Thought this was a good one....
http://www.prepbaseballreport....d-Twitter-9725018436
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This is exactly what I have been saying for the past two years. This simple decision to allow early LOIs would halt the practice of early recruitment and at least balance the scale between the player and the school.
Spot on! Especially the dig at decommits. It always gets me when I see the "after considerable thought and prayer" line that inevitably precedes a kid pulling his commitment. It's as if the kid is trying to say, Hey, Coach, you can't think bad of me. I mean, God told me to do it." As if God spoke in his ear and said, "Dude, you shouldn't go to Mississippi State. I mean, have you seen StarkVegas?"
Fun read. I just read one of those about a local player who decommitted to Coastal Carolina.
Speaking of that fine institution, my son's now ex-GF (following 3-4 almost break ups and the drama), basically was told last year (after verbally committing her sophomore year) that they miscalculated the scholarship pool and were cutting her award in half. I think that is a highly questionable mistake but she decommitted and she is still having difficulty finding her academic/softball home for 2017 (and she was all-met).
Anyhow, this makes me wonder, are there any true repercussions for a school pulling that sort of bait-and-switch?
Batty67 posted:Fun read. I just read one of those about a local player who decommitted to Coastal Carolina.
Speaking of that fine institution, my son's now ex-GF (following 3-4 almost break ups and the drama), basically was told last year (after verbally committing her sophomore year) that they miscalculated the scholarship pool and were cutting her award in half. I think that is a highly questionable mistake but she decommitted and she is still having difficulty finding her academic/softball home for 2017 (and she was all-met).
Anyhow, this makes me wonder, are there any true repercussions for a school pulling that sort of bait-and-switch?
Not really. Up until a NLOI is signed, any verbal agreement is on the honor system. Having said that, it'd be fun if some athlete like that had the stones to sue based on contract law. However, it would be difficult to get around the Statute of Frauds most states have codified which basically requires any contract that cannot be fulfilled within one year to be put in writing.
Having thought it over for a couple of minutes, though, I believe an athlete could plead equitable estoppel. An athlete in this position has performed in reliance on the agreement by taking themselves off the market at a considerable expense to themselves. So, as long as the athlete attempted unsuccessfully to find a replacement for their services I would think he could argue that he had suffered irreparable harm. Hmmmm.
I like the suggestion that the NCAA require an LOI within a short period of time. Nuke also mentioned it in another thread. Anyone know if this is getting any traction with the NCAA ?
Hilarious take by Duncan. A real situation, I know of several parents where their player has committed early and now they're having anxiety attacks due to the number of recruits the school has taken at the same position.
roothog66 posted:" As if God spoke in his ear and said, "Dude, you shouldn't go to Mississippi State. I mean, have you seen StarkVegas?"
I resent that!!!! Lol. Hail State!
RedFishFool posted:roothog66 posted:" As if God spoke in his ear and said, "Dude, you shouldn't go to Mississippi State. I mean, have you seen StarkVegas?"I resent that!!!! Lol. Hail State!
That one was just for you.
Anyone plugged into the football recruiting community? I have heard that football is even worse about early recruiting than baseball, is that community in the same boat, calling for reform on the early commitments?
pabaseballdad posted:I like the suggestion that the NCAA require an LOI within a short period of time. Nuke also mentioned it in another thread. Anyone know if this is getting any traction with the NCAA ?
Not a chance.
The NCAA is virtually nothing about the student athlete. They represent and are run by the universities, who employ the football, basketball...baseball coaches at great expense. They will never, ever enact something that levels the playing field like this unless there is an uprising of parents and players...and that too, will never happen.
Parents/players go through this once. They/we are so eager to have our sons and daughters get that offer, make that commitment, tell our family and friends, announce it in the newspaper or on a recruiting website...that there will never be enough of us in that 'commitment phase' that can see the realities of the situation and demand changes.
And its not going to happen out of the goodness of the NCAA's hearts.
CaCO3Girl posted:Anyone plugged into the football recruiting community? I have heard that football is even worse about early recruiting than baseball, is that community in the same boat, calling for reform on the early commitments?
Define "worse?" Football coaches actively recruit players already committed to another university. Recruiting sites reporting on virtually every D1 college commonly talk about 'flipping recruits' near the signing day. Coaches even brag about 'flipping Johnny' on signing day when they get one of those. Seems no one is off the board until the LOI is signed.
I think, because of even more dependency on physical development for football, that the 8th grade/freshman commit thing is less common in football, although there are some well publicized exceptions to that such as the recent article posted on this message board about the Jr. HS USC commit from 5 or 6 years ago.
