Daddy Ball

Rec ball includes a lot of people playing for a variety of reasons: excersize, the value of the team experience, experimenting with different sports, because it's the game Mom or Dad love, child's interest in the game, athletic ability, "healthy" babysitting, an older sibling's experience. It's always good to keep this in mind.

Parents (the universally acknowledged bane of youth sports ) each have their own filters through which they observe the team. Parents will believe that their child is every bit as talented as yours (and some may/will be, but I'm talking about those that clearly aren't) "if only he/she were given the chance". I would explain that they earn their positions and innings in practice, and that giving a child a chance in the All Important Infield doesn't lead to success and "self esteem" (Lor, I hate that phrase) if the child hasn't shown that they have developed the skills to field and throw well enough to make it a good experience for them. But we would continue to work with them until that happens.

I would then generally ask (say in the situation where the child is afraid of the ball) what happens when they play catch with their child in the backyard. This was generally met with a pauzzled expression. "Practice is "class", the games are "tests"...."homework" will help your child get better." Make them a partner in the process.

Of course, true Daddy Ball exists. But a very reasonable couple from our LL days put it well --- "Your child has a chance to compete for one of eight positions on the field. The ninth belongs to the coach's child. It's payment for all the time put in."

If your child is clearly a stand-out player, the accusations will be fewer. But many of the parents you encounter will not be equipped to judge that, or will have an inflated view of their own player's skill. So you can't always avoid the Daddy Ball label from some folks; it doesn't mean it's true.

My definition of a successful season was that each player ended the season a better player than they started. Seeing that progress will help even the most delusional parent see the value of their child playing for you.

Welcome to Daddy Ball!

Actually at the ages before 12, as many dads we could round up coached our kids. At the young age of coach pitch, we also played all the kids at different positions and all sat at some time of the game. When we hit 10 and became more competitive, as a league, players started to specialize more and when they were 12, it was very competitive within the league. We also played tournaments from 9-12 years old during the summer after the league was over.

At the age of 13, we left the league and played travel ball and officially left "Daddy Ball" at that age we felt that he needed to get ready for high school and we wanted him to start seeing the best competition he could and be coached by someone else other than fathers.

I read the posts about travel ball teams having fathers and the challenges they have when their players happen not to be the best player in his position and the problems it creates for other players, with non-parent coaches determine the line-up it makes it easy to say the coach determines the lineup and develop the player to their fullest extent.

There are times where coaches happen to have their children on the team, but it can cause problems unless the player is just a stud and there is no question who the best player is and there are no conflicts for a given position.

The above is true.

However some of the best coaches are "dads" and often times more qualified than the paid "professional" coaches. Some, and I say some professional coaches are only in it for the money. The "dads" while sometimes showing favoritism to their kids are doing it without getting paid and because they enjoy working with kids. Some "dads" don't play their kid at SS (even though he is the best ss on the team) because they don't want to be called a "daddy ball" coach. Of course there are always the exceptions. I guess my point is you can't make a blanket statement one way ot the other.

My husband coached Rec for years. Sometimes no matter what he did, it was wrong. You will probably be accused of a number of things. Then again, you may just be playing with parents who think a catcher can throw a ball and hit a runner for an out.

Keep that thick skin.

Daddyball is about UNEQUAL opportunity and is prevalent in almost all cases where parents coach their son. Daddyball is meant to be a derogatory label conjured up by the “other” disgruntled parents and envious others and is placed on fathers (or mothers) which assume a proactive role (usually coaching) with the primary goal of providing opportunity for their own child. I never had a big problem with daddyball because I was confident my son would succeed without special opportunities. I always looked at it that the less talented players needed more opportunities to gain some semblance of success while the talented others need only a smidgen of opportunity to succeed. Ever notice how daddyball coaches let their son ride the coattails of the talented player. Ever hear them say: “My son and your son are -------“

quote:

My son will play as much OF as he will IF. But what if eventually he is a really good SS and when he gets to be 10 or 11 and we actually start to try and win games, will I be a "daddy ball" guy if I play him at SS quite a bit because he is most suited for it?

