Has the slider become the pitch that college recruiters like to see from a high school pitcher. Would they prefer a great change first?
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They say that the college pitch of choice is the slider? Mine never really relied on his slider to get noticed.
Concentrate on the change, FB, the safer pitches for a young arm, a good pitching coach will help the college pitcher to perfect the slider, his change,his curve, his fastball, whatever.
A college recruiter looks for pitchers movement, coachability before perfect pitches. Many like to make their own changes or teach it their way.
I am understanding that my son, whose slider was more of a slurve, somewhat effective, is now learning to throw a slider, the way his coach prefers. It has been a work in progress.
JMO.
Concentrate on the change, FB, the safer pitches for a young arm, a good pitching coach will help the college pitcher to perfect the slider, his change,his curve, his fastball, whatever.
A college recruiter looks for pitchers movement, coachability before perfect pitches. Many like to make their own changes or teach it their way.
I am understanding that my son, whose slider was more of a slurve, somewhat effective, is now learning to throw a slider, the way his coach prefers. It has been a work in progress.
JMO.
Tiger Paw Mom:
Your comments make perfect sense. I particularly like hearing your thoughts on 'coachability'. My older son has this quality in abundance...I hope it is appreciated.
Thanks.
Your comments make perfect sense. I particularly like hearing your thoughts on 'coachability'. My older son has this quality in abundance...I hope it is appreciated.
Thanks.
Gotwood,
That is just my opinion. But I'll bet if you polled college coaches the first thing they would say they look for in a player is one who will be willing to learn to improve his position, accept adjustments and make the necessary changes willingly.
You'd be surprised, not all can do that.
That is just my opinion. But I'll bet if you polled college coaches the first thing they would say they look for in a player is one who will be willing to learn to improve his position, accept adjustments and make the necessary changes willingly.
You'd be surprised, not all can do that.
Well it depends on what you are saying TPM. Coachability is great but has to be secondary to the skills needed to pitch the game with good command. It does a team no good to be coachable if he can't get batters out. JMO
Tiger Paw Mom:
I'm confident that our son's coach is soundly in that group...but until you see the proof you can only hope.
It's just really reassuring to hear that this type of coach really exists...hearing it from those that have been there means alot!
I'm confident that our son's coach is soundly in that group...but until you see the proof you can only hope.
It's just really reassuring to hear that this type of coach really exists...hearing it from those that have been there means alot!
Chicks,
Ok, let me change it.
The first thing they would say they look for in a TALENTED PLAYER is one who is willing to learn to improve his position, accept adjustments and make the necessary changes willingly.
One more point, every pitcher comes with strength and weaknesses in his pitches. Some have more than others. Some have great changes, some can't throw the change but have great sliders, an overpoering fastball. I don't know if a change is what they prefer over the other, however, IMO, a great kid with talent, a team player, no attitude, adds to team chemistry and willingness to learn (besides having the ability to get batters out) will make you more attractive than throwing any one particular pitch.
I would say it goes the same for the position player as well.
Ok, let me change it.
The first thing they would say they look for in a TALENTED PLAYER is one who is willing to learn to improve his position, accept adjustments and make the necessary changes willingly.
One more point, every pitcher comes with strength and weaknesses in his pitches. Some have more than others. Some have great changes, some can't throw the change but have great sliders, an overpoering fastball. I don't know if a change is what they prefer over the other, however, IMO, a great kid with talent, a team player, no attitude, adds to team chemistry and willingness to learn (besides having the ability to get batters out) will make you more attractive than throwing any one particular pitch.
I would say it goes the same for the position player as well.
Tiger Paw Mom:
Nicely re-stated. I knew what you meant the first time.
I think it is understood that a coach has to demand good skills and good abilities in his players but is more than pleased to have all of that and a player that doesn't have a bad attitude but rather a good attitude and is easily coached. The more 'good' the better!
Nicely re-stated. I knew what you meant the first time.
I think it is understood that a coach has to demand good skills and good abilities in his players but is more than pleased to have all of that and a player that doesn't have a bad attitude but rather a good attitude and is easily coached. The more 'good' the better!
Much better TPM. 
ChicksDigTheLongBall:
You never know...it could be that a pitcher's ability to be easily coached, early on, is the very reason that he is a good pitcher now.
