Not keeping up to date on tools, I was wondering if anyone might ponder a guess at what the average mph is for an average varsity player?
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Average is probably low 80s or less for varsity pitchers. There are a whole lot of kids throwing harder than that but you asked for the average. Our league had one at 95 and a couple others in the 90s but the average was probably still under 85.
One of the league's more effective pitchers last season was gunned at 84-86 at Jupiter recently.
One of the league's more effective pitchers last season was gunned at 84-86 at Jupiter recently.
Avg 77-80
Above avg 81-84
Outstanding 85-88
Elite 89+
Above avg 81-84
Outstanding 85-88
Elite 89+
I agree with Coach May.
We read about all the 90 MPH high schoolers and so it seems as if they are more comon than they are. Average is below 80, from what I have seen. Many high school teams have no pitchers throwing above 80.
In HS from what I have seen it is very possible for a pitcher to be effective without high velocity. A kid my son hs played with for years is about 5'8" and throws about 77 mph.... but bends the ball three different ways.
He was pitcher of the year as a sophomore in our HS league last year - and many people thought he would never pitch in high school at all because of his lack of killer velocity. He struck out few, but batters didn't center the ball on him much. Lots of ground ball and fly ball outs.
Will he play at college level? I'll tell you this - he is already being ignored and dissed by they local showcase organizations. All the kid does is get outs, and he has heart on tap, but that unfortunately is not what gets the scholly and scout looks.
We read about all the 90 MPH high schoolers and so it seems as if they are more comon than they are. Average is below 80, from what I have seen. Many high school teams have no pitchers throwing above 80.
In HS from what I have seen it is very possible for a pitcher to be effective without high velocity. A kid my son hs played with for years is about 5'8" and throws about 77 mph.... but bends the ball three different ways.
He was pitcher of the year as a sophomore in our HS league last year - and many people thought he would never pitch in high school at all because of his lack of killer velocity. He struck out few, but batters didn't center the ball on him much. Lots of ground ball and fly ball outs.
Will he play at college level? I'll tell you this - he is already being ignored and dissed by they local showcase organizations. All the kid does is get outs, and he has heart on tap, but that unfortunately is not what gets the scholly and scout looks.
I was surprised to hear about some of the velocity readings from Jupiter. Two local kids played in the tourney. One of the dads said he was expecting higher readings on the gun than he saw. He said he could just about count on one hand the number of kids he saw throwing 90 or above. The large majority he saw were low to mid 80s. I'm not sure the average person understands how few high school kids can throw 80 or above. In my area the average HS team probably has 15-16 players. Out of those 15-16, there may be 3-4 than can hit 80. If a kid can hit 85-86, everyone thinks he is throwing 90 plus.
I think your estimates are a little low, or the school my son played for last year should have done better than they did, if pitcher's velocity matters.
Of the top 6 pitchers on last years team, not one threw below 80 and the main guys were mid 80s. (Based on my Speedster) We had two guys throwing 82ish with good stuff who couldn't get on the mound.
Of the top 6 pitchers on last years team, not one threw below 80 and the main guys were mid 80s. (Based on my Speedster) We had two guys throwing 82ish with good stuff who couldn't get on the mound.
The AVERAGE for HS varsity pitchers in my area is low to mid 80's. There are some in upper 80's and VERY few above 90. By the same token, there aren't many throwing in the 70's at the varsity level.
In my neck of the woods there are a lot of kids who compete quite well living around the 80 mark. On the other hand, my son throws 80-82 (16 yo)and is considered relatively slow on his team. We have a boy who has touched 91 and another who throws 87. I think 80 might well be close to the average velocity all high school pitchers throw.
Average velocity. When you factor in the amount of teams that have maybe one kid at 80-83 and the rest in the mid to upper 70's it counters the teams that have two or three in the mid to upper 80's. I was at a recent showcase event where there were 118 07 players and over 100 underclass players. One guy hit 90 one guy hit 88 in the 07 class out of about 60 kids. In the underclass 85 was tops and five kids hit 84 out of about another 50 kids. The fact is if I had a nickle for everytime I have heard about a kid that hit 90 that ended up being a 84 mph guy I would be rich. And the same goes for the guy you hear about being mid 80's turning out to be a 78-80 mph guy.
