which mlb pitchers do you see throwing in winter leagues. Almost all pitchers shut it down.
You are right it is a discussion.
My advice is to get rest but i dont think a long toss program will hurt.
As for shutting it down and getting it going again. Again i will go back to the timing of these ridiculous "showcases". I think if a kid can play he will be noticed. If his high school coach thinks he can play then he should help him find a place to play. These showcases are money making ventures and I just dont know if high school ball and a good summer season would not be enough to get a kid noticed.
Being great in any endever takes hard work. And to stay at that level takes work. Not to mention working hard to improove!
Lets put it this way.
What would happen to a virtuoso instrimentalist if his instructor said I want you to stop playing for a few months to rest your chops?
If you want to be the best you better work your a** off!!!!!!!!!!
Lets put it this way.
What would happen to a virtuoso instrimentalist if his instructor said I want you to stop playing for a few months to rest your chops?
If you want to be the best you better work your a** off!!!!!!!!!!
I have to agree with TeamAce
quote:Shutting down a pitcher does NOT mean doing nothing, just not live pitching or max-effort throwing. Son is working out 6 days a week. His program includes core strength and aerobic workouts; lots of leg work; pitching form and balance drills. Every day has light throwing and every other week a 7th day is added for a low pitch-count, non-max effort, bullpen. The program and player is supervised and monitored. Is this the norm, NO WAY! But he works with a core group of kids who are serious enough to put in this kind of time in the off-season. IMO, this is the time that pitchers should work to gain strength and work on form and control. During the season a pitcher will work just as hard to maintain his strength while working on technique for maximum velocity.
If you want to be the best you better work your a** off!!!!!!!!!!
RHP05Parent....
I also agree with TeamAce.......but the true definition of shutting down is not throwing. It has nothing to do with eliminating strength work, running and overall conditioning, it is specifid to shutting down the throwing arm.
Certainly a pitcher who wants to improve will make a great effort to improve core strength and conditioning while he is shut down.
I also agree with TeamAce.......but the true definition of shutting down is not throwing. It has nothing to do with eliminating strength work, running and overall conditioning, it is specifid to shutting down the throwing arm.
Certainly a pitcher who wants to improve will make a great effort to improve core strength and conditioning while he is shut down.
All MLB pitchers throw in the off-season. Come on, you know better. What, you thought they just put away their glove and watched re-runs of "Friends" while on their stationary bike.
Not only Friends but also Law & Order. I think some pitchers with many innings the previous year will not touch a ball until December. Maybe PGstaff who has a son in the majors, or one of the other posters with MLB affiliation can give us the skinny on the pros take of "shutdown".
My son was told to shut down for 3 weeks from weights and throwing (by his club). He still did the stationary bike, basic cals, and running as part of his life program.
One thing that some of the parents here with kids in hs and college forget is the amount of work and throwing during the season for the guys in the minors.
At rookie ball my son was on the field by 8 and not off until 5 most days. Then there is fall instructs. All that was after a hs season. Or in some guys cases, spring training. Pro ball is a long and grueling season.
If any one thinks that taking a couple of weeks off will cause a significant loss in skills is wrong imo. After getting back, it only takes 2 weeks of throwing and long toss to get back into throwing shape. Don't get me wrong, my son works harder than most.
Baseball is my son's career. Right now he works out 4-6 hours a day. Two sessions. One in the morning for stretching (30 min), lifecycle (45 min), core and trunk stabilization work (30 min), weight room (90 min).
In the afternoon, plyos, agilities, interval running program, throwing, pfp's, dry work, and hitting. (2-2 1/2 hours).
Now he even is learning about proper nutrition. That is so important to maintaining good health and strength during the long season. I saw a lot of guys in the GCL lose 5 mph by the end of the summer just from the grind.
He was not able to put in those kind of hours during hs. So I understand not taking time off during hs. We took very little, but still shut him down from pitching at least 2 weeks every year.
The quantity of work out and the quality is what is important. You don't lose a lot by taking time off as long as you still do cardio and cals.
This is only my opinion. If someone doesn't need time off, no problem. I just don't buy that taking a couple of weeks off will put you way behind in training. JMO
One thing that some of the parents here with kids in hs and college forget is the amount of work and throwing during the season for the guys in the minors.
