driving back knee - how critical?

The back knee action is a result, not an action you can take.

I don't see your back knee as a problem anyway.

Your main issue is that your swing plane is a chop down. This is why your bat head is lagging behind your hands at the normal contact location, and you are fouling balls off.

Most instructors will tell you to throw your hands at the ball. This is the typical result.

After stride/coil, your bat head is sliding straight down off your shoulders instead of turning toward the catcher.

Keep your hands back longer, and use your back elbow to initially rotate the bat.

Thanks Sultan - i was trying to take the bat from "A" to "C" - doesn't this happen by sliding it from my shoulder. Or are you saying this is incorrect? I'm not sure what you mean by turning it towards the catcher -do you mean dropping the barrell and swing on a slight incline to meet the trajectory of the ball? thank you again. PMM

I was also told i do not stay back long enough - cold this be the root of my problem?

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quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Thanks Sultan - i was trying to take the bat from "A" to "C" - doesn't this happen by sliding it from my shoulder. Or are you saying this is incorrect? I'm not sure what you mean by turning it towards the catcher -do you mean dropping the barrell and swing on a slight incline to meet the trajectory of the ball? thank you again. PMM

I was also told i do not stay back long enough - cold this be the root of my problem?

Good hitters do not swing "A to C". I hate that teaching cue. The root of your issues is your lack of coil and stretch.

I would start by learning to coil. PM me if you're interested.

Thanks - yes I'm intersted.

When I slow the down video....Hands may be a little high, but, after his load, knob of bat is pointed at catcher and bat is not wrapped around head but is at good angle to develop needed whip when swing starts.

Also, the bat head is always slightly behind the hands with the hands inside the ball at contact (i.e., at point when have transferred weight into firm front side at contact). This is seen nicely at 7, 12, 17 and 22 seconds of the video.

I think swing looks pretty good and any issues with consisent contact are about timing and ensuring hands are inside the ball. Also, he is a little heavy on the front side with balance which can also impact timing and consisent contact. Need to get to 50/50 weight balance at the point the load is complete and before the hands start moving forward and not be out on that front foot 60/40 which I see as you mention PMM as something identified to work on.

Agree driving of back knee forward (or what is also called gaining ground) is a result that some do better than others. Nice video link to MLB hitters gaining ground resulting in back foot coming off ground.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCAHx63yUiQ

Nice link!

Thanks very much...so what do you think my off season swing thoughts should be? I try to concentrate on just one focus area at a time - if not it just gets too complex!

Trying to keep my hands back until my front heel drops? This will keep my weight a bit more back i've been told?

Thanks again!

Simple thoughts for off season:
Load
Foot down
Trust hands

Game thought:
"See the ball"

By the time you get to game time, you should have many, many rep's on your simple off season thoughts. You did your work, now in the game just see it!

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Thanks very much...so what do you think my off season swing thoughts should be? I try to concentrate on just one focus area at a time - if not it just gets too complex!

Trying to keep my hands back until my front heel drops? This will keep my weight a bit more back i've been told?

Thanks again!

The swing is underway prior to heel plant.

So Low Finish - you are confirming that i should really try to keep hands back until front heel is planted????

Thanks!

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
So Low Finish - you are confirming that i should really try to keep hands back until front heel is planted????

Thanks!

Get them back by foot plant. Slightly different than what you said.

Keep them near the shoulder until back elbow hits hip.

Hi pmm,

Over the past few years, what kind of results have you gotten in games vs. decent pitching? (not the best pitchers, and not the worst)

Comparing yourself to your peers who hope to play in college--top of the order hitters, all-conference, etc.-- do you hit enough rising line drives? (in games)

That's the true measure of a swing.

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
So Low Finish - you are confirming that i should really try to keep hands back until front heel is planted????

Thanks!

The hands have to stay back, but your lower body has to turn open into plant. Open pelvis and coiled rear hip. You don't keep the hands back- with the hands. You pinch the scapula to keep them back.

You need to turn the barrel, not shove the handle.

Thanks much for all of your input...

Do you think my "stride" is wrong and not allowing me to coil. Someone said my right hip closing in when I stride instead of staying open - and allowing me to coil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wde8wjxAqfg

pmm

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Thanks much for all of your input...

Do you think my "stride" is wrong and not allowing me to coil. Someone said my right hip closing in when I stride instead of staying open - and allowing me to coil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wde8wjxAqfg

pmm

Good! You're starting to make progress. Get into an athletic stance, and just turn the hip around the rear leg. You'll feel the bind. No need to do anything with your front leg.

That's the ultimate control. When you're "on top" of your rear leg, you're automatically going to stay back.

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Thanks much for all of your input...

Do you think my "stride" is wrong and not allowing me to coil. Someone said my right hip closing in when I stride instead of staying open - and allowing me to coil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wde8wjxAqfg

pmm

My view is that your load (negative move) and balance after load looks very good. To me, you have a disconnect between your hand path and hip rotation through impact. That is, your hip rotation drags behind your hand path. At contact, your are not in the classic L-postion with the back leg. Losing power as the back hip is not efficiently translating power to the hands at impact. You get to the classic L-postion with your back leg during the follow through with your hands if you slow the video down.