The exact same thing can be said about catchers pop times. There were around 20 07 catchers present. The best pop time was 2.06 and the next best time was 2.11 then it went up considerably. In the underclass pop times there were around 15 more catchers. One kid was 1.93 and the next best was 2.0 then it went way up again.
Same thing for 60 times. Over 200 kids present and one sub 7.0 60. There were 15 or so kids at the 7.0 - 7.09 mark. And then it was spread out.
Before you say this must have been a showcase for a bunch of scrubs let me just say this. There were over 50 college coaches in attendance and several ml scouts. Most of the kids present are very good baseball players. Sub 7.0 60's are rare. Guys that throw upper 80's low 90's are rare. Catchers that throw sub 2.0 pops are rare. Honesty and truthfullness in rating baseball players by some parents and some hs coaches is rare as well.
This showcase is no different than all the rest I have attended as well as PG events. Kids that get noticed are the ones that stand out. They are the ones that run really fast. Throw really hard. Or hit it really hard. If you blend in with the pack then you are not going to be noticed. The coaches are looking for the kids that stand out from the pack.
PG has a list of how many kids hit certain mph from the hill in Jupiter. Remember most of these guys are the cream of the crop. If 88 to 90 is elite then above avg is mid 80's. And average is around 80 to upper 70's.
The exact same thing can be said about catchers pop times. There were around 20 07 catchers present. The best pop time was 2.06 and the next best time was 2.11 then it went up considerably. In the underclass pop times there were around 15 more catchers. One kid was 1.93 and the next best was 2.0 then it went way up again.
Same thing for 60 times. Over 200 kids present and one sub 7.0 60. There were 15 or so kids at the 7.0 - 7.09 mark. And then it was spread out.
Before you say this must have been a showcase for a bunch of scrubs let me just say this. There were over 50 college coaches in attendance and several ml scouts. Most of the kids present are very good baseball players. Sub 7.0 60's are rare. Guys that throw upper 80's low 90's are rare. Catchers that throw sub 2.0 pops are rare. Honesty and truthfullness in rating baseball players by some parents and some hs coaches is rare as well.
This showcase is no different than all the rest I have attended as well as PG events. Kids that get noticed are the ones that stand out. They are the ones that run really fast. Throw really hard. Or hit it really hard. If you blend in with the pack then you are not going to be noticed. The coaches are looking for the kids that stand out from the pack.
PG has a list of how many kids hit certain mph from the hill in Jupiter. Remember most of these guys are the cream of the crop. If 88 to 90 is elite then above avg is mid 80's. And average is around 80 to upper 70's.
I agree wholeheartedly with Coach May.
I cannot tell you how many times I've heard about a "90-mph guy" in our area...so out I go to watch him. Almost every time, 80-84.
Not many HS parents/players really know what 90 looks like. They see good velo. (and 84 is GOOD velo.) and they call it 90. If you throw 84 in HS you will most definitely be one of the faster guys around your part of the world.
I cannot tell you how many times I've heard about a "90-mph guy" in our area...so out I go to watch him. Almost every time, 80-84.
Not many HS parents/players really know what 90 looks like. They see good velo. (and 84 is GOOD velo.) and they call it 90. If you throw 84 in HS you will most definitely be one of the faster guys around your part of the world.
I think the answer depends on what you consider "average". If you took all the kids who are considered pitchers, took their top MPH readings, added those readings and divided by the number of guys, you'd get about what Coach May says.
But remember that the guys who throw harder tend to carry more of the innings, so if you're looking for what's "average" in the sense that you might see that number in any given inning, I'd say your "average" FASTEST pitch in any given inning is going to be 83-84.
But a guy who PEAKS at 83-84 is going to serve you any number of fastballs in the 79-81 range, which is pretty much the range Coach May is quoting you.
I would also add that MPH numbers are really only relevant for power pitchers. I've seen lefties with 3 different off-speed pitches come in with a 78 mph fastball and absolutely blow it by good hitters. If a pitcher can get a guy thinking the next pitch is going to be 68 mph and sinking down and away, a 78 mph fastball on the fists will have the same effect as a 90 mph fastball from a pitcher who relies on MPH to succeed.
What this means is, you have to work with your strengths. If you throw 90+, then you can throw in the heart of the plate and succeed in HS. If you throw low 80's or lower, you'd best hit spots and change speeds. It's only if you're a low MPH guy and you're trying to use a power pitching style that you're in trouble. Or, if you're a power guy whose ball jumps a lot and you're trying to scrape the corners, you're asking for a lot of walks and thus trouble.
