Ex minor leaguer discusses his journey

Remember how it was on a hot summer day when you were too impatient to wait for the water to cool down and you got a mouthful of HOT water?

I was never THAT thirsty nor impatient. 

That first taste also often had bits of grass in it and a nice hot plastic hose taste. Now I won't drink water unless it comes out of a factory sealed bottle!

Funny thing about garden hoses, especially old ones, is that they can leach asbestos into the water.  And brass fittings add lead to the mix.  So while I drank out of the hose back in the day, my kids don't. Sometimes overprotective modern helicopter parents get it right!

Give me a number.  What is "it might only be enough for a single meal?"  Club supplied food and drink.  Sure I can see the "best" food being taken up quickly but I doubt anyone is starving unless by choice. 

 

I wonder what the Dominican players think of the life style?   

 

 

I'm here, reading every word. I've been amazed at the passion and clarity in people's reactions to the interview.  One thing is clear: we all sure love and defend this game, regardless how we feel about the interviewee's comments.

 

My original interest in the article was the kid's college experience, and his window into Minor league teammates. The bus ride/food/living accommodations stuff I had heard before.

 

Thought if he knew Spanish, he would have had more fun with his Hispanic teammates.  Maybe he does know it; he didn't say, but he pointed out the language issues.  He should have watched the movie "Sugar." Might have helped prep him for the minors experience from a Latino's perspective. If you haven't seen it, and you love baseball, you should track it down.

 

I didn't pay much attention to the city bashing; I thought it was ill advised but I think he's still a kid.  Frontal lobe development may still be going on with him. People say things without thinking all the time.  Just go to a little league game for five minutes and listen to the whack parents around you.

 

Thanks, everyone, for sharing here. I continue to learn.

 $15 per day on the road (-0- when not on the road).  For an athlete burning a lot of calories, $15 barely buys a meal big enough for them.  Cheap fast food is often chosen to make stretch or of course if you have enough of your own cash to make up the difference, then no problem.  For those who got decent bonus checks, it's NOT a problem.  When they are at their home field, they get things like pizza or subway type of sandwich. They don't "starve" but they don't get what they want if they don't have the financial resources.

 

For the Dominicans, they don't get what they're used to getting either, be it food or drugs.  Because they have developed a unique pallet, some of them will find a way to cook their own type of food and share it among themselves where the American players tend to not be very interested in it.  So, it's a big adjustment for them too, only in a different way.  For the most part, it seems the Dominicans feel better about the conditions and facilities than the Americans.   

Over the years I have come to know quite a few players.  A few that played a handful of games in the big show but most that never made it passed MiLB.  Obviously it's not the dream a 12yr old boy has in his mind but it is pretty darn close.  Sure it's a grind and becomes VERY obvious pretty darn quick what a players role is in an organization. 
Good friend drafted out of High School loved the experience and was out with injury by 22.  His biggest disappointment was not taking full advantage of the opportunity.  From 18-22 it was just a big party that included playing some baseball between partying.  The same thing he would have done in college or if he just started working out of High School. 

Looking back he wishes he would have put in the work to get better and grow as a player.  His problem was he never had to work to stand out on the field prior.  He just showed up and out played everyone else. 

I have read the article over a few times, and for the life of me, I can't figure out what the problem is. Maybe not saying real nice stuff about the towns he played in but like someone pointed out, there are plenty of college towns that might fit that description. I remember when son visited Stetson, the main street in town was a few blocks long, wasn't going to happen for him, but neither was it going to happen in Miami or in Gainesville. A small quaint town in SC called Clemson, fit the bill, others have turned it town stating its too boring and too far from a major city. Good example that everyone has different perceptions.  And one thing to ALWAYS keep in mind, that not all milb teams are equal. Before you sign, know exactly where you will be headed in the next 3-5 years. I have known some folks who didn't even know where the next level would be for their player. That may or may not be important, but do your homework.