Everyone can list examples of players that had plenty of potential but just couldn't compete or fit into a team structure...don't underrate this valuable asset!
You never know...it could be that a pitcher's ability to be easily coached, early on, is the very reason that he is a good pitcher now.
Everyone can list examples of players that had plenty of potential but just couldn't compete or fit into a team structure...don't underrate this valuable asset!
Chicks
Cut the condescending attitude
Thanx
Cut the condescending attitude
Thanx
It was a very nice and well worded post.
I feel that college coaches want to see a pitcher with an out pitch. A great change is very valuable at the next level to keep a hitter off-balance and is often overlooked. The slider is a pitch that can more readily cause a swing and miss and is therefore usefull as well. I prefer a kid master spotting his fastball and develop a consistent change and then work on the out pitch, be it a hard curve or slider off the plate. It is important that a kid know what his strike-out pitch is and learn how to use it.
quote:Originally posted by hsballcoach:
I feel that college coaches want to see a pitcher with an out pitch. A great change is very valuable at the next level to keep a hitter off-balance and is often overlooked. The slider is a pitch that can more readily cause a swing and miss and is therefore usefull as well. I prefer a kid master spotting his fastball and develop a consistent change and then work on the out pitch, be it a hard curve or slider off the plate. It is important that a kid know what his strike-out pitch is and learn how to use it.
Do you think the change can be a great "out" pitch or more of a "setup" pitch.
My opinion for what it may be worth to you chicks
A good change up can be a devastating "OUT" pitch
A good change up can be a devastating "OUT" pitch
[QUOTE]Originally posted by TRhit:
Chicks
Cut the condescending attitude
Thanx[/QUOTE
Mr. Pot, I would like to introduce you to Mr. Kettle.
Chicks
Cut the condescending attitude
Thanx[/QUOTE
Mr. Pot, I would like to introduce you to Mr. Kettle.
Yeah, but if it becomes your "out" pitch and then they start looking for it and one would think that it would become a jack-it-out-the-park pitch. What does one do to offset this and what other pitch would it become?
Chicks,
I think it really depends on the quality of your change. Even a mediocre change can throw off timing and get pop-ups and ground outs. A good one can definately be an out pitch. I do think, however, that a pitch with some side-to-side or sharp change of direction is great to add to the arsenal at the right time.
I think it really depends on the quality of your change. Even a mediocre change can throw off timing and get pop-ups and ground outs. A good one can definately be an out pitch. I do think, however, that a pitch with some side-to-side or sharp change of direction is great to add to the arsenal at the right time.
The change can definitely be an out pitch - good examples from the pros are Eric Gagne and especially Trevor Hoffman.
As hsballcoach said - "it really depends upon the quality of your change". If it comes out of the same arm slot, with the same arm action, and has movement (normally down but hopefully some side to side as well), it will be tough on hitters at any level.
As hsballcoach said - "it really depends upon the quality of your change". If it comes out of the same arm slot, with the same arm action, and has movement (normally down but hopefully some side to side as well), it will be tough on hitters at any level.
You just throw the pitch that is called now-a-days. Every coach doesn't call the slider because at the college level most kids don't have a good one. Most of the time they hang it over the plate.
I had taught my son how to throw 7 different pitches for strikes, because even at the lower levels his FB was not one of those that made everything behind it distort from the wind created by its wake. It's up in the upper 80's. As he went from level to level they removed all of those and he is now left with two pitches. FB and a changeup.
I ask myself why would they try to make a great finesse pitcher into a power pitcher? Just shake my head sometimes at the notions that coaches get in their heads. I guess they want to see if they can get him to throw "heat" but it just serves to discourage him because he likes getting people out using the off speed stuff.
But he is "coachable" so he never says anything. Just trys to give them what they want. But he and I both know he is a better pitcher using the 7 pitches.
I had taught my son how to throw 7 different pitches for strikes, because even at the lower levels his FB was not one of those that made everything behind it distort from the wind created by its wake. It's up in the upper 80's. As he went from level to level they removed all of those and he is now left with two pitches. FB and a changeup.
I ask myself why would they try to make a great finesse pitcher into a power pitcher? Just shake my head sometimes at the notions that coaches get in their heads. I guess they want to see if they can get him to throw "heat" but it just serves to discourage him because he likes getting people out using the off speed stuff.
