Do these bats ever wear out? My 13 year old thinks his Easton s1 is losing its pop after 6 months of hard hitting. I have read that the trampoline effect actually increases with usage. Also, he has been hitting with a -3 since last fall.
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My 2017 son's batting coach felt my son had partially worn out his 32" 5150 Velo after 1 year of heavy use in practices, games, and MANY lengthy hitting lessons. Plus, it was time to go to a 33" bat...
That's a 2-piece composite, right?
Yes, composite bats can lose their pop. Supposedly their life can be charted like a bell curve. They gain pop as the matrix starts to loosens up, then lose pop as it gets too loose.
6 months sounds like it's too soon, though, unless he's a real cage rat.
That's a 2-piece composite, right?
Yes, composite bats can lose their pop. Supposedly their life can be charted like a bell curve. They gain pop as the matrix starts to loosens up, then lose pop as it gets too loose.
6 months sounds like it's too soon, though, unless he's a real cage rat.
My 2017 son's batting coach felt my son had partially worn out his 32" 5150 Velo after 1 year of heavy use in practices, games, and MANY lengthy hitting lessons. Plus, it was time to go to a 33" bat...
That's got an aluminum barrel. Not an engineer, and not an expert, but don't think I've never heard/seen anybody who is an expert say that metal bats lose their pop. OTOH kids do grow and they also like to buy the latest model bat.
Myself and few other coaches begin to notice bats losing pop and/or breaking and it was an open discussion amongst coaches at a meeting. During this meeting one of the coaches called his brother who works in the bat industry and he told him that most of the bats now a days are built to breakdown around the 1,500 swing marker.
IMO, I do believe that the metal will fatigue in an ally bat. and composites will do just as described above. That S1, even with heavy use, should just be getting hot at around 6 months though...send it back after the summer
IMO, I do believe that the metal will fatigue in an ally bat. and composites will do just as described above. That S1, even with heavy use, should just be getting hot at around 6 months though...send it back after the summer
Do these bats ever wear out? My 13 year old thinks his Easton s1 is losing its pop after 6 months of hard hitting. I have read that the trampoline effect actually increases with usage. Also, he has been hitting with a -3 since last fall.
FYI: There is no "Trampoline Effect" with BBCOR Composite bats... they tend to break at the Connection point of Easton's 2-piece bats... I've seen more than a few break. Your son's may have started to break...From experience, the BBCOR Easton Comps don't have a 'break in' period (see their website - ALL composite bats say No break-in required)... My son used both of his in games the day he got them, with just minimal cage swings prior to games...
BBCOR bats include an Accelerated Break-In Test (ABI). This is to make sure that a well-used bat doesn't exceed maximum performance limits.
They wear out just about the time the new models come out. 
They wear out just about the time the new models come out.
That brings up an interesting question: alloy vs. comp in BBCOR?
For most of us, comp was assumed to be much hotter in LL and travel ball. With the possible exception of the Youth Techzilla, metal bats could not compare. But once the kids put those drop-fives away, the choice in BBCOR isn't so obvious.
Friend of mine did some research last year and found that a large majority of the home run hitters in NCAA D1 last year were using metal. My own casual observation was the same -- I saw a lot more alloy bats being used in local HS games, local college games, and in the College World Series on the tube. (I know that colleges have contracts with specific makers, but those makers all offer a choice between comp and alloy) No question that the bat I saw used most last year, especially by power hitters, was the DeMarini Voodoo.
But this year seems different. I don't know if my friend has run any numbers, but I am not seeing nearly as many kids swing voodoos. I am seeing a lot more comps -- CF5's, S1's, and -- especially -- Makos. I think my friend's kid has one, BTW.
So I'm wondering it that's just anecdotal evidence that doesn't match the main trends out there, or if kids just like the new model and new paint jobs, or if those are the best performing bats available.
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
BBCOR bats don't have any pop (trampoline effect) in the first place.
So, they can't lose it.
The BESR bats had some serious trampoline effect which, counterintuitively, actually increased with use, according to The Baseball Research Center at UMass/Lowell
bat and hence, the workhardened bat exhibits an increased performance
http://m-5.eng.uml.edu/umlbrc/...0Drane%20-%20pwp.pdf
We moved in February from denver to a small farming community, so my 2018 will be playing babe Ruth ball for the first time. When looking over the rules, the BR bat rule for 13-15 reads as follows:
"The bat may not exceed 34" in length, and the bat barrel may not exceed 2 5/8" in diameter. All aluminum/alloy barrel bats and all composite handle (only) aluminum/alloy barrels are allowed. Only composite barrel bats certified and marked BBCOR .50 will be allowed. Wood barrel bats conforming to the specifications of Official Baseball Rule 1.10 are allowed."
