If your son needed teachers' recommendations to get a scholarship or entrance into a top academic school and the teachers refused to do it and said, "that is not my job," would you still feel the same way? I believe that it is a part of the teacher's job to do this and a coach is a teacher.
It is also part of a coach's job to be honest with his players about whether they are capable of going to the next level. If my son is not D1 or D2 material, please be honest with him and guide him to other programs that he may be better suited for.
A coach has the right to demand that the players be dedicated and make a committment to give everything to the team. A player that does everything he can to help his team should expect the coach to be honest and do everything he can to help his players.
quote:It is also part of a coach's job to be honest with his players about whether they are capable of going to the next level. If my son is not D1 or D2 material, please be honest with him and guide him to other programs that he may be better suited for.
This is a big one. It is about trusting the evaluation of the coach. parents and players would love for the coach to say all the right things to a college coach . a coach reccomends a player who is not of a certain calibre simply to make everybody feel good is not only hurting that player but those that follow that may be of the calibre. It is a bout credibility.
Ok I have tried to be nice. I have tried to not take this as a personal attack on the HS coach. But here goes.
The VAST majority of kids are not players that are going to stand out at a showcase event. When your at a showcase the kids with the top tier tools are the ones that will stand out. The college coaches are going to bore in on the players that show the tools that they feel will play at their level. Showcase events are great for these players as far as getting on the radar for college programs. But what about the HS player that does not have TOOLS that make him stand out above the other players at the showcase event?
The HS coach is a critical element in helping these players. The top tier player does not need my help. He is going to get noticed and he is going to have options. But what about the kid that can flat out play but will not stand out at a showcase? What if he has an advocate that is going to steer him the right direction? What about that D-2 or D-3 program that needs a 2b? What about the juco or community college program that is looking for players but does not have the budget to send their coaches to Showcase events? And if they do come are they going to notice the 5-8 150 lb player who runs a 7.3? But the kid can flat out play the game and he would be a great fit for that community college program.
A High School coach who works for his players is critical. He finds great fits for players and he finds coaches looking for these players. Let me put it this way. I have never (NOT ONE TIME) EVER had a player that wanted to play in college , not get the opportunity! I mean 100% of the players that have come through our program the last 12 years that wanted to play in college have played in college.
Why has this happened? Not because they went to a showcase. The top tier guys we have had went to showcase events and they stood out. The other guys needed someone to work for them. Parents can be pro active. Market their kid. But if the HS coach has built relations with college coaches from all levels , built a reputation for being honest about players this means a whole lot more than a parent making a call. How do you know who to market your kid to?
The High School coach should work for his players like they work for him. And it is important that the High School do this. Not for the top tier player even though you still do. But for the player that needs you. 100 guys at a showcase. 50 college coaches at a showcase. The top 10 or so guys are going to be noticed. Everyone else is paying the bills. Get out and work for your players. Again Im batting 1000%. Why? Because there is a place for every young man that truly wants to play at the next level and is honest about his current ability.
To say the HS coach does not matter is so wrong its ridiculous. He doesnt matter if your Rick Porcello. If your John Doe its makes all the difference in the world. YOUR JOB IS TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR BOYS. I have helped just as many players from other schools as I have my own. How many of you parents are sitting there wondering when the coach is going to call? You have gone to all the showcase events. No one is calling. You have been proactive made phone calls sent emails etc etc. A high school coach that does not feel its a big part of his job to help his players play at the next level is a clown. He has no business coaching at the high school level.
Dont tell me the HS coach is not important in this process. Only if your a top tier guy that everyone is going to be on anyway. But to the rest of the guys it is critical.
The VAST majority of kids are not players that are going to stand out at a showcase event. When your at a showcase the kids with the top tier tools are the ones that will stand out. The college coaches are going to bore in on the players that show the tools that they feel will play at their level. Showcase events are great for these players as far as getting on the radar for college programs. But what about the HS player that does not have TOOLS that make him stand out above the other players at the showcase event?
The HS coach is a critical element in helping these players. The top tier player does not need my help. He is going to get noticed and he is going to have options. But what about the kid that can flat out play but will not stand out at a showcase? What if he has an advocate that is going to steer him the right direction? What about that D-2 or D-3 program that needs a 2b? What about the juco or community college program that is looking for players but does not have the budget to send their coaches to Showcase events? And if they do come are they going to notice the 5-8 150 lb player who runs a 7.3? But the kid can flat out play the game and he would be a great fit for that community college program.
A High School coach who works for his players is critical. He finds great fits for players and he finds coaches looking for these players. Let me put it this way. I have never (NOT ONE TIME) EVER had a player that wanted to play in college , not get the opportunity! I mean 100% of the players that have come through our program the last 12 years that wanted to play in college have played in college.
Why has this happened? Not because they went to a showcase. The top tier guys we have had went to showcase events and they stood out. The other guys needed someone to work for them. Parents can be pro active. Market their kid. But if the HS coach has built relations with college coaches from all levels , built a reputation for being honest about players this means a whole lot more than a parent making a call. How do you know who to market your kid to?
The High School coach should work for his players like they work for him. And it is important that the High School do this. Not for the top tier player even though you still do. But for the player that needs you. 100 guys at a showcase. 50 college coaches at a showcase. The top 10 or so guys are going to be noticed. Everyone else is paying the bills. Get out and work for your players. Again Im batting 1000%. Why? Because there is a place for every young man that truly wants to play at the next level and is honest about his current ability.
To say the HS coach does not matter is so wrong its ridiculous. He doesnt matter if your Rick Porcello. If your John Doe its makes all the difference in the world. YOUR JOB IS TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR BOYS. I have helped just as many players from other schools as I have my own. How many of you parents are sitting there wondering when the coach is going to call? You have gone to all the showcase events. No one is calling. You have been proactive made phone calls sent emails etc etc. A high school coach that does not feel its a big part of his job to help his players play at the next level is a clown. He has no business coaching at the high school level.
Dont tell me the HS coach is not important in this process. Only if your a top tier guy that everyone is going to be on anyway. But to the rest of the guys it is critical.
Coach May,
I wish that every HS coach in America could read your post, that's who it should be directed to.
My son's HS coach made little effort to help mine, who was a top prospect and did not need his assistance.
He also didn't help the other players much either.
I wish that every HS coach in America could read your post, that's who it should be directed to.
My son's HS coach made little effort to help mine, who was a top prospect and did not need his assistance.
He also didn't help the other players much either.
Coach May,
IMO - I wouldnt get too upset about what some people say.
The folks that generalize are usually the ones that are too lazy - or too experienced - to know what they are talking about anyway.
They will take one bad experience with a high school coach - and apply it to all high school coaches across the USA.
So what? - as I said - too lazy or just not enough experience.
I know coaches - like you - that are as knowledgable and caring and experienced - as any college coach in the country. (And certainly more caring than the majority of college coaches in the NCAA - IMO.)
So, unhappy people come on - and spout about their bad experiences - and a few - generalize and say all high school coaches are meaningless.
And when all is said and done - it means nothing.
