CPLZ,
How funny.
Not sure about where this topic is headed, but I hope that regardless of whatever has been posted by everyone, that each player continues to pursue the schools and baseball programs that are good fits for them, not based upon opinions of any poster in general.
That would also include what coaches may have to say about players when asked, good recruiters interested in players do their homework, because they need to field the best players for their program, regardless of academics and talent. One thing I noticed, many coaches recruit based on balance. You will find the player with a 4.0 and a player with a 2.8 coming into a program. Why, talent and academics have to balance each other for the coach to maintain his required GPA, plus his production on the field. Can't imagine how hard that job must be. That's why so many scratch their heads when they hear about who signed where, like he's not a good student but very good player, or he is an excellent student but doesn't have the talent I would expect for that program. The ultimate decision lies within the recruiting coach, he will do his homework if he is truely interested, regardless of what anyone else says, if he doesn't do this, he's not doing his job. And yes he can very well pull strings to get a player into a program that may not be otherwise eligible, but as a parent, that is not what I would be looking for, with the assumption that my student MAY do better in college. I know my son, good at time management, good student, good player, but we also knew (and he) that he was going to college for the total experience, we felt that the smaller classes and degrees offered were more suited for him, he didn't want to spend all of his time either on the field or in the classroom and that is why he was discouraged from pursuing engineering.
Did it matter where he went to school for his education, absolutely, just as much as it mattered where he went to play baseball.
The recruiting experience is unique for each and every player, and new rules change many things that were standard practice years ago, it is very hard to relate my son's recruiting experience to what is going on now, baseball money is hard to come by, it was pretty free flowing back then when the coach didn't have to give a minimum.
Unless you are a stud player that will make a significant impact, one MUST put in as much effort on their performance in the classroom as well as the field to remain competitive.
TPM,
I agree with everything you've said especially what I've quoted below. A lot people come to this site to learn about college and pro recruiting...myself included. I have learned so much but you captured it all.
"The recruiting experience is unique for each and every player, and new rules change many things that were standard practice years ago, it is very hard to relate my son's recruiting experience to what is going on now, baseball money is hard to come by, it was pretty free flowing back then when the coach didn't have to give a minimum."
Also, you made a comment about coaches and their recruiting "balance". Balance is everything. Let's face it, they have a really, really tough job. They look at many thousands of kids to fill a few/couple spots for their school or organization based on so many criteria. I know a lot of them love what they do, and many are really good at it. A man has to know his limitions, and I know I couldn't do it. I've tried to put myself in their shoes, and I've come to respect them a lot more.
I agree with everything you've said especially what I've quoted below. A lot people come to this site to learn about college and pro recruiting...myself included. I have learned so much but you captured it all.
"The recruiting experience is unique for each and every player, and new rules change many things that were standard practice years ago, it is very hard to relate my son's recruiting experience to what is going on now, baseball money is hard to come by, it was pretty free flowing back then when the coach didn't have to give a minimum."
Also, you made a comment about coaches and their recruiting "balance". Balance is everything. Let's face it, they have a really, really tough job. They look at many thousands of kids to fill a few/couple spots for their school or organization based on so many criteria. I know a lot of them love what they do, and many are really good at it. A man has to know his limitions, and I know I couldn't do it. I've tried to put myself in their shoes, and I've come to respect them a lot more.
Thanks Fenwaysouth, my son's scholarship consisted of all baseball money, if he were to be recruited today, I doubt pretty much that would be the case, so as well as he did do in school, he might just have to do better for today's recruiting.
I thought things were competitive back then, boy have things changed.
That's why good grades are so imnportant.
I thought things were competitive back then, boy have things changed.
That's why good grades are so imnportant.
6 or 7 yrs ago i would have said, who cares about grades? hearing all the story's about athletes going here and there on full rides. why worry? if it looks to good to be true, it probably is.
being an acedemic under achiever myself i didn't know any better. not only didn't the apple's fall far from the tree...we didn't get much of a roll either. while they are both going to be fine in life, we'd approach things different today.
regardless of what you want to do in life, good grades aren't just important they should be a must.from the voice of experience.
being an acedemic under achiever myself i didn't know any better. not only didn't the apple's fall far from the tree...we didn't get much of a roll either. while they are both going to be fine in life, we'd approach things different today.
regardless of what you want to do in life, good grades aren't just important they should be a must.from the voice of experience.
I'll throw this in to the discussion. I went to college in the mid 70s. I went on an academic scholarship. I played baseball. Take that for what it is worth but my college coach often remarked that I was "for free." Of course I was terrible as well and so, I can't account for how good "for free" was. 
quote:BHD, you should also realize that college coaches do care about what kind of parents a player has, even though college coaches usually won't have much if any interaction with mom and dad beyond exchanging pleasantries. I was once trying to convince a college coach about what a great fit I thought one particular player would be for his program, and the response I got was "I know the kid would make us better, but his dad is a big *ssh*le and I won't have his kid on my team because I don't want to hear from his dad all the time."
