Another consideration is that both VT and UVA view themselves as national programs and as such, they recruit nationally. Neither would turn away an in-state guy they believed in, but in the end VA is only one of 50 states. There's a lot of competition out there.
But who knows what the future holds. Hughes replaced his pitching coach this year and then had to replace his other assistant when Gambino got the job at BC. The recruiters will have their own contact networks and while they will no doubt try to build on them and also network in VA, you'll probably see them continue to farm the contacts they have for VT.
One thing for sure, in a lot of travels all over VA and NC and down to East Cobb last summer, we just never saw anyone from VT. I think they had a bunch of early commits and got all they needed, and with no assistants to help him, I'm guessing Hughes' priority was likely on filling those positions first.
quote:Originally posted by Midlo Dad:
Another consideration is that both VT and UVA view themselves as national programs and as such, they recruit nationally. Neither would turn away an in-state guy they believed in, but in the end VA is only one of 50 states. There's a lot of competition out there.
True. My point is UVA is successful with 90% of their signees from Virginia. While VT 8% of their signees are in state. My problem is that VT appears to disregard the players from the state that helps fund them. I would love to know if VT courted any of the recent UVA signees. Just curious.
quote:I would love to know if VT courted any of the recent UVA signees. Just curious.
No, at least not one of them.
quote:
True. My point is UVA is successful with 90% of their signees from Virginia. While VT 8% of their signees are in state. My problem is that VT appears to disregard the players from the state that helps fund them. I would love to know if VT courted any of the recent UVA signees. Just curious.
Wow. What mathematics system are you using? On UVA's currently posted roster, there are 35 players, 20 of whom are from Virginia and 15 who are not from Virginia. That equates to 57% from Virginia and 43% who are not from Virginia. No where near the 90% from Virginia that you touted. As for the 2011 high school players, according to Perfect Game, UVA's has 10 in its recruiting class, 2 from Virginia and 8 (i.e. 80%) NOT from Virginia.
I guess my math is off but my assertions are not.VT does not seek VA players, even the best ones, i.e. Kenny Towns. So, I say to all those who think Coach Hughes is looking for some hometown talent, save your $$. VT is not VA baseball friendly.
No coach can have perfect knowldge of local players especially when staff members leave. VT looks for the players to fill thier needs, whether they are in CA or VA. SOmetime its impossible to get a VA kid eventhough the commonwealth cup resides in Blacksburg
From washington post:
From washington post:
quote:STRIKE]The Hokies have a base of talented players. But unlike many of Virginia Tech's other sports programs, which target home-grown talent and try to recruit regionally, the Hokies took a broad recruiting sweep under Hughes. Virginia Tech has six players from California and others from Georgia, New Jersey and Florida.
In explaining his recruiting philosophy, Hughes pointed out four powerhouse programs within Virginia Tech's recruiting turf: Virginia, North Carolina, Clemson and South Carolina.
"We don’t beat those people in recruiting," Hughes said. "I can see all the Hokie alums going crazy over that, but they're funded differently, their facilities are different. The longer we stay in region when they’re funded differently, the more we’re going to play with their B-list recruits."
[/STRIKE]
I have heard Coach Hughes say that he cannot get VA players, yet he does not seek VA players. He says he can't compete, I'm not aware of his efforts. I have yet to see someone from his staff show up for VA showcase.
For years, even before Coach Hughes, we have seen Va. Tech at many of our events. In fact, we saw them last month in Florida. They work very hard.
Here is their roster (home state) all but two have played in PG events. Link is to the players PG web profile. It’s pretty much the same way at every major college in the country.
BTW, there is something that recruits from VA have in common with recruits from other states. Many have been competing with and against their teammates, at the same places, even before they got to College.
Chris Kay (GA) – PG Showcases. WWBA Georgia and Florida many times with East Cobb and Atlanta Blue Jays
Chris Kay
Clark Labitan (CA) – PG WWBA/Georgia two years with San Diego Show
Clark Labitan
Chad Pinder (VA) – Many PG WWBA events in Florida and Georgia with the Canes
Chad Pinder
Michael Seaborn (GA) – Many PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with East Cobb teams.