Yes! Remember this is about OPPORTUNITY not talent. At the start of the post you hope you will not be a "daddyball" coach and by the end of your post you have admitted you probably will be. Daddyball coaches are parents!!!!! All parents have trouble seeing things as they really are. They tend to see things as they want them to be. This has nothing to do with baseball. THAT'S NORMAL!

PS: Go on --- Play your son at shortstop --- we understand.
Fungo

If you are the coach and your son is on the team, get ready, you will be accused of favoritism whether it's true or not.

Just be aware of what's right and what's not and do what's right. And be careful, often times the most innocent things are misperceived, especially by parents whose kids are struggling on the field, or whose kids might want to play where your son plays or get the mound innings he gets. As noted above it's often more a matter of what filter you view it through. But without question there are teams built for no reason other than to promote the coach's son, and if you find your son is a member of someone else's supporting cast it's a good time to move on.

quote:

I guess what I want to know is, since I'm a dad, and I intend on coaching my son, when will I be accused of fostering "daddy ball"?....

But what if eventually he is a really good SS and when he gets to be 10 or 11 and we actually start to try and win games, will I be a "daddy ball" guy if I play him at SS quite a bit because he is most suited for it?

Great questions Larry. If he produces in the field and at the plate you shouldn't hear about it too much. The thing is at those ages, lots of mistakes are going to be made by ALL players so it is easy for someone to criticize your decisions. They may feel if only their son were given a chance at SS then he ultimately would "develop" into the better player. There is nebulousness in all that because in some cases some will hang their hat on the one good game their kid plays out of five as proof they are right and at the same time they will not let you forget the bad game your kid had two weeks ago.

Since I still can't believe to this day how bad some parent-coaches were in our experience, here are some rambling stories...

In some cases not only did the Dad coach play their kid at SS when there were better players on the team, they batted them in the 3-hole when they were one of the worst hitters on the team.

These same type of people would see their kids get two hits after going 0-9 and proclaim their sons were smoking the ball. Once my son started a tournament 7-7 and in the next game went 0-4. The coach came up to me after the game and said I can't believe how bad he is struggling

My son once had a grandslam and knocked in 9 runs in a game we won 13-5. After the game, the coach had this long speech about giving the game ball out and it seemed obvious who would get it. He said and the game ball goes to - our pitcher I could have killed the guy as blood rushed to my head. No problem giving a ball to the pitcher but he did not even mention my son.

My son was a good pitcher and threw a 1 hitter against the best team in our area that year. After the game, the coach never acknowledged the pitching performance. During the post-game meeting, the opposing coach walked over and asked our coach if he could interrupt. He said he had never done this before but he wanted to give a game ball to my son for the game he pitched. I had to hold back tears because I knew there was a higher power at play.

In the final game of the season that year, we were in the championship game. That coach had long since given up pitching my son because he said he was not big enough. None of the pitchers they threw in the game were effective and they finally brought my son in as a last resort. He never allowed another hit over the last four innings and we won the tournament for our last game together when they were 12 years old.

Though all this, I learned that not only are their some that will blindly favor their own they will down-grade other kids which is sinful imho.

Larry - you mentioned winning and I do believe winning is the deal in sports but not paramount at those ages. Kids can learn how to win and still have fun. Maybe your kid is the best SS but what does it hurt to give some other kid a chance at the postion? If your son is a good infielder, let him play 2b and 3b while also giving other kids a chance. Obviously, it makes no sense having a first baseman play SS and your catchers are going to have to want to play that position. Try your son at different spots in the batting order also. Most importantly, if a kid was good enough to make your team in the first place, let them ALL play. Let them all try different spots in the order. One way to achieve this is during our travel years we played local league games during the week and tournaments on weekends. Those league games gave a good opportunity to to mix things up. You could also reward the producers with the plum spots on the weekends while still giving others their opportunities to play.