 

As I stated, everyone's perception is not the same, everyone's tolerance for certain situations is not the same. FWIW, I have known many free agent players who have left the game even before their second season. Once again, it is very different for a drafted player than a free agent. So I get why he says the things he has stated, and I have to wonder also how much may have been taken out of context.

 

This article is a good example of really thinking about when that scout calls you up and tells you that he got you a plane ticket (not much else), all you have to do is pack your bags.  And of course, he says,  you do have the opportunity to play pro ball and one day maybe as a ML player. Whatever it be, more than likely it will not meet your expectations while in single A at 23-24  years old.

 

The per diem is 25.00 for all levels of milb. BTW, the ML per diem is 100 and that  includes clubhouse dues to the other team. Some say that is not enough for meals, especially when you find yourself in big cities. For the rookie player, they do budget. Everything is relative, so they say.

So the bottom line is that 25.00 per  day is not enough for a really decent meal, after clubhouse dues are paid. 

Now what one could do is go buy some rice and chicken and prepare your meal in your room and skip eating out, like the latins do, but reality is that most of our kids really would never do that. I know that before every road trip son went to store and shopped for staples needed for the road, kind of a habit from when in college (see college does prepare you for pro ball).  My kid was obviously lucky, he usually got, while at home 2 meals at the clubhouse. If his dues were $11 per day, he told us there is no way he could eat for that daily so he was happy. And he ate well, once he moved to AA or AAA meals were donated to the club, and in turn they get free advertising on billboards and on the scoreboard. So for local business it is a win win situation. This is how milb and businesses work together, if this isn't happening then someone isn't planning for ML and the small towns to work together. I tip my hat to the Cardinals organization, they treat their future ball players very well, its part of the cardinal way I suppose, and a very classy organization in how they feed and house their players.  

 

The thing to remember is that no one ever said it was going to be easy.  Are you going to have fun, yes, on most days, on other days maybe not. Its a job, and you will get back what you put into it. If you are good and dont get injured, you will move quickly.

 

As far as being 'shitty", does it count when you are sitting in the bull pen and your home team fans are yelling at you how badly you suck?  If you think this doesn't happen, get a hold of one of Dirk Hayhursts books he has written, pretty funny stuff but really very true. We used to post his articles here on the hsbbweb. What a hoot and I know my player could definitely relate to his stories.

 

One more thing, pretty funny. On one of the AA teams son played for, they had an older DR LHP on the team. He was there to help the young latins, but he also was the repairman when the bus broke down just an hour away from home. Yup, it happens buses break down!  I am sure that it is not just a milb thing either.

 

And FWIW, that player and my son are very close friends as son is with other latin players. You really have to learn to accept the fact that they are a part of the team you are on, and in some cases just if not more talented than you . And yes, they will do anything not to be released and sent back home. He got that 100% correct.

 

Just so you know, my info is from what son has told us and what I have seen while visiting. Never once while in 7 years in pro ball have we heard complaints (other than injury).

I will tell you one thing though, as you move up the ladder, yo do get paid more, but it doesn't get any easier, and even being on a ML roster you might have to fight for what you feel you deserve. I wont get into details, but if you ask many ML guys if all is good when they get there they might have some interesting stories to tell!

A friend played for the last three weeks in MLB a few years back to fill in for an injured player.  He had a great showing.  Very productive at the plate, made the ESPN play of the week in the OF...  Left that season on cloud nine sure he would be picked up fulltime next season.  He got release at spring training.  It was cool to hear how the high dollar players (most but not all) took care of the guys while traveling. 

He was on a ML roster and did well and they designated and released him in spring? It usually doesnt work that way, the player is DFA and has to pass waivers, if not  than placed on the AAA team. Unless he stunk it up, usually isnt a release situation unless the player asks for one. Good players are usually kept around.

I must be missing something.

We're lucky the Internet didn't exist in baseball's early days, and through at least the 1960's, or it would've died on the vine. True or not, Greg Zebrack is a whiner.

