Is it really my business if my 12u doesn't want to pitch?

My 10th grader was/is the same way.  He just does not enjoy pitching even though he was a top pitcher at 11-14.  He threw 90 at perfect game at 15.  But he loves to catch and loves to bat.  I have encouraged him to pitch occasionally and his coaches have had him catch every so often just to keep him in the game.  In a way, I am glad he does not pitch much.  It gave his arm a chance to mature.

 

I say let him play where he is happy.  He has time to change his mind.

It's up to him.  Baseball, especially at 12 is supposed to be fun.  And if he isn't having fun, he won't want to play at all at some point.  

 

Pitchers are a special breed.  My son pitched and played position all the way thru HS.  But, pitching was his thing.  I would often ask him if he had the choice between pitching only every few days or playing position every day, his response was "why would I not want to pitch?"  That's his mindset.  He didn't have to make that decision or accept his role one way or the other until college, but he is doing what he loves to do - pitch.

 

If a kid doesn't want to pitch, then he shouldn't have to, in my opinion.  Like I said, baseball is supposed to be fun.  If he loses his love for the game because his is forced to do something he doesn't want to do, that is not a good thing.  

 

Others may have a different opinion, but that's what I think.

I had a similar experience with an 11U at catcher due to a speed-up rule that took him off the base paths with two outs.  Forcing a young kid to do something that makes them unhappy with the game isn't the way to go.

 

Eventually, the kid will see the value he brings to the team in the unwanted position and offer to help or not.   Playing catcher will keep the arm strong though.  1B not so much.

I'm with bballman.  Just plant the seed that should he choose to be just a position player, that he should at least throw some bullpens just to keep up on his pitching mechanics.  Anything can happen and he may have to fall back on pitching at the next level.....and he may just realize that he misses pitching.

I agree with the others. As a father of a committed pitcher I see some benefits to him not pitching at his current age.  

 

Mine was full time catcher and part time pitcher until 9th grade.  Too much throwing looking back at those youth years. 

 

In 9th grade it started to become clear that he could have most impact on his HS varsity team as a pitcher.  Pitched out of pen as a freshman and was #3 as a sophomore. 

 

through this he has truly found his passion. His demeanor and competitiveness make it clear pitching is where he should be. 

 

I say let him do what he enjoys for now. That will likely change and evolve over time.  I think given the opportunity to grow without undue parental influence most kids will figure out where their passion lies. 

You might also remind him that baseball is a team game.  

 

The team needs someone on the mound every inning, and every player needs to be prepared to carry his part of the pitching load. 

 

A player in youth ball who won't pitch for the reasons you described is putting his preference ahead of the team, which is not an attitude that will serve him well in high school and beyond.

He's freaking 12....thiings may happen that allow him to have the choice to play both ways or he may need to pitch to  make it to college. He has a long way to go and it should be about fun at 12. A few upcoming field dimension and changes with 13u and 14U and he may change his mind. Keep him engaged and his enthusaism high so he has options. My son was all world in the middle infield, lead off type batter and will go to an ACC school next year as a D1 pitcher. Have fund while the game is still about fun and let him mature into his natural position/s. Enjoy it...it goes by fast.

I'm not sure how adding the word "freaking" to a statement turns it into a persuasive argument for or against a proposition, but I'll give it a try.

 

He's freaking 12.  Who does he think he is to enlist his parents to tell his coach what positions he will and will not play?

 

As a parent I absolutely would not tell the coach of a 12 year old that my son is unavailable for pitching unless it was for a valid health, safety, or over-use issue.

 

After all, he's freaking 12 years old.

