College hitting mechanics question

That is a tough question. I imagine you are trying to focus on 4 year programs, however I do know that Daytona State College is very firm on how their hitters approach the game. Very Linear, and the reason my son transfered out after 1 year. The Coach is a great guy with a history of success and my son did well there hitting .393 his first year. We realized early on that the linear approach was not an approach that attacted scouts.

floridafan, so you are saying that was a major reason for transferring because they stressed linear? Interesting. My son has done rotational for what about 10+ years and now is being taught linear. Obviously some peaks n valleys have occurred and he is working through that. You mention that PRO scouts dont like linear, how have you concluded that?

Not to hijack, but are there any current MLB pros who still use linear?

Eric, I would be very concerned that after 10+ years some coach is seeing fit to completely change your son's swing from rotational to linear.

Sometimes I wonder how much the terms rotational and linear are just marketing terms. I do know Epstein created the term to distinguish his teaching from the Lau methodology. Yet George Brett swears by Lau. The Lau program claims credit for ARod.

Does anyone know what Kevin Long encourages? I am reading his Cage Rat book and have not gotten to that point in the book if there is any claim at all for that matter. When ARod was mentioned I wonder on him now. I am supporting my son in his venture to revamp his swing so as to not counteract what the coaches are teaching him, but mannnnnn it is hard !!!!

The technique that my son has developed, which begins with his naturally good swing, can neither be called linear or rotational. Purists of either approach lack some aspect of a high level swing. Linear discounts the power of the un-coiling body, and rotational discounts the power and importance of wrists and hands.

I know the scouts in our area that I have spoke with are definitely looking for linear hitters. My personal opinion...rotational hitters seam to have more power because they pull the ball but are more prone to the strikeout but linear hitters make more consistent contact and the great ones (Miguel Cabrera) can hit the ball out to all fields. If you have watched Prince Fielder this year I believe you are seeing him try to make the transition. I would have considered him a rotational hitter before he came to Detroit but has made an effort to stay through the ball more this year...hitting over .300 for the first time in his career.

If anyone spots a current MLB player using linear, let me know.

Youth coaches teach linear. The lucky players that survive this nightmare have a chance at MLB.

I predict this thread will be chock full of myths within an hour. If you make contact with your back elbow 'tucked' near your hip, you are using rotational. It has nothing to do with striding, lunging, or pulling.

If you can do this, you are linear. (yet many HS and college coaches teach this and it's twin, the 2 tee drill) (Note that some coaches twist the LS tee below, or angle the two-tees to allow a hitter to use rotational)



Some MLB guys tuck, then extend sometimes (Giambi, Freeman, Ripken). Still considered rotational.

In 'pure' (worst case) linear, the hands leave the shoulder too soon (right away), which causes a downward swing path, and fully extended arms on contact.

(Typical rotational hitters have the added advantage of being able to extend their arms to - weakly - hit an offspeed pitch after they were fooled.)

Food Fight!!!!

Ichiro

florida, I thought you had me on that one

But, Ichiro looks rotational here and here, then looks hybrid here (he threw his hands down toward the plate!, then rotated and tucked)

Hey Sultan - no desire to get into the debate, not really anyway...IT CAN BE A FUN ONE, lol.

But I reject the rotational purists that place no value in hands, other than that they are connected to a bat.

Many believe my son to be rotational, yet he places a high importance on his use of hands, and the value of forearms and wrist strength.

Nice video links though!

quote:

Originally posted by SultanofSwat:
Ichiro looks rotational here and here, then looks hybrid here (he threw his hands down toward the plate!, then rotated and tucked)

Ichiro is an interesting study. At full speed he more often looks linear. In slow motion, you will often see rotational at the key moments of the swing.

I suspect that most coaches use linear cues and drills from the 70s and 80s ("hands to the ball", "don't drop your shoulder" etc.), but will say they use rotational concepts.

So, I am not sure how you can tell which coach you are getting.

I couldn't tell one from the other but aren't the hands a key component in bat speed?

See Angular momentum re 'hands'. (Compare the hand weights to a 34 ounce bat)

Just keep your back elbow close to your body/hip as long as possible. (Don't throw your hands so far away from your body, so soon, that both arms become extended)

quote:

Originally posted by fillsfan:
I couldn't tell one from the other but aren't the hands a key component in bat speed?

Absolutely, if you use them properly, you can gain quite a bit of bat speed. Turn the barrel rearward to use them properly.

Synchronize them with the lower body for maximum power.

Also, I'd say that the swing is neither linear nor rotational. It is both.

The swing is rotational, then linear.

quote:

but aren't the hands a key component in bat speed?

As Sultan alluded to, as long as they remain close to the body.

30 years ago; World class behemoth Slow Pitch softball hitters would be called "rotational" by just about anybody. While, with baseball hitters, who had to deal with a pitches changing speeds and moving across multiple planes, they might be described as using a more linear approach to the ball. But in that contrasting example, so too was Republican and Democratic political platforms easily defined. With everyone jockeying to get elected, or to sell lessons, they have pirated desirable aspects of both styles and added confusing linguistics to the point that no one can agree on what they see or describe it similarly. I remember when traditional martial arts styles were; traditional. Now, the styles and approaches are blurred. At the MMA level they've cross trained to incorporate everything. Hitting approaches now are often blended. I always felt that hitting a baseball required both forces.

I know this. I spent a lot of time money and effort to incorporate more "rotation" in my son's baseball swing because I felt he was going to need to be able to drive the baseball to be recruited to College. And at the time (BESR bats), college baseball was an offense oriented game. It worked, he did mash in H.S. (2nd best HR season ever at his school) and he was recruited.

But, BBCOR standards hit his College Freshman year. The bats reaked big time, the fields got way bigger, and the resulting near 50% decrease in power (HR's, doubles and RBI's) across College baseball changed recruiting at his College, and from what I read, many others.

His team for the past two years has gotten, smaller, faster, and chock full of left handed slap style JUCO transfers. Offense now is; hit the ball in the middle, on the ground, and hope for an error or beat it out. Then, sacrifice them over (rarely ever see hit and run but do sometimes) and look to score a run. Then let pitching an defense hold. Kind of boring to watch at times. The pro approach differs IMO.

So, his school now; definitely favors what many would say is a linear hitting approach. And, it is very obviously taught and promoted by the Hitting coach.

However, I'm with florida and Sultan, that's not the pro approach nor one I would want someone teaching if it's a valid literal linear mechanics.

A good swing has both concepts. Its one of the wierdest arguements in hitting. I have even seen and heard people use the same player to support their arguement for rotational or linear. When in reality the player displays both.

Some MLB players might have in their swing a bit more rotational action and some a bit more linear but that is not to say they do not have the other in their swing. A good hitter has both concepts. In my experience with hitters, the hitters that come to me for help that have tried a pure linear approach are a mess.

shotquick, this is what I am trying to convey to my son, both components are likely going to be a part of the swing. I advised him he has done rotational for 10 yrs now and now inserting some linear aspects could be a good thing!