Michael Seaborn
Gabriel Ortiz (Panama) – PG WWBA in Georgia and Florida with All Star Baseball teams
Gabriel Ortiz
Tim Smalling (NC) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Tim Smalling
Manny Martir (FL) – PG WWBA Georgia with Jacksonville Stars
Manny Martir
Tony Balisteri (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia with Ohio Warhawks
Tony Balisteri
Mark Zecchino (NJ) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Tri State Arsenal
Mark Zecchino
Jake Joyce (VA) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Jake Joyce
Danny Farris (CA) – PG WWBA events California
Danny Farris
Sean McDermott (MA) – PG NE
Sean McDermott
Jacob Atwell (AR) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with OK Boomtown Prospects
Jacob Atwell
Charlie McCann (VA) – PG and WWBA events NE, Georgia, Florida
Charlie McCann
Andrew Rash (SC) – PG WWBA events Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Andrew Rash
Colin O’Keefe(CT) – PG NE
Colin O'Keefe
Zach MacAneney (NC) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Zach MacAneney
Matt Blow (VA) – PG and WWBA in Georgia and Florida
Matt Blow
Richard Hodges (CT)– PG and WWBA NE, Georgia
Richard Hodges
Eddie Campbell (MA) – PG and WWBA events in NE, Georgia, Florida
Eddie Campbell
Tyler Horan (MA) – PG NE
Tyler Horan
Ronnie Shaban (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida
Ronnie Shaban
Scott Donley (IN) – PG WWBA Georgia with Indiana Bulls
Scott Donley
Kyle Cichy (NJ) – PG WWBA Georgia with Tri State Arsenal
Kyle Cichy
Joe Parsons (CA) – PG California
Joe Parsons
Chad Morgan (VA) – PH WWBA Georgia and Florida with Canes
Chad Morgan
Scott Heelan (IL) – PG WWBA Iowa, Georgia and Florida with Top Tier (Illinois)
Scott Heelan
Brent Zimmerman (FL) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida
Brent Zimmerman
Patrick Scoggin (VA) – PG and WWBA events in Minnesota, Georgia, Florida
Patrick Scoggin
Joe Mantiply (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Canes
Joe Mantiply
Here is their roster (home state) all but two have played in PG events. Link is to the players PG web profile. It’s pretty much the same way at every major college in the country.
BTW, there is something that recruits from VA have in common with recruits from other states. Many have been competing with and against their teammates, at the same places, even before they got to College.
Chris Kay (GA) – PG Showcases. WWBA Georgia and Florida many times with East Cobb and Atlanta Blue Jays
Chris Kay
Clark Labitan (CA) – PG WWBA/Georgia two years with San Diego Show
Clark Labitan
Chad Pinder (VA) – Many PG WWBA events in Florida and Georgia with the Canes
Chad Pinder
Michael Seaborn (GA) – Many PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with East Cobb teams.
Michael Seaborn
Gabriel Ortiz (Panama) – PG WWBA in Georgia and Florida with All Star Baseball teams
Gabriel Ortiz
Tim Smalling (NC) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Tim Smalling
Manny Martir (FL) – PG WWBA Georgia with Jacksonville Stars
Manny Martir
Tony Balisteri (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia with Ohio Warhawks
Tony Balisteri
Mark Zecchino (NJ) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Tri State Arsenal
Mark Zecchino
Jake Joyce (VA) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Jake Joyce
Danny Farris (CA) – PG WWBA events California
Danny Farris
Sean McDermott (MA) – PG NE
Sean McDermott
Jacob Atwell (AR) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida with OK Boomtown Prospects
Jacob Atwell
Charlie McCann (VA) – PG and WWBA events NE, Georgia, Florida
Charlie McCann
Andrew Rash (SC) – PG WWBA events Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Andrew Rash
Colin O’Keefe(CT) – PG NE
Colin O'Keefe
Zach MacAneney (NC) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Dirtbags
Zach MacAneney
Matt Blow (VA) – PG and WWBA in Georgia and Florida
Matt Blow
Richard Hodges (CT)– PG and WWBA NE, Georgia
Richard Hodges
Eddie Campbell (MA) – PG and WWBA events in NE, Georgia, Florida
Eddie Campbell
Tyler Horan (MA) – PG NE
Tyler Horan
Ronnie Shaban (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida
Ronnie Shaban
Scott Donley (IN) – PG WWBA Georgia with Indiana Bulls
Scott Donley
Kyle Cichy (NJ) – PG WWBA Georgia with Tri State Arsenal
Kyle Cichy
Joe Parsons (CA) – PG California
Joe Parsons
Chad Morgan (VA) – PH WWBA Georgia and Florida with Canes
Chad Morgan
Scott Heelan (IL) – PG WWBA Iowa, Georgia and Florida with Top Tier (Illinois)
Scott Heelan
Brent Zimmerman (FL) – PG WWBA events in Georgia and Florida
Brent Zimmerman
Patrick Scoggin (VA) – PG and WWBA events in Minnesota, Georgia, Florida
Patrick Scoggin
Joe Mantiply (VA) – PG WWBA Georgia and Florida with Canes
Joe Mantiply
quote:From washington post:
[QUOTE]
In explaining his recruiting philosophy, Hughes pointed out four powerhouse programs within Virginia Tech's recruiting turf: Virginia, North Carolina, Clemson and South Carolina.