CaCO3Girl posted:Anyone plugged into the football recruiting community? I have heard that football is even worse about early recruiting than baseball, is that community in the same boat, calling for reform on the early commitments?
My kids aren't involved in football but we know a kid who is very good. He is either a reclassified 8th grader (in private school now) or a freshman and he has received numerous offers from big programs (UNC, UMD, Penn State, etc.) and has been getting them the past year or so.
Lacrosse is another sport that gets kids to commit in middle school.
Whether those sports are calling for reform or not, I have no idea.
justbaseball posted:CaCO3Girl posted:Anyone plugged into the football recruiting community? I have heard that football is even worse about early recruiting than baseball, is that community in the same boat, calling for reform on the early commitments?
Define "worse?" Football coaches actively recruit players already committed to another university. Recruiting sites reporting on virtually every D1 college commonly talk about 'flipping recruits' near the signing day. Coaches even brag about 'flipping Johnny' on signing day when they get one of those. Seems no one is off the board until the LOI is signed.
I think, because of even more dependency on physical development for football, that the 8th grade/freshman commit thing is less common in football, although there are some well publicized exceptions to that such as the recent article posted on this message board about the Jr. HS USC commit from 5 or 6 years ago.
Worse, as in, why are their recruiters stalking the 9th grade football practice? 8th graders committing is still not common but not UNcommon in football land.
If coaches are still recruiting football players up to LOI signing day then what's the point of committing?
CaCO3Girl posted:If coaches are still recruiting football players up to LOI signing day then what's the point of committing?
Primarily because parents and players a) fearing no better will come along, wanna secure an offer in hand, b) wanna brag to friends and family, c) know how the game is played and in turn, 'play the game.'
Also, it is not unusual for a big program to drop 'commits' when performance wanes or they need to make room for a bigger commit. Happens many times, every year.
The kid loses the moral argument and is judged/stoned by the mob despite his reasoning and the college isnt held to any standard when the commit is broken on their end. I understand the excitement on social media to share the verbal, its a new time and these kids live by the minute, but i don't quite get the tweets regarding offers without commitments.
This article was in our local paper this AM. This is the #1 high school basketball recruit in the country and how she handled "her business". I don't know her, but I'm a big fan wherever she goes. She has a number of quotes in the article that are priceless for anybody going through recruiting at any level.
justbaseball posted:pabaseballdad posted:I like the suggestion that the NCAA require an LOI within a short period of time. Nuke also mentioned it in another thread. Anyone know if this is getting any traction with the NCAA ?
Not a chance.
The NCAA is virtually nothing about the student athlete. They represent and are run by the universities, who employ the football, basketball...baseball coaches at great expense. They will never, ever enact something that levels the playing field like this unless there is an uprising of parents and players...and that too, will never happen.
Parents/players go through this once. They/we are so eager to have our sons and daughters get that offer, make that commitment, tell our family and friends, announce it in the newspaper or on a recruiting website...that there will never be enough of us in that 'commitment phase' that can see the realities of the situation and demand changes.
And its not going to happen out of the goodness of the NCAA's hearts.
If the NCAA was fair and balanced coaches who get programs put on probation wouldn't be allowed to run away to a new, better situation. They would be stuck where they are or have to sit out coaching until the probation expires.
fenwaysouth posted:This article was in our local paper this AM. This is the #1 high school basketball recruit in the country and how she handled "her business". I don't know her, but I'm a big fan wherever she goes. She has a number of quotes in the article that are priceless for anybody going through recruiting at any level.
This is great perspective for a kid being told for years she's the best ..
Still, the most important piece of advice Megan Walker has for other high school athletes in similar situations is this: “Don’t let anyone rush you, because you’re the one who has to be there for four years. You need to figure out how that school will benefit you when you’re done. I don’t really know what I want to do after college, I just know I want to go to a school with good academics in case basketball doesn’t work out.”
She's not taking the bait. She understands college ball is nothing more than "next man up" if a player doesn't pan out.
My best friends son recently committed as a Senior for D1 football...was recruited by several schools but not hounded until he "committed" then everyone came calling...my limited experience , baseball coaches respect the commitment at least a little more than football.
bigcubbiefan posted:My best friends son recently committed as a Senior for D1 football...was recruited by several schools but not hounded until he "committed" then everyone came calling...my limited experience , baseball coaches respect the commitment at least a little more than football.
I agree, but this too is changing.