Here is the bottom line in all this imho. Coaches who remove competitive pressures from their sons will ultimately hurt them imho even though they may believe they are helping them. At the same time, even if you are completely fair about things and perhaps even are less fair to your son than you ought to be - some people will still complain. That is the life of a coach who happens to also be a Dad. I believe God is watching and that things generally work out like they ought to in the long run.

Daddy ball isn't just about playing time or who gets to be shortstop, especially in rec ball. Here are some situations which aren't likely to generate complaints by a disgruntled parent, but which I view as undesireable.

One fairly prevalent negative aspect is the scapegoating of other players for a head or assistant coach's son's mistake. For example, runners at first and third, and an unsuccessful double steal attempt. If one of the runners is the son of a coach, which runner receives the benefit of "constructive criticism"? Some coaches are very hard on their own kid, but the majority seem to find fault with another player. I don't think either reaction is desireable.

Some coaches overuse pitchers, especially during Little League tournament time. In my experience, they only do this with their own kid. It's a bad emotional dynamic: an eager kid convincing his dad that he's OK to continue.

Some kids have had a lot of practice at baseball, and have developed skills, in spite of mediocre talent or minimal self-generated desire to play the game. Of course, their dad will be their coach, and he will probably practice Daddy Ball. Sooner or later, certainly by freshman year in high school, reality will set in. Frequently, it ain't pretty.

Without parent coaches, there would be very few coaches in rec ball. My own kids had coaches who were all fine people with the best of intentions. Some practiced Daddy Ball, and some didn't. It was all good; it's OK to learn at 9 or 10 years old that not everything in life is decided by objective criteria.

The strong team becomes the weak team when coach's son becomes the weak player in the team. This travel team will not last for a year. Basicly either the coach gone with his kid or this team becomes a new team every year. When chose a youth team, you should check out the coach's son first, if his son is a weak player, forget about, go find another team ASAP. There's no future of this team. JMHO

quote:

Originally posted by ClevelandDad:

My son once had a grandslam and knocked in 9 runs in a game we won 13-5. After the game, the coach had this long speech about giving the game ball out and it seemed obvious who would get it. He said and the game ball goes to - our pitcher I could have killed the guy as blood rushed to my head. No problem giving a ball to the pitcher but he did not even mention my son.

.

hi, CLevelandDad: You got too much egos in yoour heart. There's no reason to kill the coach over a game ball. To my opinion, your son got his highlights on "ESPN", he doesn't need the game ball.
Let the fact speak for itsself. You knew it, other parents knew it, and the American people knew it.
This happened to my son all the time, because he is the top player, coaches alway shy away to give him anymore praises, just to keep our egos down. I can understand it. What I am looking for is 3 things:
1. Where my son bats in the batting order?
2. How many games he pitched?
3. How many positions he played?

Batting 3rd, pitch every week, play infield/outfield all season long, what else should I ask for? A game ball???

quote:

hi, CLevelandDad: You got too much egos in yoour heart. There's no reason to kill the coach over a game ball. To my opinion, your son got his highlights on "ESPN", he doesn't need the game ball.

Welcome to the hssbbweb

There was no ego involved - I am talking about common decency and it had nothing to do with a ball. Also, I was not talking about literally killing the coach but how I felt for my son at the time. I did not ask the coach to single any players out and would have preferred he did not give out any game balls.

Curious if ego is not involved why does it matter where your son bats in the order? I agree with you that getting a game ball is unimportant.

Did you see my son on ESPN this past spring btw in the NCAA regionals from Myrtle Beach? I do agree with with that comment because he is the only one who still plays baseball from the hundreds of kids he has played with in the past.