"We don’t beat those people in recruiting," Hughes said. "I can see all the Hokie alums going crazy over that, but they're funded differently, their facilities are different. The longer we stay in region when they’re funded differently, the more we’re going to play with their B-list recruits."
While I would certainly agree that the facilities at the four schools mentioned by Hughes are A-rated facilities, it doesn't appear to me that those same four schools, particularly the out-of-state schools, are grabbing all of the "A-list" recuits from Virginia.
Looking at the current rosters on the web sites (which are still the 2010 rosters in many instances), UNC has 1 player from Virginia, Univ of So Carolina 3, Clemson at least 1 (hometowns are not given) and UVA 20. As for the recruiting class that just signed, according to Perfect Game, UNC has 0 from Virginia, South Carolina 2, Clemson 0 and UVA 2. Hughes' argument that the competition for Virginia players from the four powerhouse programs is overwhelming does not hold water.
Interesting that in football, Tech is a national power, yet clearly recruiting successfully in Virginia is Job 1, and they pretty much get whichever kids they want.
I don't think it's terrible that VT didn't sign any Virginia kids, I was just surprised I didn't see them looking.
quote:Originally posted by golfball:
I don't think it's terrible that VT didn't sign any Virginia kids, I was just surprised I didn't see them looking.
VT or George Mason...invisible...their choice...their methodology...but invisible in the NOVA area...
According to PG, the 2011 in state commits are as follows (listed in PG's order of ACC recruiting classes):
North Carolina - 12 in state, 6 out of state
Florida State - 13 in state, 3 out
Georgia Tech - 9 in state, 1 out
Clemson - 4 in state, 5 out
Virginia - 2 in state, 8 out
NC State - 8 in state, 3 out
Miami - 7 in state, 1 out
Maryland - 6 in state, 3 out
Boston College - 3 in state, 3 out
Wake Forest - 0 in state, 7 out
Duke - 0 in state, 7 out
Virginia Tech - 0 in state, 6 out
North Carolina - 12 in state, 6 out of state
Florida State - 13 in state, 3 out
Georgia Tech - 9 in state, 1 out
Clemson - 4 in state, 5 out
Virginia - 2 in state, 8 out
NC State - 8 in state, 3 out
Miami - 7 in state, 1 out
Maryland - 6 in state, 3 out
Boston College - 3 in state, 3 out
Wake Forest - 0 in state, 7 out
Duke - 0 in state, 7 out
Virginia Tech - 0 in state, 6 out
quote:Originally posted by golfball:
I don't think it's terrible that VT didn't sign any Virginia kids, I was just surprised I didn't see them looking.
They are certainly free to seek whoever they want. My 2-bits: don't spend money on their camps. My issue is that it is a state school, intentionally avoiding in-state players. That's all. I'll bet you if they would actively go after the top players, they might be surprised to see the results.
quote:VT or George Mason...invisible...their choice...their methodology...but invisible in the NOVA area
In George Mason's defense, we did see them a lot last spring and summer here in Northern Virginia and elsewhere.
And in VT's defense, it's not as if other ACC schools are raiding tons of Virginia talent.
According to the list El Gato posted, Florida and North Carolina produced at least 20 ACC players each this year, not counting the ones headed to other major programs.
For 2011, Virginia has so far produced only 2 players for the ACC and another 9 to other top tier programs (4 to ECU, 3 to South Carolina, 2 to Coastal Carolina, 1 to LSU). Of those, some probably didn't have the grades, and some probably wanted warm weather.
It's not as if there are vast herds of suitable in-state ACC-level talent that VT is ignoring.
Maybe there just isn't enough in-state talent to supply two elite programs.
According to the list El Gato posted, Florida and North Carolina produced at least 20 ACC players each this year, not counting the ones headed to other major programs.
For 2011, Virginia has so far produced only 2 players for the ACC and another 9 to other top tier programs (4 to ECU, 3 to South Carolina, 2 to Coastal Carolina, 1 to LSU). Of those, some probably didn't have the grades, and some probably wanted warm weather.
It's not as if there are vast herds of suitable in-state ACC-level talent that VT is ignoring.
Maybe there just isn't enough in-state talent to supply two elite programs.
quote:Originally posted by golfball:quote:VT or George Mason...invisible...their choice...their methodology...but invisible in the NOVA area
In George Mason's defense, we did see them a lot last spring and summer here in Northern Virginia and elsewhere.
I have seen GM at a few events and individual games, just don't hear of much local contact or offers. I don't profess to know it all, but I do know quite a few of the NOVA 2011's that have signed and most of them never heard a word from GM....other than the "come to our camp" emails.
quote:........ My issue is that it is a state school, intentionally avoiding in-state players. That's all. .......