To succeed, start with an honest assessment of your physical capabilities and your strengths and weaknesses. Use your strengths and avoid your weaknesses. It's so simple, yet so many fall on their swords trying to be something they're not.
But remember that the guys who throw harder tend to carry more of the innings, so if you're looking for what's "average" in the sense that you might see that number in any given inning, I'd say your "average" FASTEST pitch in any given inning is going to be 83-84.
But a guy who PEAKS at 83-84 is going to serve you any number of fastballs in the 79-81 range, which is pretty much the range Coach May is quoting you.
I would also add that MPH numbers are really only relevant for power pitchers. I've seen lefties with 3 different off-speed pitches come in with a 78 mph fastball and absolutely blow it by good hitters. If a pitcher can get a guy thinking the next pitch is going to be 68 mph and sinking down and away, a 78 mph fastball on the fists will have the same effect as a 90 mph fastball from a pitcher who relies on MPH to succeed.
What this means is, you have to work with your strengths. If you throw 90+, then you can throw in the heart of the plate and succeed in HS. If you throw low 80's or lower, you'd best hit spots and change speeds. It's only if you're a low MPH guy and you're trying to use a power pitching style that you're in trouble. Or, if you're a power guy whose ball jumps a lot and you're trying to scrape the corners, you're asking for a lot of walks and thus trouble.
To succeed, start with an honest assessment of your physical capabilities and your strengths and weaknesses. Use your strengths and avoid your weaknesses. It's so simple, yet so many fall on their swords trying to be something they're not.
Coach May; Was this showcase at Wingate? If so, do you know who the 07 standouts were at that showcase that hit 90 and 88, had the better poptimes, and ran well? Any standouts hitting and fielding? If so, my son and the sons of several friends of ours were there. I didn't make it because of a wedding (and of course all my son said when he got back was he and his buddies did alright) and was looking for some feedback from it.
As a side note, and if it was at Wingate, I heard from a friend of mine that they pulled the 07 catchers straight over from running to throwdown and didn't give them much of a warm up period - and it was cool that day. May of had an impact on their poptimes.
As a side note, and if it was at Wingate, I heard from a friend of mine that they pulled the 07 catchers straight over from running to throwdown and didn't give them much of a warm up period - and it was cool that day. May of had an impact on their poptimes.
Our velocities are very comparable here in southern Ontario.
We usually have a few guys that can touch low 90s but only a very few.
The majority of the guys fall into coach mays ranges.
The one think I will always remember is a scout at a MLB camp who came to see a 90s pitcher and he topped out at 84. He was visibly angry and that stayed with me when ever we were asked about our son's velocity.
I enjoy a kid who can make good batters look like beginners more than the hard throwers.
We usually have a few guys that can touch low 90s but only a very few.
The majority of the guys fall into coach mays ranges.
The one think I will always remember is a scout at a MLB camp who came to see a 90s pitcher and he topped out at 84. He was visibly angry and that stayed with me when ever we were asked about our son's velocity.
I enjoy a kid who can make good batters look like beginners more than the hard throwers.
I enjoy hard throwers who make good batters look like beginners.quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
I enjoy a kid who can make good batters look like beginners more than the hard throwers.
Jason
Agree with coach May. Those are pretty good numbers.
Gunned 3 of our top four 2009 pitchers and one was low 70s, 76 max, one was 78-80, 81 max, one was 77-78, 79 max all on a JUGS. The other one who I didn't get a chance to gun I think is about 80 max and since he tends to overthrow probably works 78-80. We've got a 2010 who is the same age as the three younger 2009 pitchers (the low 70s guy is the older one) and has always been the hardest thrower of these but is in the same ballpark and also a 2009 who threw 1 mph less than the 2010 before the 2009 was injured. There's a 2011 coming along who has a chance to be a high 80s or low 90s type. Time will tell.
I have no idea what the varsity pitchers throw other than one who posted 83-84 at a showcase but I don't think anyone is over mid 80s this year. In past years one hit 93 at a showcase and worked 87-89 and another was working 88-90 as a senior. They've both been pretty successful in college.