Larry(if I may call you that),
Coaching is always appreciated! Just to echo a few sentiments. I hope that your son is the stud on the team when they get a little older. It makes all the problems go away. Do your son a favor and teach him outfield also. As you probably know, it is a skill set that he will need and it will keep a lot of the other parents off your back if he is out there on occaision. I know it is hard for every parent out there, but if you bat him in the top 4 it had better be because he earned it!! The other players will know.
Bad daddyball usually involves all of the coaches kids playing infield and pitching only plus always batting in the top 4. Keep stats in case there are any questions on why they are in the top four. If your stats don't prove it, you may be playing daddyball.

Talk to parents and players and ask them where they want to play. Give them a legitimate chance in practice and the games. Especially when they are 8-9 years old. As you know, kids develop at different levels, the clumsy kid at 8 could be the ballerina at SS by age 12. Always keep the options open and it will help to keep the kids honest and playing hard.

But if you coach your own son expect some abuse no matter how good he is. It goes with the territory. That is one of the reasons that I stopped coaching my son at the age of ten. Plus the fact that he had heard everything I had to say and there are definitley better coaches than me out there. For some reason, I always did better with other peoples kids than my own.
Something to think about.

Sometimes the daddyball label is unfair. A few years back in rec ball we needed to diffuse some parents who were upset about the batting order and such. We began to publish the batting averages on a weekly basis. It stopped all arguments. What would have made it a daddyball situation would have been continuing to bat one of our sons at the top of the lineup when they didn’t earn it. The other thing we did was to make sure our kids sat out an inning or two like the other kids. For us no kid sat out 2 innings in a row. Again this was rec ball.

quote:

Originally posted by ClevelandDad:
[Curious if ego is not involved why does it matter where your son bats in the order?

What I want say is that forget about the after game comments, think about the real benefits of playing in this team more. If your coach bat your son last, bench him every now and then, never let him stand on the pitching mound, then think about "killing" the coach (Just kidding), Chasing the unreal fame is not the things to do at the little league level. To improve my son's skill level every year is what I like to focus on.
Please let me know, which spot your son bats? (batting 3rd will obiviosly give him more AT BAT.) How many games he pitched?( In case you want your Grand Slam hitter become a pitcher someday.) Which other positions your son play? (To improve his infield and outfield skills). This is not ego, it's called player development.

quote:

Originally posted by xbcoachoh62:

quote:

Originally posted by ClevelandDad:
[Curious if ego is not involved why does it matter where your son bats in the order?

What I want say is that forget about the after game comments, think about the real benefits of play in this team more. If your coach bat your son last, bench him every now and then, never let him stand on the pitching mound, then think about "killing" the coach (Just kidding), Chasing the unreal fame is not the things to do at the little league level. To improve my son's skill level every year is what I like to focus on.
Please let me know, which spot your son bats? (batting 3rd will obiviosly give him more AT BAT.) How many games he pitched?( In case you want your Grand Slam hitter become a pitcher someday.) Which position your son play? (To improve his infield and outfield skills). This is not ego, it's called player development.

Coach I was telling stories from 10 years ago about 10/12 year olds and don't have a clue what you are trying to say other than it appears you are trying to get in my face. Most know me as very easy to get along with and I am really trying here.

Look, I welcomed you on to the hsbbweb and your posts seem inflamatory in response. You also seem like you are trying to conceal your identity. In some sentences it sounds like Espanol is your first language and in others you practice remarkably good grammer. If you have a beef with me or are trying to get my dander up please take it off line or refrain from posting.

quote:

Originally posted by philsfan:
Sometimes the daddyball label is unfair. A few years back in rec ball we needed to diffuse some parents who were upset about the batting order and such. We began to publish the batting averages on a weekly basis. It stopped all arguments. What would have made it a daddyball situation would have been continuing to bat one of our sons at the top of the lineup when they didn’t earn it. The other thing we did was to make sure our kids sat out an inning or two like the other kids. For us no kid sat out 2 innings in a row. Again this was rec ball.