Seriously?
quote:Originally posted by Swampboy:
And in VT's defense, it's not as if other ACC schools are raiding tons of Virginia talent.
According to the list El Gato posted, Florida and North Carolina produced at least 20 ACC players each this year, not counting the ones headed to other major programs.
For 2011, Virginia has so far produced only 2 players for the ACC and another 9 to other top tier programs (4 to ECU, 3 to South Carolina, 2 to Coastal Carolina, 1 to LSU). Of those, some probably didn't have the grades, and some probably wanted warm weather.
It's not as if there are vast herds of suitable in-state ACC-level talent that VT is ignoring.
Maybe there just isn't enough in-state talent to supply two elite programs.
Of the 11 players, how many were pursued by VT?
I rest my case.
Yes. Seriously Mr California.
George Mason is an interesting NOVA point. Son received plenty of 'come to our camp' emails, but most schools don't give a second holler until a player also responds with interest.
George Mason is an interesting fit for local NOVA players who may not want to be that close to home at a growing school, so maybe Mason wasn't getting overwhelming response in "yes, you're my top choice" from the local boys.
Bit of a two way street?
George Mason is an interesting fit for local NOVA players who may not want to be that close to home at a growing school, so maybe Mason wasn't getting overwhelming response in "yes, you're my top choice" from the local boys.
Bit of a two way street?
member, as a fellow taxpayer, I sympathize with you, but I doubt any coach, in or outside of Virginia, recruits on the basis of residency. At least, I hope not. I mentioned a year ago that I thought UVA and VT were not acting quick enough to garner some of the top 2011 talent and suggested that they were either just too slow to make an offer or overplaying their hand(s). Whatever the reason, none of the top 10 2011 Virgina recruits (per PG website) are going to an in state school. Cave is headed to LSU, Beal and Costen to South Carolina, White to Michigan, Clemmons to UNNC, McGillicuddy and McConnell to Marshall and Morimando and Thompson to ECU. Only Deshorn Lake remains uncommitted. A year has passed since that posting, and the numbers are still appalling. Maybe next year will be different?
quote:Originally posted by ...:
Of the 11 players, how many were pursued by VT?
I rest my case.
Your summation is a question whose answer we cannot know, so I think you rested your case without proving it.
I imagine that 11 would start to shrink if you subtract anyone not academically qualified (we don't know who that might be), guys who committed real early, and guys whose hearts were set on other schools.
The population of qualified in-state prospects who would have met their needs and been responsive to recruiting overtures appears to be very small this year, maybe just a handful or so. Not a big enough sample to make the sweeping conclusion that VT doesn't want local talent. And we do have to give them some slack for having to deal with coaching staff turnover.
Nate Hoffa, a 2010 RHP out of Manassas Park H.S. is at George Mason.
Garrett Marin, a 2009 RHP out of Colonial Forge is there as well...
Garrett Marin, a 2009 RHP out of Colonial Forge is there as well...
Va Tech's current roster has 12 kids from Virginia High Schools.
U of Va. has 20 from Virginia.
Then if you count up the number of kids from Virginia going to other Virginia DIs, you have a lot of Virginia HS players at those DIs.
Then as in many states the very top recruits from Virginia are recruited by other top DIs nationally.
I would think that Tech in order to compete in the conference needs the very best talent possible no matter what state the players come from.
That said, I'm sure they would love to get players like Cave from their home state. But Cave is going to LSU.
Virginia is a top baseball state, but like some of the other top states the talent level (at least ACC/SEC type talent) will differ from one year to the next. And the very best will continue to be recruited by national powerhouses. Of course, U of Virginia is now one of those national powerhouse programs.
Even if someone thought Va Tech was ignoring players in their home state, which players are they ignoring. If they feel the player is good enough, why on earth would they ignore him? Maybe rather than ignoring anyone they are simply doing what they feel is neccessary to compete at the level they play.
U of Va. has 20 from Virginia.
Then if you count up the number of kids from Virginia going to other Virginia DIs, you have a lot of Virginia HS players at those DIs.
Then as in many states the very top recruits from Virginia are recruited by other top DIs nationally.
I would think that Tech in order to compete in the conference needs the very best talent possible no matter what state the players come from.
That said, I'm sure they would love to get players like Cave from their home state. But Cave is going to LSU.
Virginia is a top baseball state, but like some of the other top states the talent level (at least ACC/SEC type talent) will differ from one year to the next. And the very best will continue to be recruited by national powerhouses. Of course, U of Virginia is now one of those national powerhouse programs.
