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What to think?

N newb10+ posts
My 2014 son recently received a verbal offer from a D1 school in a great conference. Although I am very pleased for my son to receive an offer this early, the actual offer itself was somewhat bittersweet, if not outright disappointing for my son and myself. I realize I might sound like someone who is never pleased or think of my son as a "prima donna", so please allow me to explain. Before attending a recent tournament, my son was asked by the recruiting coordinator to stop by the baseball complex after the games concluded. So that is what we did. However, we were asked to wait outside standing in the heat for about an hour while the RC and Head Coach met with other recruits. When the RC came out to get us, he informed us the Head Coach was sorry but he had to leave to be with his family. The HC had been at two of my son's games, but never introduced himself to me or my son (nor did he at two previous camps my son attended on campus in the winter). So we then met with the RC, but it was somewhat difficult for me during our discussion to completely get my mind off the HC's decision to skip our meeting. The RC offered, unofficially of course, a partial scholarship to my son, but it was somewhat lower than what I was expecting. I had expected to receive a larger offer since he is only a 2014, am I wrong? I somewhat felt we were being "low balled", especially since he said the amount was the smallest it would get, but my son could possibly "earn" more between now and signing day. I can't help but feel that it was disrespectful for the HC to run out on our meeting but attend the others - plus, it makes me really question how important my son is to him and his program. I would love to hear others opinions and related experiences. As this was the first offer for my son, what should have been a memorable, once in a lifetime experience, left both my son and I disappointed, hurt and offended. Am I being too sensitive about this or is this just typical?
Last edited {1}
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C calisportsfan100+ posts
I think you sound ridiculous. I admire the fact that the coach had a commitment to his family and kept it. Perhaps you should simply communicate to them you still have questions and either want to come back in to meet with head coach or need to attempt to find a school willing to offer more money and see what happens. Keep in mind, you make like the result of that less then feeling offended.
justbaseballjustbaseball10,000+ posts
newb - I think you are asking yourself the right questions. That is, what does it mean? Does the amount send a less-than-great signal? Does the HC leaving mean anything?

All good questions that I think many parents/players don't ask themselves enough.

So here is what I would do...I would ask them what it means? 'Coach, this is a little lower than what we expected...can you put it in context for us?'

As for the HC leaving, they told you he had to leave to be with his family. I would just take them at their word on that one.
N newb10+ posts
Calisportsfan, Did you not hear that we were invited to meet after the games? We did not ask for the meeting. We were out of town for a tournament, where our last game was not even on campus. If the HC had a prior family commitment, then why were we asked to meet? Could he have at least shown the courtesy of introducing himself and explaining the situation? This is the third time on campus without meeting the HC. Yes, I still have lots of questions, but I can't go traveling back to the campus every time to try to get answers, especially not even knowing if the coach will be there to answer them.
Last edited by newb
SandmanSandman500+ posts
Our son was invited to a "private" workout by/with a D2 HC last fall. We drove the 2+ hours to go. When we arrived, there were a few other players there. Also, the HC "got called into a meeting", so the workout was just with his assistants.

Though disappointed, we took this to mean "Our son [and likely the other few kids there] are pretty far down on his list". Given that this D2 team also has a JV team, we shied away from this school and focused on others. (In the end, he ended up at a top D3, which is a very good fit for him - athletically, academically and socially.)

So sometimes, maybe a little bit of cynicism can help us take off the rose-colored glasses. Maybe we were wrong and maybe that D2 coach really did have a meeting that day. But if our son and the others were important to him, that'd have to have been one pretty important meeting to skip out last minute after several players drove several hours to meet with him. Roll Eyes
ClevelandDadClevelandDadHSBBWeb Administrator
quote:
Originally posted by Sandman:
Our son was invited to a "private" workout by/with a D2 HC last fall. We drove the 2+ hours to go. When we arrived, there were a few other players there. Also, the HC "got called into a meeting", so the workout was just with his assistants.