Very nice post and I agree. Also agree that rec ball versus travel ball are entirely different considerations.

sorry ClevelandDad,
If my posts give you that impression. I am not direct it at you. I knew it's an old story, I tried to use it as a example to illustrate "Daddy Ball". The "Daddy ball" usually got a lot of egos involved. I am 100% sure that post is not against you. Especially for a ten-year's old story.

sorry.

quote:

Originally posted by xbcoachoh62:
sorry ClevelandDad,
If my posts give you that impression. I am not direct it at you. I knew it's an old story, I tried to use it as a example to illustate "Daddy Ball". The "Daddy ball" usually got a lot of egos involved. I am 100% sure that post is not against you. Especially as a ten-year's old story.

sorry.

Thanks. Again, welcome to the hsbbweb

BTW - I agree. True Daddy ball is about ego - usually the parents. Like others have said, if Dad's gave up coaching then our youth leagues would probably disappear and that would not be good. I believe Dad's can coach effectively if they are fair and realize that some people will oppose them anyways. It comes with the job. It's possible that the best pre-training for a politician might be to serve as a youth baseball coach

You will only be accused of daddyball if your son is on the team.

Now the accusations may be isolated or widespread. The accusation may be justified or unjustified. But in all likelihood at least one parent will accuse you of daddyball. This will be the parent who is unhappy with their son's playing time, position, etc.

Daddyball is the situation of a dad giving his son preferential treatment. Pure and simple.

Don't make the mistake I did, however. In attempting to ensure that there was no perception of preferential treatment of my son, I went the other extreme and was too hard on him.

* Daddyball is when you see your son through rose colored glasses and can't see his faults.

* Daddyball is when your son pitches and plays short over more qualified players.

* Daddyball is when your son gets preferential treatment on his (lack of) behavior.

* Daddyball accusations are when jealous parents can't see your son deserves to play certain positions over their kid.

* Daddyball accusations end when your son plays and bats in the key positions when you aren't coaching.

Chances are the jealous parent is the one with the rose colored glasses. It's their kid who doesn't have much time left in the game.

* Daddyball is watching three kids lead a team to a section championship along with a solid supporting cast, then hear the head coach only talk about how his son (not one of the three) with the heart of a lion put the team on his back and carried it to a championship.

As long as LL is all volunteer coaches you will have daddyball---there is no way around it

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
As long as LL is all volunteer coaches you will have daddyball---there is no way around it.

At the 12U level, as a whole, I did not see anything wrong with it. Sure there were some problems, but for the most part, it works well especially if the player is one of the better players or the coach is realistic of his son's ability.

When you get a little older, like in high school, you need to separate yourself from fathers/mothers coaching and if you are going to play a more competitive brand of ball between 12U and high school; I suggest you get away from fathers/mothers for the true development purposes.

First off, if dads didn't coach there very simply wouldn't be enough coaches for the t-ball through Little League age groups. So it's necessary to some extent.

In rec ball I think you have to assume there's going to be some daddy-ball going on with nearly every team. At least that sure seems to be true. When you get to "select" though, for me at least, my expectations are that daddyball is over. If I'm paying $600-$700 yr for my kid to pay I expect equity from the coaches. I don't always get it of course.

My middle son still experienced it in 9u and 10u, even things you wouldn't think any rational human being would do. I saw the team batting stats about half way through his 10u season (2006) and the coaches' sons are all hitting .200 points better than my son and a couple other kids which was absolutely shocking to me. Well I started watching the scorebook and sure enough, the next game the HC's son hit a routine ground ball through the 3B's legs for a "double". Same thing happened in his next at-bat. He ended the game 3-4 when he would have been 1-4. This continued with all the coaches' kids and I didn't say anything to anyone. I just kind of chuckled to myself...these guys are so desperate to build their kids up (actually IMO to build themselves up).