Even if someone thought Va Tech was ignoring players in their home state, which players are they ignoring. If they feel the player is good enough, why on earth would they ignore him? Maybe rather than ignoring anyone they are simply doing what they feel is neccessary to compete at the level they play.
Now why would they not want local talent? Why wouldn't Va Tech want the best players they could possibly get? Maybe they go outside their area because they feel they have to in order to compete in the ACC? The state of VA is loaded with outstanding talent. That means the power programs are going to work very hard to cherry pick the best players from VA every year. Va Tech is not just competing with UVA for players in the state of NC. They are competing against the other programs in the ACC and SEC as well. And in some cases other major conferences. Not to mention ECU which has made it very clear they are going to recruit and recruit hard in the state of VA.
Va Tech is not going to compete for the ACC championship with mid major talent. If they can't get the top players from Va the ones they believe can help them compete for the ACC then they have to go outside the state and bring in players they feel can allow them to do just that. With the top players in Va playing the showcase circuit and spending so much time in front of the coaches at these other schools its no wonder you see them ending up at So Car, LSU, ECU, etc etc. These schools know the talent level in the state of VA. And they ID them early and they get on them early.
Check out Coastal Carolina's roster. They have to compete in state with So Car and Clemson for the top players in SC as well as other SEC school and ACC schools. They have built a national power in the much the same way that Va Tech is attempting to build their program. You can bet if they believe you are good enough to help them win in the ACC they won't pass you up because your from VA. But there not going to load up their roster with a team from VA that they dont believe can compete for a championship in the ACC just so they can say they have a roster full of VA players. Why should they?
Va Tech is not going to compete for the ACC championship with mid major talent. If they can't get the top players from Va the ones they believe can help them compete for the ACC then they have to go outside the state and bring in players they feel can allow them to do just that. With the top players in Va playing the showcase circuit and spending so much time in front of the coaches at these other schools its no wonder you see them ending up at So Car, LSU, ECU, etc etc. These schools know the talent level in the state of VA. And they ID them early and they get on them early.
Check out Coastal Carolina's roster. They have to compete in state with So Car and Clemson for the top players in SC as well as other SEC school and ACC schools. They have built a national power in the much the same way that Va Tech is attempting to build their program. You can bet if they believe you are good enough to help them win in the ACC they won't pass you up because your from VA. But there not going to load up their roster with a team from VA that they dont believe can compete for a championship in the ACC just so they can say they have a roster full of VA players. Why should they?
Coach May is correct again. VT had targetd many of the Top 2011's from VA but, IMO, they couldn't compete with the facilities/programs of UVA, USC and ECU. Heck, until last fall, they didn't even have an indoor hitting facility.
IMO, they are building their program similar to Coastal. In time, as they establish themselves as ACC contenders, they will get the top VA talent. I know they are very heavy on many of the top 2012's in VA.
IMO, they are building their program similar to Coastal. In time, as they establish themselves as ACC contenders, they will get the top VA talent. I know they are very heavy on many of the top 2012's in VA.
As for the excuse that VT can not compete on the recruiting scene with elite programs due to lack of facilities, weather. etc..., hopefully those thoughts aren't in the minds of the VT staff. That excuse may be valid in other states, but that should NEVER be the case in Virginia. With likely
the largest alumni/fan base in the state, it just stands to reason that many of these top Virginia players are the offspring of Hokies or Hokie
fans, have been rooting for them from a very young age, and would LOVE an opportunity to represent the Hokies. For that reason alone VT should make a concerted effort to sign EVERY top prospect in Virginia... and that mentality is a big reason why the football team has been so successful
the largest alumni/fan base in the state, it just stands to reason that many of these top Virginia players are the offspring of Hokies or Hokie
fans, have been rooting for them from a very young age, and would LOVE an opportunity to represent the Hokies. For that reason alone VT should make a concerted effort to sign EVERY top prospect in Virginia... and that mentality is a big reason why the football team has been so successful
Chris I have a hard time believeing that the staff at Va Tech is not indeed trying to get the best players, period. And I know for a fact they work very very hard at recruiting. Why would they not want to get the very best they can get from Va? If they are players they believe are Va Tech guys and can help them win of course they are going to go after them. When you are competing against other schools for the same players there are many things that come into play. And facilities ranks up there on the list. When a program brings in a player that has choices he is weighing several things in his decision. Facilities , school , campus , coaches , location , prestige of the program , recent success , who is on the roster , who is going to be on the roster , who has been on the roster , etc etc.
UVA going to the CWS , upgrades in the facilites , success of their players , etc etc has given them an advantage. Heck ECU's ability to recruit jumped big time as soon as they opened their new facility. Some instate players would not even look at ECU started as soon as they saw that facility they built. Its two fold as well. Its nice. And its shows the player that the school and program are serious about their baseball. Va Tech is on the right track there is no doubt. They recruit a certain type of player. Much like CC does. Hard nosed kids that want to be at Va Tech and not because they couldnt get an offer from Va or NC.