I was the guy who was not happy that my kid wasn't pitching at 9 & 10. Dad /Coach pitched his kids all season and moved my kid from SS to CF. He did pitch some at 11 and won a USAAA championship on the mound but was not the main guy. At 12 he got a few innings in Cooperstown but nothing really for the whole season as we came into a mature rostered team for that cooperstown experience with an east cobb team (got 4th from 106 teams). I was "freaking" out because i thought it mattered then to pitch. At 13, he got a few innings, (same coach that saw potential at 11) and did fine but was not starter. At 14....he lost his infield spot at 2nd, due to not hitting well and was saved by a pitching coach who saw his potential to get guys out. He became our bullpen guy. Fast forward to today, i could hug all the SOBs who wouldnt pitch my kid in youth travel ball, heck i'll buy em a beer too.....or maybe even send em a Snuggie for the cold nights watching Bull Durham and wishing their kids were playing ball or they were still coaching, most are not.

 

I'm super happy, because none of them used up my son for meaningless games in meaningless tournaments with inflated pitch counts  to try and win a rinky dink tournament. I was wrong about pitching at the younger ages and i accept it.

 

I'm freaking sorry.

Agree 100%. There's something to be said about a kid learning how to be coachable and a good teammate.  He'll go a lot further saying "whatever you need me to do coach!" than drawing lines in the sand regarding what he will and won't do.

 

 

I'm all for the team approach.  My son played where he was told his whole life.  He was willing to bat or play the position his team needed him.  But at 12, if a kid doesn't want to do something, you shouldn't make him.  CaCO3Girl, maybe point out to him what others have said about being a team player, but, personally, I'll stand by my comment about making sure he's having fun.  

 

Not all players have the mindset to be a pitcher.  Maybe some of this is about him wanting to play every inning of every game as he stated.  Maybe some of it is about not liking the pressure cooker of being on the mound.  It's not easy being out there, the center of attention with every pitch having potential consequences.  If your son is not having fun playing baseball, he may not stick around until he gets to high school or college.

 

Let him have fun and play where he wants.  This ride will not last forever.

I understand that baseball is a team sport.  I am all for the "wherever you need me coach" type of player.  But, I can't agree with putting a kid on the mound that doesn't want to be there.  When I coach young kids, 9-12, I tel them all at the beginning of the year, I plan on having you pitch at least one inning.  A lot of kids say "Well I've never pitched"...and I tell them, well, I want you to experience what it takes to be a pitcher, maybe you'll like it maybe you won't.  I have had kids try it and like it.  I have had kids try it and say "never again", and I've had kids refuse to do it.  The ones that refuse, I did not push, just left the door open for the opportunity when they felt comfortable enough to give it a shot.

 

Why put a kid on the mound when he doesn't want to be there?  You're risking the chance of evoking a bad attitude out of the kid and then having it spread like cancer, especially at 12.  IMO, in the OP's statement, I don't recall them saying their kid would only play a certain position, just that he didn't want to pitch.  I don't consider that being selfish or anti-team.  Forcing a kid to take the mound, IMO, is a bad move.  There is no real upside for it except for the Coach exerting his authority.

Lefthook,

I guess I just don't understand this perspective.  To me, the question is not "do you want to pitch?" or "where do you want to play?", it is "do you want to play baseball?".  He's playing travel ball - if a kid develops a bad attitude for being asked to play a particular position, then I would suggest he doesn't really want to be a baseball player after all.  If he were on my team I would suggest to him and his parents that perhaps he should move on.

And thank you board for presenting pretty much every argument that has been running through my head! LOL!

 

One clarification, he will play any position coach asks him to, without a single question, but in his mind the sitting him on the bench because he pitched is a detriment to the team. I tried to tell him that the coach understands he will have to sit if he pitches and has deemed that the best course of action.  He is a math kid, so I think he is glitching because in his brain if you have 8 kids that can pitch, 3 that can catch, and 2 that can play 1B....then mathematically he does more good at Catcher and 1B than pitching and sitting.  I think in some strange way he is doing a cost analysis on how his value as a player with this team is being used and it isn't making sense to him. 

 

While talking about it his points were that it would give other kids who WANT to pitch more time, it might be a relief to coach if he told him he didn't really want to pitch so coach didn't have to worry about trying to get him into the rotation of pitchers, and if he didn't pitch he would be down to 2 gloves instead of three in his bag. To that one I had to laugh because HELLO like one glove outweighs the catcher gear?