Same coaching staff started handing out stickers after games midway through that season for big hits, good pitching, good base running, etc. After a few games my son didn't seem to care about it any more. I inquired about that and he said the coaches' kids all showed up each game with more and more stickers that were not "earned" and given out after each game, so the stickers didn't really mean much. I told him he was crazy since I didn't figure anyone would actually do that. Turns out he was right. I started watching the sticker distribution and watching the helmets of the coaches' kids and they'd show up each game with a couple extra stickers each so they could keep up or stay ahead of other kids on the team.

Can you believe that? I mean, this is supposed to be 'select' ball.

Of course these were simply amusing things for me. I wasn't so amused at how the coaches' kids never sat the bench while better players were rotated into the field. And of course all 3 coaches' kids batted in the top 5. Shocking, I know.

All I can say is, if you're scouting a new team, make sure your son doesn't play one of the positions the coaches' sons play.

Great discussion so far!

Sounds to me that "Daddy ball" is both good and bad. Just as I suspected. Some people are always going to find fault when their son is not the center of attention. Other folks can accept the fact that junior won't be signing a 13 million dollar contract any time soon.

Without dads, lots of kids would never get in to baseball, or other sports for that matter.

quote:

All I can say is, if you're scouting a new team, make sure your son doesn't play one of the positions the coaches' sons play.

Be leary of teams with five or six coaches. That's five or six positions not available to other players.

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:
Other folks can accept the fact that junior won't be signing a 13 million dollar contract any time soon.

I had a surprising conversation with a parent today. His son is on a community travel s****r team. He was cut from the 8th grade team. I told the dad middle school coaches make mistakes and hoped his son wasn't discouraged. The dad called community travel "advanced rec ball," said his son doesn't have what it takes to compete at the high school level and they have never tried to delude him into thinking he could (kid's sister is a stud athlete). Usually the perception is the opposite, hopes hit the floor with a resounding crash in high school and parents trash the "ignorant" high school coaches.

quote:

Originally posted by larrythompson:
Without dads, lots of kids would never get in to baseball, or other sports for that matter.

Without kids, lots of dads would never get into baseball, or other sports for that matter.

Larry - You sound like you have your eyes wide open and are very conscience of player and parent perceptions. You would have been the type of coach I would have liked my kids to play for during rec.

To me, daddyball is about more than coaches sons getting what is perceived as preferential treatment. Since parents are so engaged at this age, and they often don't or refuse to understand the concept of earning a position, parents often unduly influence the coach.

When one of my sons was nine he missed the first few practices of the season because he was sick. Over the next few weeks of practice and over the first three or 4 games of the season he showed what he could do. The coach decided to start him at second base (he had been playing outfield). The incumbant 2b had grown accustomed to playing second base and started crying, right there in the dugout before the game! The kids parent wasn't a coach, but he was a very vocal parent and thought he knew everything about baseball. Long story short, although my kid was a superior second baseman he was replaced after three innings and only played 2b sporatically after that. The incumbant wasn't the coaches son but it was daddyball nevertheless.

Here are my thoughts for avoiding daddyball during the elementary school years:

1. Be as fair as reasonable to all of the players, regardless of how vocal their parents are.
2. Adopt a philosophy that your purpose is to development players, have fun, and win games, in that order - then follow through. If you do the first two the wins will usually follow.
3. Try to be as tough (but no toughter) on your kid as you are for other children.
4. Give kids opportunities to play other positions, especially if your team is up by a lot of runs. (Don't do this wholesale, swapping everyone all at once) As someone said earlier, let them earn their position in practice and with game performance.
5. Find good things to say about each kid over the course of 3 or 4 games. Keep notes and try not to overlook strong performances or even small things that helped create a situation for the team to win or remain competitive in a game.
6. Building confidence in the kids about their abilities, helping them overcome fears, and building their knowledge and enjoyment of the game is critical at this stage. I can't tell you how many good ballplayers I've seen leave the game because of a poor experience.

I have a lot a respect for anyone who puts forth their time and effort to coach youth sports. I know how difficult it is.