 

1964 Bob Gibson St. Louis Cardinals Contract

Starting Bid - $300, Sold For - $4,113

I prefer tap water.  Unless your house has a well, tap water from a city system has been treated and has to pass certain quality tests.  Water sealed in a bottle does not.  Think about that the next time you buy "bottled" water.

The biggest entitlement and whining on this thread I have seen are those that are attacking the ball player. Those attitudes are the reason changes are slow to come if they come at all because as indicated on this thread, many think they should be happy to get a dime, get any food or water or an airmatress to sleep in on the close floor.  Spoiled kids for asking for more than that.

 

That doesn't even make sense.  The fact of the matter is, the players deserve better.  I don't think anyone is denying that FACT!  Although much of what the young man has stated is factual, he doesn't seem very tactful, and seems like a spoiled, coddled, ingrate.  Don't blame me or any others for the way we interpret what we read.  He is the one who chose to crassly express his opinion of cities that supported him and afforded him an opportunity.  That's on him.  As intelligent as this man must be, he made a mistake in judgement, and I will venture to guess this wasn't his first interview.  Playing for a large University, and obviously being a good/great HS player, he has to have experience with the media. 

 

I don't even feel that the guy is a bad guy, because I like the fact that he was open and honest about the situation.  However, I feel that at times his approach will/probably turned some off, and that isn't positive for the cause.

 

JMO

       
       
Ryno I have no problem standing up and saying the players don't 'deserve' better.  No more than any other person working an entry level job deserves better.  Do I wish the world was perfect and we all were rich?  Sure I am not a mean spirited guy.  But its just not reality.  There will always be low paying jobs.  Very low paying jobs.  And if you take one (because of the dream opportunity) knowing full well what the pay is then just do the best you can and choose your attitude.  If they are successful in their endevour to make more money then good for them.  I don't begrudge them anything.  But if they aren't successful that doesn't mean they are getting screwed either.

I haven’t gone to the trouble of researching every poster, but my general take (and I could be wrong) is that for the most part posters with sons who have been in MiLB or have intimate first-hand knowledge of the experience don’t have a big problem with the pay or conditions. I have two sons who are in their second season and currently playing in Low A. We discussed these very topics recently and while it’s not the ideal situation, they don’t have any strong complaints about it either.

 

As far as the transition from college to the minors, their junior year they attended a ranked school in one of the Power 5 conferences where the living quarters, food, stadium, and everything else about the program was top-notch. They went from that to one of them sharing a room in a roadside motel that was bug-infested and cost him $7 per day. There’s probably very few of us that would have voluntarily stayed in that room given the opportunity. This year they both found a host family and that experience has been very good.

 

As far as the interviewee’s comments about the towns, they were honest but immature. Most if not all of us have years of experience and the wisdom to not have worded it the way he did. Some of the towns my sons have stayed or played in are small and very depressed economically. But I am amazed at how many people show up every night for games, probably because there is not much else to do. Most of the fans support the team very strongly but there can also be a vocal few who rag on their own players or coaches. As I see it, it’s not any different than other MLB franchises (think Philly right now).

 

Professional baseball is not for everybody. That is why some choose to voluntarily retire after a season or two. I liken it to my own experience in my early 20’s. I have always loved music, played the drums, and thought I wanted to be a professional musician. After making a living at it for two years, I realized that it wasn’t the lifestyle for me no matter what level of success I achieved and got a “real job” as my Mom put it.

 

Overall I think the experience is good for my sons. They are learning to fend for themselves, live on a small budget, and make the best of what they’ve got - life lessons everyone could use.

 

 

I just don't get why the focus is on the players, other than the fact that  30 billionaires spend lots of money to influence public opinion.

This issue is not about the players. They are not the villains. They are the pawns!

This economic issue is is about MLB now being a 9 billion dollar business (probably more) and 30 owners and MLB who are colluding to drive down Milb pay and suppress Milb player movement, to control the pay and also to control any and all playing opportunities in the same way they did 60 years ago.  The economics have changed so much over 60 years for the owners but they want to apply 1960 economics and laws to arguably unlawfully collude in ways to suppress the salaries of their employees, the players.

