Holy Re-Classing!

@22and25 posted:

I find some of the post here about summer birthday kids and the kindergarten decision very interesting.

So we waited, rather than enter kindergarten at barely 5 years old he entered at barely 6.  No regrets....and so he is 2025, and not 2024.

I think that's fairly common story although there's a lot of rationalizing that goes on. I n my state they even moved the date back from December or January 1 to Sept 1 several years ago so your kid would have right on the cusp in our state  Holding your kid back to re-do 8th grade, while his lifelong friends move on, for a slightly better chance at being a high 2024 over an above average 2025 or maybe not getting cut from sports altogether is different and much more common story.  I can look at my kids yearbook and see at least 10 out of 200 boys that did that and I don't think it will matter one bit.  And I've heard some of the other boys and parents call them red-shirts.

Soooo, my son went to a Montessori school for pre-k and K. Pretty good group of kids and parents. There were some summer birthdays including late august. The school convinced a few of these parents that their kids were so smart they needed to be skipped ahead a grade. Can't remember if they skipped K or 1st, but they skipped. So a couple parents tried to move over to public school and the district told them they don't let kids advance until after 3rd. Low and behold wouldn't you know it, the families were locked into another 2 years at the Montessori school. Now that the kids are in HS, the parents are pissed. Their kids are not able to really compete at sports with kids in their grade levels who are 2-3 years ahead.

My son is a May bday, so he's already young. Thank God my wife listened to me when I argued to leave him on grade level.

@Dadbelly2023 posted:

We "academically red-shirted" our 2023 summer birthday boy in 6th grade.  He was so smart as 4-5 year old we felt like we had to put him in Kindergarten early.  But he was always noticeably a little emotionally behind as the youngest kid in his class.  After 6th grade, I had a career change and an epiphany to have him repeat the grade.  (I would be lying if I didn't consider the sports implications)  Every teacher and the principal told me I was being unreasonable... he's too smart, he'll be bored, he'll get in trouble, etc...  We did it anyways.  We home schooled him so he wouldn't feel weird.    I went fishing and camping with him.  Did overseas travel trips.  And played lots of sports together.  It was a great year.   

He's definitely a more mature high school student because of it.  Grades are super easy.  He's disciplined enough to study for the SAT/ACT every day since mid freshmen year.

I think it will help him out with soccer and baseball.  He's little so I can't imagine he would have had any shot if he were on the original timeline.  Now I think he might have a shot at high level D3 baseball or soccer.  IMO, it was a win to do this.   

I started kindergarten a year early. While I was one of the top kids in my class I started falling behind emotionally and socially in 7th grade. What I posted below about sports bothered me. In 8th grade my grades started to decline. We moved. I repeated 8th grade got all A’s and was back on track.

Sports were never mentioned as a reason. But I went from being a competent athlete to a dominant athlete at school like I was in age related non school baseball and basketball. In 7th grade I was an 11yo competing in football against some 8th graders who were 13. Same thing in basketball. In sports where size mattered I was at a tremendous disadvantage.

My daughter (oldest) has a July birthday. When she was young I could see the difference between her and girls who were ten, eleven months older. But girls physically mature by 8th, 9th grade. Recruiting isn’t effected. My son with his May birthday was the dominant kid from the time he stepped on any field/court. He fell back in 7th and 8th grade in terms of size, strength and power before growing. But the skills were visible.

My son was 5’ at twelve and 5’2” and 5’4” the following two years. When we saw a tall, non athletic  person he would mutter, “What a waste of height.”

We held my son back and while it wasn't uncommon then, it is uncommon not to now.  My oldest was born late August, would have been the youngest, or we hold him and he is one of the oldest.  Preschool teacher said he wasn't emotionally ready and we knew he would be a late bloomer.  A week before turning 13, he was 5' flat.  At 14, he was 5'8 and ended up graduating at 6'3 and 205 .  It 100% made a difference in his ability to reach his goals.  Our youngest son is 5'3 and almost 13.  He will likely be bigger than his older brother and he is 8-12 inches shorter than almost every kid on his 7th grade football team.  Every boy he knows in his grade is almost a full year older.  He was born in February...couldn't justify it. That said, there are many kids born around the same time that are a grade below.  I see the value in holding them.  I don't blame anyone.  Reclassifying in high school usually only makes sense if the kid really hasn't developed physically yet, but this year and last...who knows.