I'm not sure if I agree with someone who said 8 positions are up for grabs and the 9th position is for the coaches son. However, I wouldn't have a problem if he played somewhat more than his talents should allow for. If the coaches son earns his position then fine. Otherwise the coaches son should not be playing a position any more than 50% of the time if he isnt' clearly the best at that position.

Thanks BillBill...

When I was coaching 17-18 summer baseball, I had an established staff of men who had proven themselves as coaches and teachers. Ever so often, I'd have a parent of some new kid to the team tell me that coaching lost a game for us.

In 2000, we were at the Univ. of Virginia playing one of the East Cobb teams in a tournament hosted by author John Grisham. We lost a close ball game to a very good team by a score of 6-4. In the bottom of the 7th, we had an opportunity to get runners on 2nd and 3rd for our best hitter (#3 hitter). Our #2 hitter missed a bunt sign, ended up swinging, and hit into a game ending DP. #2 hitter was not swinging the bat all that well that game, but was a very good bunter. Even though we had one out, I elected to call for a bunt, with option to sacrifice or bunt for a base hit.

After the game, our #2 hitter's dad told me and one of my assistants that coaching lost that game for us. As I have always felt I can learn, I asked him to explain. He asked me why I didn't have his son bunt in the last inning. He proceeded to tell me that his son was 0-3 in the game and should have been pinch hit for or at least have him bunt. When he was done, before I could say any thing, my assistant told dad "your son missed the bunt sign we gave him". Dad's jaw dropped as he continued to his vehicle.

My point is not that we got him in not knowing what he was talking about. Heck, I'm sure my decisions have cost us many a game over the years. My point is that there was a parent who thought he knew every thing, and instead of trusting the coaches to do their job in coaching the team, he felt like he needed to jab a stick in our eyes.

If there was a winning formula for every game, some one would have written a book about it by now.

Team walks #3 hitter and #4 hits into weak force out at 2B. Would you still have been the coach that lost the game?


_____________________________________________________________________________________

CD, the broken English schtick going on here sounds suspiciously like StarDad.

quote:

Originally posted by Orlando:
CD, the broken English schtick going on here sounds suspiciously like StarDad.

StarDad/Texan or whoever. I couldn't care less. It seems some people's opinion only center around the athletic success of their offspring. Too many people forget it's a game at the young age and not a business, yet. I would never think it puts one on some sort of social status ladder when posting on a forum. If a coach influences a child in becoming a more responsible adult, then I would say he's earned his keep quite nicely.

Heck, even Joe Torre got the axe in New York. Remember, he didn't have much or a track record with the Mets or Braves. Could be much of the same with the Dodgers. He will earn his millions, regardless.

You have to coach to be accused of daddy-ball,so
if you complain about your son`s coach try putting
that bullseye on your back.While rec ball is full
of daddy-ball coaches,coaches period are hard to find.Our league has good coaches not come back,due
to PITA parents.If you want to help but not coach
try being a player agent or run the snack bar.
Just my 2 cents as a league president.

quote:

You have to coach to be accused of daddy-ball

Simply put, if you want to take a shot in the back in your community, volunteer. "Those stupid board members! I'd do better if I had time." My response: So would I.

Some people coach in order to help all the kids. Some people coach in order to help their kid. It is easy to spot which one of these guys the coach is. We have all seen both types of coaches. Its not going to stop. There will always be daddy ball coaches. Hopefully there will always be people that want to coach for the right reasons. The thing is the daddyball coaches are only hurting their kids.

I had the solution to the problem while I was involved with youth athletics in our town--- I was in charge, with the towns consent, of baseball, basketball and sokker--- no board of directors---no assistants

For baseball we instituted a 6 week instructional program during the winter--prospective coaches need to attend and graduate--no attendance no coaching--

Basketball and sokker were simpler--I was it---you don't like you take over---never had any takers for the spot

All drafts had people non affiliated with the league in attendance as witnesses---I even suspended kids for behavior unbecoming our league

YES !! "It is good to be the King"---it sure worked for us

quote:

Originally posted by Coach May:
Some people coach in order to help all the kids. Some people coach in order to help their kid. It is easy to spot which one of these guys the coach is. We have all seen both types of coaches. Its not going to stop. There will always be daddy ball coaches. Hopefully there will always be people that want to coach for the right reasons. The thing is the daddyball coaches are only hurting their kids.