This would indicate that BESR bats can be used (at least the alloy ones). How fortunate. They are a dime a dozen still in the wrapper online. In fact, I pulled out an old Triple 7 BESR 33/30 and he hit with it. Pretty worn out, but the pop...oh, my. I had forgotten.
Do these bats ever wear out? My 13 year old thinks his Easton s1 is losing its pop after 6 months of hard hitting. I have read that the trampoline effect actually increases with usage. Also, he has been hitting with a -3 since last fall.
My son has been using a 2012 Easton XL1 33-30 since I bought it for him for Xmas in Dec.2011.He is halfway through his senior season and has used this bat in every HS game for almost 3 seasons.He uses wood in the cages and on his 18U summer/fall team.This bat has lasted and there has been no noticeable drop in "pop" over time.In fact, he hit another homerun with it yesterday afternoon
He's tried the newer XL1 versions and that obscenely expensive Mako model as well(teammates have these bats).However,he likes the "feel" of the 2012 XL1 versus the newer models.I guess that's what really matters.How a bat feels in a hitters hands.
I was able to find another new 2012 Easton XL1 33-30 on eBay the other day.Still in the original wrapper ! Now my son can rest easy when he goes off to college 2500 miles from home,knowing that he has a backup "boomstick". Hahaha !
FGYI--
All bats have a trampoline effect. A bat with no trampoline effect would have a BBCOR rating of zero (which is impossible.)
Myself and few other coaches begin to notice bats losing pop and/or breaking and it was an open discussion amongst coaches at a meeting. During this meeting one of the coaches called his brother who works in the bat industry and he told him that most of the bats now a days are built to breakdown around the 1,500 swing marker.
Is that a typo (1500)? That's about 2 weeks worth of swings. Maybe 15,000?
FGYI--
All bats have a trampoline effect. A bat with no trampoline effect would have a BBCOR rating of zero (which is impossible.)
Dr. Alan Nathan in Collegiate Baseball Newspaper, "Physicist Discusses BBCOR Bats":
“What these figures mean is that there will be no trampoline effect for the new non-wood bat barrels. From a trampoline aspect, the barrels will react just like wood. A wood bat is essentially a perfectly hard surface. When a ball hits a wooden bat, it has the same trampoline effect as a ball hitting a massive, rigid floor."
http://www.baseballnews.com/ol...usses_bbcor_bats.htm
FGYI--
All bats have a trampoline effect. A bat with no trampoline effect would have a BBCOR rating of zero (which is impossible.)
Dr. Alan Nathan in Collegiate Baseball Newspaper, "Physicist Discusses BBCOR Bats":
“What these figures mean is that there will be no trampoline effect for the new non-wood bat barrels. From a trampoline aspect, the barrels will react just like wood. A wood bat is essentially a perfectly hard surface. When a ball hits a wooden bat, it has the same trampoline effect as a ball hitting a massive, rigid floor."
http://www.baseballnews.com/ol...usses_bbcor_bats.htm
How many things can I find wrong with this article...
I'm amazed that a physicist would say that. This is basic stuff regarding the concept of inelasticity.
My 2017 son's batting coach felt my son had partially worn out his 32" 5150 Velo after 1 year of heavy use in practices, games, and MANY lengthy hitting lessons. Plus, it was time to go to a 33" bat...
That's got an aluminum barrel. Not an engineer, and not an expert, but don't think I've never heard/seen anybody who is an expert say that metal bats lose their pop. OTOH kids do grow and they also like to buy the latest model bat.
Hah. He is using the same bat, just 33" model. But my estimates had the bat hitting a ball 2.5 to 3k times before his hitting coach felt it was losing a little pop. But I too am no expert!
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
Are there any rules saying that a bat can't be under .50 ? What if the bat manufacture said ehh .46 is good enough or.37 . Maybe they don't want to go through anymore development money or they get a batch of sub par material .I guess it could go either way with alloy or composite . But, I would say there is a difference in bats.
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
Are there any rules saying that a bat can't be under .50 ? What if the bat manufacture said ehh .46 is good enough or.37 . Maybe they don't want to go through anymore development money or they get a batch of sub par material .I guess it could go either way with alloy or composite . But, I would say there is a difference in bats.
Nope. As long as the tested bat is below .50, it's legal.
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
...But, I would say there is a difference in bats.