The great high school coaches - will keep on being great. Just like you. And keep on helping kids achieve their goal.
And the whiners and moaners will keep on whining and moaning - and spitting into the wind.
IMO - I wouldnt get too upset about what some people say.
The folks that generalize are usually the ones that are too lazy - or too experienced - to know what they are talking about anyway.
They will take one bad experience with a high school coach - and apply it to all high school coaches across the USA.
So what? - as I said - too lazy or just not enough experience.
I know coaches - like you - that are as knowledgable and caring and experienced - as any college coach in the country. (And certainly more caring than the majority of college coaches in the NCAA - IMO.)
So, unhappy people come on - and spout about their bad experiences - and a few - generalize and say all high school coaches are meaningless.
And when all is said and done - it means nothing.
The great high school coaches - will keep on being great. Just like you. And keep on helping kids achieve their goal.
And the whiners and moaners will keep on whining and moaning - and spitting into the wind.
Coach May
Great post! That's put on the fridge material right there for HS Coaches to read and re-read.
Great post! That's put on the fridge material right there for HS Coaches to read and re-read.
I don't know about you guys but I'm moving to Stem NC. I've got an 8th grdr that loves baseball, is a fierce competitor and seems to play his best in big games but is not one that would stand out at a showcase. 
Coach May
I like this statement, If you have a player busting his butt for you.
At least you should return the favor.
EH
quote:The High School coach should work for his players like they work for him.
I like this statement, If you have a player busting his butt for you.
At least you should return the favor.
EH
PGJerry, I stand corrected! I took your comments, without reading them carefull enough, to include coaches. ADs, yeah I can agree that they don't have the same level of responsibility. Coaches who don't care to help their kids, however, I don't have much patience with them. There are plenty of good hs coaches out there who do care about their kids moving on when possible and who help them; but the few who don't care, and don't care to learn if they're naive to the process, should be assistants or find something else to do to fill their time.
The very top players don't need the help so much, but there are many players who don't have get the attention top prospects garner, but who can play in college. I firmly believe that every head coach has a responsibility to help those kids in any manner possible.
The former head coach at our local school once told me "It's not my job to help kids move on, and I'm not going to waste my time with it, either." A guy like that has no business coaching youth sports at any level above, maybe, little league.
The very top players don't need the help so much, but there are many players who don't have get the attention top prospects garner, but who can play in college. I firmly believe that every head coach has a responsibility to help those kids in any manner possible.
The former head coach at our local school once told me "It's not my job to help kids move on, and I'm not going to waste my time with it, either." A guy like that has no business coaching youth sports at any level above, maybe, little league.
Part of your job? Its a job to help kids achieve a dream? Its a dream to help your players achieve a goal like this. I am not ashamed to say that I cried for joy earlier this year when one of my boys committed to NC State. I had the same joy when one of my boys committed to Methodist College a D-3 school. If you actually think that this is a burden or a JOB then what in the he ll are you doing in a posistion like this. Get out. Parents transfer if he does not. Any coach that doesnt take pride and joy and a sense of accomplishment to see your kid accomplish goals is not worthy of being called your sons coach. And this is one of those subjects where I have to say if you dont agree with me on that one you can kiss may _____!! Almost said it TPM! Im getting better right?
A kid busts his butt for you for four years. Sacrifices constantly to help your team win. And its a job!!! Its a job to help him? Its a burden you dont feel you should carry? What is going on? These are your boys. These are your kids. Would you help your own son? Then whats the problem?
A kid busts his butt for you for four years. Sacrifices constantly to help your team win. And its a job!!! Its a job to help him? Its a burden you dont feel you should carry? What is going on? These are your boys. These are your kids. Would you help your own son? Then whats the problem?
I admire coaches like Coach May and Will and others on the board that believe coaching is so much more than handling the games. They are teachers of the game who help all of their players improve to whatever degree their talent allows them to improve. Their character does not allow them to quit on their players after the games are over.
One of my brothers was lucky enough to have a coach like them. My brother was not a star on his HS team but a team player that did all of the dirty work. His coach didn't wait for letters of recommendation but helped my brother find a school where he could play. With this coach's help,my brother was able to play at Davidson College and obtain a degree.
My son is in 8th grade right now and I pray that he will have a dedicated coach like those on this board.
One of my brothers was lucky enough to have a coach like them. My brother was not a star on his HS team but a team player that did all of the dirty work. His coach didn't wait for letters of recommendation but helped my brother find a school where he could play. With this coach's help,my brother was able to play at Davidson College and obtain a degree.
My son is in 8th grade right now and I pray that he will have a dedicated coach like those on this board.
quote:Because there is a place for every young man that truly wants to play at the next level and is honest about his current ability.
Coach May - that is one of the most positive things I have ever seen posted here. I like to repeat myself but it does not take overwhelming talent to play at the collegiate level imho. It takes decent talent with the will to compete. It may indeed be more mental than physical in some cases.
They all have talent. Some more than others. But some have never had to compete for a posistion in their lives. They have always just won it based on the fact they were more talented. Now when talent is more equal, the will to compete the desire to battle will be the difference. Players that know how to compete and want to compete will be their long after the more talented players who have never learned what it truly means to compete.
Talent can get you there. But it will not keep you there. jmho
Talent can get you there. But it will not keep you there. jmho
CM,
Much better.
I am not sure what it is like in the rest of the country, but our HS coaches cannot coach kids outside of HS. They are not allowed to work with them on the field until mid-late January. That means that many players spend very little time with the coach in game situations, 25-28 games maybe, mid february until end of April, about 2 and a hlf months out of the year. My son spent more time playing with the travel coaches, and the games he played were of much more significance than most of his HS games.
Do you think that is why many coaches do not take actice roles in the recruiting process? In the overall scheme of things, he spent very little time with him.
Much better.
I am not sure what it is like in the rest of the country, but our HS coaches cannot coach kids outside of HS. They are not allowed to work with them on the field until mid-late January. That means that many players spend very little time with the coach in game situations, 25-28 games maybe, mid february until end of April, about 2 and a hlf months out of the year. My son spent more time playing with the travel coaches, and the games he played were of much more significance than most of his HS games.
Do you think that is why many coaches do not take actice roles in the recruiting process? In the overall scheme of things, he spent very little time with him.
I'm sorry I got in late on this discussion. I debated for a moment whether to post or not.
I see a few critical distinctions need to be made. First, there is a HUGE difference between a coach that doesn't help or doesn't know enough to help in recruiting and a coach that HINDERS or discourages the recruitment of one of his players (e.g. throwing away questionaires). The latter of the two, in my mind, needs to be dealt with either from the AD or principal or by leaving the program.
I cannot for the life of me understand why a coach would not want his players to go on to bigger and better things. That position, in and of itself, is detrimental to the program ...and leads me to ask, should this person be a coach/mentor/teacher etc.
I see baseball recruiting like this...
About 70-75% percent of the recruiting process is the responsibility of the players family or guardian. The other 25-30% is coaches, be it High School or club coaches. Now, I realize that those coaches don't HAVE to be involved for a kid to move on to another level, but they CAN play an important role...particularly for the non D-1 draftable talents ...because they can give a fair assesment of the kids skill and help finda good fit.