 

Anyway, thanks for all the advice :-)

 

P.S. He adores baseball, he really does eat and breath it.  He also shows zero reluctance when asked to pitch by the coach, he always just says "Yes Sir!", it's only to me that he has asked the "what if" question. You know, because I'm the parent and am supposed to know everything! *rolls eyes*

LefthookDad and BBallman,

 

Think through the consequence of what you said.

 

Do you really believe that because baseball is supposed to be fun, we shouldn't ask youth players to do anything they don't want to do?

 

Is that really how you manage your team?

 

I want to see the practices and games run on that principle.   Check that.  No I don't. Nobody playing right field, cuz that ain't fun.  Half the kids skip bunt drills because it's more fun to swing away.  Catcher won't block balls in the dirt:  where's the fun in that?  Conditioning work? Running out grounders?  Don't even ask. 

 

The main reasons kids don't like to pitch are that it's hard, it affords no place to hide when it doesn't go well, and it's not fun to have the results of your work destroyed by the batter, erratic umpiring or weak defense. 

 

But if your sonis on a team that doesn't make players learn to deal with adversity like this, he is not learning the lessons he should be learning from sports.

 

And if he is allowed to opt out of difficult or undesirable assignments, then he is missing out on the real fun of finding out he can do and enjoy things he didn't think he could or would.

 

I stand by my previous advice.  Parents of 12 year olds should not allow a child's preference to motivate them to tell the coach what positions the player is willing to play.

 

I really look at it this way.  When you start getting to the level that the travel teams become important for recruiting purposes, I see it as having 8 positions and Pitchers.  That's why there are PO's.  At the 12u level, almost every travel team tries to fill their rosters with the best local "SS's" they can find, which means they all usually pitch. No travel coach is going to put a kid on the mound just to have him pitch.  My reference was for LL'ers, it's about letting them get the chacne to learn and develop.  I really have no interest in travel ball under 14/15u.  

 

IMO, Pitching is not just another position.  You cannot /should not put a kid on the mound that is not mentally prepared or does not show the desire to be there.  Afterall, we are talking about a level where the kids are all touted as being "elite" by  the parents and coaches.  Forcing a kid to be on the mound can be detrimental to the team and also safety risk, because the hitters are all "elite".  A kid not mentally in the game could get hurt.  I watched it happen many years ago, kid didn't want to pitch but coach/dad put the kid on the mound anyway, a few batters later, and a rocket right back to the face, the coach/dad was screaming at our team because the hitter was a really big kid and his son was younger(11) playing up (12u).

 

I agree that if the kid has a bad attitude and is a cancer to the team, they can be shown the exit door.  But I don't see where forcing a kid to pitch,when he doesn't want to, makes him a selfish player.  I have stedfastly taken the stance that there are two position, on the field and on the bench, but the OP states this kid is willing to play anywhere else on the field.  I believe a scenario like this will only alienate the player and coach and may have a much more negative effect on the team than one where the coach just putting someone else who actually wants to pitch, on the mound.

CaCo3Girl,

I would agree with the team first mentality here. When one considers the amount of travel tournament games packed into a weekend, a coach needs a very deep team of P's. The more capable kids who can throw strikes, the more competitive the team will be. I would suggest this to your son that he needs to help his team in this regard. Taking a break on the bench is not a bad thing, especially from the workload Pitchers and Catchers handle on a weekend.

I have both 10 and 13 yr old boy's playing 70 games a year. From my coaching perspective- I need about 9 kids on my squad that I can count on to toe the rubber and give me strikes. My job is to develop and protect their arms from overuse. Without a deep staff of P, the risk of overuse increases exponentially.

Maybe that is the angle to propose to your son. Good Luck!

 

 

LOL, My son is going to pitch in a D1 program in 2016. I'm still worried about his spring senior year in HS. There were many times in middle school years I wanted my son to pitch. Now I'm glad another player threw instead.  