At rookie ball my son was on the field by 8 and not off until 5 most days. Then there is fall instructs. All that was after a hs season. Or in some guys cases, spring training. Pro ball is a long and grueling season.
If any one thinks that taking a couple of weeks off will cause a significant loss in skills is wrong imo. After getting back, it only takes 2 weeks of throwing and long toss to get back into throwing shape. Don't get me wrong, my son works harder than most.
Baseball is my son's career. Right now he works out 4-6 hours a day. Two sessions. One in the morning for stretching (30 min), lifecycle (45 min), core and trunk stabilization work (30 min), weight room (90 min).
In the afternoon, plyos, agilities, interval running program, throwing, pfp's, dry work, and hitting. (2-2 1/2 hours).
Now he even is learning about proper nutrition. That is so important to maintaining good health and strength during the long season. I saw a lot of guys in the GCL lose 5 mph by the end of the summer just from the grind.
He was not able to put in those kind of hours during hs. So I understand not taking time off during hs. We took very little, but still shut him down from pitching at least 2 weeks every year.
The quantity of work out and the quality is what is important. You don't lose a lot by taking time off as long as you still do cardio and cals.
This is only my opinion. If someone doesn't need time off, no problem. I just don't buy that taking a couple of weeks off will put you way behind in training. JMO
That is what im saying, the original question was shutting down throwing. The arm needs some rest, throwing is something that is not natural.
Major league pitchers do stop throwing for an extended amount of time. Nobody said they lay around and watch tv. The keep their body in shape and work on core strength. As i said before there is a reason they shut down the throwing. If you dont take some time off then you will be looking at problems down the road. It may not be right away, it may be a month or 2 down the road but you will have problems if your arm does not get some kind of rest during the winter. Im still looking for schilling,oswalt,pryor,wood, any mlb starter that is throwing in a winter league.
Major league pitchers do stop throwing for an extended amount of time. Nobody said they lay around and watch tv. The keep their body in shape and work on core strength. As i said before there is a reason they shut down the throwing. If you dont take some time off then you will be looking at problems down the road. It may not be right away, it may be a month or 2 down the road but you will have problems if your arm does not get some kind of rest during the winter. Im still looking for schilling,oswalt,pryor,wood, any mlb starter that is throwing in a winter league.
That's very different from the original post. Yes, I would agree depending on your particular situation, sometimes several weeks rest is the perfect RX for a pitching arm. If you have pain or some kind of injury that also changes the situation completely. However, the original post was to "shut-down" for several months (the entire off-season" for no particular reason except to rest. Again, all training, throwing/pitching routines need to be administered intelligently for the long haul. Putting emphesis on rest and recuperation between maximum efforts. The majority of arm injuring are from two causes. First, not warming-up properly and getting the arm ready to throw. Secondly, not throwing enough on a regular basis. The pitcher who has to many maximum effort days and not enough min.-to-medium practice throwing days is an injury waiting to happen.
I just spoke to my son who worked out with Matt Ford of the Brewers today (liftiing). Matt told him that he shuts down every year until Dec 1.
I guess different strokes for different folks.
I guess different strokes for different folks.
again throwing is unnatural and the arm can only handle so much that is why we have off season. Lift, run,long toss. Stop throwing from the mound and rest. All the good ones do.
Around december start busting your tail and get yourself game ready. Dont go too fast!!!
Our guys throw in the 1st scrimmage about 30 pitches and then we move up from there. Come on guys that is common sense. Why do you think the pros have spring training and pitch counts.
Around december start busting your tail and get yourself game ready. Dont go too fast!!!
Our guys throw in the 1st scrimmage about 30 pitches and then we move up from there. Come on guys that is common sense. Why do you think the pros have spring training and pitch counts.
Big,
I enjoyed reading your post and found it most informative.
I think that regardless of where a player is at or what his coach tells him (LL, HS,college, pro), the general consensus is that a pitcher's arm needs some rest once in a while.
I enjoyed reading your post and found it most informative.
I think that regardless of where a player is at or what his coach tells him (LL, HS,college, pro), the general consensus is that a pitcher's arm needs some rest once in a while.