But he is "coachable" so he never says anything. Just trys to give them what they want. But he and I both know he is a better pitcher using the 7 pitches.
daddybo
Sorry if my NY background makes me sound condescending but it aint and I aplogize to nobody--talk to those who know me
I am not afraid to be who I am , good bad or indiffernet,unlike some others I know-- as my m Mother tells everyone "to know me is to love me"
Perhaps being "old school" is no longer PC--too bad, I still think "old school" is the best way--perhaps it would eliminate some of the problems in our society we see to day if more people were "old school".
Mr Pot ?-- are you talking about my 'flower power" times? LOL
Sorry if my NY background makes me sound condescending but it aint and I aplogize to nobody--talk to those who know me
I am not afraid to be who I am , good bad or indiffernet,unlike some others I know-- as my m Mother tells everyone "to know me is to love me"
Perhaps being "old school" is no longer PC--too bad, I still think "old school" is the best way--perhaps it would eliminate some of the problems in our society we see to day if more people were "old school".
Mr Pot ?-- are you talking about my 'flower power" times? LOL
I have heard that they like coachable players. When he gets thru this phase of baseball and reaches the next level, he can then take all these attributes together including the 7 pitches and control his own destiny.
quote:Originally posted by hsballcoach:
Chicks,
I think it really depends on the quality of your change. Even a mediocre change can throw off timing and get pop-ups and ground outs. A good one can definately be an out pitch. I do think, however, that a pitch with some side-to-side or sharp change of direction is great to add to the arsenal at the right time.
You mean the cutter... ????
quote:Originally posted by 08Dad:
The change can definitely be an out pitch - good examples from the pros are Eric Gagne and especially Trevor Hoffman.
As hsballcoach said - "it really depends upon the quality of your change". If it comes out of the same arm slot, with the same arm action, and has movement (normally down but hopefully some side to side as well), it will be tough on hitters at any level.
I've often heard that the "change" is the best pitch in baseball but all you ever hear about is the heaters even though there are more of those that flop in the pros.
quote:Originally posted by ChicksDigTheLongBall:
Yeah, but if it becomes your "out" pitch and then they start looking for it and one would think that it would become a jack-it-out-the-park pitch. What does one do to offset this and what other pitch would it become?
Hey Chicks!
What you have said can pertain to any 'out' pitch. If you've got one they are going to be looking for it regardless of whether it is a change, slider, curve, etc. A pitcher has to know when and where to throw it to make and keep it effective. It's only an 'out' pitch if you get the batter behind in the count. Once you have him...then you locate the 'out' pitch. Location is everything!
At least that's the way I look at it.
quote:Originally posted by twoseamer:quote:Originally posted by ChicksDigTheLongBall:
Yeah, but if it becomes your "out" pitch and then they start looking for it and one would think that it would become a jack-it-out-the-park pitch. What does one do to offset this and what other pitch would it become?
Hey Chicks!
What you have said can pertain to any 'out' pitch. If you've got one they are going to be looking for it regardless of whether it is a change, slider, curve, etc. A pitcher has to know when and where to throw it to make and keep it effective. It's only an 'out' pitch if you get the batter behind in the count. Once you have him...then you locate the 'out' pitch. Location is everything!
At least that's the way I look at it.
Hello TS,
That is the best post! I agree.
Chicks,
A good change-up, especially for a starter, makes all of your other pitches a little better. A change throws off a hitters timing and turnes an OK fastball into a good fastball. It gives you a very good second option when you are behind in the count. I agree that it is the second best pitch in baseball. The first being a well placed fastball. If you can't spot the fastball, everything else is moot.
A good change-up, especially for a starter, makes all of your other pitches a little better. A change throws off a hitters timing and turnes an OK fastball into a good fastball. It gives you a very good second option when you are behind in the count. I agree that it is the second best pitch in baseball. The first being a well placed fastball. If you can't spot the fastball, everything else is moot.
RR
Just a question,
Why on earth does your son or any other pitcher for that matter need 7 pitches?
And please don't tell me that it's 'x' amount of pitches at 'x' amount of arm angles, cause just cause you change your arm angle doesn't classify it as another pitch.