I must admit, I find this a little surprising. I would think a college coach would have enough control and/or experience over at the collegiate level that the parent issue would be sooo select/high school and not an issue anymore. I guess not.
You would be surprised how many parents call the coach or AD on a regular basis , some even on a weekly basis
Coaches do not need the grief and aggravation and it certainly does not help the player---in fact it can hurt him
Coaches do not need the grief and aggravation and it certainly does not help the player---in fact it can hurt him
quote:Originally posted by workinghard:quote:BHD, you should also realize that college coaches do care about what kind of parents a player has, even though college coaches usually won't have much if any interaction with mom and dad beyond exchanging pleasantries. I was once trying to convince a college coach about what a great fit I thought one particular player would be for his program, and the response I got was "I know the kid would make us better, but his dad is a big *ssh*le and I won't have his kid on my team because I don't want to hear from his dad all the time."
I must admit, I find this a little surprising. I would think a college coach would have enough control and/or experience over at the collegiate level that the parent issue would be sooo select/high school and not an issue anymore. I guess not.
Don't let this statement shock you. That is why it is so important, IMO, for the parent to stay out of the recruiting process until they have to ( counter offers, questions before or after the offer), let the recruit develop his relationship with the coaches.
Funny thing a recruiting coach told us once, he really doesn't like dads calling and asking tons questions, but moms can call whenever they want and ask whatever they want.
I won't mention him by name, but we have discussed this coach here a few times and it wasn't my son's coach. Great sense of humor.
TPM
what are your thoughts on parents calling the coach after the boy is a rostered player? I am talking either Mom or Dad
what are your thoughts on parents calling the coach after the boy is a rostered player? I am talking either Mom or Dad
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
TPM
what are your thoughts on parents calling the coach after the boy is a rostered player? I am talking either Mom or Dad
TR depends on what for. If you are talking about calling to ask why son isn't playing, no, never.
Major injury to discuss options with coach, no problem.
Concern over grades should be directed to the athletic or academic advisor.
AD, NEVER.
It's tough question for me, as you know that I spoke to Sully on occasion and so did husband, but mostly due to the friendship, which is still to this day. But Sully was like that, he kept his line of communication open with all the pitchers parents, one mom was so distraught over her son going so far away he spoke to her everyday for a week to make her feel better. Clemson was an unusual situation, some parents of players from far away actually moved in their son's last season, it was not discouraged by the coaching staff, but I am not sure I agree with doing that.
I actually saw (and heard) a parent pull KO over to the side and went off because his son had lost his start, now that's not his business to tell coach how to run his team, for any level. It was embarrassing, some of us heard, in that case, call him up if you plan on making a scene.
Talked to HC twice over the phone during recruiting, that was it.
When you live so far away, have opportunities to send your son much closer to home, it's very tough, for us it was hard, but we knew and understood that, and trusted the coaches would take care of him, which they did, that doesn't happen often, so I should never say never call.
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
You would be surprised how many parents call the coach or AD on a regular basis , some even on a weekly basis
Coaches do not need the grief and aggravation and it certainly does not help the player---in fact it can hurt him
Then I'm a coach's dream, I never talk to the HC. Should I put this on the questionnaire?
55mom
I only advise the parents of my players what to do or not do
Sorry
I only advise the parents of my players what to do or not do
Sorry
I think she was kidding.
But I do strongly agree with TR's advice.
But I do strongly agree with TR's advice.
.
Here ya' go 20dad...Merry Christmas to you and your family!
.
- "...we didn't get much of a roll either."
Here ya' go 20dad...Merry Christmas to you and your family!
.
TPM,
Again great advice coming from someone who has been there done that. I won't be in those shoes until next year. I'm not the type of parent to call a coach regardless, but it is good to see there is protocol to follow, and it makes sense. Let the coaches "coach", and parents "parent".
Again great advice coming from someone who has been there done that. I won't be in those shoes until next year. I'm not the type of parent to call a coach regardless, but it is good to see there is protocol to follow, and it makes sense. Let the coaches "coach", and parents "parent".
quote:TR depends on what for. If you are talking about calling to ask why son isn't playing, no, never.
Major injury to discuss options with coach, no problem.
Concern over grades should be directed to the athletic or academic advisor.
AD, NEVER.
Talked to HC twice over the phone during recruiting, that was it.
quote:Originally posted by TPM:
I think she was kidding.
But I do strongly agree with TR's advice.
oh I am kidding!
In an attempt to steer things back on track,I'll contribute what I tell my players and parents about the role of academics in the pursuit of an opporunity to play collegiate baseball.
