Expectations

Good topic TPM.

Son is sophomore at local D2.

My son had aspirations of D1, played hard all through high school – his team were the state champs his senior year. He was approached by several D1’s during the recruiting process. Had a couple opportunities presented to him at some very good mid-major D1 programs.

He had been presented the local D2 opportunity from his sophomore year forward in high school. Coaches liked him and kept in touch, but no pressure (he played at their field in tournaments regularly.) They said explore your options and then come back and we’ll talk. Part of the draw like anyone would like was to get the opportunity to play and compete as soon as he got there.

He was a great student in high school – worked very hard to get the highest grades, but noticed that the SAT/ACT scores were not as high as what one would expect with the high grades. He was 50 or so out of a class of 700. He thought about several schools and talked about how local D2 being a smaller school with 6,000 students may be better for him academically.

We have known kids that go to bigger schools and struggle, and we know kids that do very well at big schools, they have the natural gift of learning without much teacher interaction. 17 was the type who needed to be in an environment where he could interact regularly with the teacher and those around him, and the D2 is well known for its smaller class settings. That has become very important to him over the last year and a half.

His decision then became very clear and he has excelled academically in college (still has to work very hard and study a lot.) We shall see how the baseball ends up but he is very happy and committed to progressing. He is still equally excited about both academics and baseball, so his choice has matched his expectations.

I shared the link to this video before on here, but in regards to this topic I think it is good to look back and see the vision he had as a HS senior is still the vision he has now. He would probably say all the same things right now if asked.

Athlete of the week

Nice video Backstop, very nice. Nice young man! Hearing mention of 'Town and Country,' did your son play in the Bronco WS when he was 11/12? If so, good chance I saw him play.

Good topic TPM. I need to think a little more before responding.

I think that you brought up something important, class size consideration.
Son went to a large HS but in an excelerated program (could grad early) with no more than 30 per class. He was very overwhelmed by the 40K+ D1 when we went to visit, the academic advisor told us some lecture classes had as many as the amount of kids in son's school.
One of his considerations was smaller class size at CU.
Another thing you brought up was SAT/ACT scores. My son's scores also didn't match his grades (though not bad), partly because it was taken with half an effort at the time and not ONE coach cared. Since most of the better academic programs base their class difficulty on such scores, he might have struggled a bit more than he did at first. Like many other players, he opted out for an easier course of study and I think he is sorry he did.

quote:

Originally posted by justbaseball:
Hearing mention of 'Town and Country,' did your son play in the Bronco WS when he was 11/12? If so, good chance I saw him play.

No, he was on an AAU Travel Team during his bronco years and did not play those years at Town and Country. He did go back and play 13/14 Pony and did play on the Colt World Series team from Tampa.

Horizons change as does ones reality with time. Those of us that look at the game from the prospective of our sons experiences in the past are clearly different. We have the luxury of "been there, done that."

It is easy now to say what our expectations were and how they were or were not met. It really doesn't change the anxiety of a parent whose son is looking ahead and hoping/expecting great things from baseball.

My son's baseball experience is all but done; but that has changed how I look at this forum. We (myself and a good number those that have been down the road) continue to provide guidance, tell stories of our kids experience and wish those that follow success that we may or may not have found for our sons.

Expectations are intertwined with hopes and dreams. I consider it my personal mission to help those that can benefit. At the same time; it is human nature to limit ones perspective to what they have experienced and are willing to see. Some will benefit; some don't have a chance but we continue to do it because we love the kids that play the game that for many of us define our childrens fondest memories.

And our fondest memories as well!

Nice post ILVBB. How far did your journey with your son go? We are at a crucial juncture as my son completes his Junior year at College.

FloridaFan - you have a PM.

quote:

Horizons change as does ones reality with time. Those of us that look at the game from the prospective of our sons experiences in the past are clearly different. We have the luxury of "been there, done that."

It is easy now to say what our expectations were and how they were or were not met. It really doesn't change the anxiety of a parent whose son is looking ahead and hoping/expecting great things from baseball.


My son's baseball experience is all but done; but that has changed how I look at this forum. We (myself and a good number those that have been down the road) continue to provide guidance, tell stories of our kids experience and wish those that follow success that we may or may not have found for our sons.

Expectations are intertwined with hopes and dreams. I consider it my personal mission to help those that can benefit. At the same time; it is human nature to limit ones perspective to what they have experienced and are willing to see. Some will benefit; some don't have a chance but we continue to do it because we love the kids that play the game that for many of us define our childrens fondest memories.
Posts: 467 | Location: Northern Calif | Registered: February 27, 2006

NICE POST

ILVBB - Back at ya...

quote:

Reading over some of the topics lately, I keep thinking about what expectations parents and players have of the recruiting as well as the college baseball experience. Draft? Done Different?

My son is a freshmen pitcher at a mid to lower D1 program. His goal and expectation was that it was going to be fairly easy to find a D1 baseball program with top academics. Nothing could have been further from the truth from our experience. It was a vastly different experience than what we expected, and the journey took us off course a few times. After a few months of frustration and mistakes, we circled back to the original goals and that is when things started happening in spades.

Program prominence vs playing time expectation. We discussed this alot between my son and wife. Question: Go to a very successful D1 program (and sit the bench for 1-2 years) or go to a rebuilding program with the opportunity of getting freshmen playing time? This is a huge decision, and one that should be discussed in depth by players and parents IMHO. We opted for the opportunity at freshmen playing time for many reasons.

