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Showcasing, scholarships, the economy

infielddadinfielddad10,000+ posts
At the time I read it on another message board, a few months back, I dismissed a poster who argued that Cal Berkeley will abolish men's baseball at the end of the current coach's contract and that they will not dismiss the coach because they cannot absorb his contract.
Recently, there have been a series of articles that I have found interesting and caused me to wonder whether I dismissed that poster too easily.
BA recently featured an article on showcasing, its financial costs, the possible impact on how the game is played, and the benefits that a small number of players receive from scholarships and/or the draft.

http://www.baseballamerica.com...ews/2009/269031.html

Today, the SF Chronicle has an article on the cost of intercollegiate sports and how a number of professors at UC Berkeley are mounting opposition to the continued funding of the athletic department deficits.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/...10/27/MN0L1AAUM3.DTL

In reading the Chronicle article, I came across the Knight report.

http://www.knightcommission.or...cle&id=344&Itemid=84

This conclusion from the Penn State AD was of particular interest:
"Penn State’s athletics director Tim Curley, who currently oversees 29 intercollegiate sports, told the Knight Commission in 2009: “I believe the economic realities and conditions facing athletics will have a major impact on sponsorship [of teams] and participation in the years ahead. I remain concerned that, if adjustments are not made, we will see a reduction of both men and women's programs in the next three to five years” (Knight Commission on Intercollegiate Athletics, 2009). He warned that non-revenue men’s sports will be hardest hit and reduced to club or intramural status...As such, it is incumbent upon colleges and universities to make sure that they and their athletics programs are functioning efficiently to fulfill their missions. In terms of athletics, this means that it is time for a serious examination of the structure of intercollegiate athletics to find ways to brake the runaway train of athletic expenses."

With the escalating costs of running a DI college program, the potential that baseball will be one of the costly and visible programs subject to the economics, and the amounts of money families are putting into travel and showcasing in the pursuit of that DI scholarship opportunity, I would be extremely interested in learning if others see reason for concern.
What is the future in showcasing and travel ball if DI baseball, within 3-5 years, is facing the critical choices the Penn State AD suggests? Similarly, what is the future for players if/when the DI opportunities are less, the scholarships more elusive and the budgets required to balance?
Does anyone envision that, as opposed to a scholarship, men's baseball may end up imposing a charge, a cost, on players who wish to compete, as one option for balancing that budget?
My head hurts just thinking about this. Do these articles provoke some thoughts about your son, his future in baseball, and the economics to get him there that might not have occurred, until today?

'You don't have to be a great player to play in the major leagues, you've got to be a good one every day.'

Last edited {1}
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ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Does anyone envision that, as opposed to a scholarship, men's baseball may end up imposing a charge, a cost, on players who wish to compete, as one option for balancing that budget?

I will think out loud on this one and off the cuff...

I think this has already occured to some extent. Most high schools in our area are pay to play. I can see colleges following a similar model to balance the budget. Moreover, some of that already occurs since there are only 11.75 scholarships to go around and in some non-fully-funded scenarios, much less than that. Many schools spend a big portion of their scholarship budget on pitching and perhaps a few power bats. The rest of the team subsidizes those efforts for the "chance" to compete.

Assuming athletic funding goes away altogether, here is how it might impact things imho. For competitive warm-weather situations, you'll still find players willing to attend and parents willing to pay. I would guess for drafted players, it would take less incentive to get them to forgo college. I would expect programs where the main incentive to field a team is the scholarship, then I could see some of those programs folding altogether.

If this is really a trend, then maybe you go from about 300 D1 programs in the country to 150 or so. We saw some evidence of this with the Northern Iowa team folding this past year after 100 years competing in the sport.

The game of musical chairs obviously becomes more difficult and those having financial means behind them may be able to overcome more athletically gifted competition who do not also have the means. Maybe someday baseball will be more like polo. A bunch of rich guys duking it out to see who has bragging rights back at the country club
Coach WaltripCoach Waltrip100+ posts
IFD,

You have made some valid points here with your concerns. I have often thought of the money I have been pouring into baseball for my son and wondered if I would have just put it all into a college fund? Probably would be better off...but, seeing the joy he has playing the game makes all the worth while for me...

Yet, I believe the drying up of money for baseball is a very real possibility. In what way, shape or form I don't know if anyone can say for sure. If the scholarships were to dry up I could envision college club teams playing each other in local, regional and national venues where the cost would be bourne by the players and their parents. Not good for sure...

Additionally, if this were to occur I could see an explosion in JUCO baseball programs across the country.
P philsfan100+ posts
The reality for schools is that athletic programs do end up drawing many other students to the enroll in them. You need to have activities and social events that students can attend. What studies also show is that sports create an identity (from athletes and non-athletes) that lasts with the students and they are more likely to donate years after graduation. This is especially true if the teams win. You can see this in the move by many of the mid to small schools seeking to join the NCAA. DIII is booming.
B BobbleheadDoll5,000+ posts
quote:
The reality for schools is that athletic programs do end up drawing many other students to the enroll in them. You need to have activities and social events that students can attend. What studies also show is that sports create an identity (from athletes and non-athletes) that lasts with the students and they are more likely to donate years after graduation. This is especially true if the teams win. You can see this in the move by many of the mid to small schools seeking to join the NCAA. DIII is booming.