See proper sequence from this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Oq6CU6sqGA

Thanks 4baseknock...

In your opinion could I just not be waiting long enough with my hands back? Is this mostly about timing? Are my hands starting the swing a bit too early and thus my hips lagging behind????

thanks man

pmm

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Thanks 4baseknock...

In your opinion could I just not be waiting long enough with my hands back? Is this mostly about timing? Are my hands starting the swing a bit too early and thus my hips lagging behind????

thanks man

pmm

So hard to fully tell from the video angle and quality, but perfecting the timing is every hitters area to work on. Overall, I think your swing looks very good. Keep taking reps and working on ensuring your hands and lower body are working in unison through the swing path.

This is a interesting drill to get the correct feel at contact of hands and lower body.

http://www.facebook.com/video/...o.php?v=547084945462

Hey all - thanks for feedback and here is some fresh video.

I am trying to brace against a firmer back leg for more coil. Do you see that?

I'm still out in front - need to let the ball travel I guess. so hard for me - my dad says im too jumppy! As far as getting the front foot down before my hands launch - not sure I'm making progress there.

Thanks for any continued feedback. pmm

http://youtu.be/ibLDVuH1pYg

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
As far as getting the front foot down before my hands launch - not sure I'm making progress there.

Your hands should not move long after that.

Quit pushing. Don't throw your hands at all.

Take some dry swings with two bats.

PMM......looks very good. Front side is very firm and on most of the swings your back hip and hand path are working in unison with nice L-shape on the back leg at contact if you slow the video down.

Good drill for "getting feel" of front foot down (and rest of body in correct position) is to set-up already in the loaded position with your hands/bat back in the correct position (creating coil) and your stance as wide as you would be after completing your load/step with 50/50 weight on both legs. Now you just initiate your swing with your hands/back hip. You can do this with a T or live pitching.

quote:

Originally posted by pmm:
Hey all - thanks for feedback and here is some fresh video.

I am trying to brace against a firmer back leg for more coil. Do you see that?

I'm still out in front - need to let the ball travel I guess. so hard for me - my dad says im too jumppy! As far as getting the front foot down before my hands launch - not sure I'm making progress there.

Thanks for any continued feedback. pmm

http://youtu.be/ibLDVuH1pYg

I'm going to PM you some videos, because that's the easiest way to show you this kind of thing.

Right now, you need to sell out to the coil and allow the hands to move the bat, not the arms. That's a big change, but it can mean an additional 30-40 feet right off of the bat.

You have to understand that the hips resist rotation. They are trying NOT to turn.

The rear leg drive (or knee as you have been told) is what turns the hips and NOT the hips.

The first thing to learn is that the hips do not rotate the hips.

When the hips rotate the hips it pulls the rear leg along which removes any chance for there to be a "driving back knee"

How critical are you asking? As critical as the heart is to living is how critical the driving back knee is to hitting and adjustability.

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuilder:
You have to understand that the hips resist rotation. They are trying NOT to turn.

The rear leg drive (or knee as you have been told) is what turns the hips and NOT the hips.

The first thing to learn is that the hips do not rotate the hips.

When the hips rotate the hips it pulls the rear leg along which removes any chance for there to be a "driving back knee"

How critical are you asking? As critical as the heart is to living is how critical the driving back knee is to hitting and adjustability.

PMM, you'd do well to read and understand this. However, it's not JUST the hips, IMO. The pelvis is resisting as well. There's a bind in the hip socket. It keeps getting tighter.

The above isn't a great video for showing it, but notice how Posey's torso is pulling back causing his leg to turn the pelvis open.

Please explain the difference between the hips and the pelvis.

The hips are the pelvic bone yes/ no?

There is no bind in the hip socket either. Espeically if it keeps getting tighter. lol

Really?

A bound joint, range of motion reached, can not get tighter?

It most certainly does if other muscles are added to the tightening process.

Duh.

quote:

The pelvis is resisting

Ed Sullivan tried this.

quote:

Originally posted by swingbuilder:
Please explain the difference between the hips and the pelvis.

The hips are the pelvic bone yes/ no?

There is no bind in the hip socket either. Espeically if it keeps getting tighter. lol

The hip is the femur and the acetabulofemoral joint. The pelvis is a compound structure consisting of three bones.

You have to understand that the hips resist rotation. They are trying NOT to turn.

The rear leg drive (or knee as you have been told) is what turns the hips and NOT the hips.

The first thing to learn is that the hips do not rotate the hips.

When the hips rotate the hips it pulls the rear leg along which removes any chance for there to be a "driving back knee"

How critical are you asking? As critical as the heart is to living is how critical the driving back knee is to hitting and adjustability.



OR


The back knee action is a result, not an action you can take.