 

This is my opinion, as well. Some seem to think that we're a pure capitalist economy where wages are based solely on the market. We tried that for about a century. What you ended up with was labor exploitation because the choices were bleak - work for peanuts and starve slowly or don't and starve quickly. Just because players will willingly work for low wages because it's the only path they can take in their chosen field doesn't mean that we should allow ownership to take advantage of a cornered labor market to improve their own bottom line.

       
       
And I just don't get how this is so different from other businesses!  This is America.  Multimillionaires and billionaires own huge companies.   There are all sorts of jobs and all sorts of income levels within these companies.  But one thing is pretty much for sure.  At the bottom of these companies are some very low paid employees.   Period.  That's life.  Any further debate would fall into the category of overall political philosophies.  I for one am not going down that toad.  But again I will say if my son is lucky enough to suffer such servitude for a few years and have it help him to a good living then I would be pleased as punch.  For the last time being a minor league baseball PLAYER is NOT a career.  It is an opportunity!

Don't blame me or others who interpret those that attack him as spoiled and entitled.  That is all I am see by those attacking him and his opinions.

Root you and I usually see eye to eye on things but I guess here we will have to part ways.  As an old history teacher I can verify what you say about capitalism 150 years ago.  But this is a completely different scenario.  These kids have OPTIONS!  And yet they CHOOSE this route.  If someone longs to be a starving artist or a two bit actor with dreams of making it big should we fight for their right to do that at at least minimum wage?  The extra in hollywood gets paid for the time they put in.  I bet you they would all say they spend a ton of time practicing but they don't get paid for that time.  The minor leaguer doesn't have to work out he does it for.the same reason the actor practices.  To try and make their dream come true.  How about the local sports writer?  The guy on a radio station in a town of 15000?  We could go on and on and on.  People chasing their dreams and willing to struggle through incredibly tough times to make it happen.  How many stories have you heard of famous actors living 4 or 5 in an apartment?  These guys are simply NOT in a unique position.  If its not worth it don't do it!  I know a guy from my grade school and high school who told the scouts "don't waste your draft pick on me I won't sign".  We all thought he was nuts but he wanted to get on with his teaching/coaching career and just didn't want to do the minor league thing for a lot of the reasons stressed here.  He made his choice.  Those who sign make.their choice.  This really should be common sense.

This is not like any other American business.  This is a business where collusion is apparently permitted under the guise of an anti-trust exemption granted when baseball needed it. It does not need it or deserve it any longer.

If you want MLB to be like any American business, then they should compete like Apple does with Google. They should compete like Ford does with GM. They should compete in an environment just like any other American business.

They just don't and it is, in my view, a HUGE mistake to try and argue American capitalism exists in MLB.  Actually, MLB is just like the OPEC oil cartel which artificially drove oil prices sky high and created market shortages and left us, the Amercian consumer as hostages to them.

That analogy transfers to MLB

The players are just like American consumers held hostage to a cartel controlling the prices of oil. For those who liked that experience of gas lines, oil shortages and prices through the roof, then you will love MLB and its owners!!!

 

I agree with the statement that it isn't a career, but an opportunity. There may be a handful of career minor beleaguers, most former ML guys the organization needs to keep around in AAA for the younger guys, most of them making well over the 100-150K. Son has a friend who makes about 150K in AAA. He works with the pitchers as well sort of like in a coaching capacity as well.

We keep getting back to the same discussion which is good, but I too don't see how players getting low wages has anything to do with the article.

 

lhprhp,

You have a good attitude and sounds like your players do too.  I think that living on what son had to (even as a free agent the last two years) he has learned to budget himself and not spend unless he has to.  He still drives the truck he got for high school graduation.  It definitely was a good lesson in survivor ship and frugality for him as a young adult.

Best of luck to your players.