This is so true. The problem is that the academics don't see this. Several academic staffs have mounted opposition to college sports and especially against athletic admits.
Holden CaulfieldHolden Caulfield1,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
quote:
The reality for schools is that athletic programs do end up drawing many other students to the enroll in them. You need to have activities and social events that students can attend. What studies also show is that sports create an identity (from athletes and non-athletes) that lasts with the students and they are more likely to donate years after graduation. This is especially true if the teams win. You can see this in the move by many of the mid to small schools seeking to join the NCAA. DIII is booming.


This is so true. The problem is that the academics don't see this. Several academic staffs have mounted opposition to college sports and especially against athletic admits.


Without getting too political, let me add that this is not at all surprising. The people who populate academia in general are not the type who see value in athletics and, at the same time, far over-value themselves. Yes, there are exceptions, but I'd guess those are few and far between.
2Bmom2Bmom1,000+ posts
Hey - I resemble that remark. Wink

I am lucky to work at one of the exceptions.

Faculty, staff and students get the Friday off before Homecoming. The new Dean of the College of Engineering is a huge sports fan, and encourages everyone to wear Gator gear on Fridays before football games. I'm waiting to see how she handles baseball season. Of course, the Engineering building is right across the street from the football stadium and the basketball stadium (which also holds gymnastics, swimming, and volleyball), and track, baseball, and tennis are within easy walking distance. The faculty members I work with always seem willing to make special provisions for tests, not just for athletes, but for others who have a legitimate, documented need.

At the same time, I'm guessing that if one takes a faulty position at the University of Florida, one knows to come down from the ivory tower, at least on football Saturdays. Smile
Last edited by 2Bmom
bballmanbballman10,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Holden Caulfield:


Without getting too political, let me add that this is not at all surprising. The people who populate academia in general are not the type who see value in athletics and, at the same time, far over-value themselves. Yes, there are exceptions, but I'd guess those are few and far between.


I would say these types do not see value in competition as a whole. Even in the classroom, they would prefer no grades as those who do not make it would feel bad about themselves. Hopefully, there are enough who see the value in competition and school pride around to not let this happen. Can't imagine baseball not being part of college life.

Although it did happen with wrestling in Georgia. Thanks to title IX, the entire state dropped wrestling as a sport. Granted, wrestling is not as popular as baseball, but it did happen.

No offense to you personally 2BMom. There are always exceptions. Talking as a general rule.
Last edited by bballman
2Bmom2Bmom1,000+ posts
None taken. Go Gators. Smile
(Don't tell anyone, but I'll be pulling for my alma mater this weekend...Go Dogs!)

Academics get on my nerves too. My husband is a faculty member, so I am around them 24/7. But I think these broad generalizations are unfair. The reasons for these changes are much more complex than the revenge of the nerds.

But I agree that this is a really scary thought:
quote:
The game of musical chairs obviously becomes more difficult and those having financial means behind them may be able to overcome more athletically gifted competition who do not also have the means. Maybe someday baseball will be more like polo. A bunch of rich guys duking it out to see who has bragging rights back at the country club noidea
Last edited by 2Bmom
infielddadinfielddad10,000+ posts
While I included the article from this morning about Cal, this, for the most part, is not an issue of academia vs athletics, according to the Knight report.

Here is a quote of interest:
"To the reality of burgeoning budgets and growing deficits, of heightened commercialism and aggressive marketing, add the layer of the global recession of 2008-09, which has affected state appropriations, private giving, and enrollment at most colleges and universities. This has put big-time college sports in the eye of a perfect storm of economic challenges."

Bottom line is that athletic budgets are increasing at rates higher than any other department. at many colleges. Revenue, whether from private giving or from the States is down drastically, and with the high costs and lower financial aid, the student numbers are also down.
To provide an illustration, there is little doubt the baseball program at many universities does not pay for itself. Football, at the top tier program, does pay for itself and pays for many other programs.
If colleges are not able to continue to subsidize the escalating losses within the athletic departments, due to declining revenues and increasing budgets, something has to give. If States will not allocate money/support as they have in the past,and private giving is down, money needs to come from someplace or costs need to be cut.
In point of fact, the choices may end up including the option to increase the salary of the football coach the to $5,000,000 per year or cutting baseball, so the budget balances, or comes close.
I think that is the point the Penn St AD was trying to make.
From the Knight report, the top 25 or so BCS teams and programs will not be impacted, or will be impacted to a lesser extent, depending the number of programs they support and the increasing revenue they need to allocate to already out of control salaries, weight rooms, stadiums, sky boxes and the like.
For the rest, as the Knight report suggests, they are in the eye of a perfect economic storm.
Last edited by infielddad
2Bmom2Bmom1,000+ posts
I just reread infielddad's original post, and somehow I missed the part about Berkeley.

I am sure that if our athletic department was running a deficit during a time of layoffs, there would be opposition to the athletic programs, too. Especially for sports that aren't moneymakers.

Here in Florida, our state-funded "Bright Futures" academic scholarship fund is being chipped away while tuition rises. Even if my son didn't play baseball, even if there were no athletic or academic scholarship opportunities, if he wants to go to college, he'll get there. It would be a lot less fun without athletics.
Last edited by 2Bmom

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