Steroid Testing @ HS Level

We have pushed for a drug testing program in general. I want everything tested. Legality issues are the main drawback. Currently, we are discussing bringing in a guy that has dealt with many legal issues concerning drug testing in high schools. Don't know his name but hope that we will further our studies. Steriods, while terrible, are not remotely close to the biggest drug problem our athletes have.

I am a political liberal and I think high schools should test athletes for steroids, and should have the right to test. It is in the health and safety interest of the kids. I know it is a can of worms because of fights against other types of random drug test for other types of illegal drugs.

It is harder to tell in hs kids than pros if they are taking steroids because some of the telltale signs, acne, extreme muscle growth and body changes can be normal in teenage athletes.

Backinil , There is a voluminous amount of information available from public domain sources that identify this as a significant problem at the HS level. You probably don't have to go far to hear stories about certain schools and how drastically some of the kids change and develop after enrolling in a sport or how they changed after spending a summer at (a well known gym) As coach stated, it probably pales in comparison with other "issues" facing this age group. That being said, I think the way to proceed would be developing aggressive programs that place an emphasis on the dangers, not only physical but criminal as well. The schools and athletic programs need to be proactive and really make a concerted effort, utilizing trained professionals and guest speakers (people that have been ravaged or lost everything because of steroids) to hopefully change the perceptions that seem to prevail. The other idea, would be to make it a requirement to sign an agreement that you will voluntarily agree to testing as a participant in the athletic programs. "Scared Straight"

CoachB25.

I Have very seldom disagreed with any of your posts.

Drug testing as it stands in the US market place is a costly procedure when done correctly, has extremely limited results when using only urine and is intrusive for the vast majority.

Alcohol (the # 1 problem, imo) is virtually undetectable as it leaves the body immediately.

Other hard drugs (cocaine, heroin etc.) have similar short term testing windows.

Only marajuana with regular or even occasional use stays in the body long enough to be detected.

A hair or blood test is far too costly...and are the only methods that can truly test for drugs other than marajuana or alcohol.

In a perfect world the testing would root out the cheaters (steroids) and maybe save some kids lives with the other drugs/alcohol usage.
However, you never will see it in IL. A huge percentage of our school districts are in dire financial situations. Many of these schools are borrowing just to buy books and keep their buildings in functional condition. Some need metal detectors & more police presence. It's a great idea but as Soxnole said cost of testing alone is prohibitive not to mention all the legal challenges.

Soxnole, I understand and agree. Believe me, I don't really support in my heart what I posted but I'm at my wit's end with regards to these kids. Perhaps it comes down to a Poster I have in my classroom which states, "YOU CAN'T FEED A ROCK!" Maybe you can't help someone that doesn't want help. We have had a lot of tragedy in our school district this year and I'm just searching for any answer or deterrant. JMHO!

FYI, we have had 3 deaths in our community in the last 2 weeks. Several others are in critical condition. Mary Jo Baumgartner, who works so hard in our booster club and Mom of my former 2nd baseman was among those when she was involved in a head on accident when another driver crossed the centerline of Rt. 40. Monday we had another crash on the same spot. Another death. We are waiting on results of why yet another driver crossed the centerline. 4 people are in critical condition from that crash. Another student of mine drove her car under a semi this past week. Some of her passengers are in the hospital and one is dead. She is being held due to Alcohol use. That was not a mile away from the other spot. Like I said, just looking for some answers.

All athletes at OPRF are required to sit through an imformational meeting as a team at the start of the year. This is the first year of the program so it is hard to say how effective it will be. The J Kyle Braid foundation takes up the issues of steriod use at our high school any many of the larger high school in the surburbs. For those you don't know about the foundation I will try my best to explain. J Kyle Braid was a high school student form Florida that killed himself after taking steroids. His parents Ken and Colleen have taking up the fight against distructive behavior by teens, starting a leadership foundation and ranch in colorado. The choose various high schools around the country to select leaders to attend the ranch and bring the message back to thier high school. Oak Park, Hinsdales, Downers, Naperville north and south, LT, just to name a few of the participating schools have helped educate kids on destructive behavior. The West surburban conference has an all day work shop for 40 athletes per school that the braids facilitate to discuss these issues. It is a start in the right direction. I kind of got off subject, but wanted people to know about the J kyle Braid foundation because that is why they started this leadership group.