In this case, it's not just the owners who are responsible. Major League players and those who represent them view increases in minor league wages as part of a zero-sum game; that if minor leaguers get an increase, the increased expense will find its way into the next contract with the MLBPA. In other words, it'll ultimately come out of the major leaguers' pockets.

 

Meanwhile, it's fair to say that both sides see subsistence wages at the minor league level as a cost-of-entry that everyone before them has had to bear; so, why change it for the new guys? 

Isn't this "cost of entry" more expensive these days?  I keep hearing things like MiLB salaries have gone up 50%over the past 20(?) years whereas inflation over that same period has been 200%.  Aren't their wages shrinking?  Lastly, I wonder how their wages compared to MLB leauge minimum or MLB average over that timeframe.  I suppose MiLB slice of the pie is getting smaller at an increasing rate.

(emphasis mine)

 

Seriously???

 

Because everyone had done it in the past is NOT a good or justifiable reason for not making changes for the better.   

 

And people. . . .don't forget that these players don't have a choice when they can only sign a 7 year contract and have no say about changing organizations if they wanted to try somewhere else for whatever reason.  Comparing these players to others like starving artists or two-bit-actors isn't the same as these people are not stuck to a 7 year contract if they don't like the organization they're working for they move on to another.

 

PS:  Yes, it's an opportunity. . . just as it's an "opportunity" when you're hired by any company.  So, I see this argument about the "opportunity" is really a moot one.

So, lets get this straight. 

A team drafts a player and pays a bonus, lets say 750K for the "opportunity" to play ball.  Are you suggesting that after the team makes an investment, giving the "opportunity" the player should have an option of changing teams before his minor league contract is up?

Many players do have "opportunities" to go play for other teams, when they have been released after a season or two.  However, I am going to assume after a year or two of pro baseball no team will give any player a free agent contract that would be worth anything for the same "opportunity".

I am just trying to figure out what exactly is the point here.  A player has an "opportunity" to sign with a team, just like any contract, he doesnt have to accept the "opportunity".  

The system is set up in each organization for a player to learn each spring and that season.  There is a familiarity and consistency that exists that is necessary for learning to take place, year after year and yes, many players do not always progress as quickly as they or their parents think they should.  When I hear people say(or complain) that they have to remain with the same team for 7 years, it is a signal to me that there is some unhappiness there, like they are thinking that the grass is greener on the other side (it is not) or that they belong in AA or AAA.  Sometimes I do not think many actually understand how difficult those levels can be, and that for each league, the difficulty levels are not equal.  But that is a discussion for another day.

 

After 4 years if the player has progressed he gets protected from the 5 year draft. That is an "opportunity" to get into an other organization, but still bound by the 7 years. however being placed on the 40 man roster more than likely would be the best "opportunity" the player has.

Again, this is all about opportunity and not a moot one, IMO

 

 

 

 

MLB players have issues with the large sums of money thrown at young drafted players who never played a day of pro ball in their life. They are the ones who would decide on who gets what and they are not much in favor of giving raises if they cant get one themselves.

This sounds nuts and I repeated before. 500K for a rookie is said to not be enough. They have horrendous taxes if no home, have to live in big cities and pay huge rent per month or buy expensive homes. And since most of them leave after the season, many have to maintain 2 residences. Do you think that after all is said and done, the time they spend at the field, in the game and travel, that they are getting paid enough? I dont think they get paid enough. This is entry level into MLB.

 

I mean if you play in NY do you have any idea what an apartment or home costs? 

A lot.

Hmmmm???   How about let's not cherry pick here?   

 

The issue really has to do with the great majority of players.

 

 The player has no choice in the matter.  Unless he's released he can do nothing to make a deal with another organization ... . like one might when working in some other type of business.

 

Back in the 80's my wife got a substantial signing bonus to go work work for a high tech company in Silicon Valley.  Six to nine months down the road the company went through some management changes as the company struggled and moral slumped.  It was at that time she had been getting recruiting calls and decided to take an offer and change to a different high tech company.  She had the "opportunity" to change for something she felt was a  better "opportunity."   