Though disappointed, we took this to mean "Our son [and likely the other few kids there] are pretty far down on his list". Given that this D2 team also has a JV team, we shied away from this school and focused on others. (In the end, he ended up at a top D3, which is a very good fit for him - athletically, academically and socially.)

So sometimes, maybe a little bit of cynicism can help us take off the rose-colored glasses. Maybe we were wrong and maybe that D2 coach really did have a meeting that day. But if our son and the others were important to him, that'd have to have been one pretty important meeting to skip out last minute after several players drove several hours to meet with him. Roll Eyes

Good advice.

I think if you felt like you were disrespected, then you were disrespected. Given he is a rising junior and receiving an offer this early, it seems there will be more offers to come and ones that hopefully show a little more effort toward recruiting him.
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
quote:
Originally posted by newb:
Calisportsfan, Did you not hear that we were invited to meet after the games? We did not ask for the meeting. We were out of town for a tournament, where our last game was not even on campus. If the HC had a prior family commitment, then why were we asked to meet? Could he have at least shown the courtesy of introducing himself and explaining the situation? This is the third time on campus without meeting the HC. Yes, I still have lots of questions, but I can't go traveling back to the campus every time to try to get answers, especially not even knowing if the coach will be there to answer them.


Don't blame the coach, it may be what the RC told you. Some recruiters work real hard to get players to commit, so anything is possible.

Because of your son's year, the coaches can not talk to your son at a game.

I find your comments a bit ridiculous as well, however, as for teh benefit of doubt, maybe you just don't understand the entire process.

Folks need to understand exactly what can be offered and as to position as well. Pitchers get the most, for everyone else, unless a top prospect, get minimun 25%.

Early verbal offer has nothing to do with amount.
A right fit for the player should be much more important than the amount. Is this where he wants to go to school, does it offer the right degree, is it a good fit academically, socially and geographically?

My opinion is to use this as a learning experience, if the HC doesn't want to meet with your son, and it feels uncomfortable for him, then move on. My player didn't commit until he felt comfortable to and where he was commiting to and who to and that was a just few months before signing.

Understand what exactly goes into early commitment.
Last edited by TPM
G gotwood4sale10,000+ posts
.

Stick with it here at the HSBBW newb. One way or another you will get advice that will be helpful. RJM's advice, for example, is excellent.

I would think that it is best for your son to go to school and play ball where he feels welcome and needed. That school and baseball program is out there somewhere...keep searching. And keep learning.

Welcome to the HSSBBW and keep us posted on your progress.



.
Last edited by gotwood4sale
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
quote:
Originally posted by newb:
Thanks to everyone for your advice. There is more to the story, as this was by no means a family emergency. The situation was explained somewhat in detail to my son and I by the RC - I guess, it is possible there is more to the HC's side of the story.


Was there more to the story before or after you wrote this?

I am just curious, if there was, why not include it in your first post?
Last edited by TPM
N newb10+ posts
Thanks gotwood4sale and RJM! I figured I would take some heat when I initially posted, but was willing to take the risk in order to also receive some good advice. Thanks!


quote:
Originally posted by gotwood4sale:
.

Stick with it here at the HSBBW newb. One way or another you will get advice that will be helpful. RJM's advice, for example, is excellent.

I would think that it is best for your son to go to school and play ball where he feels welcome and needed. That school and baseball program is out there somewhere...keep searching. And keep learning.

Welcome to the HSSBBW and keep us posted on your progress.



.
YoungGunDadYoungGunDadHSBaseballWeb member since 2005
You son is young and apparently a talented player that is already getting serious looks.

Don't rush it Dad. Seriously. Take a deep breath and realize what some of the others on here who've been there and done that are saying....Let his play and growing open doors at other programs. They are bound to come.

It's doggone flattering for your son to be offered this early. But sometimes patience truly is a virtue. And in this case, it would hold true.