Your academics are very important, every bit as much as your baseball playing ability. If you aspire to play in college at a 4-year university then you'll have to be as succesful as possible in the classroom. Just being a 'NCAA Qualifier' isn't good enough these days, as Academic Progress Ratings (APR) are as much a concern with college coaches as whether you can pitch or hit a fastball. If a prospective college coach has doubts about your academic abilities for his institution, he'll be as shy as if he thinks you aren't the player for his program. If you expect to receive money beyond any potential athletic aid, then you'd better strive to keep your cumulative core GPA above 3.5, with SAT math and verbal scores of at least 1200. Below those levels you won't seen any academic aid (and many schools require even higher grades/scores for academic aid).
I'll finish by telling a story about a conversation I had earlier this year that provided excellent information for anyone who aspires to go to a top level academic univesity. As background, in 2006 two of the young men who played for us, Lars Anderson and Tim Wheeler, were offered athletic scholarships to play for Stanford. Now, Lars and Tim were outstanding students at demanding high schools, both with 4.0 or higher core GPA's and high SAT & ACT scores. Both are also top baseball players (Lars is now a top prospect for the Red Sox and Tim was a 1st round draft pick of the Rockies last June.) Both were denied admission into Stanford, so clearly both they and the baseball coaches were stunned. Stanford had a new Dean of Admissions at that time who apparently had issues with athletes (which has since been resolved!) and these outstanding student athletes were both denied admission. Anyway, with that in mind, while we've had players go on to play for nearly every other northern California university that plays D1 baseball, we've never had a player get into Stanford. This past July at the Area Code tryouts, I was standing next to Coach Nakama of Stanford and we struck up a conversation about what it takes these days for a good player to get into Stanford. Coach Nakama said (this is excellent advice every student who aspires to get into a top university should keep in mind): "A student must have all A's and B's, with more A's than B's. He cannot have a C in any class at all. If he achieves that with high test scores, he's someone who'll be academically eligible for consideration." No matter which top university a student athlete aspires to attend, I think that's very good advice!
I also wonder what Stanford might have done the last 3 years if Lars and Timmy had been Cardinals?
Your academics are very important, every bit as much as your baseball playing ability. If you aspire to play in college at a 4-year university then you'll have to be as succesful as possible in the classroom. Just being a 'NCAA Qualifier' isn't good enough these days, as Academic Progress Ratings (APR) are as much a concern with college coaches as whether you can pitch or hit a fastball. If a prospective college coach has doubts about your academic abilities for his institution, he'll be as shy as if he thinks you aren't the player for his program. If you expect to receive money beyond any potential athletic aid, then you'd better strive to keep your cumulative core GPA above 3.5, with SAT math and verbal scores of at least 1200. Below those levels you won't seen any academic aid (and many schools require even higher grades/scores for academic aid).
I'll finish by telling a story about a conversation I had earlier this year that provided excellent information for anyone who aspires to go to a top level academic univesity. As background, in 2006 two of the young men who played for us, Lars Anderson and Tim Wheeler, were offered athletic scholarships to play for Stanford. Now, Lars and Tim were outstanding students at demanding high schools, both with 4.0 or higher core GPA's and high SAT & ACT scores. Both are also top baseball players (Lars is now a top prospect for the Red Sox and Tim was a 1st round draft pick of the Rockies last June.) Both were denied admission into Stanford, so clearly both they and the baseball coaches were stunned. Stanford had a new Dean of Admissions at that time who apparently had issues with athletes (which has since been resolved!) and these outstanding student athletes were both denied admission. Anyway, with that in mind, while we've had players go on to play for nearly every other northern California university that plays D1 baseball, we've never had a player get into Stanford. This past July at the Area Code tryouts, I was standing next to Coach Nakama of Stanford and we struck up a conversation about what it takes these days for a good player to get into Stanford. Coach Nakama said (this is excellent advice every student who aspires to get into a top university should keep in mind): "A student must have all A's and B's, with more A's than B's. He cannot have a C in any class at all. If he achieves that with high test scores, he's someone who'll be academically eligible for consideration." No matter which top university a student athlete aspires to attend, I think that's very good advice!
I also wonder what Stanford might have done the last 3 years if Lars and Timmy had been Cardinals?
Confused - they were offered an athletic scholarship and denied admission? A college can give out a scholarship before a student is accepted to the school? I guess I never knew that.
I meant the travel coach didn't have the info. Any coach in our district can look up their player's grades online any time they want. They get a weekly report on any player either academically ineligible or in the (determined by the district) danger zone. The ineligibility line at our high school is above the state requirement. If a player has an F for a week he/she's ineligible until the situation is remedied. It may not be fair at times to the athlete. But the high school has a 97% on to college rate.quote:RJM non of our coaches had any info.
I'm not sure the guys in the picture would be interested in having a women in their group hug. Not that there's anything wrong with that!quote:I dont know if my husband would want me in that group hug.