What good does it do to have 7 pitches?
I've always wondered this, you hear guys saying oh ya I can throw a FB, CU, KNCB, CB, SL, SNK, SB, CCU, 2FB etc. etc.
How effective are they, for the most in general, not very effective.
How far do they get? College, maybe, beyond College not likely, and if they do go beyond College by the time they hit High level baseball (Double A Triple A MLB) they'll only be throwing 3,4 maybe 5 pitches and be effective.
How many Effective MLB pitchers have more then 4 or 5?
How many Effective MLB Pitchers throw more then 4 or 5 different types of pitches during the course of a game?
I'm not trying to spark a debate or anything, but I've always wondered why guys try and throw 7 pitches and cause even more stress on their arm that they don't need to have, like we all know that the human body in the first place isn't designed to handle the stress of throwing a ball, so why do more to harm to your body?
Just a question,
Why on earth does your son or any other pitcher for that matter need 7 pitches?
And please don't tell me that it's 'x' amount of pitches at 'x' amount of arm angles, cause just cause you change your arm angle doesn't classify it as another pitch.
What good does it do to have 7 pitches?
I've always wondered this, you hear guys saying oh ya I can throw a FB, CU, KNCB, CB, SL, SNK, SB, CCU, 2FB etc. etc.
How effective are they, for the most in general, not very effective.
How far do they get? College, maybe, beyond College not likely, and if they do go beyond College by the time they hit High level baseball (Double A Triple A MLB) they'll only be throwing 3,4 maybe 5 pitches and be effective.
How many Effective MLB pitchers have more then 4 or 5?
How many Effective MLB Pitchers throw more then 4 or 5 different types of pitches during the course of a game?
I'm not trying to spark a debate or anything, but I've always wondered why guys try and throw 7 pitches and cause even more stress on their arm that they don't need to have, like we all know that the human body in the first place isn't designed to handle the stress of throwing a ball, so why do more to harm to your body?
Doc
well said
well said
Thanks TR
Appreciate the words of kindness.
Appreciate the words of kindness.
DKK
thanks for opening a good discussion about pitching efficiency.
My argument ( hypothesis ) is that throwing with less velocity and more movement saves the arm from distention, with less stress from torque.
However, lets, clarify a very important requirement...the arm must not be twisted, nor the elbow hyperextended, nor the wrist turned to achieve the desired pitch-n-yaw, downward, and sliding movements.
Every pitch is thrown just like a FB throughout the mechanics, but the position and pressure of the fingers at the release point is critical to the rotation, and thus the movement.
Based upon this, 7 pitches can be taught to every youngster no matter how fast he throws the ball.
It is the movement of the ball and the variety of speeds associated with the pitch that creates hesitancy in a batters ability to hit the ball with the bat exactly on the sweet spot.
Every pitch start ovver the middle of the plate but can end up as far as 6 inches off the plate by the time it reaches the catchers glove. Every three inches of movement is the equivalent of 2 mph speed. So If I throw in the high 80's and the ball move 6 to 12 inches the pitch is in effect creating the illusion that the speed is 4 to 8 mph in modulation. Notice I didn't say increase in velocity, but mo9re the modulation of speed variance.
Now couple that with a FB that can be located with precision and you can see why this method of pitching can be very successful.
It's a different philosophy, but it does take patience and time to learn. Coaching now-a-days takes the easiest and laziest approach. Reduce the time it takes to learn pitching efficiency by reducing the number of pitches and increase the velocity to overwhelm the batters instincts.
This use to work but as we have been watching the batters are beginning to catch up with the "heat". Batters have the most trouble with good off-speed stuff. My theory is that the overwhelming reliance on the FB has made the batters "recognition skills" hypersensitive to the speed and "little" movement of the FB.
The batters now have much more difficulty dealing with a good "junk" pitcher, especially if it is couple with a decent FB. Pitcher's like this, can be very effective even if the FB is sub 90.
thanks for opening a good discussion about pitching efficiency.
My argument ( hypothesis ) is that throwing with less velocity and more movement saves the arm from distention, with less stress from torque.
However, lets, clarify a very important requirement...the arm must not be twisted, nor the elbow hyperextended, nor the wrist turned to achieve the desired pitch-n-yaw, downward, and sliding movements.