I promise you one thing. There is 1 school, 1 coach, and 1 program that is the PERFECT fit for you son. And when you and your son find it, you will know it in a flash. There won't be any feelings of disrepect or frustration about any part of it.
N newb10+ posts
TPM,

There was more to the story when I initially posted. I don't think the RC would appreciate his explanation of the HC's decision being shared, so I will not do so. Plus, there is the possibility that there is more to the HC's story than was shared to me by the RC. So I will leave it at that. I think I shared enough for others to provide their input, whether I like it or not.

quote:
Originally posted by TPM:
quote:
Originally posted by newb:
Thanks to everyone for your advice. There is more to the story, as this was by no means a family emergency. The situation was explained somewhat in detail to my son and I by the RC - I guess, it is possible there is more to the HC's side of the story.


Was there more to the story before or after you wrote this?

I am just curious, if there was, why not include it in your first post?
wraggArmwraggArm500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by newb:
...
I don't think the RC would appreciate his explanation of the HC's decision being shared, so I will not do so. Plus, there is the possibility that there is more to the HC's story than was shared to me by the RC. So I will leave it at that.
...

Good thing your discretion saved the day. I swear, I was probably one pronoun away from figuring out RC's true identity...
BumBum1,000+ posts
Newb, I was with you until you used the words "hurt" and "offended".

By what? Look, this is a business decision, not unlike buying stock. If you feel his stock value is higher, pass. What is there to be hurt and offended by? I just don't get hurt and offended, IMHO.

So pass. Perhaps the grass is greener elsewhere.

Perhaps not. Decide, but keep the emotion out of the decision.
S smalltownmom100+ posts
I don't think I would worry so much that the RC made the offer as opposed to the HC. It has been our experience that the RC makes the offer quite often. Granted, you generally visit with the HC, but the RC has seen the players the most and generally has the HC's ear. Since it's early in the process and you probably don't want to shut the door on this program, a good idea would be to be polite, thank them for the offer, but say as a 2014 he is not ready to make the commitment yet. Your son owes it to himself to make sure he makes the right decision. He doesn't need to be in a hurry.
Coach_MayCoach_May10,000+ posts
What is important is that you didn't come away from the situation feeling like it was good. You were uneasy about it. Right or wrong that is how you felt or feel and that is important. It doesn't matter if any of us would have felt the same way or differently. What matters is your son is about to make a very important decision and if you don't feel good about making the decision for whatever reason take a step back.

The last thing you want to do is step into a situation you don't feel good about. When a player makes this decision it should be a happy moment and he and you should feel good about making it. I will say this. If your son was a guy that they really felt like they needed to get and they were really interested in getting a verbal would the HC step out before the meeting? I don't know about every program but that sounds shaky to me. Also the comments about earning more before he got there sound very shaky as well. Does that also mean he could earn less if he doesn't perform as well leading up to his arrival on campus? You are either offering us this or that but to say its conditional depending on his play leading up to arrival on campus sounds shaky to me.

Step back and continue with the recruiting process and grow some thick skin. Your going to need it once he is on campus much more than you will before he gets there. Let the process play out and when he feels great about where he wants to go and who wants him to come there then pull the trigger. You will be able to tell who
"really wants him" and who would "like to have him" trust me. Good luck
B bothsportsdad100+ posts
My daughter was a recruited D1 softball player. The head of her organization always told the kids to "go where the love is".

You aren't feeling much love in this scenario. Be respectfull but appreciative in your communications with this staff but keep your options open.

And Coach May has dropped a pearl here.... many scenarios are classic Dr Jekyll (when being recuited) and Mr Hyde (once you are in the program). Do not fall into the trap of going to the perceived highest caliber baseball program so you can puff out your chest.
Last edited by bothsportsdad
fenwaysouthfenwaysouth10,000+ posts
A couple objective thoughts. Yes, you do sound a little "whiny" about some things, but I think your intended point is valid. Your son (and you) are confused because their non-verbal communication did not match their verbal communication (we want you and we want you to commit to our program).