Ballfan, I think what your school district is doing is a great idea. I sat through a steroid talk that was similar last summer. They had a doctor talk, some kids, a few others and a physical trainer. Then man by the name of Hootn talked about his son, a high school pitcher out of texas, that commited suicide in his house after trying to get off of steroids. You could have heard a pin drop every parent, coach and player had theirs eyes on this man. I can't imagine the pain that he went through and how strong he was to talk to these kids. I wisk it was mandatory, will it stick with these kids, I don't know for sure but I can still see him in my mind as he talked about his son and the entire steroid process. It opened my eyes. The biggest thing that concerns me is the high schools themselves. We all see some that enforce other drug and alcohol program and some that seem to turn a blind eye. So I think you need to get to the athlete themselves. I also didn't think it was that prevalent in hs baseball but after listening to this man you have to consider it much more.

Lineshot, It puts it all into perspective. So many parent's,coaches, friends are passionate about the kids and baseball and sometimes the arguments on this site go a little overboard. when you hear about these two families having to deal with a son that has taken his life, you have to stop and think. As coaches, parents and friends we all need to take a harder look at the influences that our boys are dealing with. These things are happening to great kids with great families and support. Don't turn an eye on this, you may have to deal with it the rest of your life.

During my son's code of conduct meeting for winter sports, the kids, and parents, were shown a video of the terrible effects of steroids. The AD said that they were mandated to show it to us, but I can't remember if he said whether the school district or IHSA mandated the video. It was powerful and included the parents of the young baseball player who died, who was subpoenaed by Congress during the MLB testimony in the spring.

Ballfan & Tuzigoot excellent posts..Hopefully some of these ideas and the information contained herein will get in the hands of school administrators, resulting in enhancements in the school districts that need it! Anything that can have a beneficial impact on the kids would be great!

I think that that steriod testing for hs players is ridiculous and not necessary. Don't get me wrong steriods are a major problem in baseball. However, its hard to imagine having a high school students day go, 1) math 2)English 3)Lunch 4)Gym 5) Science 6)Steriod testing 7)Baseball game.

Steroids are of course nasty stuff and if one HS kid is using them, that is one too many. The problem lies at the root and that is where a kid thinks they might be able to go with the added advantage of steroids. It is a fine line between going all-out in a sport you love and are good at and the simple math that tells you how long the odds are in actually making it in a way that could remotely justify taking that risk. I think that most kids who are balanced....that is that although they may a great player, they still have a life complete with being a serious student are not so much at risk as are those who really think they are going to make it and don't care about other things. It is a lot like the Ghetto Mentality we see in basketball. These kids need to know that they should keep opening doors in their baseball career, but it is icing on the cake should they get there. If it isn't enough to play to enjoy it now, you probably shouldn't be playing. Tommorrow is promised to no one.

quote:

Originally posted by bballdad1954:
I am a political liberal and I think high schools should test athletes for steroids, and should have the right to test. It is in the health and safety interest of the kids. I know it is a can of worms because of fights against other types of random drug test for other types of illegal drugs.

It is harder to tell in hs kids than pros if they are taking steroids because some of the telltale signs, acne, extreme muscle growth and body changes can be normal in teenage athletes.

I am on the same page politically as you and feel the same way. Good post.

