2021 Recruitment after very Positive Camp

Julio,

Welcome and congrats on  the camp experience.  It sounds like your son nailed it.   If I was going to give you one piece of advice (based on my son's recruiting experience) I WOULD continue to pursue other opportunities if you have them.   Do not wait for anything or anyone.   The best thing for your son is competition for his services.  Coaches will act when they have a reason to act.  Give them a reason.

As always, JMO.   Good luck!

Congrats! Sounds like a great outing.  I completely agree with Fenway South. It is always encouraging to be noticed and it tells you he is doing things right.  That said, we had 2 experiences with top SEC schools where he was pulled in after camps to do tours and speak with the coaches.  One school actually had him come get me right after he pitched (an hour into the camp) to come back and tour and sit down with the pitching coach while the camp was still going.  They told him they could offer him that day but they wanted to see him throw a few more times.  He spoke to both schools for almost a year, and neither ended up offering, although they were still asking him to call.  My son was talking to about 15 schools when he committed.  Until you commit, DO NOT let up on the recruiting. 

This is where having a well connected travel coach helps. If he's going to Jupiter I assume he has one. Let the coach know about the camp conversations and he should be making calls to other schools on your behalf. Hey, ______ is interested in Jimmy you guys should come and take a look. Now is the time to be reaching out to other school, Jupiter is a great event for recruiting. 

I would assume that the school liked what they saw, but they just want to see him against top competition, Jupiter is the best place for that. Camps are tough because while there are good players, there aren't enough and the ages range from 14-18 with maybe 2 kids at the entire camp that are capable of playing at the host school. So they want to see him hit 90mph pitching and field hard hit balls off other top players. He's in a good position, just keep doing what he's doing. 1220 is good enough to get him into any Fl school with baseball. They just want to see him live. 

JULIO - congrats to your son on a great camp!   It sounds like he is in a very good place.  The others who have responded are correct, he should continue to pursue opportunities with other schools until he gets an offer that he accepts.

Congratulations, glad he had a great camp. Remember this is a business. So I agree with all the others, Do not let up on the recruiting.

I am sure that this coach would love to keep him off the market. IF he has no competition, how much does he have to offer? It is supply and demand. Your Son's talent is the supply, as others have said that is limited. The more Demand you have the higher that supply is worth. So if he only has demand from one school any offer does not have to be very high. However if the demand goes up so does your son's value.

Also He does not know what else is out there. He should try and experience other schools. What if there is a better fit? you will never know if you do not try. 

Thanks for the replies, his HS Coach thinks that if they were intersted enough they should have offered him already, he thinks most likely nothing will come out of it. He  thinks he should commit to a Juco if he gets offered right away. My son loved the shcool and really would love to play for them, I don't think he would be content comitting to a Juco right now after this experience with this D1, specially now in his Junior Year. If he was a uncomitted Sr., it would be a different story. I just want to make sure we are handling this the right way and not burn any bridges.

Would asking the D1 RC a couple of weeks down the line after they've talked a few times wether or not he (my son)should be open to pursuing other schools be a good idea to see if the RC has near future plans to commit him?, or not such a good idea?

I would not.  It is likely the coach is going to ask who else he is talking to and I will tell you that every time my son mentioned another school, they were just more interested.  I would keep emailing, having your coach call, etc.  These coaches EXPECT you to be not only pursuing but being pursued by other schools.  If you act like they are your only option, they have zero incentive to offer any money. 

The recruiting process can blow hot and cold. First school to contact my son his junior year invited him to a game and campus visit, then acted like they couldn't remember his name when he got there. A few weeks later, they loved him again. They finally made him an offer later in his junior year, and then hung up on him when he told them he was going to a different school.

Don't put all your eggs in one basket and don't feel like you have to commit to the first school that offers. Sure, keep talking to these guys, but definitely keep exploring other options and expanding the list of schools you talk to. Always remember the schools are in it for themselves, you (and your son) need to do what's best for you. 

Update:

HS Coach just put him in Contact with the head Coach of a D1 Juco in FL, Juco Coach just offered him tuition + books and depending on his performance in Jupiter they might include Room and Board. HS coach suggested to go and visit the JUCO after Jupiter and Commit if by then nothing else comes up with an offer. He says if a D1 offer comes up AFTER the Juco Commitment he can always consider it.

What do you guys think on this approach?

Again, much appreciate all the input.

You are getting good advice from your HS Coach. You might want to take it. You may think that he isn’t a positive thinker but my bet is he is a realistic thinker. 