Gunned 3 of our top four 2009 pitchers and one was low 70s, 76 max, one was 78-80, 81 max, one was 77-78, 79 max all on a JUGS. The other one who I didn't get a chance to gun I think is about 80 max and since he tends to overthrow probably works 78-80. We've got a 2010 who is the same age as the three younger 2009 pitchers (the low 70s guy is the older one) and has always been the hardest thrower of these but is in the same ballpark and also a 2009 who threw 1 mph less than the 2010 before the 2009 was injured. There's a 2011 coming along who has a chance to be a high 80s or low 90s type. Time will tell.
I have no idea what the varsity pitchers throw other than one who posted 83-84 at a showcase but I don't think anyone is over mid 80s this year. In past years one hit 93 at a showcase and worked 87-89 and another was working 88-90 as a senior. They've both been pretty successful in college.
MichealsDad yes it was at the Wingate Showcase. And yes it was pretty cold out there. Here are the top five in 60 velocity from the hill and pop times.
07 60 Times
McKoy 6.83
Crump 7.00
Bridgeman 7.03
Crowder 7.09
Parnell 7.09
08 60 Times
Henderson 7.00
Allison 7.03
Litwin 7.06
McBride 7.12
Adams 7.16
Pitchers 07
Girdwood 90
Woodley 88
Falcon 87
Lindsay 86
Harrington 86
Dalley 86
Pitchers 08
Alphine 85
Rollins 84
Farmer 84
McCoury 84
Meyers 84
Blackley 84
Catchers POP Times 07
Sessoms 2.03
Locklear 2.09
Lawing 2.10
Vaughn 2.10
Epley 2.11
Catchers POP Times 08
May 1.93
Rash 2.00
Paske 2.10
Windham 2.10
Horn 2.11
If your sons last name starts with a "V" I thought he did very well. He swung the bat very well in BP. I have seen him play a few times and he's a good one.
07 60 Times
McKoy 6.83
Crump 7.00
Bridgeman 7.03
Crowder 7.09
Parnell 7.09
08 60 Times
Henderson 7.00
Allison 7.03
Litwin 7.06
McBride 7.12
Adams 7.16
Pitchers 07
Girdwood 90
Woodley 88
Falcon 87
Lindsay 86
Harrington 86
Dalley 86
Pitchers 08
Alphine 85
Rollins 84
Farmer 84
McCoury 84
Meyers 84
Blackley 84
Catchers POP Times 07
Sessoms 2.03
Locklear 2.09
Lawing 2.10
Vaughn 2.10
Epley 2.11
Catchers POP Times 08
May 1.93
Rash 2.00
Paske 2.10
Windham 2.10
Horn 2.11
If your sons last name starts with a "V" I thought he did very well. He swung the bat very well in BP. I have seen him play a few times and he's a good one.
Coach May;
Byron McKoy sure can fly cann't he? Saw him run a 6.69 at Virginia Tech - on wet grass! A couple of my son's friends did show up on the list. Thank you for the information.
My son's last name does start with a V. Thank you for the compliment. I see your son, I'm assuming that is him, posted an excellent poptime.
Wish it could have been a little warmer, like today, and I could have been there.
Byron McKoy sure can fly cann't he? Saw him run a 6.69 at Virginia Tech - on wet grass! A couple of my son's friends did show up on the list. Thank you for the information.
My son's last name does start with a V. Thank you for the compliment. I see your son, I'm assuming that is him, posted an excellent poptime.
Wish it could have been a little warmer, like today, and I could have been there.
I always wondered what the average was. Looking at Coach May’s averages it seems my son is doing fairly well. He is a 15-year-old sophomore. He was throwing 78-80 last spring (baseball season) as a freshman. He has grown 1 to 2 inches since and has put on about 20 pounds (mostly muscle). He is 6 feet, 188. I know it is hard to predict, but give me your guess on what he will be throwing as a senior. He has not thrown in a while, except for long toss, he is playing football; first state playoff game tonight. We love football but we are so ready for baseball season (nothing compares to baseball).
I am so glad to see this post. We were taught early to know the talent that your child has not what we dream he has so we are often confused by what parents and other "experts" tell us. I love having this information finally so BIG THANKS!!!! Have a Freshamn playing college ball. He's a right handed catcher. Last two years, he has hit in the low 500's as a left handed power hitter. As recruitment started he was completely bummed because he had heard pop times of 1.8 & 1.9 were required. His 2.0-2.1 was "just not going to get him any where" when the summer before his Senior year started and the calls came in we thought Wow are we lucky he can hit, thats what got him noticed. We worried as this last summer went by if he was solid enough to make it as a position player. This year his coach told us it was his play as a catcher that grabbed his attention. Thats when we realized we had to stop listening to the parents in the stands.