At the very least, a coach who wants to stay out of the recruting process or isn't knowledgeable enough to help, can assist the player and their parents by passing along letters or letting them know who has called.
It's incredible to me to think a coach gets called by a college recruiter and says "no one here can help you" or throws away letters.
I see a few critical distinctions need to be made. First, there is a HUGE difference between a coach that doesn't help or doesn't know enough to help in recruiting and a coach that HINDERS or discourages the recruitment of one of his players (e.g. throwing away questionaires). The latter of the two, in my mind, needs to be dealt with either from the AD or principal or by leaving the program.
I cannot for the life of me understand why a coach would not want his players to go on to bigger and better things. That position, in and of itself, is detrimental to the program ...and leads me to ask, should this person be a coach/mentor/teacher etc.
I see baseball recruiting like this...
About 70-75% percent of the recruiting process is the responsibility of the players family or guardian. The other 25-30% is coaches, be it High School or club coaches. Now, I realize that those coaches don't HAVE to be involved for a kid to move on to another level, but they CAN play an important role...particularly for the non D-1 draftable talents ...because they can give a fair assesment of the kids skill and help finda good fit.
At the very least, a coach who wants to stay out of the recruting process or isn't knowledgeable enough to help, can assist the player and their parents by passing along letters or letting them know who has called.
It's incredible to me to think a coach gets called by a college recruiter and says "no one here can help you" or throws away letters.
Although I am out of coaching I still work with kids at camps and clinics. A while back a [arent asked me if I thought his boy would get a baseball scholarship for college. Maybe the question should be can he play in high school?
aside from un-cooperative guys who have already been discussed ...quote:by estone: It's incredible to me to think a coach gets called by a college recruiter and says "no one here can help you"
think about why "good college recruiters" are sucessfull
they evaluate/select 16 yr olds and project them 5 yrs to the future WITH the added benefit of development in that coach's own college program
not many regular hs coaches have or even would ever need that ability ...
of course there are some "baseball men" coaching hs for whom that would not apply
put aside the "no brainer" stud players, and it's not at all uncommon for a hs coach to be "very surprised" at many other players success at the next level
I'm sure there are plenty of good coaches out there for high school, but there are also a lot of bad ones too, that I don't think I'd have a lot of faith in them being able to tell if a kid has d1,d2, d3 talent or whatever. If all they know is history or math I'm certainly not gonna rely on them to get my child exposure. I can see where the coach might feel that it's not their job to to talk to college coaches, and if your in a situation like that do you really want him to? Even if you have to pressure him a little?
2Diamonds, you make a valid point. Unfortunately, across this great nation we all have teachers who coach baseball only for the stipend. To them it's all about working that approx. 12 week stretch for that added pay. Heaven-to-betsy don't EVEN ask if they would be willing to coach some of the boys in June for a little summer ball. Fall Ball? Forget it. This was our former coach.
Now we have a Baseball coach (former college/minor leaguer) who has to teach in order to get on the field to do what he truly loves - coaching! The difference between these 2 types are night and day.
Just to give you an ideal at how bad of an attitude the former coach had and still has my son invited him to the library couple weeks back for his signing out of respect. Went to his classroom and asked him. The former coach told him when he signs D1 he would show up. (son signed NAIA). It was his way of trying to deflate my son's "15 minutes". Just an ole sourpuss who's been ******* lemon's his whole life.
May be a jealously thing...who knows. I think he played 1 year of college ball in D3 long ago.
Now we have a Baseball coach (former college/minor leaguer) who has to teach in order to get on the field to do what he truly loves - coaching! The difference between these 2 types are night and day.
Just to give you an ideal at how bad of an attitude the former coach had and still has my son invited him to the library couple weeks back for his signing out of respect. Went to his classroom and asked him. The former coach told him when he signs D1 he would show up. (son signed NAIA). It was his way of trying to deflate my son's "15 minutes". Just an ole sourpuss who's been ******* lemon's his whole life.
May be a jealously thing...who knows. I think he played 1 year of college ball in D3 long ago.
The topic of high school coaches could be titled “The Good, The Bad and The Ugly. I’ve spent the last 30 years or so involved in dealing with recruiting, scouting and dealing with many high school coaches.
First of all, the coaches like Coach May, Will, and several others who post here, I would automatically place in the “Good” category. If for no other reason, their involvement here is proof that they really care about players and the game of baseball.
Coach May is one that I’ve had a lot of contact with and there is absolutely no doubt he has a strong desire to help players. He has a talented son, that we have followed for quite awhile and we’ve talked to him regarding his son. More important though is the many times Coach May emails me telling us about “other” talented players who play for him or even play elsewhere in the Carolinas. He understands that we can help talented players and he definitely has proven (over and over) that he has a desire to help young players. That said, Coach May knows baseball and talent, so any information he passes on needs to be taken seriously.
There are several others that we run across who operate like CM, Coach Merc (also from this site) is another that comes to mind who has helped us so much over the years. Just so happens that he also has talented sons, but tries to help many in his part of the country. Ther are many other great coaches who help young players, but I think it’s important to understand that overall these type guys are RARE when compared to the average high school coach. The work these guys do and the time they spend helping young players should never be reflected as the norm for high school or youth coaching.
There is absolutely no doubt that a larger majority of “travel” or summer coaches do so much more to promote players to the next level. In many cases they also help promote talented players that don’t actually play for them. Unfortunately, as in all things, some do a “much” better job than others. There will always be those who “use” but don’t do much “giving” when it comes to promoting or helping their players. Some due to lack of knowledge which can be forgiven, some due to not caring, which should never be forgiven.
One last thing… Not bragging here, but it can be very helpful when players are listed in our database. Our information is seen by more colleges and professional baseball people than any other place. It is what we do for a living!!!! We have earned credibility over many years of providing reliable information to decision makers. The purpose for bringing this up… Every once in awhile we send out correspondence to every high school coach in the USA. I can’t remember how many, but kind of recall something like 20,000 HS Coaches. Obviously, lots of this correspondence doesn’t reach it’s intended target, so that must be taken into account. The correspondence is much like what a pro scout or college coach might send out…. It’s a questionnaire and the purpose is to find out which are the best players.
For the most part, many of the coaches who are most familiar with what we do will fill out the questionnaire and return it. Some even take the time to call us and ask questions and give information or promote their players. Sadly, the vast majority, over 90% we never hear from. That is why coaches like Coach May, and many others are nowhere near the norm when it comes to being a high school coach. BTW, we do get a few questions regarding why we want the information. This is also a case of a high school coach who cares.
The topic of high school coaches and high school administrators could be a very long one. We have seen just about everything imaginable when it comes to caring, not caring, agendas, self promotion, etc., but they should follow the lead of the college coaches. We also rank college players for the draft. The amount of cooperation from college coaching staffs is an altogether different ball game. It’s because they understand the importance, the system, and it really means much more to them and their program.