HS Coach sounds like a rock star!  Great advice and actions to help your son with his recruiting experience.  Absolutely take him up on it, and go there to learn about the JUCO opportunity.  

Good luck!

PS...Don't be surprised if that Top 50 D1 coach gets wind of this, and suddenly has something to offer.

Do FL kids commit to JuCo so early? In CA there is no reason to do so before senior year once 4 year school recruitment is done. 

JCG posted:

Do FL kids commit to JuCo so early? In CA there is no reason to do so before senior year once 4 year school recruitment is done. 

The timetable for JuCo recruiting has really accelerated in past year or so. Top JuCo programs are already way down the road on class of 2020. Lesser JuCo programs not as far along but have gotten started. Always a scholly or 2 held back for hard throwing pitchers that might be late to the party. 

Not sure that I have seen better advice, collectively, then what what has been shared in response to your questions JULIO! Have a class starting now so will get back and share my son's experience regarding similar experience.

Top JUCO's in the South are done with 2020's except the guys who don't get drafted high enough and are looking for a chance to get better and be drafted again next year.  They are hard and heavy on 2021's and 2022's just like D1's.  I agree with your HS HC but I also don't like the idea of committing to a JUCO and then decommitting to go to a D1.  I think a commitment is a commitment but that is just me.  I wouldn't do anything until after Jupiter.  if they are truly a top d1 then they will be at Jupiter.  After Jupiter, they will either offer or drag him along.  But I would also only commit to JUCO if it is a top one not just a JUCO and there are a few in FL.

If his defense is the greatest thing since sliced bread and they didn’t make an offer there must be some question about his hitting. Keep moving forward. Even if they eventually offer there may be a better situation.

Keep in mind a D1 top fifty will bring in five of the best shortstop recruits in the region. The one that hits the best and fields adequately wins the position. The others get moved to 2b, 3b, cf or transfer. 

Great advise from the posters above. There is no reason to stop talking to others and waiting for them to offer. Things change rapidly in the recruiting process, especially at top DI programs. He should be looking for as many offers as possible, as these schools are looking at as many recruits as they can. 

Regarding the JC offer, if he is good enough for top DI offers, they will find a spot for him should he become available down the road. 

Actually, I'd like to ask a question for this thread. If a 2021 got such strong positive reaction from a top 50 D1 at camp, why do some of you think it's such a great idea to pivot to Juco? Honest question. As I read this it seems like the kid has time to look at other 4-year schools and the skills to get some interest. What makes it so smart to go the Juco route now?

Thanks

I don't think he should go the JUCO route right now, but I think getting other offers only makes you a hotter commodity.  I also think there are just some cautionary tales that a great camp and even one on one tours at schools many times materialize into nothing.  You run the recruiting race hard until you commit. Also, I know there are exceptions, but a lot of top D1s do have most of their 2021 recruits, you can't put your eggs in one basket at this stage.

Good stuff on this thread, Julio.  Keep pursuing every opportunity.

My son was in a similar situation although it was late JR year that he was offered by top D1 JUCO program. He told the HC that he wanted to go home and talk things over with family. Fortunately for my son, we met his private PC couple of days after returning home. His PC recommended that he pass on JC offer and that even high level D1 JC's, would be interested after spring of his SR year should he not receive a D1 4-year offer. Fortunately for my son, he had a great summer and performed well enough to pick up a D1 offer during fall of his SR year. Even when attending his last event during fall of SR year, he had a top D1 JUCO program talking to him about "what if you don't get an offer you like" scenarios.

Long story short, I agree with those who recommend waiting to commit to JUCO program. You could commit and de-commit but that would be burning a bridge that you may need later. It is a much smaller baseball world then you might imagine. No offense but I disagree with PF in regards to "a commitment is a commitment." D1 baseball programs are notorious for cutting players or leading them on until they no longer have a need. Coaching staffs also voluntarily change schools due to bigger/better opportunities. Unfortunately a commitment does not mean much in college baseball anymore and I believe that has more to do with the selfish decisions coaches make!

Also recommend that your son use the FL experience to his advantage. This was also a recommendation we received from his PC. Let other programs know about FL's interest and whatever you do, don't let a D1 JUCO pressure him in to signing. If he has P5 skills, they are obviously going to try and get him to sign before someone else does. They know how good it looks to have players who end up transferring to high-level programs. 

Just my 2 cents and my son's experience. Also probably good to note that his private PC is as good as they come and very well connected.