 

 And if the player doesn't accept, what does that do for "opportunities" to play in this profession for the higher levels?

  

Surely you're not arguing that there's never situation where there's a mismatch of some type between player and management where a player under a different wing might have a greater chance of succeeding than some other?

 

Regardless of the inherent difficulty, the difficulty can be multiplied when one finds they can't be in sync with management.   Having a choice for their opportunities, like most do with their profession, mitigates such a problem.

  

 As you suggest, some have a better "opportunity" than others.  

 

It's the argument about opportunity using a comparison of starving artists or two-bit-actors that's moot.

 

 

 

My issues is not over the small group of players who get large bonuses.  It's the majority of lower level players who don't get paid enough to qualify above the poverty line.  

 

And though I feel those players who've moved up and been aground a while getting something above the poverty line should be paid more than they're getting, it's the newer players at the lower levels that needs to be address most.

 

It's a shame that Milb player's salaries have not kept up with inflation over the years.

I am not cherry picking, sorry if it came across that way to you. 

 

Unfortunetly, its not about the majority of guys in the lower levels because if the organization cared they would have given those players more bonus money to help live comfortably.  Those players are there to be teammates for the guys they gave big bucks to.  If one of those guys reaches the ml level, which happens, they got a bargain.  It becomes a great story for the organization.  That player becomes valuable as he might be traded and yes that new organization gives him a great opportunity. It happens but usually those guys were more talented from the beginning.

 

Just my opinion and just my observation. Tell your players to work their butts off and someday they will be one of those success stories and gosh,,,stop complaining!

 

Listen, when my son went to another team he got some more money as a free agent because of his experience. Reality is they didn't care at all about him. They were more focused on their bonus babies. Since son was one of those with his drafting team, he understood. It really didn't matter how hard he worked or how well he did. He got it, it took us a while until we figured it out. 

 

There are lots of players that don't see eye to eye with the organization that drafts them, not just in milb but in ML too.  Its just not something that is discussed here and shouldn't be. So realistically you would have a hell of a lot of movement if this was allowed to happen, that's for sure! I do know ML players who lost their spark that have been swapped,

That's why ML players covet free agency, I know that you know that.They get to choose who they want to play with. But they worked years and years for that opportunity.

 

http://www.houstonchronicle.co...-through-6392992.php

 

(hope the link works)  Attached is a different story of life in the minor leagues, and one person's journey.

Link works, but you have to subscribe to the paper to get the article.  Looks interesting tho!

Hmmmm???  It's a really nice story, but it's not so much one of life in the minor leagues as it is simply a story of his path to the minor leagues.  He's only now in the middle of his first year of minors.  Though obviously, he has a passion for the game.

was able to read it by separately googling the pitcher's name.  I liked it.  Was impressed by the fact that he hadn't played in awhile, and then found his way back into the game.  Kid has a great attitude.  Thanks for posting the link.

To reinforce something that TPM alluded to above: My son learned to live on very little money in his two years in the minors. He had a home stay, which was very helpful at keeping costs down, but he also learned that he really didn't need much "stuff" to get by just fine.

 

Now that he is making a good income in a professional capacity, he lives way below his income, which he realizes is the most reliable route to financial security. He credits MiLB for that.

 

It's not always a bad thing to be temporarily poor.

I didn't read the article, but its just another example of how people view experiences differently.  

 

That is really what it is all about, not everyone loves having to live frugally and some couldn't care less because its all about the game.

Eventually for most, they learn that its time to move on (on their own or by release), and I think those that have played for "peanuts" really will become successful at anything they do because they have learned about the struggle  to stay afloat in what some consider "minor league poverty".

 

RK, I hope all is well with JK and your family!  

Yes, thanks the kid is doing great! Likes his job, and is doing well at it. He'll always wish he got a shot at affiliated ball, but I think he's grateful for everything baseball did for him.