A few coaches are now being paid over $1M. The stakes are higher than ever, especially with things like conference realignment still on the table. A table that is now spreading wider than just football and basketball success.
I already know of a case or two where 'committed' baseball players continued to be pursued and you might even be surprised by who. This practice will only grow. You can count on it.
My son was a late bloomer but had a great summer season. He's 6'6" 225 rhp throws low 90s, made area code this year. He had offers from a number of schools and went on several official visits. He committed to a Big 10 school and notified all the other schools of his decision.
Since committing last week, he has had two schools that have called him and tried to make sure he is happy with his decision. He is, and told them so. I'll be happy when it becomes official. They mentioned that if he still has an official visit left, they would love to show him around to compare facilities.
I'm glad he's done with all this nonsense.
justbaseball posted:bigcubbiefan posted:My best friends son recently committed as a Senior for D1 football...was recruited by several schools but not hounded until he "committed" then everyone came calling...my limited experience , baseball coaches respect the commitment at least a little more than football.
I agree, but this too is changing.
A few coaches are now being paid over $1M. The stakes are higher than ever, especially with things like conference realignment still on the table. A table that is now spreading wider than just football and basketball success.
I already know of a case or two where 'committed' baseball players continued to be pursued and you might even be surprised by who. This practice will only grow. You can count on it.
By the time the conference realignment dust settles there could be four conferences with two eight team divisions. The revenue for football will be huge. Athletic departments could have more money. College baseball is growing. It could become big. Already $15-20M college baseball stadiums are becoming the norm for recruiting.
Looks like football may be moving to an earlier signing window: http://footballscoop.com/news/...ding-10th-assistant/
2019Dad posted:Looks like football may be moving to an earlier signing window: http://footballscoop.com/news/...ding-10th-assistant/
What is a 72 hour period in June and December going to get them? I don't get it.
CaCO3Girl posted:2019Dad posted:Looks like football may be moving to an earlier signing window: http://footballscoop.com/news/...ding-10th-assistant/
What is a 72 hour period in June and December going to get them? I don't get it.
Well, June after junior year would be significantly earlier signing then current practice wrt to football, which is early February of senior year. Not exactly allowing early binding commitments/NLIs at any time, but it is much earlier than current practice.
I agree that December vs. February of senior year is no big difference.
2019Dad posted:CaCO3Girl posted:2019Dad posted:Looks like football may be moving to an earlier signing window: http://footballscoop.com/news/...ding-10th-assistant/
What is a 72 hour period in June and December going to get them? I don't get it.
Well, June after junior year would be significantly earlier signing then current practice wrt to football, which is early February of senior year. Not exactly allowing early binding commitments/NLIs at any time, but it is much earlier than current practice.
I agree that December vs. February of senior year is no big difference.
Call me cynical, but I think Dec benefits the schools, not the students. There are actually a decent number of mid-year JuCo transfers in football. A kid plays 2 seasons of JuCo football, graduates (insert jokes here), and is on a D1 campus for spring workouts. Midyear JuCo transfers sign in Dec. Schools probably want another chance to sign high school kids at that time before committing to the JuCo kids. Or they can use the threat of signing a JuCo transfer to nudge the high school kid.
MidAtlanticDad posted:Call me cynical, but I think Dec benefits the schools, not the students. There are actually a decent number of mid-year JuCo transfers in football. A kid plays 2 seasons of JuCo football, graduates (insert jokes here), and is on a D1 campus for spring workouts. Midyear JuCo transfers sign in Dec. Schools probably want another chance to sign high school kids at that time before committing to the JuCo kids. Or they can use the threat of signing a JuCo transfer to nudge the high school kid.
Cynical perhaps, but you are also correct IMO.
2019Dad posted:Looks like football may be moving to an earlier signing window: http://footballscoop.com/news/...ding-10th-assistant/
Saw a discussion of this on ESPNU. Hardly a passed initiative. Lots of amendments already proposed including an 'escape clause' if coach is fired, for example.
They had comments from a few unnamed coaches. SEC coach thought it would force college coaches to be more thoughtful about giving offers (good IMO). Big10 coach thought it was a big mistake - he needs more time to evaluate during senior year. Pac12 coach called it a "game-changer."
Based on the discussion, I think a lot will have to be ironed out before its passed. Might take a while.
I also wondered how it affects, for example, Stanford. Sign an LOI without being admitted yet? Maybe they've already started doing that - but they hadn't when our son was involved (2003), nor would I have let him without the admission confirmation.