COACHLD, I understand a commitment does not mean much anymore but one of the life lessons I have tried to teach all three of my sons is a commitment is a commitment.   Your word is vital.  We went through it in my son's senior year.  Two P5 schools wanted to offer my son but would not talk to him as long as he was committed.  He would have to de-commit to the school he had to talk to the other two.  I reminded him that before he committed the two were sent word that he was committing and did not respond.  It was only after a great junior and summer that they wanted to talk and offer.  I just think unless there are extenuating circumstances your word is your word.  You talk about burning bridges and to me de-committing is burning bridges or credibility unless something major happens from the time you commit until you sign NLI and I would say coach leaving fits into that.  But just because a better offer comes along does not constitute something major.  Just my thoughts. 

I think COACHLD's post shows another instance where the pitcher's timetable is different at times than a position player. More options, more spots, more scenarios.

Lost of great info above. All i can add from experience is do what is best for your son. RCs have a job to do and a list of candidates. Nothing more nothing less. The good ones stay in touch and always keep kids abreast of status/interest, all the rest are average to not great. The comment above about the RC hanging up on their kid makes me think of when my son decommitted and dealing with the fury of the PC on that call. Son got better and chose to move on to a bigger, better and "closer to home" (albeit much warmer and without snow) school after a previous verbal.  Take it as you like, some will say it reflected negatively on his character to do so but its funny when the schools, who have ALL the power, do it and it's commonplace and just part of the recruiting game. Keep us up to speed on your son and where he ends up!

Thanks for all the Replies, where we stand right now is the JUCO Coach has contacted my son and is trying to get him to visit the School Before Jupiter Oct. 10 to make an official offer . We really would like to go after Jupiter for (2) reasons:

1- Don't want to miss any Fall games in preparation for the Jupiter Event, and 

2- I feel the same way as others, and my son does too. Although it might be the "industry std." we would hate to commit and de-commit 2 weeks after we give our word to the JUCO Coach if the D1 comes through. I also feel my son needs to keep communication as requested by Head Recruiter from D1 for a couple of weeks to see how things turn out. 

He loves the school and they have the program he wants to Major in .

I realize you are not going to put any pressure on a D1 Coach by telling him you have a JUCO D1 offer on the table, however I strongly feel before he verbally committs to the Juco (when the moment comes) he needs to find out from the D1 Coach where he stands as far as being recruited. Others have suggested to Commit to the Juco and don't tell anything to the D1 University, and if they come through just make the switch, but honestly I think that is not ethical, and we really don't want to be going back and forth. 

I figured being Honest with the D1 Coach and finding out at the correct time where we are in the recruting chart/process the worst that can Happen is the D1 Univeristy will tell him that is ok to pursue other avenues and that they will keep watching him , but are not ready to make any offers or commitments at this point,

OR Best case maybe they tell him to wait a week or 2 because the 2021 Roster is not finshed ( D1 only has (2) 2021 commits so far on my son's class and none at his position) and they need to figure out what they can offer, or maybe they want to see him play at Jupiter and will make a decision then. 

I don't know which scenario will play out, but I think we need to be up-front and eventually find out where we stand so we can make a better decision moving forward and not burn any bridges. 

I just don’t think there is ever a scenario where you stop trying to be recruited. If they tell you to wait, they better have an offer.  Also, you don’t have to answer the offers immediately.  Most coaches told my son to just let them know what he decided.  I know some schools give time tables, but it’s usually st least several weeks.

You will find that what you feel is ethical probably needs to looked at through a different lens now, instead look at it as “what is best for my son.” 

What you need to realize is that going forward, baseball is a business and the players at the college level have the least leverage. You need to use whatever leverage you have when the opportunity arises and it will benefit you. Being non-committal on the D1’s part means you aren’t on the top of their board and honestly should not expect an offer. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. If the D1 offer comes after verbaling to the JUCO, then you cross that bridge. Right now, it’s not even an option.

COLLEGEBASEBALL,  we will commit to the JUCO most likely unless the D1 changes that in the next 2-3 weeks, however in your opinion do you think being upfront and asking the D1 where we stand before comiting verbally to the Juco is not a good idea? 

Julio, reading back thru this thread, there is still a disconnect here.  I have thoughts on your primary questions but need to hear more to fill the gap.  You say...

"...his HS Coach thinks that if they were intersted enough they should have offered him already, he thinks most likely nothing will come out of it. He  thinks he should commit to a Juco if he gets offered right away. My son loved the shcool and really would love to play for them, I don't think he would be content comitting to a Juco right now after this experience with this D1, specially now in his Junior Year."