Every pitch is thrown just like a FB throughout the mechanics, but the position and pressure of the fingers at the release point is critical to the rotation, and thus the movement.
Based upon this, 7 pitches can be taught to every youngster no matter how fast he throws the ball.
It is the movement of the ball and the variety of speeds associated with the pitch that creates hesitancy in a batters ability to hit the ball with the bat exactly on the sweet spot.
Every pitch start ovver the middle of the plate but can end up as far as 6 inches off the plate by the time it reaches the catchers glove. Every three inches of movement is the equivalent of 2 mph speed. So If I throw in the high 80's and the ball move 6 to 12 inches the pitch is in effect creating the illusion that the speed is 4 to 8 mph in modulation. Notice I didn't say increase in velocity, but mo9re the modulation of speed variance.
Now couple that with a FB that can be located with precision and you can see why this method of pitching can be very successful.
It's a different philosophy, but it does take patience and time to learn. Coaching now-a-days takes the easiest and laziest approach. Reduce the time it takes to learn pitching efficiency by reducing the number of pitches and increase the velocity to overwhelm the batters instincts.
This use to work but as we have been watching the batters are beginning to catch up with the "heat". Batters have the most trouble with good off-speed stuff. My theory is that the overwhelming reliance on the FB has made the batters "recognition skills" hypersensitive to the speed and "little" movement of the FB.
The batters now have much more difficulty dealing with a good "junk" pitcher, especially if it is couple with a decent FB. Pitcher's like this, can be very effective even if the FB is sub 90.
Absolutely nothing wrong with throwing a variety of fastball grips using the same fastball mechanics. It does bring another element to keep the batter off balance. Having different movement really does help in getting those weak grounders & pops.
I keep hearing all these wonderful things about the 90 mph+ pitchers. Yet many of them that I see throw straight & flat. And they seem to give up a lot of runs when they play against decent sticks.
I keep hearing all these wonderful things about the 90 mph+ pitchers. Yet many of them that I see throw straight & flat. And they seem to give up a lot of runs when they play against decent sticks.
So the way you've taught your son to throw is that every ball comes out of his hand like a FB with the wrist's movement the exact same no matter it be a FB or CB? (I'm really bad at describing things with proper terms like supination, extnesion, pronation)
I have the exact same mechanics for every pitch I throw (Which I get by with 4) but the way the ball comes out of my hand is different (i.e. different wrist movement), and you can feel the stress added to the elbow and see the muscles in your forearm perform a different movement from this when you snap your wrist for a CB vs a FB or a SL.
I agree that finger placement and finger pressure plays a vital role in throwing a pitch. I also agree that movement is key in being an effective pitcher.
But still 7 pitches.
Why not focus on 4? A pitcher will get more attention if he can throw 4 effective pitches over a guy who can throw every pitch known to man and not be effective as a guy who only throws 3 or 4.
Maybe I'm just old school and love a guy who can throw a FB CU CB and change speeds and hit his spots and mow down runners rather then having to throw 7 pitches to get outs. Like yes the end result is getting outs and if you can do it with 3 4 or 7 who cares, but still 7 pitches?!?!
Just out of curosity what pitches does he throw? I've never seen a guy throw a good hard Curve without breaking the wrist differently from that of a FB release.
I have the exact same mechanics for every pitch I throw (Which I get by with 4) but the way the ball comes out of my hand is different (i.e. different wrist movement), and you can feel the stress added to the elbow and see the muscles in your forearm perform a different movement from this when you snap your wrist for a CB vs a FB or a SL.
I agree that finger placement and finger pressure plays a vital role in throwing a pitch. I also agree that movement is key in being an effective pitcher.
But still 7 pitches.
Why not focus on 4? A pitcher will get more attention if he can throw 4 effective pitches over a guy who can throw every pitch known to man and not be effective as a guy who only throws 3 or 4.
Maybe I'm just old school and love a guy who can throw a FB CU CB and change speeds and hit his spots and mow down runners rather then having to throw 7 pitches to get outs. Like yes the end result is getting outs and if you can do it with 3 4 or 7 who cares, but still 7 pitches?!?!
Just out of curosity what pitches does he throw? I've never seen a guy throw a good hard Curve without breaking the wrist differently from that of a FB release.