Someone mentioned they couldn’t understand why a high school coach would ever tell a college coach “He has no one who can help them”. I can only think of one good reason one of the top high school coaches would say that… If it happened to be TRUE! It’s all about credibility! We lie to a college coach once and he will never listen to us again. We can be accidentally wrong about a player and once in awhile we are, but we can never be “wrong on purpose”!
Note: Please forgive the part of this post that might sound like bragging or self promotion. I don't like either of those, but found it hard to explain my thoughts without saying those things.
Merry Christmas
First of all, the coaches like Coach May, Will, and several others who post here, I would automatically place in the “Good” category. If for no other reason, their involvement here is proof that they really care about players and the game of baseball.
Coach May is one that I’ve had a lot of contact with and there is absolutely no doubt he has a strong desire to help players. He has a talented son, that we have followed for quite awhile and we’ve talked to him regarding his son. More important though is the many times Coach May emails me telling us about “other” talented players who play for him or even play elsewhere in the Carolinas. He understands that we can help talented players and he definitely has proven (over and over) that he has a desire to help young players. That said, Coach May knows baseball and talent, so any information he passes on needs to be taken seriously.
There are several others that we run across who operate like CM, Coach Merc (also from this site) is another that comes to mind who has helped us so much over the years. Just so happens that he also has talented sons, but tries to help many in his part of the country. Ther are many other great coaches who help young players, but I think it’s important to understand that overall these type guys are RARE when compared to the average high school coach. The work these guys do and the time they spend helping young players should never be reflected as the norm for high school or youth coaching.
There is absolutely no doubt that a larger majority of “travel” or summer coaches do so much more to promote players to the next level. In many cases they also help promote talented players that don’t actually play for them. Unfortunately, as in all things, some do a “much” better job than others. There will always be those who “use” but don’t do much “giving” when it comes to promoting or helping their players. Some due to lack of knowledge which can be forgiven, some due to not caring, which should never be forgiven.
One last thing… Not bragging here, but it can be very helpful when players are listed in our database. Our information is seen by more colleges and professional baseball people than any other place. It is what we do for a living!!!! We have earned credibility over many years of providing reliable information to decision makers. The purpose for bringing this up… Every once in awhile we send out correspondence to every high school coach in the USA. I can’t remember how many, but kind of recall something like 20,000 HS Coaches. Obviously, lots of this correspondence doesn’t reach it’s intended target, so that must be taken into account. The correspondence is much like what a pro scout or college coach might send out…. It’s a questionnaire and the purpose is to find out which are the best players.
For the most part, many of the coaches who are most familiar with what we do will fill out the questionnaire and return it. Some even take the time to call us and ask questions and give information or promote their players. Sadly, the vast majority, over 90% we never hear from. That is why coaches like Coach May, and many others are nowhere near the norm when it comes to being a high school coach. BTW, we do get a few questions regarding why we want the information. This is also a case of a high school coach who cares.
The topic of high school coaches and high school administrators could be a very long one. We have seen just about everything imaginable when it comes to caring, not caring, agendas, self promotion, etc., but they should follow the lead of the college coaches. We also rank college players for the draft. The amount of cooperation from college coaching staffs is an altogether different ball game. It’s because they understand the importance, the system, and it really means much more to them and their program.
Someone mentioned they couldn’t understand why a high school coach would ever tell a college coach “He has no one who can help them”. I can only think of one good reason one of the top high school coaches would say that… If it happened to be TRUE! It’s all about credibility! We lie to a college coach once and he will never listen to us again. We can be accidentally wrong about a player and once in awhile we are, but we can never be “wrong on purpose”!
Note: Please forgive the part of this post that might sound like bragging or self promotion. I don't like either of those, but found it hard to explain my thoughts without saying those things.
Merry Christmas
So we've had a thread to bash high school coaches.. shall we start one to bash travel coaches too?
My high school coach would help his players anyway he possibly could. He's written players letters of recommendation that were not for baseball. It's actually funny last spring when he was talking to us seniors after our last game he was saying how he'd do anything, except give us money, that he possibly could at any time. Afterwards, assistant coach told him he had heard that speech before... The assistant coach was our head coach's high school baseball coach. The speech was the same one he had given.
I don't believe that it is the high school coach's job to find a player a place to play. I think that if a college coach contacts him, he should help as best as he can. If a player asks for a letter or something, the coach should do what he can. I do not believe a coach should go out of his way.
I didn't have teachers calling schools trying to get them to let me in. Or offer me a scholarship. When I asked a teacher for a letter of recommendation, I cannot think of one who turned me down.
My high school coach would help his players anyway he possibly could. He's written players letters of recommendation that were not for baseball. It's actually funny last spring when he was talking to us seniors after our last game he was saying how he'd do anything, except give us money, that he possibly could at any time. Afterwards, assistant coach told him he had heard that speech before... The assistant coach was our head coach's high school baseball coach. The speech was the same one he had given.
I don't believe that it is the high school coach's job to find a player a place to play. I think that if a college coach contacts him, he should help as best as he can. If a player asks for a letter or something, the coach should do what he can. I do not believe a coach should go out of his way.
I didn't have teachers calling schools trying to get them to let me in. Or offer me a scholarship. When I asked a teacher for a letter of recommendation, I cannot think of one who turned me down.
I agree with every word of PG post. When I met coach Merc all he talked to me about were other players in his area. He never mentioned his own son until I asked him about him. The reason I have always promoted PG and their events is because of the tremendous credibility they have within the baseball community. They have earned this credibility and they understand that their credibility is the most important thing they have. My son recieved offers from coaches based on information that PG had given to them from them seeing him at their events. If you have a tremendous amount of credibility it goes a long way. PG is right about the vast amount of HS coaches. It is a shame but it is true. But that does not mean you have to accept it. There are people that will help you. The top tier guys dont need a hs coach to work hard for them even though I feel you still should. But the other guys do need someone. If not the hs coach then who? The summer coach if he has credibility can be a good source. But what if you do not have a quality summer coach? Its sad to me when I see a kid who has no one working in his corner. This is where someone like PG comes in bigtime. They are going to rate the kid and have a kid in their database and believe me college coaches check that database. Heck my sons picture on UNC's website is his picture from the PG underclass national showcase.
I can never say enough about how much attending PG events helped my son during the recruiting phase. And I know many more that are in the same boat as well. When Miss State calls because they got information from PG database and they say if PG says this we know its for real - What does that say about someone's credibility. Funny thing about some college coaches "Hey if MSU is on him he must be legit we better make some contact with them".
I know I have gone all over the place with this post. But the fact is you have to help yourself and you have to know how to help yourself. But I also feel very strongly that a HS coach should want to do everything possible to help his players anyway he can. And he has to get out there and learn and see whats out there. This way he can arm himself with knowledge about levels of play and where his players stack up in the overall picture and not just in his little community. My son is the best player in his area. But at a PG national he is just holding his own. If you dont get out of the little pond how do you know how big a fish you really are? And more importantly how do you know how good your players really are if you dont make some drives to the ocean?