Va Tech would love to get the top players from Va. They ID the kids they believe are Va Tech guys. If they cant get those guys they dont settle for Mid Major talent in Va instead of going out of state for players they believe are Va Tech players. Your not going to compete in the ACC by signing Virginia players that are not ACC caliber players just so you can say you stay in state. Their recent success says they have it right. I can tell you that many of the players I have coached seriously consider Va Tech. And a couple are there now. But if NC offers them they are not going to turn that down to attend Va Tech. When Va Teach reaches the point where kids are turning down the Virginias of the college baseball world to attend Va Tech more top level players from Va will be on their roster.
I am not suggesting in any way you feel this way. But there are many people who say "Va Tech doesn't recruit in state talent" when in fact the problem is "Va Tech didnt recruit my son and went out of state to get a player he is just as good as or better." Its a sour grapes complaint imo. To suggest that Va Tech would pass on a player they believed could help them win that was from their own back yard simply because they dont recruit Va players is ridiculous. Do they miss on some home grown guys that could play for them? I have no doubt. And every program does imo.
UVA going to the CWS , upgrades in the facilites , success of their players , etc etc has given them an advantage. Heck ECU's ability to recruit jumped big time as soon as they opened their new facility. Some instate players would not even look at ECU started as soon as they saw that facility they built. Its two fold as well. Its nice. And its shows the player that the school and program are serious about their baseball. Va Tech is on the right track there is no doubt. They recruit a certain type of player. Much like CC does. Hard nosed kids that want to be at Va Tech and not because they couldnt get an offer from Va or NC.
Va Tech would love to get the top players from Va. They ID the kids they believe are Va Tech guys. If they cant get those guys they dont settle for Mid Major talent in Va instead of going out of state for players they believe are Va Tech players. Your not going to compete in the ACC by signing Virginia players that are not ACC caliber players just so you can say you stay in state. Their recent success says they have it right. I can tell you that many of the players I have coached seriously consider Va Tech. And a couple are there now. But if NC offers them they are not going to turn that down to attend Va Tech. When Va Teach reaches the point where kids are turning down the Virginias of the college baseball world to attend Va Tech more top level players from Va will be on their roster.
I am not suggesting in any way you feel this way. But there are many people who say "Va Tech doesn't recruit in state talent" when in fact the problem is "Va Tech didnt recruit my son and went out of state to get a player he is just as good as or better." Its a sour grapes complaint imo. To suggest that Va Tech would pass on a player they believed could help them win that was from their own back yard simply because they dont recruit Va players is ridiculous. Do they miss on some home grown guys that could play for them? I have no doubt. And every program does imo.
Coach May- Perhaps you misinterpreted the point of my post. I am not complaining one way or the other about Tech's recruiting practices...just that I'm tired of hearing excuses. Your points are valid, but they also have inherent advantages to getting instate talent,
However, from the numerous posts about the subject, many feel there could be improvement as to recruiting instate talent and that is something that should throw up a red flag to the coaching staff because truth or not, that is not a perception that they want out there
From a strictly personal perspective, for whatever reason (lack of need at that position perhaps), Tech did not recruit my son. All worked out for the best though and both he and I have absolutely no regrets as to where he ended up...oh, and better facilities is near the bottom of the list of reasons why
However, from the numerous posts about the subject, many feel there could be improvement as to recruiting instate talent and that is something that should throw up a red flag to the coaching staff because truth or not, that is not a perception that they want out there
From a strictly personal perspective, for whatever reason (lack of need at that position perhaps), Tech did not recruit my son. All worked out for the best though and both he and I have absolutely no regrets as to where he ended up...oh, and better facilities is near the bottom of the list of reasons why
Chris Taylor,
I could not agree anymore with your posts.
It is amazing how the baseball coaches are oblivious to the recruiting power of the Hokie nation.
I could not agree anymore with your posts.
It is amazing how the baseball coaches are oblivious to the recruiting power of the Hokie nation.
quote:Originally posted by Coach_May:
UVA going to the CWS , upgrades in the facilites , success of their players , etc etc has given them an advantage.
Va Tech would love to get the top players from Va. They ID the kids they believe are Va Tech guys. If they cant get those guys they dont settle for Mid Major talent in Va instead of going out of state for players they believe are Va Tech players. Your not going to compete in the ACC by signing Virginia players that are not ACC caliber players just so you can say you stay in state. Their recent success says they have it right. I can tell you that many of the players I have coached seriously consider Va Tech. And a couple are there now. But if NC offers them they are not going to turn that down to attend Va Tech. When Va Teach reaches the point where kids are turning down the Virginias of the college baseball world to attend Va Tech more top level players from Va will be on their roster.