Grateful hit on something in his first post. Go to www.asmi.org [american sports medicine institute - headed by the noted Dr James Andrews - pre-eminent "shoulder guy" in the country] they have a "Pitchers Conditioning Program" for $10, which outlines the entire year of training in 4 phases - Preparation, Pre-Season, Competition Period, and "active rest" - they advocate a 2 month active rest period. This is a 40 page booklet with many photos demonstrating the exercises - weight training, plyo's, flexibility, rotator cuff exercises, etc. Best 10 bucks you can spend!! The ortho that did my rotator cuff surgery 15 yrs ago trained under Dr. Andrews [who operated on Mike Schmidt and Charles Barkley, among others - 'nuf said!]
Shutting down until February is too long, showcases or not! Case in point - ck out Big15's post - Ford says he shuts down until Dec 1 - may be a coincidence, but that's 2 months from the end of the season, 3 months to prepare for spring training - pretty consistent with asmi program
Shutting down until February is too long, showcases or not! Case in point - ck out Big15's post - Ford says he shuts down until Dec 1 - may be a coincidence, but that's 2 months from the end of the season, 3 months to prepare for spring training - pretty consistent with asmi program
Big & Windmill
Exactly. Well thoughtout training programs. There are many (won't endorse a particular one) with a periodization of rest. This is pretty consistent and common to most training programs. Which brings up another training question (again there are many views on this) How do you feel about conditioning & weightlifting during the season? I don't mean tubes and light dumbell work. I am talking about progressive resistance weight training. To destructive or helpfull?
Exactly. Well thoughtout training programs. There are many (won't endorse a particular one) with a periodization of rest. This is pretty consistent and common to most training programs. Which brings up another training question (again there are many views on this) How do you feel about conditioning & weightlifting during the season? I don't mean tubes and light dumbell work. I am talking about progressive resistance weight training. To destructive or helpfull?
A power pitcher had better train during the season.
Nolan Ryan used to lift on game days.
If you are used to lifting and you recover quickly, I see no problem with lifting during the season.
Nolan Ryan used to lift on game days.
If you are used to lifting and you recover quickly, I see no problem with lifting during the season.
I also agree that continuing weight training during the season is vital for pitchers, and as BigHit said, recovery is pretty quick if one has maintained his conditioning.
To be a good baseball player these days you must work with a sports specific program in the off season and in season. Baseball has become a sport that very few can play if they do not work at it all year. It used to be the best baseball players were the football players coming over, but now this all year stuff has caused a difficulty for 2 sport players. There are some very gifted athletes that can do it but for the most part if you look at 4a and 5a rosters probably 70% are straight baseball. Then you add the fact that alot of football coaches are A.D.'s and now you have a whole different discussion. (spring football off season weights) dont get me started on that topic.
in summary you definetly need an in season workout and an off season workout.
in summary you definetly need an in season workout and an off season workout.
Shutting down is necessary for some people, not all. I know people who have energy levels that would eschew the idea of taking time off from what they love doing.
There is a big difference between functioning in the crucible of intense competition, like in-season competition, and maintaining skills in the off season by playing a more relaxed schedule that Fall Ball and Winter Ball offer.
Though the player is not shutting down he is not losing anything either by being idle.
Someone asked about free time activities and spiritual activities for renewal of the soul. I can attest that these are participated in but not in the quantity that those kids who are not envolved in a competitive sport. The sacrifice that is being made is in the amount of time delegated to non-baseball related activity.
I have another son that is not highly motivated to push himself toward excellence in a sport and he spends more time in non-productive endeavors that are more satisfying to him, but would be viewed as a waste of time by by son who is the baseball player. Each has his own fine attributes and both are responsible and worthy people...just different in what they consider important.
There is a big difference between functioning in the crucible of intense competition, like in-season competition, and maintaining skills in the off season by playing a more relaxed schedule that Fall Ball and Winter Ball offer.
Though the player is not shutting down he is not losing anything either by being idle.
Someone asked about free time activities and spiritual activities for renewal of the soul. I can attest that these are participated in but not in the quantity that those kids who are not envolved in a competitive sport. The sacrifice that is being made is in the amount of time delegated to non-baseball related activity.
I have another son that is not highly motivated to push himself toward excellence in a sport and he spends more time in non-productive endeavors that are more satisfying to him, but would be viewed as a waste of time by by son who is the baseball player. Each has his own fine attributes and both are responsible and worthy people...just different in what they consider important.