Why is the HS coach suggesting he commit to Juco?  Is that where he sees talent matching?  Are there other factors?  If you don't think he would be content committing to a Juco right now, why are you leaning that way?  If a rising junior is getting some top 50 D1 interest, why would he sign early to a JC without exploring other D1 opportunities?

You gave good reasons why you want to wait on the D1 until at least after Jupiter but you didn't give reasons why you are leaning toward signing w/ the Juco.  Even if Juco's sign relatively early in that part of the country, if son is that caliber of a player, the Juco will most likely still have interest and a package to offer later.  Was the camp performance an exception?

Julio posted:

COLLEGEBASEBALL,  we will commit to the JUCO most likely unless the D1 changes that in the next 2-3 weeks, however in your opinion do you think being upfront and asking the D1 where we stand before comiting verbally to the Juco is not a good idea? 

Why not get other schools involved before committing to a JUCO?  You have a solid year within your recruiting window, especially if you are open to mid-major D1.

I have no experience with JUCO, which is why I've been hesitant to chime in.  But there are credit transfer, etc things you need to consider, beyond the baseball aspect.  I would also think you can wait JUCO out until next summer.

This thread seems to be about one specific D1 or JUCO, before your son even plays his junior year of HS.  Seems strange to me TBH...

I agree with CTBBALLDAD 100%! Your son has an entire year to commit. Unless he really wants to go to this particular JUCO I would hold off. Go on the visit but your son does not have to commit. Will this turn them off to your son if he doesn't commit? Perhaps, but that's how this recruiting thing works. If they don't want him a year from now then he's either not lived up to expectations or they found better prospects.  Either way, that's a sign things would have not have gone his way if he stepped on campus.  JUCO's usually commit a LOT of players; not all make the final roster.

By the way, I just want to clarify by saying this is is just my opinion and I have no experience with JUCO's. But I do know about holding off on commitments because my son, while he did not flat-out say no to offers, he instead delayed and ultimately did not accept them. It is totally a gamble but if you are not comfortable or think it's not the right fit then I would not accept. It cost him (us!) scholarship money (60% and ~44%) to in-state schools but in the end he made a commitment to a school he did want to attend which has  no money other than need-based financial aid.   ;-(

Would he have been OK attending the first school that offered? My bank account definitely would have! Perhaps he would have been fine at the first, and he definitely would have been OK with the second (HA), but the school he committed to was still a step up (HA) for him and there is no way he would be accepted into that school without baseball support.

Would have either of the first two schools still taken him if the last school did not? I would like to think so but I'm quite sure there would have been little to no scholarship money.  Would he have had an opportunity to go to a JUCO if he didn't commit? Definitely.

So, in my opinion, the only other thing that should be a consideration is MONEY. Your son should be able to get into a JUCO, no worries about losing out on an admissions slot. I already mentioned the possibility of your son not living up to expectations or the JUCO finding a better player; you would have a problem whether you are committed or delay a commitment if this happens so it SHOULD NOT be a deciding factor! And lastly, is it the right school from an academic and career perspective?

Thank you all for your input. Just to answer a few questions posted:

Our HS coach really goes out of his way to find schools for his players, mostly D2s and Juco's . Juco's are top programs in FL. His D1 connections are limited although he has recently commited a 2024 8th Grader to a top 25 ACC school . Has a lot of Connections in FL with D2s and Jucos.

I think he feels that maybe we are ansxious to find a school and wants to help, picked up the phone and 10 minutes later the Juco Coach was offering my Son tuition+ books, just based on the HS refereces of him without even seeing him on Video. HS Coach feels that is a good idea to secure the Juco now (after Jupiter) if the D1 falls through, and if other D1s or the D1 in question offers, then take it now or later, but secure in October if nothing comes up with Juco.

Keep in mind that in FL, a lot of the Jucos are not recruting 2020's, they are doing 2021's now and some looking into 2022's.

And yes we have looked into transfering credits, Academic Program, etc. is a no brainer to go D1 if the offer would be on the table.. there are not other options now on the table, maybe a Camp in December for another D1, but that is it.  We play a busy Fall and Spring schedule on our HS and the Coach/Program is very demanding. (went to State Finals last year and were ranked in Max Preps top 25 in the nation for a while)Going to Camps and traveling etc. during a Fall season and missing games and/or practices is NOT acceptable unless the Coach sends you out. Most of the times (98%) he brings schools in to watch our workouts.