@Gunner Mack Jr. posted:

The ultimate are Hockey players.  My son is a young Freshman in college, turned 18 in September.  He made friends with a Hockey Freshman who turns 21 in May.  Kid was old for grade, took a PG year, played a year before college and as a result buys the beer.

Hockey is notorious.

New England prep hockey is full of kids who have repeated 8th grade at private schools, do a year of public school for 9th grade, and then re-class back to 9th when they go to prep school. Most kids who come into the league later after being somewhere else re-class too. Parents fuel it and Coaches want it 3yrs instead or 2, or 2 instead of 1 for the tuition "subsidy" provided. 21yo freshman in college hockey is very common.

I'll never forget the feeling of first watching my 14yo 145lb "true" freshman competing against 19yo 200lb men, from all over the country and world, who had better beards than me. He's 5'9 and has always played like he doesn't know he's not 6'3. Despite some huge hits given and taken he came away relatively unscathed, but man what a season.

Definitely seeing more of it now in baseball. Four baseball friends of his (2) re-classed and (2) PG'd. The two PG ended up going committing to better schools than they were originally committed to. But the re-classes haven't found a home yet.

Here in Texas lots of parents are having their kid redo 8th grade in private school. I have a June Bday boy and he wants “no part” of doing an additional year. He will graduate HS at 17. We considered reclassify him but he’s a A/B student and his social friends group is something we also consider. Maturity wise he’s behind, wish I started him in K at 6 this said...he wants no part of it now! It’s so common here to be older it’s now weird to be the correct age/grade lol.

The first I really heard of this was when I was in high school. We played Lowndes County in Valdosta in the football playoffs. They were really good, and really old. Evidently all, or nearly all of their football players went to 8th grade twice

New York/Jersey Basketball players will happily tell you 8th grade was the best 3 years of their lives

@Francis7 posted:

I have officially lost track on how many good 22s we have seen reclass to 23s. Some of them were even old for their grade as 22s. Everyone knows who they are and what they are doing. The coaches and recruiters don't seem to care. In fact, they they seem to prefer it.

Hypothetical:  Kid repeats 8th grade because he's small for his grad year and wants to have a better chance to play Varsity Baseball and get recruited. Actually dad thinks he will grow to be 6"2' even though he's 5'8 and mom is 5'2.

I know of one instance where the kid actually took 9th grade classes in the HS he was going to attend but enrolled in 8th grade in the attached private middle school where he took gym etc. but he took Spanish, math and chemistry in the HS with Freshman which set him up for more AP credits.  Pretty smart.     

Only problem is, in our state  you are not supposed to be able to that.  There is a rule that says once you start taking 9th grade curriculum, whether home school or in school, you are a freshman and your 4 year eligibility clock is ticking. Problem is  they seldom enforce it.  If the HSAA enforced their own rule the 8th grade redshirts wouldn't bother.

@Gunner Mack Jr. posted:

The ultimate are Hockey players.  My son is a young Freshman in college, turned 18 in September.  He made friends with a Hockey Freshman who turns 21 in May.  Kid was old for grade, took a PG year, played a year before college and as a result buys the beer.

It’s very common for hockey players to head off to Juniors after high school if not during high school. If they’re still in juniors at twenty they tend to head for college hockey.

There used to be a handful of dominant college hockey programs. Ultimately other programs became more competitive by recruiting men (20yo Juniors). Then it became a trend for all programs.

If you see an 17/18yo freshman  in D1 college hockey player getting ice time he’s a legit pro prospect.

The post-grad/academy biz must be booming in FL with all the re-classing going on. This week I’ve seen 3 new travel orgs offering PG teams for this summer and next spring. I’m sure there are more, I just happened to check out their sites. Doesn’t look like there is any type of academic tie in, just a team to play on.

@KennieProton posted:

Hypothetical:  Kid repeats 8th grade because he's small for his grad year and wants to have a better chance to play Varsity Baseball and get recruited. Actually dad thinks he will grow to be 6"2' even though he's 5'8 and mom is 5'2.