Our youngest is a 6'3, 220 lb. right handed pitcher that also plays the corners. Last year as a Freshman we were told that he was just not really throwing as fast as he should be. He was gunned repeatedly at 79-83 mph fast ball with off speed that dropped off 10-12 mph. While we started the worry fest again now I can breathe and enjoy that my sons are on track. THanks again to al that post on this site.
Our youngest is a 6'3, 220 lb. right handed pitcher that also plays the corners. Last year as a Freshman we were told that he was just not really throwing as fast as he should be. He was gunned repeatedly at 79-83 mph fast ball with off speed that dropped off 10-12 mph. While we started the worry fest again now I can breathe and enjoy that my sons are on track. THanks again to al that post on this site.
louisiana09,
How old is he? 15 covers a lot of ground. Big difference in growing 1 inch and 2 inches since then also.
How old is he? 15 covers a lot of ground. Big difference in growing 1 inch and 2 inches since then also.
allaboutbaseball,
He may not be throwing all that hard for a 6'3" 220 lb'er but he's certainly throwing hard for a freshman. Then again you're in Texas and some freshmen are 16yo.
He may not be throwing all that hard for a 6'3" 220 lb'er but he's certainly throwing hard for a freshman. Then again you're in Texas and some freshmen are 16yo.
CADad
He will be 16 at the end of February. He was 5'10 at the holiday season last year and now he is at 6'.
He will be 16 at the end of February. He was 5'10 at the holiday season last year and now he is at 6'.
Coach May;
I guess I just have to ask. My son started working out at the catcher position last fall after an ex-college head coach saw him helping out in the bullpen and told him he thought he would make an excellent college catcher. He's been working at the positin for a year now and has his receiving and blocking down pretty well. He is also improving on his endurance. He would like to shave that last little bit off his poptime. What drills does your son do to work on his poptime?
Thank you for any information you are willing to share.
I guess I just have to ask. My son started working out at the catcher position last fall after an ex-college head coach saw him helping out in the bullpen and told him he thought he would make an excellent college catcher. He's been working at the positin for a year now and has his receiving and blocking down pretty well. He is also improving on his endurance. He would like to shave that last little bit off his poptime. What drills does your son do to work on his poptime?
Thank you for any information you are willing to share.
One thing to keep in mind is that it is October and that many of the kids in JUpiter havent stopped since last Jan or Feb. Avg velocity is going to be down for most pitchers...3 to 4 mph if not more.
quote:Originally posted by SoutherNo1:
I was surprised to hear about some of the velocity readings from Jupiter. Two local kids played in the tourney. One of the dads said he was expecting higher readings on the gun than he saw. He said he could just about count on one hand the number of kids he saw throwing 90 or above. The large majority he saw were low to mid 80s. I'm not sure the average person understands how few high school kids can throw 80 or above. In my area the average HS team probably has 15-16 players. Out of those 15-16, there may be 3-4 than can hit 80. If a kid can hit 85-86, everyone thinks he is throwing 90 plus.
quote:Originally posted by justbaseball:
I agree wholeheartedly with Coach May.
I cannot tell you how many times I've heard about a "90-mph guy" in our area...so out I go to watch him. Almost every time, 80-84.
Not many HS parents/players really know what 90 looks like. They see good velo. (and 84 is GOOD velo.) and they call it 90. If you throw 84 in HS you will most definitely be one of the faster guys around your part of the world.
From a post about a showcase, invite only by the State of FL MLB Scouts Association last week, Florida Diamond Showcase. You gotta be a draft prospect to get in;
quote:I thought the pithcing was good, but alot of the kids just seemed worn out after a long summer and fall season this is what the scouts/coaches told me. Alot of kids who are normally upper 80s to low 90s guys were mid 80s to upper 80s, but they still pitched well for the most part.
Diamond Club Thread
About says it all, and it's the same thing every year. Plenty of kids do throw 90 (see PG reports), but they are few and very far between in this country.
If you factor in how many kids pitch in HS very very very very few throw 90 period! When you go somewhere like Jupiter the numbers are skewed because your talking about the cream of the crop all gathered in one spot.