My son is not a National Ranked Player, not a big guy , (5-10, 160 lbs just turned 16)has tools and plays lights out. This is not your typical top recruit guy that has 10 top schools from the SEC or ACC after him. Not the case. Just a good player that will impress you when you see him on the field with Plus Defense and range. His metrics will not impress you, 84 mph across the diamond, 7.2 60 yeard dash, but like I said you have to see him taking ground balls on the field to really judge him. Will hit for ave, with a few doubles.

We went to this Camp on our own as Coach had brought in the RC of the D1 to see our workouts and check out 1 of our players, who eneded up not comitting. I was told the RC liked my son, so we decided to call him and he offered to go to Camp, our HS coach was not too encouraing at the begining, and the rest is History.

I'll keep everyone posted how it turns out, thanks again to all that replied.

If it were me, I'd be leary of accepting an offer from a coach/school that had never seen my kid play, or has seen video. Just like you he is probably thinking that he can back out of the commitment if something better comes along.

nycdad posted:

If it were me, I'd be leary of accepting an offer from a coach/school that had never seen my kid play, or has seen video. Just like you he is probably thinking that he can back out of the commitment if something better comes along.

...or the other side of the coin (speculating a bit, of course) ... likely that the HS HC has a very good relationship with the JC HC and assures him that the player will be an immediate impact player for him.  Which means that the player has a good chance to get attention from other 4 yr schools.  Which brings me back to wondering why he would want to commit early to the JC he's not sold on, particularly if concerned about the ethical aspect of backing out of a commitment.

Let the JC know you certainly have some interest but need to go a bit further into the recruiting process to gain a better understanding of what pond you should be fishing in and what the best fit will be.

"Keep in mind that in FL, a lot of the Jucos are not recruting 2020's, they are doing 2021's now and some looking into 2022's."

Where are you getting this info? Makes no sense to me at all. The elite JUCO's I am aware of, which included the one that offered my son, will take players that have elite tools at any time! My son They have 24 scholarships to play with and obviously more annual turnover. I know that some P5 fall ball cuts (for variety of reasons) end up at D1 JUCO's in the spring. Sure there is a possibility that they have limited or no athletic money but in-state tuition at most JUCO's is a drop in the bucket compared to a 4-year university.

I don't understand why there is such a huge push to commit to early to a JUCO. Unless it's Chipola where the baseball experience will be similar to a strong D1 baseball program there really isn't a need to commit so early. Even then...Your son just recently received genuine D1 interest from a pretty good school. You wouldn't want to wait longer than a month to see what other options may pop up? This D1 is still interested, they just want to see him perform against other top players and not at some showcase with sophomores throwing 81 mph. To get ready to commit to a Juco so early doesn't make sense. 2022s are not committing to JCs. They are just starting to commit to the top D1s. Go to Jupiter, take the fall winter to get bigger, faster, stronger and see where that takes him if it doesn't work out this fall with D1s. 

As far as the coach, there are a few red flags that are throwing me off. Why would a coach blow off such good feedback from a top D1 program? The comment about them making an offer already makes no sense if they only saw him recently, swapped numbers and started having conversations. It sounds like a coach who has this JC connection and wants your son there to keep the pipeline going. I'm also going to guess that the HS coach had nothing to do with the rising 8th grader committing to a D1 program out of state. 

This is all about your son. If you feel your son would excel at a juco academically, socially, and athletically then do what it right. But if you just want to take the offer because his HS coach set it up for him then you're doing it for the wrong reasons. Be selfish, look at all options, and give him some time. Top50 programs don't offer players after one good camp. What they do is get their contact info, have them stick around for practice, tell them how they see them fitting into their system and continue to follow them until they know that it wasn't a career day. JCs can be a good option, but you're going to have a hard time convincing me that they're a better option than a high level D1 program. Especially one that only has two commits. 

Do a little research on that Top50 D-1...for past 4 -5 years, see who on roster started as a freshman or sophomore, redshirts, transfers in & from where, transfers out, etc...See who played all 4 yrs...

That should give you a clearer picture & a fairer comparison between that school & the JC...

And, go to Jupiter if possible. That could open more doors...

Here you are:

https://www.perfectgame.org/Co...centCommitments.aspx

Just take a look at the 2020's who posted in the last few hours. Caveat: that doesn't necessarily mean they didn't commit earlier; it just means that they posted today on PG.

Of course PG doesn't show an actual date; it only shows the most recent.  Just know that I check this everyday, sometimes several times a day because my son is a 2020 and these are his peers. So you just have to take my word for it that the recent string of 2020's didn't show earlier today.