This is where I fought the baseball board until I quit. When asked if my kids were being served, I replied my kids would be fine in rec ball under almost any circumstances, it's the community we're supposed to be serving. The program has declined from 1000 to 400 baseball/softball participants.

i can handle a dad giving his son one or two extra opportunities, it's when 'dad' (coach) is giving all his buddies' sons the opportunities, as well, it becomes "what is left for the rest of the team?"
my son is on a wonderful baseball team, coached by a great dad, who keeps excellent stats and plays kids according to ability. however, my son has played on other teams, in other sports where the above goes on.
anyhow, hope for everyone, it all works out in the end.

larrythompson:

I think I have written what I am about to write before but it seems appropriate now and so here I go.

My father, from all I have been told by others, was a very good baseball player. He starred on teams in a very competitive local corporate sponsered team league in Charleston, West Virginia in the 1930's and pre-war 40's called the Twilight League. It was called the Twilight League because they came directly from work and began play baseball at twilight. He loved the game and, at a young age, took me to minor league games where he paitiently talked hitting strategy, base running and defense while we both watched. We would pass ball in the yard after he came home from work and on the weekends find areas where he could pitch to me and I would hit the ball and run after it. However, there was one thing he would never do.

In order to avoid the possible accusation that he would be favoring me as a coach, he never was my official "team coach". Nor would he ever coach any team my brothers played on. We got plenty of individual coaching in the front yard, etc. but never a coach of any team I ever played on. He did umpire, however, and I probably struck out looking with him as an umpire more than any other umpire. But that is another story.

My first "team coach" that I remember was in Little League as a 12 year old. He was a seventeen year old high school junior who had never played baseball. He made me a catcher and I wore glasses. As you might imagine, when I would rip off the catcher's mask to catch a foul pop or on a play at the plate, my glases would go flying. I probably broke 3 or 4 pair in that one year. Finally my dad, who desperately wanted me to get a shot at shortstop, said, "Look son. I know you are supposed to take your mask off to make those plays but we can't afford any more broken glasses so just leave the mask on from here on out". OK Dad.

As a result, I was determined that I would NOT refuse to coach my sons. If there was someone more qualified than me that wanted to coach the team they were on I would prefer that [and that did happen*. But I was not going to refuse to coach and allow my sons go through some of the lousy and incompetent coaches that I went through. Thus, I became familar with "Daddy ball".

Youth League Lessons learned:
1. Talk to your son in advance. Make sure he understands that Dad is dad and coach is not dad. Coach is coach. Tell him he will be treated like everyone else and sometimes maybe as he sees it worse. If that is not a deal between us, I won't coach.
2. Make sure mommy understands what the deal is. If she is not brought into this conversation early on, trouble will be appearing sooner than you think.
3. Talk to the parents of the kids on your team. Put the issue out there at the very beginning. If you think I am not treating your child fairly and am favoring my son, you are free to come talk to me about specifics. Please don't talk about it amongst yourselves without talking to me. It will only create problems. Although coaching kids is not new to me, coaching my son in team sports is. I am human and make mistakes and will listen to good constructive criticism. And if, after talking to me, you are not satisified, i will be more than happy to release your kid from my team and will do everything I can to get him on someone else's team.
4. Pick assistant coaches that will tell you if you are going to far one way or the other and trust them enough to change. "You are being to hard on your own kid. lighten up" "Maybe you ought to give Tommy a chance to play shorstop against this team and give your son some outfield experience"
5. Put it all out of your mind once practice starts and let your good baseball instincts take over.

Enjoy the ride.

TW344

Great post. No , awesome post.