I can never say enough about how much attending PG events helped my son during the recruiting phase. And I know many more that are in the same boat as well. When Miss State calls because they got information from PG database and they say if PG says this we know its for real - What does that say about someone's credibility. Funny thing about some college coaches "Hey if MSU is on him he must be legit we better make some contact with them".
I know I have gone all over the place with this post. But the fact is you have to help yourself and you have to know how to help yourself. But I also feel very strongly that a HS coach should want to do everything possible to help his players anyway he can. And he has to get out there and learn and see whats out there. This way he can arm himself with knowledge about levels of play and where his players stack up in the overall picture and not just in his little community. My son is the best player in his area. But at a PG national he is just holding his own. If you dont get out of the little pond how do you know how big a fish you really are? And more importantly how do you know how good your players really are if you dont make some drives to the ocean?
quote:Originally posted by Bulldog 19:
So we've had a thread to bash high school coaches.. shall we start one to bash travel coaches too?
I didn't have teachers calling schools trying to get them to let me in. Or offer me a scholarship. When I asked a teacher for a letter of recommendation, I cannot think of one who turned me down.
I don't think that this was meant to bash HS coaches, just to point out that some are different and look at their responsibilities differently than others.
Coaches are teachers, the way I look at it every teacher has a responsibility to help every student to get to the next level. As a kindergarten teacher, it was my responsibility to get the student to the next level, that was first grade.
How many HS teachers (not coaches) actually go beyond the classroom to help students get to college? Your point was a good one.
IMO, there aren't too many coaches out there like Coach May. As PG has suggested, he will go out of his way to let others know about players he sees throughout his area and state. I know this for a fact because he has asked me to supply contact information to a coach regarding players. He is proud of what he does and he should be. I wish there were more coaches like him, Coach Merc and CoachB.
After reading PG's post, and knowing what they do to help get players exposure I got to thinking about recruiting and how it has changed since my son first stepped foot in HS. Their showcases and tournies were an important part in son's recruiting process. So therefore, we didn't feel the need to ask son's HS to be involved, though during his final season he was very helpful with scouts, answering questions, letting them know when he would get his next start and talking to them after the game. So as not to pass judgment, I have to go back and think, maybe he didn't feel that he needed to help in the recruiting process and he also knew that as a parent I was pretty much on top of things.
I in particular am enjoying this discussion, as I feel it goes hand in hand with many discussions we have had regarding HS vs. travel ball in the recruiting process. Everyone sees things differently. We considered HS more of a place to refine skills where for high profile tournies, showcases outside of HS, it was a chance to put those skills to good use. I think that a lot of that was based on where we live and how important travel ball has now become. There are some HS here in the area, where competition is fierce and plays an important role in getting players noticed, i didn't find that to be true in the competition son played against in HS.
I don't think it's fair to place blame on anyone particular person, but a fair thing would be to find out where your son's HS coach stands in the way of the entire process before judgements can be made.
JMO.
quote:Originally posted by Tiger Paw Mom:quote:Originally posted by Bulldog 19:
So we've had a thread to bash high school coaches.. shall we start one to bash travel coaches too?
I didn't have teachers calling schools trying to get them to let me in. Or offer me a scholarship. When I asked a teacher for a letter of recommendation, I cannot think of one who turned me down.
I don't think that this was meant to bash HS coaches, just to point out that some are different and look at their responsibilities differently than others.
Coaches are teachers, the way I look at it every teacher has a responsibility to help every student to get to the next level. As a kindergarten teacher, it was my responsibility to get the student to the next level, that was first grade.
How many HS teachers (not coaches) actually go beyond the classroom to help students get to college? Your point was a good one.
I agree that it probably was not intended to necessarily bash high school coaches, but several have taken it that far.
I believe teachers should help students get to the next level as well. But I believe a coach's job is also get the player to the next level. In the case of a high school student-athlete, he should be concerned about assisting the student-athlete to pursue a school which has that particular student-athlete's interests. I do not believe it is the high school coach's job to get the student-athlete onto the roster of another team. That is the student-athlete's job.
While the thread started as an issue with a high school coach, as the thread unfolded it really becomes about quality coaches versus weak coaches. The difference in high school versus travel is a college prospect is probably playing for a quality travel coach. The player targeted the team/program and coach. A player doesn't get to chose his high school coach unless he opts for a Catholic or private school. A college prospect may get stuck playing for a weak high school coach. This makes high school coaches more of a target in these kinds of discussions.quote:So we've had a thread to bash high school coaches.. shall we start one to bash travel coaches too?
The previous coach at our high school didn't even keep stats. He didn't have any information to provide for the players to pass on to recruiting colleges. The kids would make up their stats. He didn't even go to conference meetings to decide all-conference players armed with any data. The kids would lose out to lesser talent. The coach managed to lead reasonable talent to seventeen losing seasons in twenty years, while losing a lot of talent to private and Catholic schools. Fortunately a new AD came in and eventually fired the guy. The new coach is a former college and pro player.
The way high school coaches are selected can have a bearing on the quality. We're fortunate our state allows coaches to come from anywhere as long as they have teaching certificates, and our school district has adopted this philosophy. We might have better middle school coaches than some high schools. Our new AD looks for the best. On the other end of the spectrum some high schools are required to hire a teacher from the high school with the most teaching seniority who wants the coaching job regardless of whether he can teach and/or coach the sport.
Anyway, thanks to the good high school coaches. They have an opportunity to make a difference not only in the player's sport, but also the player's life. They have that opportunity every day (all year if they teach at the school).
Signed, a travel coach and parent of a high school player
I posted on this young man a few years ago. I will use this an a perfect example of what I am talking about.
His name is Gary. He was a rhp 6'2 190 with a fastball that topped out around 80. He worked hard his whole hs career and when he was a senior he got around 9 innings of work on the hill. He wanted to play in college very badly. He worked very hard but he lacked the velocity to get any looks from coaches either at showcase events or workouts.
What I saw was a good sized kid with an arm slot that could possibly work lower. I knew he would work really hard. Maybe if he could go somewhere get in the weight room and mature even more who knows what could happen. I called a juco told them what I thought and they told me to send him on over. The kid came in throwing around 80-81 and worked his butt off. He ended up being the #1 guy out of the pen his second year throwing 83-84 from a sidearm arm slot. He moved on to a D-2 school and topped out at 87 his senior year and was all conference. He got a degree and he played four years of college baseball. How many Gary's never got a chance? 1 is too many. But way more than that. Now that is not acceptable in my book.
I had a catcher Ryan who was not a great catcher. He was a 2.2 guy and had a long swing. But no one worked any harder behind the dish. He loved to catch and he was an outstanding young man. He desperately wanted to play in college. He could not get any looks at showcase events. 5-7 165 7.3 60 and bp was not pretty. I called the coach at Methodist College. I told him I had a catcher. I told him he would not find a harder worker. I told him he was not the most talented kid in the world but he would go to the pen and work his butt off. Coach send him on down and we will talk to him. He played 2 years on the JV. He never made the Varsity. But his work ethic and love of the game was undeniable. He is now the assistant coach on the JV squad at Methodist College and he will graduate this next semester. He is going to take a grad assistant coaching posistion on the varsity with Methodist College a D-3 power in NC.