Nobody is an expert at the first offer. THis is your son's first offer and your first time trying to help your son understand what it all means. I think if you have questions, you need to meet with the head coach but for different reasons than you think. Let me explain....Sometimes the RC and HC are not entirely in sync, and you need to be sure the HC is saying the same things as the RC. We had a situation a few years ago that the RC and HC were not on the same page. Your son is fortunate to get an offer this early which means he has skills that are in demand. You have a lot of time in front of you if you commit or don't commit. I know there is a lot of peer pressure/parent pressure to commit right now. I would try to fight that pressure and make sure your son makes the right decisions for the right reasons. I suggest you and your son stick to the facts as they exist.

1) Is the school someplace he would feel comfortable athleticically, academically and socially for 4 years?
2) Is the offer sufficient for your son to commit?
3) Is he wanted by the program?
4) Ask your son if he is still interested in the school since he will be the one attending.

If the answer is "no" to any of the above questios your son needs to thank them for their offer and move onto the next opportunity. IMHO he needs to feel very strongly about this school as a dream school to commit as a rising junior.

I wish you and him the best of luck.
hokieonehokieone5,000+ posts
Newb,

You're on a long journey and the first stop was a little different than expected. Just move on, enjoy the ride and see what develops. Don't read too much into anything, just keep an open mind and realize that in all likelihood, the decisive factor in all of this will be your son's "gut feel"...and the best advice I ever heard, and have repeated often-"Go to the school that wants you the most that you like the most."

H-1
birdman14birdman141,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by Coach_May:
The last thing you want to do is step into a situation you don't feel good about. When a player makes this decision it should be a happy moment and he and you should feel good about making it.


quote:
Originally posted by Coach_May:
You will be able to tell who "really wants him" and who would "like to have him" trust me.


Some real simple and great advise is being offered here that serves well in many life changing situations. If in your gut it doesn't feel good, go with your gut!

It doesn't mean things might not change at this particular school, but for now I think you have an answer.
Last edited by birdman14
N newb10+ posts
Coach_May, Bothsportsdad, Fenwaysouth, Hokieone, Birdman14 (and others who I may have missed), Thanks so much for the helpful advice. I really appreciate the wisdom imparted to me through your responses. There really was some very good stuff which you shared with me. This morning while listening to the radio on the way in to work, I was reminded in a song about some more great advice (actually more of a command or directive) from God's Word - to forgive others even though they offend you. I realized that I was not forgiving the HC for what "I deemed" to be his offense against me and my son - that was wrong on my part. Whether the HC was actually wrong or not, it does not excuse me for that behavior and thoughts. Jesus Christ set the perfect standard in handling offenses and I fell well short of the mark. Since forgiving him I have peace about the situation. On another note, the RC had given my son the HC's phone number and requested that he call him yesterday. My son wasn't too excited about calling the HC, but my wife and I both encouraged him to do so, although I did not want to make him do it. As it turned out, my son called the HC and things evidently went well. After I inquired about the conversation, my son responded "Dad, he's a super nice guy!" How about that? Thanks again to all who genuinely offered your advice and experiences!
Last edited by newb
JC Jeff Connell100+ posts
Remember, every player, their family, and coach is different. You and your family have to figure out what you are looking for and make it work. My son never even went to the D1 school he signed with until after the official signing. He talked with the head coach one time in passing. The RC followed him extensively and talked to me at every event his junior and senior year, as he legally could. We talked to most SEC and ACC schools. Some the RC only, some the HC and RC. Each was different. Figure out what you need and make it clear what you expect.
BTW, our HC said at the freshman orientation. I will talk to you about anything involving your son except baseball. So me meeting him was not a big deal anyway. We love him now as a HC and the RC is still the one my son deals with most.
S seattlestars16100+ posts
This is business leave the emotion out of it. trust your instincts and gut. You were disrespected. You were waiting outside, if the HC had to leave unexpectedly he could have taken 30 seconds to step outside and say he had to go. He could have sent an email the next day, anything but just leave. When someone truly wants him you will know it with no doubt. This was not it.
AM AL MA 08100+ posts
Hi newb,