Swamp, I think you're really bringing in a lot of factors not in play.  I don't see where the OP stated that this kid only says he will play "X" position or nothing at all.  Kida that don't/ won't do the other things you mentioned don't make the team in the first place.  The OP's kid is simply expressing that he has no interest in pitching anymore.  So how can anyone justify putting a kid on the mound who doesn't want to pitch?  Forcing a kid into that particular position, which is really like no other on the field, does more damage than good. I wouldn't mind the issue being brought up to the coach, preferably by the player, but even a parent.  It would be an excellent opportunity for a Coach to actually impart a lesson/philosophy on to a young player beyond the realms of just the physical aspect of the game.

I don't think pitching at 12U holds any special place on the team, "elite" or not.  You take an athletic kid and tell him to throw strikes.  Either he can or he can't.  What else is to it?  If you have a big game that matters to the team of course you pitch someone with proven skills, experience, etc.  The issue the OP stated was that he's got to sit out a game after pitching, therefore he doesn't want to pitch.  Either you agree with this system or not, and if you don't you should find another team - that is the option the player and parents always have.

Just another thought here.....

I have to assume here that CaCO3Girl son's coach is planning on him to contribute pitching some innings this upcoming season. Based on the info provided by CaCo3Girl, the coach probably see's him as his # 1 or # 2 pitcher. My guess the coach is looking for quite a few innings from him. Just another angle to consider here.

 

 

 

 

 

Swampboy, I understand your perspective, but I think we're just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.  Pitching is  a different animal than playing position.  It's not like the OP's son hasn't tried pitching.  He did and for what ever reason, he doesn't want to do it.  He'll play anywhere else on the field.  He'll do all the drills related to hitting and fielding.  He just doesn't want to pitch and I think that's ok.  

 

Here's my one concern.  As the kids get older, things get more competitive.  When they get into their Sophomore, Junior and Senior years, teams are built for recruiting and exposure.  What will this boy's attitude be when he has to sit a few innings or a few games for someone else to get a chance to play?  Will he be so upset that he doesn't want to play anymore?  What if he makes varsity as an underclassman, but does not start because there is a senior ahead of him?  What if he has to sit a game in a 16u tournament because another player needs exposure to the recruiters and scouts that are there?  Let's say he's a total stud and plays every inning of every game all thru HS and makes it to college.  What if as a freshman he's up against a bunch of seniors and doesn't start or get much play time at all?  Chances are pretty good that some or all of this will happen.  How will he deal with it if he is so used to not sitting out at all?

 

It's not necessarily a bad thing to sit out a few games or a few innings.  It's part of baseball.  He is going to need to deal with this.  That's the lesson he needs hear from you.

You got it!  He is arguably #1 or #2.  At age 12 you have two kinds of kids on your team, small and scrappy, maybe 85 pounds soaking wet....OR the kids who have just started puberty and have some meat on them.

 

My son is 5'5 and 140 pounds!  He can throw the ball harder than half the kids on the team simply because of his size compared to them, add that to him being accurate across the plate and poof you have a valuable pitcher for 12u.

 

 

 

 

Valuable point.  I don't think technically sitting out is the real problem, I think given all of the above scenarios you listed he would be okay with all of that and even cheer his teammates on.  He feels like there is a direct correlation that if he pitches he HAS to sit out and since he doesn't love pitching he would rather role the dice on maybe sitting out rather than for sure sitting out as a penalty for pitching which he could take or leave. He knows he is a decent pitcher, but he doesn't love it.

 

Every ball that a catcher throws back to the pitcher is equivalent to 0.5 a pitch.  If he is pitching + catching they are two entirely different actions on the arm.  He will probably need to make a choice at some point between one or the other.  That will eventually happen, maybe sooner than later, after moving up to a regulation field.  I would recommend seeking the advice of competent medical professionals, if he were to continue doing both, growth plates being an initial concern.  All the best to him, he sounds like quite a kid!

CaCo3Girl,

 

Kind of what I thought.. He is a very valuable all around Ballplayer!