My expectation was for him to play baseball at a top D3 and study engineering. I didn't think he would be able to enjoy his college experience playing D1 baseball and engineering. As it turns out, we were able to find a situation that fit perfectly for him that is kind of a hybrid between D1 and D3. I'm very glad his expectations were different from mine.

My son is really enjoying his college baseball experience. He performed very well this Fall and caught the coaches eye with his progress and results. He is hoping to be a starter at the back of the rotation this Spring as a freshmen. The baseball and engineering studies has made it difficult but so far he is getting it done on both ends. He really likes and respects his coaches and spends a lot of time with his teammates when he has some social time. The strength and conditioning workouts have been brutal, but he tells us that it is really helping him step up his game.

He really surprised us when he told us he wants to get an engineering internship this summer instead of playing summer league baseball. We'll see how that develops.

We have no expectations of him getting drafted. I don't think he does either, but he has talked about getting masters and other advanced degrees. He loves baseball, but he has other focused interests once he leaves the field or work out area.

This has been such a wild and unpredictable ride that I'm beginning to think setting expectations is a bad thing. You always have to set goals, but setting expectations can back fire. I played college tennis many, many years ago. I know how delicate the academic/athletic balance can be. I had it in my head that D1 baseball was going to be too much of a commitment based upon my sons major. Thankfully, my son is stubborn and he had other ideas.

Its encouraging to know that not everyone wants to be drafted!

The topic of playing time expectations could be a topic all to itself. Our son made his decision knowing that he might not get a lot of playing time his first year. But this school was where he wanted to be based on every other factor. He went into it knowing that he would have to pay some dues. Did he ever second guess his school choice? Never, to my knowledge. But there was a time in the middle of that first year when he wondered whether he should have redshirted.

What I am about to say is not a comment on anyone else's situation, because everyone's situation is different. EVERYONE wants to play as much as possible, as soon as possible. I get that. And I don't fault anyone for that.

But my question is has the idea of paying your dues gone by the wayside? Have kids/parents gotten so caught up in the "need" to play early that they are making less than optimal choices from the educational stanpoint? Aren't there benefits of paying your dues as well?

Maybe I'm just showing my age. I can remember when freshmen weren't ALLOWED to play in some sports. And college baseball is definitely different from other sports because of partial scholarships, the draft, the transfer rule, etc. All of that makes the decision a lot harder.

But sometimes I wonder.

quote:

But my question is has the idea of paying your dues gone by the wayside? Have kids/parents gotten so caught up in the "need" to play early that they are making less than optimal choices from the educational stanpoint? Aren't there benefits of paying your dues as well?

My son decided to go to the D3 rather than the D1 primarily for the education. The secondary benefit was that he had a higher probability of playing earlier. His choice put education before baseball.

As to paying your dues; everyone pays their dues sometime. Some pay their dues before they get to college (extra work, etc.). The better programs spend as much time building a team; where everyone works towards a goal. It is not a matter of paying dues the coach putting a team on the field that he thinks will win.

Some players have always played a lot. I know my son got more playing time from little league to where he is now. He has virtually played every inning available, on each travel team he participated on as well as his high school teams and his showcase teams through his college experience so far including Collegiate Summer Ball.

About the only time he did not play was on a Junior Olympic Team when he was added as a player to light a fire under the long time player who could be lazy.

Players that have always played, expect to play. And as ILVBB inferred, many have paid their dues over the years by putting in the countless hours of work, day in and day out.

I am sure that my son is not alone; he is not that unique...if he were he would be playing professionally by now.

But, he works his b u t t off to be the best player he can be to put his team in a position to win games. The result of that dedication has been, so far, that coaches want him on the field each and every inning.

We would never have considered a program where he would be sitting, waiting his turn. But baseball is what he does. He attends school so he can play baseball. The players that go to school for an education first and wish to continue to enjoy the game of baseball as an integral, but not primary part of their collegiate experience are more prepared to wait their turn.

Actually, I know that these players are the best prepared for what life throws their way.

Players who live and breathe the game and throw themselves recklessly into the mix expecting glory and grandeur are often left wanting more.

quote:

But my question is has the idea of paying your dues gone by the wayside? Have kids/parents gotten so caught up in the "need" to play early that they are making less than optimal choices from the educational stanpoint? Aren't there benefits of paying your dues as well?

MTH - There is no question that for some players it is better to pay your dues, learn, and then win a starting position. If I'm not mistaken, most elite D1s are set up that way by design. Most of these teams that are making the CWS seem to have a very structured method with upper classmen starting and under classmen developing and learning from them. I would think being a part of a CWS program is very fulfilling, and rewarding. There is a lot of visability and recognition as well. This can be turned into a risk vs reward discussion.

I totally agree with you that everyone's situation is different and "their reasons are their reasons". Your question is a good one, and I assume folks are doing what they think is best for the long term prospects of their son. Some people will become professional baseball players and some will become Drs, Lawyers & engineers just as the NCAA commercial states. It is a really tough choice to make as there is always some level of uncertainty with any program. The playing time issue alone is probably the single most overlooked issue IMHO when "everyday player" prospects are being recruited, because many of them have rarely sat the bench before. Conceptually they understand that they may be sitting the bench paying their dues, but it is a different matter when they actually have to do it. Perhaps pitchers have it easier because they are used to watching from the dugout or bullpen.