. The option would exist to take a year of "greyshirt"...

...Taking less than full time units while rehabing to both get fully healthy and get ahead of the academic game.

Also would concur..for those of us who do not have Bluechip recruits...the recruitng game was not over until it was over...and for some we knew that was the day before class began...

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Thanks everyone. I'll let you know how it goes but right now we are saying no surgery. His senior year is important to him and he doesn't want to risk that.

And on the Baseball and college stuff. We aren't looking at going D1 and there were a lot of kids last year that got something their senior year as well as during the summer. That's what we are working at and hoping will happen but it's also in God's hands.

Keep us posted albaseball.

Much success to your family and your son on his senior season and your ongoing college search.

TG - thanks for the warm welcome for allbaseball. They asked a valid question and you choose to post a snotty comment. I'll bet allbaseball is well aware of who is signing when/where in DFW area.

Try a little more kindness to a new poster next time. It will take you further.

P.S. - FYI - still plenty of talent left in DFW that hasn't signed.

quote:

Originally posted by splitter7:
TG - thanks for the warm welcome for allbaseball. They asked a valid question and you choose to post a snotty comment. I'll bet allbaseball is well aware of who is signing when/where in DFW area.

Try a little more kindness to a new poster next time. It will take you further.

P.S. - FYI - still plenty of talent left in DFW that hasn't signed.

I asked what I felt to be a valid question. Going back to when I played and friend's sons now, I don't know of many players who didn't know where they were going by the time their senior season started.

I know one from last year. He never got a shot to play until his senior year of high school. He had to walk on. None of the interested colleges had any rides left. One school told him it was too late to apply in May.

As for your comment about signings in your area, the NLI period for seniors happened yet. Now that I've explained why I feel my question is valid, I refuse to get in a ****ing match over it.

Not looking for a match with you at all. I graciously invite you to step over to the Texas Forum for a shake and a howdy and to celebrate our 2008 Commits. However, don't mistake that list as a complete list. There are still too many to count DI prospects out there that haven't committed for whatever reason.

It seemed more a jab at a new poster than a valid question that could be helpful.

Try to be nice when you visit the Texas Forum. The Texans are true Southerners and won't take kindly to you acting like you know it all and the rest of us are stupid.

TG

I do not know where you get your info but the majority of players that I know who are looking to make that senior year decision regarding college have not done so nor can they be accepted for admission at this early date

quote:

Originally posted by splitter7:
I graciously invite you to step over to the Texas Forum for a shake and a howdy...

A shake and a howdy? What exactly does that mean down Texas way splitter7?

I'll take a stab at it...


A Shake............................................and a Howdy!

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Well splitter7...was I close?

quote:

Originally posted by splitter7:
Not looking for a match with you at all. I graciously invite you to step over to the Texas Forum for a shake and a howdy and to celebrate our 2008 Commits. However, don't mistake that list as a complete list. There are still too many to count DI prospects out there that haven't committed for whatever reason.

It seemed more a jab at a new poster than a valid question that could be helpful.

Try to be nice when you visit the Texas Forum. The Texans are true Southerners and won't take kindly to you acting like you know it all and the rest of us are stupid.

Of course they haven't committed. The first signing period hasn't even happened yet.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
TG

I do not know where you get your info but the majority of players that I know who are looking to make that senior year decision regarding college have not done so nor can they be accepted for admission at this early date

You're missing something. Of course players haven't committed yet. The NLI signing period hasn't occurred yet. But players don't wait until their senior season just to get on the radar screen. The rides are mostly taken after the two NLI signing periods. In most cases players need to have shown their stuff before their senior season.

Don't mistake senior year with senior season. They don't commit until senior year. They usually commit before their senior season is over.

TG

I am missing nothing ---trust me

You are the one missing things---

TG ...

quote:

You're missing something. Of course players haven't committed yet. The NLI signing period hasn't occurred yet.

The commitment by a player to a D-1 baseball program is not necessarily the same as signing a NLI ... our son, and many like him, committed to the school in October and signed his NLI in November. So players CAN commit before the NLI.

quote:

Originally posted by FutureBack.Mom:
TG ...

quote:

You're missing something. Of course players haven't committed yet. The NLI signing period hasn't occurred yet.