Ok so I instigated this discussion. Here is something to consider, who got UVA to CWS? VA players.
Whether true or an incredible misconception by parents and players in VA, many do not feel the love from the VT baseball program. Absent from showcases, and more importantly from at least courting D! prospects...
Tech may identify players, but they are not doing a very good job reaching out to them. Maybe it is a defeatest attitude, I don't know. I know Hughes states at camps and publicly he can't get the top recurits - this is before he even tries to contact them. I know for a fact UVA recruits could have been swayed if Hughes reached out. Maybe he didn't want them for a position, and it worked out for the best for UVA and player, but, to continue this charade that the kids don't have the grades, or facilities are not up to par is false. Hughes never tried or he just doesn't want them, which is an interesting philosophy to say the least.
Chris Taylor/Coach May - Great debate, thank you both. Just to throw my fuel in the fire.... Coach Hughes said at camp "no walk ons and 25% min $$" Doesn't 25% out-of-state tuition take a much bigger bite out of his budget than in-state tuition or is there some accrual accounting magic that walks it off?
Nice discussion going here, and as a Hokie, I can't imagine anyone NOT wanting to go to Tech.
My guys are out of college now, but with the staff before Coach Hughes, there was a definite perception that Tech didn't knock itself out to recruit in state. Upon what was that based? Tech showed up at the Commonwealth Games, but at other in state showcase events and tournaments, they were rarely if ever present. The typical roster had very few Virginia kids.
It seems to be changing, and I'd love to see to the Hokies get to the point in baseball where they are in football, but it will take more time. Hokie basketball just achieved a top 15 recruiting class, perhaps not coincidentally just when they open the taj mahal of practice facilities, and their new football locker room is just decadent. Tech's facilities are pretty nice IMHO and the campus atmosphere is second to none. If they can build a string of NCAA appearances (they finally got to the ACC tournament last year), they'll be well on their way.
Perhaps if Mr. Grisham had a grandson that would like to be a Hokie, their facilities could really go over the top....
My guys are out of college now, but with the staff before Coach Hughes, there was a definite perception that Tech didn't knock itself out to recruit in state. Upon what was that based? Tech showed up at the Commonwealth Games, but at other in state showcase events and tournaments, they were rarely if ever present. The typical roster had very few Virginia kids.
It seems to be changing, and I'd love to see to the Hokies get to the point in baseball where they are in football, but it will take more time. Hokie basketball just achieved a top 15 recruiting class, perhaps not coincidentally just when they open the taj mahal of practice facilities, and their new football locker room is just decadent. Tech's facilities are pretty nice IMHO and the campus atmosphere is second to none. If they can build a string of NCAA appearances (they finally got to the ACC tournament last year), they'll be well on their way.
Perhaps if Mr. Grisham had a grandson that would like to be a Hokie, their facilities could really go over the top....
No one would ever guess from this discussion that VT was a 40-win team that won two games at its NCAA regional before being eliminated by the eventual national champions.
I could understand the hand wringing and finger pointing if Tech baseball was going downhill, but from this outsider's perspective the coach appears to be doing a good job.
Based on Redbird5's comment, it looks like they did go after the top in-state talent then looked elsewhere rather than settle for the in-state talent that remained. Isn't that what they're supposed to do?
Still haven't seen an answer to PG Staff's question about which 2011 Virginia players VT should have gone after but ignored.
I could understand the hand wringing and finger pointing if Tech baseball was going downhill, but from this outsider's perspective the coach appears to be doing a good job.
Based on Redbird5's comment, it looks like they did go after the top in-state talent then looked elsewhere rather than settle for the in-state talent that remained. Isn't that what they're supposed to do?
Still haven't seen an answer to PG Staff's question about which 2011 Virginia players VT should have gone after but ignored.
Some of the perception may be the head coaches leaving campus to watch players in Virginia and some of the results (re “landing” Virginia players) may be the aggressiveness or timing in making a decision on players. Having attended over 40 team showcases / tournaments in the past few years (in VA, NC, SC, GA and FL), I have been surprised at the frequency with which I have seen head coaches Tanner (South Carolina) and Godwin (ECU) at them. Both also have personally come to Hampton Roads to recruit. I perceive, from talking with Virginia players who are going to both programs, that both of those programs make decisions and act on players fairly quickly. I have never seen Hughes at an event off the Virginia Tech campus. Virginia Tech’s assistant coaches (Gambino and Turgeon), however, were observed at a number of events, including in Hampton Roads on at least two occasions in the past couple of years, once to watch a high school football game in which Cave was playing and once to watch an Eastern Regional playoff game.
quote:Originally posted by ...:
Ok so I instigated this discussion. Here is something to consider, who got UVA to CWS? VA players.