The ball is held with the ball located either at the finger tips, mid-point on the knuckles, or fully against the palm. the thumb location is varied at 180 degrees to the top of the ball, varianced askewed moving slightly toward the side of the ball, and at right angles to the top of the ball.
The ball is thrown with the fingers using either downward pressure or upward pressure upon release
The thumb can be cantered, or flatly placed on the ball. The thumb placement and pressure determines the speed variance.
Once the FB mechanics are taught then all teaching should change to understanding of how important about the holding positions of the ball and using the right pressure upon releasing it.
When a youngster first starts out it will be difficult for him to use the finger tip method but the palming and mid-joint methods are doable.
This method used properly can make a pitcher very effective.
A curve ball or slider is thrown using fingers not twisting the arm, elbow or wirst. The fingers are squeeze-snapped like shooting a marble.
It takes time to change the thinking of what has been a standard way of doing things, though we know many youngsters suffer arm injuries from that methos.
My son's arm doesn't even get sore...though he has some tightness if he throws over 135 pitches.
The ball is thrown with the fingers using either downward pressure or upward pressure upon release
The thumb can be cantered, or flatly placed on the ball. The thumb placement and pressure determines the speed variance.
Once the FB mechanics are taught then all teaching should change to understanding of how important about the holding positions of the ball and using the right pressure upon releasing it.
When a youngster first starts out it will be difficult for him to use the finger tip method but the palming and mid-joint methods are doable.
This method used properly can make a pitcher very effective.
A curve ball or slider is thrown using fingers not twisting the arm, elbow or wirst. The fingers are squeeze-snapped like shooting a marble.
It takes time to change the thinking of what has been a standard way of doing things, though we know many youngsters suffer arm injuries from that methos.
My son's arm doesn't even get sore...though he has some tightness if he throws over 135 pitches.
I didn't think you could pitch without a change up at a hidh level.
I love the SLIDER but you can pitch without it.
Nothing wrong with having several pitches that you are capable of throwing but on game day you better have 2 or 3 that are working.
Warming up is when you decide what is working. If it isn't working don't use it very much if at all. No one has their stuff every day they go out on the mound.
Use you 2 fast balls and change if they are working. If you have a great slider and its working put it in to the mix to get a lot of batters out.
Taik to your catcher who calls the game and make sure you are wprking the righ pitch combo because he dosen't knoe whats working until you tell him or the batter relays the message to you by longball express.
If you have to make a choice work on the change up.
I love the SLIDER but you can pitch without it.
Nothing wrong with having several pitches that you are capable of throwing but on game day you better have 2 or 3 that are working.
Warming up is when you decide what is working. If it isn't working don't use it very much if at all. No one has their stuff every day they go out on the mound.
Use you 2 fast balls and change if they are working. If you have a great slider and its working put it in to the mix to get a lot of batters out.
Taik to your catcher who calls the game and make sure you are wprking the righ pitch combo because he dosen't knoe whats working until you tell him or the batter relays the message to you by longball express.
If you have to make a choice work on the change up.
Doc, not speaking for RR here. Of course the curveball has different mechanics. I don't follow everything RR is talking about. I was talking about using different fastball grips.
IMHO, all fastballs & c/u's should be thrown with the same mechanics. Same arm velocity as well. Just change the grip to get different movement and/or speed.
The curve does have different mechanics. As does the slider (which is a pitch I don't advocate as it is hard on the arm).
IMHO, all fastballs & c/u's should be thrown with the same mechanics. Same arm velocity as well. Just change the grip to get different movement and/or speed.
The curve does have different mechanics. As does the slider (which is a pitch I don't advocate as it is hard on the arm).
Texan,
I agree all FB an CU should be thown with the same mechanics, personally when I throw my CU it looks exactly like a FB same arm speed an everything.
I didn't notice you're post until after I finished my post. I agree with what you say as well, changing the grip on a certain pitch can be very, very effective.
I know the type of CB RR is talking about many people refer to it as the beginners curve. Or at least that's the one it sounds liek he's describing.
I agree all FB an CU should be thown with the same mechanics, personally when I throw my CU it looks exactly like a FB same arm speed an everything.
I didn't notice you're post until after I finished my post. I agree with what you say as well, changing the grip on a certain pitch can be very, very effective.