Yes McKoy can flat out fly and he is a great player. And a very nice young man. His dad is a great guy. Im sure his mom is but I have never met her.
The best thing that every happened to my boy was attending a PG showcase the summer after his freshman year. He had the best gun reading on velocity for catchers and about the 4th or 5th best pop time 2.06. This finally got him to realize that there was more to a good pop than arm strength. I'll pm you with some drills he does and share some ideas with you. Your son is a fine ball player and I too think he is well suited to be a fine college catcher.
Yes McKoy can flat out fly and he is a great player. And a very nice young man. His dad is a great guy. Im sure his mom is but I have never met her.
The best thing that every happened to my boy was attending a PG showcase the summer after his freshman year. He had the best gun reading on velocity for catchers and about the 4th or 5th best pop time 2.06. This finally got him to realize that there was more to a good pop than arm strength. I'll pm you with some drills he does and share some ideas with you. Your son is a fine ball player and I too think he is well suited to be a fine college catcher.
quote:Originally posted by Coach May:
...there was more to a good pop than arm strength.
So true.
I've been lurking here for a few weeks. What a great site. I've learned a lot (primarily the knowledge that I don't know much of anything about baseball/prospecting/recruiting/etc. compared to all of you). Thank you for the information.
My son is a HS Junior, but only turned 16 a few weeks ago. He's 5'11" and weighs a whopping 142 lbs. He attended a local university's "showcase" in October. It was his first. He ran a 7.13 60' and threw FBs at 78-79. All of his coaches this year (H.S.,Am.Leg.,Travel,Fall) played him at Short when he wasn't pitching. He's never tried out for a true elite team; and, until this week, he's never done any organized or regular weight training or conditioning.
I have a couple questions. Can we reasonably expect that a proper weight training/conditioning routine will provide him additional pitching velocity or footspeed? Can a 16 year old pitcher continue to increase velocity as he reaches 17/18, or has he probably plateaued? Finally, if he someday garners interest from a school recruiter, will they be discouraged by his late birthday? (Lately he's been busting my chops for not holding off on starting him in school).
Thanks for the advice, and the great website.
My son is a HS Junior, but only turned 16 a few weeks ago. He's 5'11" and weighs a whopping 142 lbs. He attended a local university's "showcase" in October. It was his first. He ran a 7.13 60' and threw FBs at 78-79. All of his coaches this year (H.S.,Am.Leg.,Travel,Fall) played him at Short when he wasn't pitching. He's never tried out for a true elite team; and, until this week, he's never done any organized or regular weight training or conditioning.
I have a couple questions. Can we reasonably expect that a proper weight training/conditioning routine will provide him additional pitching velocity or footspeed? Can a 16 year old pitcher continue to increase velocity as he reaches 17/18, or has he probably plateaued? Finally, if he someday garners interest from a school recruiter, will they be discouraged by his late birthday? (Lately he's been busting my chops for not holding off on starting him in school).
Thanks for the advice, and the great website.
Welcome Beebe!
I can't answer all those questions, although I have little doubt that there are people on this board who can.
I do know that there is NO WAY your son has topped out velocity-wise, as long as he keeps training and playing and gaining strength.
I can't answer all those questions, although I have little doubt that there are people on this board who can.
I do know that there is NO WAY your son has topped out velocity-wise, as long as he keeps training and playing and gaining strength.
louisiana,
He's probably picked up about 2 or 3 mph since last season and he probably has at least another 1/2 to 1 inch left to grow. From 16 to 18 they typically pick about 3 mph due to age and he should get just under 1 mph more if he grows another inch. So my guess would be about 5 to 7 mph faster than he was throwing last season by the time he's a senior. That's assuming his mechanics don't change and he doesn't go through a strengthening or arm speed program of some sort that adds a little extra.
He's probably picked up about 2 or 3 mph since last season and he probably has at least another 1/2 to 1 inch left to grow. From 16 to 18 they typically pick about 3 mph due to age and he should get just under 1 mph more if he grows another inch. So my guess would be about 5 to 7 mph faster than he was throwing last season by the time he's a senior. That's assuming his mechanics don't change and he doesn't go through a strengthening or arm speed program of some sort that adds a little extra.
beebe,
Yes, he can expect to throw harder although there's no guarantee. However, unless there's something wrong with his mechanics or he's still got a lot of growing to do he's unlikely to end up throwing high 80s or above. The velocities he's currently throwing are pretty normal for a pitcher his size and age.