Besides, weight, balance, length, esthetics, feel, handle/grip dimensions... What are the differences? Do you think there's a performance difference? There's not. Standard does not allow for it. There may be a player's confidence difference with a certain bat that they feel comfortable with...
bobbyaguho- my son has used the 2012 XL-1 since it came out and IMAO it is the best bat on the market. Just bought him a new 2012 XL-1 for this season. given the fact that all BBCOR are .50 I refused to play the game of figuring out what bat has more "pop"and paying a premium to upgrade to the current years model which appear to be the same bat, different clors scheme. The truth is that they will all have relatively the same "pop".
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
...But, I would say there is a difference in bats.
Besides, weight, balance, length, esthetics, feel, handle/grip dimensions... What are the differences? Do you think there's a performance difference? There's not. Standard does not allow for it. There may be a player's confidence difference with a certain bat that they feel comfortable with...
I think this is a common misconception. True, the standard does not allow for the COR to exceed 0.50. But, in any manufacturing process there is variation, no way around this. The manufacturer designs and manufactures to a spec (say COR = 0.50), and let's say the variation in the manufacturing process is +/- 0.03 (I made this number up to illustrate my point). In this example, the actual manufactured product COR will vary between 0.47 and 0.53. So either the manufacturer has to throw out 50% of production (the half that exceeds 0.50) or shift the design point down to 0.47 and sell all of the bats produced. Some manufacturers will experience wider or tighter spreads and shift their design point accordingly, and some may choose to "eat" the yield loss and push right up against 0.50. These decisions could lead to differences in COR for bats that are sold.
Last season, almost every player on our team and around our district was using an S1 (Composite), This season almost every player used a Omaha Balanced (Alloy)... I think it's whatever the player is comfortable with (weight, balance, etc... , and there is no advantage to either... .50 is .50 if using Comp or Alloy.
...But, I would say there is a difference in bats.
Besides, weight, balance, length, esthetics, feel, handle/grip dimensions... What are the differences? Do you think there's a performance difference? There's not. Standard does not allow for it. There may be a player's confidence difference with a certain bat that they feel comfortable with...
I think this is a common misconception. True, the standard does not allow for the COR to exceed 0.50. But, in any manufacturing process there is variation, no way around this. The manufacturer designs and manufactures to a spec (say COR = 0.50), and let's say the variation in the manufacturing process is +/- 0.03 (I made this number up to illustrate my point). In this example, the actual manufactured product COR will vary between 0.47 and 0.53. So either the manufacturer has to throw out 50% of production (the half that exceeds 0.50) or shift the design point down to 0.47 and sell all of the bats produced. Some manufacturers will experience wider or tighter spreads and shift their design point accordingly, and some may choose to "eat" the yield loss and push right up against 0.50. These decisions could lead to differences in COR for bats that are sold.
It could also lead to their bat being reclassified as non-compliant... IE.: Marucci Cat-5, Black and Reebok Vector...
Do you think there's a performance difference? There's not. Standard does not allow for it.
Would you agree that a bat with a 0.48 BBCOR has less pop (aka trampoline effect) than a bat with 0.50? The BBCOR standard is an upper limit, not a fixed index. One of the most important skills of the manufacturers (and most expense) is figuring out how to get as close to 0.50 as possible without a significant number of individual bats exceeding the limit (and possibly triggering a de-certification). It's much easier and cheaper to err on the side of caution and produce a stiffer bat with lower manufacturing tolerances.
So either the manufacturer has to throw out 50% of production (the half that exceeds 0.50) or shift the design point down to 0.47 and sell all of the bats produced.
It would be cost-prohibitive for the manufacturer to test every bat. Once they go to production, they're all in.
Do you think there's a performance difference? There's not. Standard does not allow for it.
Would you agree that a bat with a 0.48 BBCOR has less pop (aka trampoline effect) than a bat with 0.50? The BBCOR standard is an upper limit, not a fixed index. One of the most important skills of the manufacturers (and most expense) is figuring out how to get as close to 0.50 as possible without a significant number of individual bats exceeding the limit (and possibly triggering a de-certification). It's much easier and cheaper to err on the side of caution and produce a stiffer bat with lower manufacturing tolerances.
Of course.
Watched a college game between two top 25 teams and two of the players were swinging last years 5150....just sayin'
Watched a college game between two top 25 teams and two of the players were swinging last years 5150....just sayin'
Rawlings contract teams? Or teams withou a bat contract?
Watched a college game between two top 25 teams and two of the players were swinging last years 5150....just sayin'
It's possible that while they are last years model, they are still new bats...maybe????