So your still going to say that the HS coach does not matter? Huh Frank? These are two examples of the average hs players. There are many many more. I dont need to help the Chris Lucks or the Pratt Maynards. They are studs and they are going to be fine. They are going to stand out at any showcase when they drop bombs and throw 90. No Im going to fight for the guys that need someone to fight for them. And any coach that expects players to go out there and leave skin and blood on the field for them but then wont do everything they can for their players - words can not describe how I feel about those clowns.
His name is Gary. He was a rhp 6'2 190 with a fastball that topped out around 80. He worked hard his whole hs career and when he was a senior he got around 9 innings of work on the hill. He wanted to play in college very badly. He worked very hard but he lacked the velocity to get any looks from coaches either at showcase events or workouts.
What I saw was a good sized kid with an arm slot that could possibly work lower. I knew he would work really hard. Maybe if he could go somewhere get in the weight room and mature even more who knows what could happen. I called a juco told them what I thought and they told me to send him on over. The kid came in throwing around 80-81 and worked his butt off. He ended up being the #1 guy out of the pen his second year throwing 83-84 from a sidearm arm slot. He moved on to a D-2 school and topped out at 87 his senior year and was all conference. He got a degree and he played four years of college baseball. How many Gary's never got a chance? 1 is too many. But way more than that. Now that is not acceptable in my book.
I had a catcher Ryan who was not a great catcher. He was a 2.2 guy and had a long swing. But no one worked any harder behind the dish. He loved to catch and he was an outstanding young man. He desperately wanted to play in college. He could not get any looks at showcase events. 5-7 165 7.3 60 and bp was not pretty. I called the coach at Methodist College. I told him I had a catcher. I told him he would not find a harder worker. I told him he was not the most talented kid in the world but he would go to the pen and work his butt off. Coach send him on down and we will talk to him. He played 2 years on the JV. He never made the Varsity. But his work ethic and love of the game was undeniable. He is now the assistant coach on the JV squad at Methodist College and he will graduate this next semester. He is going to take a grad assistant coaching posistion on the varsity with Methodist College a D-3 power in NC.
So your still going to say that the HS coach does not matter? Huh Frank? These are two examples of the average hs players. There are many many more. I dont need to help the Chris Lucks or the Pratt Maynards. They are studs and they are going to be fine. They are going to stand out at any showcase when they drop bombs and throw 90. No Im going to fight for the guys that need someone to fight for them. And any coach that expects players to go out there and leave skin and blood on the field for them but then wont do everything they can for their players - words can not describe how I feel about those clowns.
Coach ... Coming out of our high school with the last coach, they would have been looking forward to college intramural softball. You're making a difference.
Shouldn't a HS coach at least bring up the subject (once)during the kids HS baseball career of inquiring as to who may have goals to play beyond HS? maybe it's asking too much, but I think when the topic is never addressed by the coaches, players in a lot of cases assume there is no chance of them moving on.
Bulldog 19 is a tremendous young man and his dedication/loyalty shows in his respect for his coach. His coach is Coach Mark Vogel and he's one heck of a good man and coach. One of the finest I've met. Bulldog 19s dad also falls into that category.
Coaches are torn often between where a player wants to go, being honest with the recruiter so as to not damage their reputations on recommendations, and their natural care for their player. It is easy for some to say "who's the high school coach to say what level a young man can play at." However, this is a valid issue. I recall so many times first starting with sophomores that are on the varsity and yes, some juniors who made the varsity as juniors and telling them that they are already behind in the recruiting process. Coaches can help themselves if they begin the process in partnership with the parents. When just_learning's son was a freshman, I submitted his name to various schools because he was a freshman that earned a starting spot on our team. That is no easy task! Coaches should take a few simple steps to be ready to help their players.
For the life of me, I don't understand any coach not wanting to build a program. In building a program, one of the outstanding benefits is that colleges will come calling for your players. That only goes to make the program more successful. Coach May is a great demonstration of that.
Finally, my daugher is a freshman in high school. I won't be waiting around for anyone to promote her. I've already began the process. My favorite quotes goes, "There are three types of people in this world. Those that make things happen, those that watch things happen and those to whom things happen." If you want your son to play in college, MAKE THINGS HAPPEN.
All the above is JMHO!
Coaches are torn often between where a player wants to go, being honest with the recruiter so as to not damage their reputations on recommendations, and their natural care for their player. It is easy for some to say "who's the high school coach to say what level a young man can play at." However, this is a valid issue. I recall so many times first starting with sophomores that are on the varsity and yes, some juniors who made the varsity as juniors and telling them that they are already behind in the recruiting process. Coaches can help themselves if they begin the process in partnership with the parents. When just_learning's son was a freshman, I submitted his name to various schools because he was a freshman that earned a starting spot on our team. That is no easy task! Coaches should take a few simple steps to be ready to help their players.
- First, go to google, or any search engine for that matter, and create a favorites folder of universities in your state. Universities in U.S. Then go to those universities that you think the majority of players have interest and see if they have an online interest form. For example, Southern Illinois University at Edwardsville is very close to us. It has a form on line that lets the coaching staff know you are interested in that school.
- Next, have the parents reference this site and the info on recruitment.
- Then, make up some type of "game plan" based upon what both the parents and the player wants. For example, if a student struggles with school, you might want to let the parents know about the JUCOs in the area and the ones you've had the most success with. I do this and to be honest, 2 years ago, we had a player and parents send their son to one school I didn't recommend. I had to work hard this spring to find him another place to play. I mentioned that on this site last spring.
- Know what universities are looking for and how to make a recruitment tool (DVD) that they may look at. I always mention that if we can get a coach at the collegiate level to first look at one and second look for more than 2 minutes, we've done well.
- Coaches can create "player folders" in their favorites which include the email address of their player's choices and then during the season when that young man's name appears in the paper (on line), they can send a copy of the artilce via a hyperlink to that coach. I KNOW THIS HAS HELPED NUMEROUS KIDS THAT I'VE WORKED WITH.
- Frank Martin's comment about HS coaches isn't without some merit. Some HS coaches have done little to build a program and/or promote their players. If you find your son in the situation of playing for one of those coaches, then use your resources. I have written letters for players at just about every conference school we play in. In fact, last spring, I made a DVD for a player on another team. Naturally, his dad had to provide the video. As I tell my players, that DVD is exactly 5 minutes long and then ends with references and contact info.
For the life of me, I don't understand any coach not wanting to build a program. In building a program, one of the outstanding benefits is that colleges will come calling for your players. That only goes to make the program more successful. Coach May is a great demonstration of that.
Finally, my daugher is a freshman in high school. I won't be waiting around for anyone to promote her. I've already began the process. My favorite quotes goes, "There are three types of people in this world. Those that make things happen, those that watch things happen and those to whom things happen." If you want your son to play in college, MAKE THINGS HAPPEN.
All the above is JMHO!