Yes, he can expect to throw harder although there's no guarantee. However, unless there's something wrong with his mechanics or he's still got a lot of growing to do he's unlikely to end up throwing high 80s or above. The velocities he's currently throwing are pretty normal for a pitcher his size and age.
My son reported to me that he had dialed back his velocity in Jupiter due to the weather at his game. It was still a respectable speed and his control seemed to be fine. I wonder how the scouts factored in his adjustment to the conditions. I wouldn't encourage him to peg the meters just because this event was heavily scouted.
How many other pitchers might also have cut back on their velocity because of the conditions? I think my son made a wise decision.(I wasn't there, but I seem to remember some talk about the rain.)
How many other pitchers might also have cut back on their velocity because of the conditions? I think my son made a wise decision.(I wasn't there, but I seem to remember some talk about the rain.)
I couldn't be in more complete agreement with Coach May about his velocity observations. Average high school pitchers throw upper 70's to very low 80's. Anyone throwing harder than that is definitely above average. I say this coming from a metropolitan area of northern CA that has well over 1 million people, so I get to see lots of high school pitchers. For every kid that can legitimately pitch at 84 or above, there are probably 12-15 who are frontline pitchers for their schools who can't reach 80. The kid who legitimately hits 88+ on the gun is a rare high schooler, and the 90+ kid is exceptional and very rare.
I say this coming from a summer program that gets to compete against a lot of the best teenaged pitchers in northern CA every year. We probably have as many hard throwing pitchers as anyone, and I can assure you that finding those legitimate 88-93 range guys takes a LOT of work. There are very few of them and we draw from a huge area. This week, eight players from our program signed early letters of intent with D1 schools, and six of them pitch. Without naming names, here are the velocities that they typically work at, with the second number being their occasional top velocity. 83-85; 79-83; 83-85; 88-91; 85-88; and one juco kid who is transferring who lives at 88-92 and has touched 95. That kid will probably have a legitimate chance of going in the draft as he's one of the top juco pitchers in this region right now. If you look at the five high schooler's that signed as pitchers, remember that these guys comprise most of the high schoolers from our region who signed early. These guys aren't average, they're considered some of the best in our area. Four of those five guys had area code tryouts. They're not the norm, they're the exception. At this year's area code tryouts at UC Berkeley, they had something like 55 pitchers throwing. The top velocity was 89 or 90 and only 1 guy hit that. Next best was one of the above kids who hit 87, once. After that, I don't think 5 kids even hit 85 at all. And those are supposed to be the cream of the crop from northern CA. That is reality.
And catchers who can legitimately throw 2.10 or lower pops are just as rare.
I say this coming from a summer program that gets to compete against a lot of the best teenaged pitchers in northern CA every year. We probably have as many hard throwing pitchers as anyone, and I can assure you that finding those legitimate 88-93 range guys takes a LOT of work. There are very few of them and we draw from a huge area. This week, eight players from our program signed early letters of intent with D1 schools, and six of them pitch. Without naming names, here are the velocities that they typically work at, with the second number being their occasional top velocity. 83-85; 79-83; 83-85; 88-91; 85-88; and one juco kid who is transferring who lives at 88-92 and has touched 95. That kid will probably have a legitimate chance of going in the draft as he's one of the top juco pitchers in this region right now. If you look at the five high schooler's that signed as pitchers, remember that these guys comprise most of the high schoolers from our region who signed early. These guys aren't average, they're considered some of the best in our area. Four of those five guys had area code tryouts. They're not the norm, they're the exception. At this year's area code tryouts at UC Berkeley, they had something like 55 pitchers throwing. The top velocity was 89 or 90 and only 1 guy hit that. Next best was one of the above kids who hit 87, once. After that, I don't think 5 kids even hit 85 at all. And those are supposed to be the cream of the crop from northern CA. That is reality.
And catchers who can legitimately throw 2.10 or lower pops are just as rare.
So the league game we had in Northern California with 4 pitchers at 90+ was unique?
Two pitchers for each team hitting 90+ with others on the bench that also could bring it but had been used in previous games in the week.
Two were drafted and are now in the minors.
It was sure fun to watch!