as others have pointed out, this is a process. If you like the school keep them in the mix, do not decline the offer, but don't accept it either. IMHO, you need to be straight up with the RC and indicate that you are interested (if you indeed are) in their program but would like to delay comitting to the offer you currently have. Find out how long the program will honor their verdal offer before you must make a decision. Now keep pursuing other schools that you believe will be a good fit. You now have one offer in hand and experience in getting and responding to that offer. There is no hurry for a 2014 at this point in time and many things can and will chnage before the time that you must actually commit to a school verbally (any time between now and when you actuall sign for a NCAA program) and in writing (when you actually commit to the school November of your senior year). Most top programs will have their verbal committments lined up by the end of the HS junior year for upcoming signing peroid in tha fall of the HS senior year.

As others have pointed out, good or bad is reative and it is what it is. It sounds like you need to consider options and hold off on the response to the first offer until you must respond. But DON'T SAY NO until you have another offer in hand that you like better. Try to keep a business perspective in that they are offering your son "money" in the form of a scholarship. And this is like entering into a contract for service in that you son agrees to play baseball (aka the "service") for certain school in return for their funding your schoold costs (what ever that amount might be) as the fee for said sevice.

Sounds like a business deal doesn't it? Well, in essence it is a business deal!
Blue10Blue10500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by newb:
Blue10,

Yes - we were told the offer was good until the end of the summer.

quote:
Originally posted by Blue10:
newb-was there a timeline/deadline given to your son with the offer?


The reason I asked is because this is a pretty early offer and deadline for a 2014, and based on what some wise posters have told me, if the school "loves" vs "likes" your son, the offer might be open a little longer. And we all know that it's a lot more fun to go to a school where they love you.

Another thing...son's scout ball coach who is quite well-respected told us that in 20+ years he's never had a kid regret NOT signing early, vs many who have regretted signing early.
Last edited by Blue10
H Hounddawg10+ posts
I need some clarification on WHEN a college can actually make you an offer, verbal or otherwise. A 2014 would have just finished his sophomore year and will be going into his junior year. I had been told that they cannot actually make you an offer until a certain time during your junior year. Maybe I have it confused?? Help please, and thank you!
AM AL MA 08100+ posts
Hey Hounddawg,
the early committments are all verbal. Usually made during an unofficial visit to the school. While there are many rules on what any NCAA coach can and can not do about talking to prospects as well as making offers; they can discuss and make verbal committments all day long when on their campus while you are there visiting.

It is not official until written committment letter is signed by son.
Rob KremerRob Kremer1,000+ posts
If you listen to anything written on this board, listen to what Coach May wrote.

If there is a sage on HSBBW, he is it. And please, while you consider what he said, please also consider how lucky you are to be able to have the benefit of his perspective for the asking.

The true value of this site lies in people like Coach May, who has for years on end given willingly and without reserve the benefit of his valuable perspective to people like you.
C calisportsfan100+ posts
After catching up on this thread what I find most unusual for a group of adults is the theme of disrespect. It's a pet peeve of mine when the generation of our kids feel like they've been disrespected....I feel like you have to earn that respect and really speaks to feeling entitled when people right off the bat say "disrespected".

I think there was lots of respect for your son's ability in that out of all the guys there he was one of the few they reached out to and wanted to meet with and in fact made an early offer but what you focused on was not all that positive but some feeling of disrespect! Beyond baseball, my advice is that this process is going to be helpful to your son as he applies for jobs and simply learns how to approach different people and different situations....perhaps the best thing you can teach him is to focus on how fortunate he is rather then some nebulous feeling of disrespect. Teach him to be humble....as a rising Junior to have an offer already is great under all circumstances. My son played with a kid who just got drafted out of high school in top two rounds and signed a large contract. I never heard him or his parents sound unappreciative of his good fortune. They are at the pinnacle of success in this little baseball world and have handled it with grace and therefor so has their son. It bodes well for his future.

I bet if the RC knew you felt "disrespected" by his efforts and offer in all likelihood he would be very turned off by that.
Last edited by calisportsfan
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