With all the baseball events outside of HS baseball there is no way that a HS player, with or without his HS coaches input, doesn't know what his chances of playing college baseball are---if you think that isnt so you are only fooling yourself
Frank Martin (ANDY) --as to why a college coach will call a HS coach itis simple---they want to get input on the players character
As for Travel Team coaches there a load of bad ones there as well---it took us many seasons to find the proper combination for us
Frank Martin (ANDY) --as to why a college coach will call a HS coach itis simple---they want to get input on the players character
As for Travel Team coaches there a load of bad ones there as well---it took us many seasons to find the proper combination for us
There are some good HS Coaches and some bad. Some really help their players careers and some dont.
Good example, I saw a Junior HS Catcher I liked. Got a player info card on him and then talked to the HS Coach. HS coach was he has talent, a head case dont waste your time with him. A MLB scout approach the HS Coach about getting the player to attend East Coast Pro Showcase. HS coach told the MLB scout he a head case, I would not take him there. So the MLB scout did not bring him to the East Coast Pro Showcase or even bothered to contact the player after that.One time a college coach called the HS coach about the player, another teacher was in the room. The HS Coach told the college coach, dont waste your time with him, head case not worth your effort. Other teacher called the dad of the player. Needless to say not a pretty scene after that.
So what happen to the player drafted out of HS turned down big bucks went to a JUCO then a SEC colege before turning pro.
And yes there are some real good HS coaches out there.
As far as tools at a HS Showcase, tools can be improved. Most of the players with bad release times, 60 yard dashes , MPH, mechanics are not very good. Players can be shown how to improve their performance.
Good example saw a catcher at one tryout, good arm but consistent 2.06-2.15 release. Next week seen again the same thing, one coach showed him better footwork, release was now 1.90-1.97.
Good example, I saw a Junior HS Catcher I liked. Got a player info card on him and then talked to the HS Coach. HS coach was he has talent, a head case dont waste your time with him. A MLB scout approach the HS Coach about getting the player to attend East Coast Pro Showcase. HS coach told the MLB scout he a head case, I would not take him there. So the MLB scout did not bring him to the East Coast Pro Showcase or even bothered to contact the player after that.One time a college coach called the HS coach about the player, another teacher was in the room. The HS Coach told the college coach, dont waste your time with him, head case not worth your effort. Other teacher called the dad of the player. Needless to say not a pretty scene after that.
So what happen to the player drafted out of HS turned down big bucks went to a JUCO then a SEC colege before turning pro.
And yes there are some real good HS coaches out there.
As far as tools at a HS Showcase, tools can be improved. Most of the players with bad release times, 60 yard dashes , MPH, mechanics are not very good. Players can be shown how to improve their performance.
Good example saw a catcher at one tryout, good arm but consistent 2.06-2.15 release. Next week seen again the same thing, one coach showed him better footwork, release was now 1.90-1.97.
Keep in mind one thing when we talk about coaches---the kid who is East Coast/Aflac/ Area Codes is not the kid a HS /travel team coach needs to help---the kid who needs the assistance/guidance is the kid is who the good/above average player---these are the majority of HS players---
Another factor to keep in mind is how many college coaches does the coach know and have a solid relationship with , whether he is a HS or Travel Team coach
I keep Pro scouts out of the picture here because I am talking of the college prospect player not the pro prospect
Another factor to keep in mind is how many college coaches does the coach know and have a solid relationship with , whether he is a HS or Travel Team coach
I keep Pro scouts out of the picture here because I am talking of the college prospect player not the pro prospect
quote:There is absolutely no doubt that a larger majority of “travel” or summer coaches do so much more to promote players to the next level.
any proof or just an opinion?
Will,
That sounds like something I might have said. Don't know about proof, but we get a very small percentage of response from HS coaches compared to the number of calls we get where a travel coach is promoting a certain player he has.
When I speak of travel programs, I should add that we work with mostly the higher tier travel programs. Now days the there seems to be too many travel teams, some involved for different reasons than others.
Also I respectfully disagree with those who say the "studs" need no help. Sometimes it's the best prospects that need the very most help in the process. Yes, they will probably have college offers, but there is a whole world out there in addition to the options that pop up.
I remember, years ago when it was very seldom that a player from Iowa or Wisconsin would be recruited by out of state schools, even in the midwest. In the past few years, Iowa and Wisconsin kids have signed with Stanford, Southern Cal, LSU, Baylor, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, San Diego State, Oregon State, Georgia Tech, Missouri, TCU, Oklahoma State, Wichita State, Arizona State, etc., etc.
These were all "studs" who wouldn't have had those opportunities by doing nothing. There are kids from Texas, California and Florida who have had doors open up across the nation because they were seen by many more people. Now days Georgia kids are being successfully recruited by UCLA and West Coast schools. some West Coast players "studs" are ending up at East Coast schools.
Then whose to say that first round picks would have been first round picks without competing with and against the very best competition. I can name many first round picks that were nowhere near so obvious before they displayed their talent at the right place and right time.
Each year we find players the fall and winter before their senior year. They are "studs" but very few people knew it before then. It becomes obviously clear that we don't find them all, so some are slipping through the cracks. Believe it or not we find some of these not so well known "studs" in the states of Texas, Florida and California. Even in the state of Georgia, which is one we think we know a lot about, there are studs that pop up out of the clear blue at times.
These types are treasures to the local colleges. Sometimes it is why you see a super prospect at a small college. If everyone knew the player early on, he more than likely would be somewhere else.
So while it's important for a high school coach to help all the young players, it is equally important to help the "studs"! BTW, I've always disliked the word "stud"!
Will, You can call it our "opinion" based on our experience. We know lots of great high school coaches who really care. But compared to the number of high school coaches there are, the real good ones are fairly rare. At the higher level of travel baseball it's not so rare to find coaches who work hard to help the individual player reach the next level. In fact, it is vitally important to the top level programs track record. I'm not so familiar with the lower levels of travel ball.
That sounds like something I might have said. Don't know about proof, but we get a very small percentage of response from HS coaches compared to the number of calls we get where a travel coach is promoting a certain player he has.
When I speak of travel programs, I should add that we work with mostly the higher tier travel programs. Now days the there seems to be too many travel teams, some involved for different reasons than others.
Also I respectfully disagree with those who say the "studs" need no help. Sometimes it's the best prospects that need the very most help in the process. Yes, they will probably have college offers, but there is a whole world out there in addition to the options that pop up.
I remember, years ago when it was very seldom that a player from Iowa or Wisconsin would be recruited by out of state schools, even in the midwest. In the past few years, Iowa and Wisconsin kids have signed with Stanford, Southern Cal, LSU, Baylor, Notre Dame, Oklahoma, San Diego State, Oregon State, Georgia Tech, Missouri, TCU, Oklahoma State, Wichita State, Arizona State, etc., etc.
These were all "studs" who wouldn't have had those opportunities by doing nothing. There are kids from Texas, California and Florida who have had doors open up across the nation because they were seen by many more people. Now days Georgia kids are being successfully recruited by UCLA and West Coast schools. some West Coast players "studs" are ending up at East Coast schools.