Goose, What if the possibility of a random test was enough to scare the temptation right out of the kids? What if random test day was scheduled after school or on a Saturday, and it was done privately and didn't occur between math and science. I'm guessing the majority of people viewing this don't consider the idea of implementing some kind of testing "ridiculous" I also think, based on what I have read, that the percentage of teenagers experimenting with steroids is far more prevalent than many believe. You really must hit this from every angle...classes devoted to the topic, speakers, visits from law enforcement detailing the ramifications from utilizing controlled substances, and yes testing! and what I feel is just as important..the threat of testing. A positive result... Zero tolerance..your banned from all sporting activities and the record of the infraction goes on the college transcript. If this can be hammered home! I think you will see a decrease in the abuse, as we will now see in the MLB!!

Travel.
You would have made an excellent German citizen in the 1940's.

travel ball,
I just think that there is no place u can draw the line with testing for steriods. Would u just test baseball and football players? Why not test the wrestling team or the Gymnastics team?
Would u test boys and not girls? Would u test all of the schools in Illinois? Yea sure there could be kids taking steriods in Naperville, Schamburg, Lyons Township, or Lockport but r there really kids taking steriods in the city, where it is hard enough to field a team and get a field.
These are some questions that I think are too hard to justifiably answer, thus u can't have testing.

Well said goose. If your going to test, then IHSA needs a plan that works for all sports and for all drugs not just Steroids, but I really don’t see that happing. Drugs are used by most of the student body. Witch includes student athletes. Steroids are used in high school but not just athletes use them. If any thing, I would worry about testing for other drugs. I know plenty of high school stand outs from top high school programs that take Steroids and other drugs. And when I go back and look at some players who I seen play that went on to D 1 or D 2 schools and there not on the rosters any more. Do really know sometimes why they’re not on there. From the top of my head I Know four stand out D 1 and D2 players who got kicked out of the team for Marijuana.
all from upper class families.

Goose, I don't recall saying just football & baseball. Testing if introduced with the proper legal standards and parental consent would in my opinion act as a viable deterrant. Intrusive yes, well something needs to be done. Seems like a better approach than burying ones head in the sand? Soxnole I'm sure my Waspy ancestors would appreciate that and I'm also an excellent citizen now..!

The only way you can say that "Drugs are being taken by most of the student body" is if you include alcohol. And that includes kids who just tried rather than drink regulary. Testing won't happen because the broad spectrum...numbers of sports and other co-curricular activities make it very hard. The threat of random testing may be a factor.

We seem to be moving away from zero tolerance anyway. MLB Players still get at least two chances to screw up.....and you can't take them "accidently" so it is completely under a player's control. Here at BHS we used to have zero tolerance for athletes covering drugs & alcohol. About 5 years ago one of our D-1 football recruits got busted for drinking and did get kicked off the team. The reaction was that it was too harsh and now kids only miss a small portion of the season if they have a violation. Kids won't be deterred from using steroids or other drugs if we have those kinds of penalties even if there was testing. One more thing...for those who say that parents need to leave kids on their own regarding sports....let them do it on their own.....WRONG! The best way to stop things like steroids is to be involved...oversee and have an interest in their training and who they are training with. Yes, once they are on the field they are on their own, but if you aren't involved and interested the chances of these kinds of things happening are much greater.

Fastball:

quote:

Kids won't be deterred from using steroids or other drugs if we have those kinds of penalties even if there was testing. One more thing...for those who say that parents need to leave kids on their own regarding sports....let them do it on their own.....WRONG! The best way to stop things like steroids is to be involved...oversee and have an interest in their training and who they are training with. Yes, once they are on the field they are on their own, but if you aren't involved and interested the chances of these kinds of things happening are much greater.

I disagree with the first portion of the aforementioned quote, why do you think they won't be deterred? If I am an aspiring student athlete, not quite big enough or fast enough to garner scouting attention (pretty accurate description, my playing day shape of 6'2"180 waved bye bye long ago) ...and feel the temptation to try the magic pill...I would probably study the ramifications closely..random testing and accompanying severe penalties! Parental involvement is without question first in the line of defense! A blood test at school physical time...Then less intrusive random U testing! What is rising to the top of the discussion is the use of a random testing may be the key to deterring! Some schools are already implementing breathalyzer tests for alcohol at dances and sporting events and seems to be working!

fastball, I respectfully do AGREE!!!