Kennie, I have to respond to you because it's too ironic not to.  I am 5'2", my husband is 5'8" (he's says 9) and our 2022 just hit 6'2". lol

@TerribleBPthrower posted:

The post-grad/academy biz must be booming in FL with all the re-classing going on. This week I’ve seen 3 new travel orgs offering PG teams for this summer and next spring. I’m sure there are more, I just happened to check out their sites. Doesn’t look like there is any type of academic tie in, just a team to play on.

Same in SoCal.  I think they've already created a league.  Basically taking the league that had existed for committed highschoolers who didn't want to play for their high school (a lot of talented pitchers with HS coaches w/no regard for arm care and some potential draftees who graduate early to focus on training) and expanding it.  If there is a need, someone will fill it..and profit from it.

Under NCAA rules, can these kids take college credits during their gap year assuming they eventually wind up on a college campus?

I believe there is a maximum number of credits.  I know a kid doing it right now.  He's horrible at Math.  Getting his college distribution Math credit out of the way while he's taking a limited course load is actually really helpful.

@LousyLefty posted:

Kennie, I have to respond to you because it's too ironic not to.  I am 5'2", my husband is 5'8" (he's says 9) and our 2022 just hit 6'2". lol

Your son is definitely an outlier. When forming a 13u travel team it was an all star team of our eighteen LL district. I identified the top twenty players I felt had high school potential and secured thirteen. The idea was to train kids to become high school players. All but one played college ball at some level. He could have played college baseball. He played D1 basketball. I was more interested in the 5’2” kid with athleticism and tall parents than the player in the next paragraph.

The dad of the most dominant pitcher was perplexed I wasn’t interested. His kid was 5’8, throwing mid 70’s at 12 and never lost a game. Dad was 5’5. Mom was 5’1” The kid was cut from the high school JV team entering junior year. He was now 5’9” throwing 78.

@TerribleBPthrower posted:

The post-grad/academy biz must be booming in FL with all the re-classing going on. This week I’ve seen 3 new travel orgs offering PG teams for this summer and next spring. I’m sure there are more, I just happened to check out their sites. Doesn’t look like there is any type of academic tie in, just a team to play on.

I do believe they have to take classes but have no clue what type.

@TPM posted:

I do believe they have to take classes but have no clue what type.

The programs I saw were geared more towards the reclassified kids who won’t be able to play their senior year. You go to whichever high school you want (most seem to prefer virtual) and you pay to play on the team.

I think we will see a scenario exactly how LousyLefty described SoCal as far as having a league.

Hmmm, interesting concept @TerribleBPthrower. Repeat grade 12 and continue with HS classes ineligible for a 5th year of sports (to my knowledge no states have awarded a 5th year of eligibility to high school students) vs graduate and take a few courses at the local JUCO?  Realistically if the HS offers enough AP classes you could accrue more credits (if the college you end up accepts them) by staying in HS. My high academic student left a few AP classes on the table that he would have enjoyed taking but there simply weren't enough periods in the HS day.  (that was with a few college "dual enrollment" classes to make room for the 14 AP classes he's already taken/enrolled for next year). Granted, a kid taking that many AP classes  likely won't end up at at a school that accepts all those APs...

Biggest downside, if you get hurt or finally acknowledge it's not going to happen you're stuck in HS an additional year.  At least with JUCO you could pivot at semester and move on with your life.

@RJM posted:

I was more interested in the 5’2” kid with athleticism and tall parents than the player in the next paragraph.

The dad of the most dominant pitcher was perplexed I wasn’t interested. His kid was 5’8, throwing mid 70’s at 12 and never lost a game. Dad was 5’5. Mom was 5’1” The kid was cut from the high school JV team entering junior year. He was now 5’9” throwing 78.

Which is exactly why I had Lefty's 6' tall older brother take him to all tryouts when we were shopping new programs in middle school   Lefty had a little height, but clearly hadn't hit full blown puberty yet.  

I only commented because he nailed EVERY height to the inch

Pretty sure NJ has offered an extra year of HS eligibility. I know at least one baseball player who has taken advantage.