The commitment by a player to a D-1 baseball program is not necessarily the same as signing a NLI ... our son, and many like him, committed to the school in October and signed his NLI in November. So players CAN commit before the NLI.

I completely understand. I just went through it with a softball player a couple of years ago. She verballed months before signing her NLI. We did all her visits on our money her junior year so she wouldn't have to be bothered with recruiting during her senior year. But legally the player isn't committed to the school until the NLI is signed.

In this case people are saying a lot of players don't commit until after their senior season is over. That would be about the time their senior year of high school ends. That's after the fall and spring NLI seasons of their senior year are over. I disagree. Most baseball players I know or know of were signed/committed by the second NLI signing season in the spring.

Maybe I am missing something, I am confused when I read this thread.

In my neck of the woods, only the monster studs have signed prior to their senior season.

Last summer 06 I saw three seniors get signed D1 in Late July. One got 60% scholly.

4 seniors this year on my sons HS baseball team are playing college ball this fall. Not a single one was even close to signing during the HS season. 2 went D1, 1 Juco, 1 Div II. I was so excited to here about these great kids still playing ball, because I thought they had been passed over.

And with the new rules, I speculate later signings will be even more common.

quote:

Originally posted by TG:
In this case people are saying a lot of players don't commit until after their senior season is over. That would be about the time their senior year of high school ends. That's after the fall and spring NLI seasons of their senior year are over. I disagree. Most baseball players I know or know of were signed/committed by the second NLI signing season in the spring.

TG,
I don't think anyone said a lot of players committ after their senior season, at least I know I didn't.

There are a lot of folks here whose sons signed during their senior season, this is not unusual.

You will also find that on the HSBBW not everyone is as prepared as maybe some others are. It is part of our job to help them understand that the best scenerio in the process (committment)should be ending senior year, not beginning. In the perfect recruiting world a player should have options by the beginning of their senior year, but we all know this is not a perfect world.

Regardless, as I have learned, it is important to try to give opinions and information for the question asked, not answer a serious question with another question.

I hope that this will help you to understand why you received the answers that you did to the question that you asked.

allbaseball--Holy cow! this thread really got off subject!

I think going cautious is the best choice here. Without a tear in the shoulder I would be hesitant to let someone cut on my son. Bone spurs are a bit unusual in this young age group because they are generally arthritic in nature. Now some of us have a somewhat abnormal acromium which can lead to impingement on the muscles of the rotator cuff.

Impingement can be from tendonitis or bony encroachment (from odd acromiums and/or spurs). For whatever reason, there is pressure on the muscles/tendons and that causes the pain and weakness. Steroid injections and physical therapy can help greatly. Steroid injections are not without risk however, one has a higher risk of tendon rupture.

So, I think you are doing the right thing, slow and steady wins the race and if you can treat this without a knife, that's the best. Anytime you cut, you leave scar tissue. On the flip side of this, if it really is bony encroachment on the supraspinatus (one of the muscles of the rotator cuff) it can eventually lead to a tear, but again, this is a degenerative process not usually seen in young kids.

I am not a recruiting expert by any means and I have no idea what the future holds for your son as far as this interfering with his college baseball plans, but I wouldn't rush into a surgery ever. As much as a baseball nut as I am and most everyone on this board is, I think that we all agree that health is most important. He has a long life ahead of him with or without college baseball and these are the only shoulders he will get.

We will keep you and your son in our prayers! Good luck!

quote:

Originally posted by mom of 2 catchers:
allbaseball--Holy cow! this thread really got off subject!

Off subject mom of 2 catchers?



What could possibly make you think that?
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Seriously...you obviously know your stuff and your answer to allbaseball will undoubtedly help them.
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Now about that 'bony encroachment'...that's the best (and only) explanation on the subject that I have ever heard...I gotta' hand it to you!

Hey thanks everyone for your support. Momof2catchers, I really appreaciate your reply. Also to the ones that have PM me on the subject.

And thanks also everyone for information on the signings. Me and my son are still holding out hope that he will be signed somewhere.

I truly believe that if we can get him healthy he will get to play somewhere. So please keep him in your prayers.

Will do allbaseball.