I know the type of CB RR is talking about many people refer to it as the beginners curve. Or at least that's the one it sounds liek he's describing.
RR
Is another way of describing the squeeze-snap motion like that of snapping your fingers?
Is another way of describing the squeeze-snap motion like that of snapping your fingers?
There is no doubt a pitcher can have many many pitches, 7 is not unheard of. If a young pitcher has good mechanics and control, he can learn just about anything to add to his arsenal.
We understnad that many pitchers have a few pitches, many have a lot. Sometimes that will determine if you are a starter, reliever ,closer. Also do know that most pitchers who threw lots of sliders in HS, usually are hurt by the time they get to college. My son never threw a true slider, he is learning it now, only to have another pitch in his arsenal for the future, he calls it his Big League pitch. His best pitch is his change and he throws variations.
Bottom line is getting the hitter out. Some coaches don't care how you do it, others are very good in protecting their pitchers futures. There is one school my son decided not to attend, because the coach prefers the slider. He ws afraid they would teach him and make him use it a lot.
Going back to the original post, don't worry about the slider, work on the FB,change.
We understnad that many pitchers have a few pitches, many have a lot. Sometimes that will determine if you are a starter, reliever ,closer. Also do know that most pitchers who threw lots of sliders in HS, usually are hurt by the time they get to college. My son never threw a true slider, he is learning it now, only to have another pitch in his arsenal for the future, he calls it his Big League pitch. His best pitch is his change and he throws variations.
Bottom line is getting the hitter out. Some coaches don't care how you do it, others are very good in protecting their pitchers futures. There is one school my son decided not to attend, because the coach prefers the slider. He ws afraid they would teach him and make him use it a lot.
Going back to the original post, don't worry about the slider, work on the FB,change.
Forgot to add in my original post I got ahead of myself...
I know that guys can throw up to or more then 7.
I know how to throw 12 pitches but I don't have good enough control to be effective with all 12 or enough time to work on all 12. But I can throw 3-5 pitches everytime out that are effective, and those 3-5 are FB,CB,CCU,2FB,SL, if one or more those pitches aren't working I simply drop it for that day and don't bother to add in another from the list that I know how to throw, and I don't bother to master all 12, I stick to those 4 or 5.
Focusing your time on more then a solid 3-5 is really selling yourself short.
Show me a guy at any high level (College,Minors,MLB) that is effective with a laundry list for a repitoire.
Once you get past 4 or 5 pitches you tend to start to hang more pitches then you make quality pitches with those 7,8,9 etc. Let's say instead of making 8 or 9 quality pitches each pitch with FB,CU,CB you're only making 7 or 8 qaulity pitches with FB,CU,CB,SL,SPL,2FB theres an extra 2 or 3 pitches per pitch that you are hanging and getting knocked around. This is the mentality that I've been taught anyway, and for the most part it makes a lot of sense to many guys.
Oh and Ramrod, I like your theory on less speed plus more movement equals a healthier arm. You should also incorperate in that theory that less speed equals more movement.
I know that guys can throw up to or more then 7.
I know how to throw 12 pitches but I don't have good enough control to be effective with all 12 or enough time to work on all 12. But I can throw 3-5 pitches everytime out that are effective, and those 3-5 are FB,CB,CCU,2FB,SL, if one or more those pitches aren't working I simply drop it for that day and don't bother to add in another from the list that I know how to throw, and I don't bother to master all 12, I stick to those 4 or 5.
Focusing your time on more then a solid 3-5 is really selling yourself short.
Show me a guy at any high level (College,Minors,MLB) that is effective with a laundry list for a repitoire.
Once you get past 4 or 5 pitches you tend to start to hang more pitches then you make quality pitches with those 7,8,9 etc. Let's say instead of making 8 or 9 quality pitches each pitch with FB,CU,CB you're only making 7 or 8 qaulity pitches with FB,CU,CB,SL,SPL,2FB theres an extra 2 or 3 pitches per pitch that you are hanging and getting knocked around. This is the mentality that I've been taught anyway, and for the most part it makes a lot of sense to many guys.
Oh and Ramrod, I like your theory on less speed plus more movement equals a healthier arm. You should also incorperate in that theory that less speed equals more movement.