Lineshot do you have a thought of your own?? or shall we look to Fastball for guidance??

Travelball, yes I do and yes I ahve posted my opnions here. Do you know how to read or did you just miss the ones I posted. By the way don't give me the attitude I am way to far along in life to listen to that garbage.

Where are the dollars going to come from to administer steroid testing in our high schools? As much as we all would like to see some level of this I have to agree with soxnole it is very expensive and most of us seem to be looking past the economics to administrate a program like this. Education and awareness, educate the kids and yourself and be aware of the physical and emotional changes that are symptoms of steroids and then don't be afraid to challenge your kid.

quote:

Originally posted by Goose:
I think that that steriod testing for hs players is ridiculous and not necessary. Don't get me wrong steriods are a major problem in baseball. However, its hard to imagine having a high school students day go, 1) math 2)English 3)Lunch 4)Gym 5) Science 6)Steriod testing 7)Baseball game.

History? Goose, where is History? Come on cut me some slack no history = No CoachB25 teaching position. LOL!

Travel Ball...I'm not sure we disagree. I said that if we continue to downtrend the penalties away from zero tolerance they won't be deterred. With severe penalties they may be.....I was just commenting on the trend away from zero tolerance.

Another thing Travel....there is still plenty of room for a 6' 2" 180 baseball player on any level! I have been amazed to see some of the best players around here are not all that big. Obviously good and big beats good and small every time.....but there are some outstanding players that aren't as big as you were.

Travel,
Not trying to be combatant, just informed. I just spent numerous hours on the public domain and could not find anything suggesting that steroid use is a BIG problem at the high school level. However, it may depend on what your definition of “big problem”. Drugs in general maybe, but specific to steroids, I could not find anything. Please direct me to a specific site. Mind you, IMO even one high school athlete taking steroids is a problem.

I agree with drug testing in high school. The Supreme Court gave the public schools the authority, ruling in June of 2002. If testing keeps one kid off drugs (steroids) it is more than worth the effort. Just about every sports governing body has a drug testing policy, why not the IHSA. However, the reality of enforcing legislated/mandated drug testing at the high school level is a can of worms; legal, cost, management, enforcement, etc. Therefore, IMO drug testing in HS is difficult to implement.

The buck stops with the parents. Talk with your kids. Tell them that steroid/drug use is not an option and will not be tolerated. If you think your son or daughter is using steroids (or any other drug) take them to your doc and get them tested. Don’t wait for the local high school to do it… Educating student athletes, parents, coaches, and administrators about the health consequences associated with steroid use is the answer. Parents first and then coaches must take the responsibility of educating student athletes, recognizing steroid use/abuse and enforcing a policy with consequences.

ballfan, well said. You’ve got it right. All coaches should take your lead. You’re not only a great coach but a real leader with the power to influence your team.

Keep it Teal…….

Lots of interesting thoughts! I know one thing for sure, teenagers don't believe it will happen to THEM. Always someone else. I also believe the environment surrounding sports, created almost entirely by adults, leads kids to be willing to take the risks in the short term and not really care about long term ramifications(other than where their careers will take them).

As for drug testing/control I find it interesting how some people are more concerned with a kid's privacy than keeping him off drugs, weed, cocaine, heroin, or whatever. For example a local high school where I live is experiencing a battle between law enforcement and school board/parents regarding drug sniffing dogs being allowed in the school. One of the officers is a good friend of mine and says it blows his mind how these parents would rather preserve the privacy of a kid's locker contents than fight drug possession in the school. Interestingly one of those parents that is adamantly against the dogs happens to smoke the whacky weed frequently.

I think you guys did a great job on this thread. The financial aspect is something I hadn't thought of, and is probably a deal breaker as far as testing. After all, many schools are cutting sports do to funding probles as it is. Parent involvement is the key as itis in many aspects of a kids life. The best thing is to set an example in how you as a parent act. If you smoke, drink to excess, or use the weed, your kids probably will as well.