If you're going to make ridiculous arguments, at least mix in a fact or two. Yes, UVA got a ton of production from Virginia players in their CWS run.
But, do these names ring a bell for you? Phil Gosselin (PA), Tyler Cannon (TN), Steven Proscia (NY), Dan Grovatt (NJ), Franco Valdes (FL). Those are just the position players. Pitchers would include Danny Hultzen (MD), Kevin Arico (NJ), Matt Packer (TN). That's over half of their starting lineup, their Friday starter, their closer, and their #1 lefty out of the pen. UVA gets plenty of production from outside of Virginia.
Also, add in Bruno, Kline, Winiarski, and others from the 2010 season and they do plenty of recruiting outside the commonwealth. Like I said, mix in an occasional fact, rather than just popping off constanly with mindless cr@p.
quote:Yes, UVA got a ton of production from Virginia players in their CWS run.
exactly. Thanks! 18 from VA 2009!
No need to be uncivil. Apparently I'm not the only one to come to the same conclusion. So, you can call it a "ridiculus argument" (I prefer discussion) all you want but it seems to some of us it is our experience. Furthermore, I never said these schools do not look outside of VA, which what you are implying - that is ridiculus. Of course they do, why wouldn't they?
I believe WB had some very valid points. I too have never seen Hughes off campus, but I have not been to every event. Perhaps VT is too late to the party in trying to secure the recruits, which is a shame.
My impression is that the UVA-VT baseball recruiting situation is very much as it is in baseball, though in reverse. Right now one of UVA football's big problems is that VT is scooping up all the top in-state players. In baseball, the shoe would be on the other foot, at least to the extent there are VA kids perceived as ACC caliber.
That's not to say you don't get your share of top guys at VT. Wake's then-recruiter asked me at one time if I knew of a 2008 3B type with an elite bat and I tried like heck to get him to go after Ronnie Shaban, to no avail. All I got out of that was an I-told-you-so.
I think VT has progressed from being a perennial bottom half of the ACC team to being a team that will have as many upper half years as bottom half years. If I had to guess, I'd say this would be a year when VT might struggle to make the ACC tourney. UVA, in contrast, seems to have firmly planted itself at the top of the conference standings for the foreseeable future. But sometimes things change unexpectedly, so don't put too much stock in such things based on what you see at any particular moment in time.
There are some programs who are very reluctant to get into the ever-accelerating recruiting time table, preferring to let kids mature a bit more before laying their budget on the line for them. I see wisdom in that, but unfortunately I think in VT's case they have been late to the fire on some kids. Some revision in their approach may be in order. It'll be interesting to see what the new assistants bring to the approach, since making all those recruiting trips is quite often their chore. (And BTW, some of those head coaches you saw from other schools didn't want to be out on the road themselves, but they had assistant positions vacant at the time. But it's a fair point that Hughes was not seen much this past summer.)
That's not to say you don't get your share of top guys at VT. Wake's then-recruiter asked me at one time if I knew of a 2008 3B type with an elite bat and I tried like heck to get him to go after Ronnie Shaban, to no avail. All I got out of that was an I-told-you-so.
I think VT has progressed from being a perennial bottom half of the ACC team to being a team that will have as many upper half years as bottom half years. If I had to guess, I'd say this would be a year when VT might struggle to make the ACC tourney. UVA, in contrast, seems to have firmly planted itself at the top of the conference standings for the foreseeable future. But sometimes things change unexpectedly, so don't put too much stock in such things based on what you see at any particular moment in time.
There are some programs who are very reluctant to get into the ever-accelerating recruiting time table, preferring to let kids mature a bit more before laying their budget on the line for them. I see wisdom in that, but unfortunately I think in VT's case they have been late to the fire on some kids. Some revision in their approach may be in order. It'll be interesting to see what the new assistants bring to the approach, since making all those recruiting trips is quite often their chore. (And BTW, some of those head coaches you saw from other schools didn't want to be out on the road themselves, but they had assistant positions vacant at the time. But it's a fair point that Hughes was not seen much this past summer.)
Dot-man,
There's a big difference between Midlo Dad's thoughtful comments about VT's overall situation and your less responsible assertion that VT is deliberately overlooking in-state prospects.
Still waiting for examples of 2011 ACC-caliber Virginia players whom VT ignored because they're in-staters. Can you back it up?
There's a big difference between Midlo Dad's thoughtful comments about VT's overall situation and your less responsible assertion that VT is deliberately overlooking in-state prospects.
Still waiting for examples of 2011 ACC-caliber Virginia players whom VT ignored because they're in-staters. Can you back it up?