Then whose to say that first round picks would have been first round picks without competing with and against the very best competition. I can name many first round picks that were nowhere near so obvious before they displayed their talent at the right place and right time.
Each year we find players the fall and winter before their senior year. They are "studs" but very few people knew it before then. It becomes obviously clear that we don't find them all, so some are slipping through the cracks. Believe it or not we find some of these not so well known "studs" in the states of Texas, Florida and California. Even in the state of Georgia, which is one we think we know a lot about, there are studs that pop up out of the clear blue at times.
These types are treasures to the local colleges. Sometimes it is why you see a super prospect at a small college. If everyone knew the player early on, he more than likely would be somewhere else.
So while it's important for a high school coach to help all the young players, it is equally important to help the "studs"! BTW, I've always disliked the word "stud"!
Will, You can call it our "opinion" based on our experience. We know lots of great high school coaches who really care. But compared to the number of high school coaches there are, the real good ones are fairly rare. At the higher level of travel baseball it's not so rare to find coaches who work hard to help the individual player reach the next level. In fact, it is vitally important to the top level programs track record. I'm not so familiar with the lower levels of travel ball.
quote:But compared to the number of high school coaches there are, the real good ones are fairly rare.
I disagree. From my experience I went up against some pretty good coaches. guys that put a lot of years at a particular school. they were knowledgable and good baseball men.
When I speak of travel programs, I should add that we work with mostly the higher tier travel programs. Now days the there seems to be too many travel teams, some involved for different reasons than others.
Somebody says travel team and some get the impression that that means everybody is a prospect. You speak of higher tier? who or what determines that? You and I know I can get 15 players together and have a team and travel. Johnny is not playing so I start my own team.
I might be rambling so forgive me. I just get annoyed by those that feel that high school coaches are all teachers with little or no knowledge looking for another paycheck. Many who speak less favorably might have an axe to grind. I am sure there are some that think of me in an unfavorable way because they think their sons interest was not met.
I'm pretty sure it's determined in "retrospect" ...quote:by Will: You speak of higher tier? who or what determines that? You and I know I can get 15 players together and have a team and travel. Johnny is not playing so I start my own team.
ie: in the last 5 yrs a "high tier" team may have had a very high % go on to play in top college programs - plus a significant % drafted in early rounds
w/due respect to old school hs coaches who worked hard & did it the right way "in days gone by" ...
in present days if you are not aware of these type "high tier" teams how in the world can you debate their (and their coach's) value??
just wondering what your response was to that parent?quote:Will: A while back a parent asked me if I thought his boy would get a baseball scholarship for college. Maybe the question should be can he play in high school?
merry Christmas
I can only base this post on my experience so here goes. There are alot of HS coaches that are very good at teaching and coaching the game. There are a few that work really hard for their players. There are also alot of HS coaches that are three month coaches. They show up for the kids when the season starts and when it ends its vacation time and they are nowhere to be found.
The travel team or Showcase coaches I know are very good coaches. They work very hard for their players because that is the reason the team was put together. To showcase the players in front of college coaches and get them on the radar so to speak. There is not as much instruction or coaching going on. The main focus is getting them out in front of the college coaches. But these players are the top end guys.
There are alot of travel teams or showcase teams that are filled with players that would be better served getting more instruction and coaching. These players are hoping if they get seen enough they will get a scholley. The fact is they are not. I see no point in marketing something that is not ready to be showcased. They should be spending the vast majority of their time getting better and working at the things that would make showcase beneficial.
PG imo is right that the showcase coaches he deals with are very good coaches and work very hard for their players. Based on my experience there is three types of HS coaches. #1 The high school coach that coaches because he is told to coach and is a three month coach. #2 The high school coach that wants to coach , does the best job he can , but goes on vacation after the season and shows up when the season starts. #3 The high school coach that loves the game , coaches because he loves to coach and works very hard for his players. I do agree that at least from my experience #3 is not the majority but the minority.
The travel team or Showcase coaches I know are very good coaches. They work very hard for their players because that is the reason the team was put together. To showcase the players in front of college coaches and get them on the radar so to speak. There is not as much instruction or coaching going on. The main focus is getting them out in front of the college coaches. But these players are the top end guys.
There are alot of travel teams or showcase teams that are filled with players that would be better served getting more instruction and coaching. These players are hoping if they get seen enough they will get a scholley. The fact is they are not. I see no point in marketing something that is not ready to be showcased. They should be spending the vast majority of their time getting better and working at the things that would make showcase beneficial.
PG imo is right that the showcase coaches he deals with are very good coaches and work very hard for their players. Based on my experience there is three types of HS coaches. #1 The high school coach that coaches because he is told to coach and is a three month coach. #2 The high school coach that wants to coach , does the best job he can , but goes on vacation after the season and shows up when the season starts. #3 The high school coach that loves the game , coaches because he loves to coach and works very hard for his players. I do agree that at least from my experience #3 is not the majority but the minority.
Coach May
After reading your posts I sure wish my son had the chance to play for someone like you during HS.
I think the coach we had was willing to do most of the things you mentioned, no where near as enthusiastically but to my knowledge he did at least the minimum. One thing I always wondered about was just what he would put in his responses to the colleges, his policy was that he would respond but he wouldn't share the information with the player, do you find that unusual?
After reading your posts I sure wish my son had the chance to play for someone like you during HS.
I think the coach we had was willing to do most of the things you mentioned, no where near as enthusiastically but to my knowledge he did at least the minimum. One thing I always wondered about was just what he would put in his responses to the colleges, his policy was that he would respond but he wouldn't share the information with the player, do you find that unusual?
I don't think this thread was bashing all high school coaches either. Our son's was ignorant about recruiting, and seemed to be reluctant to put out any effort on any player's behalf. Objectively, he was a last minute hire by the administration, was at a high profile baseball school, and I think he was relying on how things "used to be" when he last had a recruited kid - 10 years ago at a public high school where he used to coach. As we all know, things have changed a lot. That's the way it goes.
Let me address this to PG. Although I agree the primary responsibilty belongs to the player and his family, wouldn't it be appropriate to have PG offer a recruiting certification course to high school coaches (OK - a one-day seminar in their area) with regular updates so that the well-meaning but uninformed coach could at least have a source to go to with his questions and know what to do and what not to do? Teachers, lawyers, doctors, and executives update their information in developing areas in their fields - why not coaches?
Let me address this to PG. Although I agree the primary responsibilty belongs to the player and his family, wouldn't it be appropriate to have PG offer a recruiting certification course to high school coaches (OK - a one-day seminar in their area) with regular updates so that the well-meaning but uninformed coach could at least have a source to go to with his questions and know what to do and what not to do? Teachers, lawyers, doctors, and executives update their information in developing areas in their fields - why not coaches?
quote:just wondering what your response was to that parent?
BEE
As I recall the kid was in 6th or 7th grade. A lot can happen between then and high school. I politely told him that was too far down the line to predict. He had to continue to work and make the high school team. Take it one step at a time.