Two pitchers for each team hitting 90+ with others on the bench that also could bring it but had been used in previous games in the week.
Two were drafted and are now in the minors.
It was sure fun to watch!
Which game was that? I can think of one or two that it might have been, and would love to know which game you're referring to. What teams were involved? I can't think of too many teams, high school or summer, that can run out those kind of pitchers in the numbers like you're indicating.
YES, no matter which game it was, it would have been very unique.
YES, no matter which game it was, it would have been very unique.
Just a regular HS league game with Deer Valley and De La Salle.
Matt North - 06 - Long Beach State - Signed by Cardinals 8th round
Taylor Staton - 06 - St Mary's of Calif
Clayton Tanner - 06 - Pepperdine - Signed by Giants 3rd round
Tyler Hess - 07 - Pepperdine / DLS football
Matt North - 06 - Long Beach State - Signed by Cardinals 8th round
Taylor Staton - 06 - St Mary's of Calif
Clayton Tanner - 06 - Pepperdine - Signed by Giants 3rd round
Tyler Hess - 07 - Pepperdine / DLS football
Coach May;
I look forward to receiving the PM with the drills and ideas. Also look forward to discussing with you.
As to the velocity issue of varsity pitchers, I remember when my son was a Fr. We had a senior pitcher, our #3, on the mound. It looked like the ball was a blur and I thought it must have at least been 90 or in the high 80s. I asked a college scout what he had on his gun and he replied that he had been as high as 84 but was pitching at 81-82. I adjusted my visual ques with regard to speed shortly thereafter.
I look forward to receiving the PM with the drills and ideas. Also look forward to discussing with you.
As to the velocity issue of varsity pitchers, I remember when my son was a Fr. We had a senior pitcher, our #3, on the mound. It looked like the ball was a blur and I thought it must have at least been 90 or in the high 80s. I asked a college scout what he had on his gun and he replied that he had been as high as 84 but was pitching at 81-82. I adjusted my visual ques with regard to speed shortly thereafter.
Welcome to HSBBW, TMM Dad. Caution though, this is a very addicting site and you should carefully consider your marital situation. 
Yeah every once in awhile in HS you get a great match up with guys throwing gas. I'll tell you this, South Caldwell HS in NC has the staff around these parts this year. Madison Bumgardner LHP 07 6'5 low 90's and has hit some 95. Justin Poovey RHP 6'1 pitches in the low 90's has hit 94. Jimmey Messer 08 RHP might be the best of the three when all is said and done pitches in the upper 80's low 90.
Bumgardner has committed to UNC and Poovey to Clemson.
Micheals Dad Im putting some stuff together and I will PM you with it.
Bumgardner has committed to UNC and Poovey to Clemson.
Micheals Dad Im putting some stuff together and I will PM you with it.
I noticed a couple of comments regarding the pitching velocities from Jupiter. According to PG Crosschecker there were over 250 pitchers that touched 88 or higher. As mentioned before these numbers includes most of the better pitchers in the country.
Since the info was part of PG Crosschecker free info area I hope they won't mind me sharing their findings:
"One of the side lists we keep in the Tower as the score/scouting sheets come in is the list of all pitchers who throw 88 mph or above. That unofficial number reached the incredible level of 268 pitchers by the end of play on Sunday. The complete list will be published later on the PG web site".
Some of the raw breakdowns of the 268 include:
98 mph: 1
97 mph: 1
95 mph: 1
94 mph: 9
93 mph: 13
92 mph: 35
91 mph: 35
90 mph: 42
89 mph: 75
88 mph: 55
RHP’s: 220
LHP’s: 48
2007’s: 212
2008’s: 49
2009’s: 4
FA’s: 1
Since the info was part of PG Crosschecker free info area I hope they won't mind me sharing their findings:
"One of the side lists we keep in the Tower as the score/scouting sheets come in is the list of all pitchers who throw 88 mph or above. That unofficial number reached the incredible level of 268 pitchers by the end of play on Sunday. The complete list will be published later on the PG web site".
Some of the raw breakdowns of the 268 include:
98 mph: 1
97 mph: 1
95 mph: 1
94 mph: 9
93 mph: 13
92 mph: 35
91 mph: 35
90 mph: 42
89 mph: 75
88 mph: 55
RHP’s: 220
LHP’s: 48
2007’s: 212
2008’s: 49
2009’s: 4
FA’s: 1