I posted this response to a thread about how easy can steriods be obtained...

"The answer is all of the above.....they can be had, and if you have the $$$ you can get them....

But Don't......

Before you pass this by, I want you to know I know FIRSTHAND what steroids can do to your body..... I was a collegiate weightlifter and used steriods back before there was the data on the side effects and long-term conditions that steroid can bring...

I have to take long term maintenece medications for blood pressure and thyroid because of the damage I caused. I have suffered over the years with joint pain caused by the over stress of muscles on my frame....

This is not a way to live and the gains you will get from them arent worth the long term effects....and dont ever let anyone tell you that they KNOW how to take them to keep you from harming yourself.....Gym room pharmacists are just as deadly as the local drug dealer....

I took them for less than 1 year.......and that was 25 years ago.......my damage will never go away...

Maybe some of us who know first hand the damages need to step up our efforts to speak with athletes regarding avoiding using steroids....we need a voice to counteract the gym pharmacists who tell young athletes that there is a safe way to take steroids....

just my $.02

Great post piaa. In the end it's up to the kid. All schools/coaches/parents can do is educate them to the risks and hope they make the right decision. The government has thrown billions of dollars at poverty,drugs etc. and they still exist at the same percentages or worse than ever. Some people will make bad decisions no matter what programs are in place or what anyone tries to legislate.
I just became aware of a kid who is using. Comes from a solid family/school, knows the risks, doesn't care. People like piaa and various groups who do the presentations at schools are a great help though and I'm sure they convince lots of kids to stay clean.

I noticed many comments concerning the costs of educating our kids on steroids. I realize that the schools don't or won't come up with the money. The seminar that I described in an earlier posts was free. That had the talk from Mr. Hooton who also talked at the congressional hearings last year. He lost his son to a suicide while coming off of steroids. I don't know for sure but I assume it was free because they combined it with fitness people that also went over the proper way to train and also advertised their product or service to the people in the audience. It is not testing but i think you would definatly get through to many kids and adults in the audience for no price at all.

No one disputes that financial concerns way heavily with regard to the implementation of testing and/or awayness programs. This is a problem that only seems to be getting worse, the administrations, athletic departments and parents need to find some common ground. Interesting post by James Donovan and a bit disturbing. Lineshot, didn't mean to provoke you, was just curious about your interpretation of the topic. What about the athletic kid that doesn't grow up in the leafy burbs, with a Mom driving the Range Rover and dad in the Beemer? No daddy connections to the IVY schools, no pops to help guide down that path...Just a single mom raising him and the kid looking for an edge..to get that scholarship. We better find a way to help that kind of kid out..if we don't the community as a whole fails!

Some of the arguements posted against drug testing and thinking it can't happen because of money issues were some of the same points raised when talking aobut urine tests for wrestlers. Well guess what, it took a few kids doing damage to thier bodies by cutting weight too fast too make a change. High school wrestlers are required to submit to a urine hydration test at the beginning of the year to set their competition weight. In time, a simple test for steroids will be developed and we will be faced with the decision to test or not to test. Until then, do what you can to help kids fight the temptation. Fear is not a good teacher, education is.

I am definitely in favor of testing at the HS level. As far as funds are concerned, the school district should be held accountable. The amount of monies wasted are shameful. Testing needs to fall into the high priority level.

From TravelBallSelect

quote:

No one disputes that financial concerns way heavily with regard to the implementation of testing and/or awayness programs.

Financial concerns DO WEIGH heavily....
And just as important as preventing steroid use is the more prevalent use of other drugs and alcohol.

I am told that daily testing would be the only answer because the problem in high school is that bad.

CoachB25:

I'm sorry to hear about all of the tragedy, pain, and suffering that your school and community has experienced. It's a tough time of the year to endure all of that...and your students will be leaning on you...you're capable...we're behind you coach.

Try and have a Merry Christmas and we'll pray that the New Year will bring better fortunes.