Sounds like his team and coaches really need him (expect him) to contribute on the mound this upcoming season. Going to the coach now and telling him " I don't want to Pitch" would not be a good idea, especially at this point when the team is most likely full and done with recruiting. Its a great time to teach a very valuable lesson. TEAM. Sacrificing one's own interests and putting the TEAM FIRST. 

That is how I would play it out this year anyway.

 

 

Have the kid go to the coach and tell him he doesn't want to pitch. The coach will ask why. When the kid explains the coach can then decide if he wants the kid on the team next year.

This doesn't seem to be about not wanting to pitch for the sake of not pitching. It's not pitching so he can take up some of a teammates playing time. I wouldn't pitch the kid AND sit him the same amount of time. Then I would decide if I want him around next year (probably not).

My son started playing catcher and pitcher when he was 9. Moved into catching and has stuck with it (he's pushing 16). Never wanted to pitch at all by the time he was 10. Because he had a strong arm LL coaches would tend to push him to pitch but he's stuck to his guns, with support from his Dad.

 

If a 12 YO does not want to pitch, then don't force him to. He may very likely decide he wants to pitch again on his own and it will be HIS choice.

I agree with you in principle, but it really depends on the team. If I'm the manager and the team has a big roster, or has plenty of arms and plays 2-3 games over the course of a week, fine, the kid can help us out in other ways.  But if we routinely go to tournaments where we may have to play 4-5 games on a weekend carrying a small roster, then it's all hands on deck, and I would expect any kid with a healthy arm and a modicum of control to be ready to help out when asked.  In that case, a kid with a healthy arm who refused to pitch is not only  not being a team player, as noted by many, but his desire not to pitch could be adversely affecting the health other kids who may have to pitch more than they should.  This would not make me happy.

I have never heard of a 12 year old that didn't want to pitch.  90% if not higher of the guys in mlb pitched some as younger players.  My other suggestion would be a 7th grader should play with his grade ( 13's)not 6th graders (12's).  Move him in with his grade and they may not want him to pitch anymore.

Here's a scenario. A boy commits to a Major D1 before he starts HS. By the summer before his sophomore year he's clocked at 91mph at the USA 15U in Mexico. Looks like he would be a good candidate for # 2 starter behind a senior for the spring season. Dad tells HS coach my son is on a pitch count. Team player? I understand the Dads' logic. 

How did it so crazy that 12 yr boys are playing 5 games on a weekend. LL BB in the sixties was close to travel ball today. You tried out. Some boys did not make it on a team. 15 man roster. 5-12yr, 5-11yr, 5-10yr. Ten year olds went to practice, but mostly sat on the bench during games. But you were developing as a ballplayer. If you were a MLB player in the early sixties you were basically indentured to the owner of the ball club. Not like the free agent system today. Sure its a team sport. But history has shown some hiccups along the way 

 

 

Shane,

 

Your scenario is a totally different situation.

 

The OP voiced no concerns about overuse, injury or anything else related to health and safety. 

 

My original advice for the parent not to get involved carved out an exception for those issues.

 

This is a situation about a 12 year old who only pitches in situational roles and doesn't want to pitch even that limited amount because pitchers on his team tend to get rested after they pitch.  This is a million miles away from the overuse and safety issues you raise.

 

I support parents of all players high school age and younger who appropriately voice informed concerns about health, safety, overuse, etc. 

As a coach there are two positions on the field and one spot in the lineup that I absolutely don't want a player that doesn't want to be there. Pitcher, catcher, and lead off hitter. To me those take a special makeup. If I had a player that didn't want to pitch I would definately want to know about it. However as a 7th grader the player needs to tell the coach not the parent.

As a parent I hate my son pitching. I've hated it since he was 8 and threw his first pitch. Unfortunately at 8 when he threw that first pitch something clicked in him and there is no where in the world he would rather be than on a pitching mound.

The best players on any youth team can play multiple positions.

The best player on any team should be willing to do whatever the coach needs him to do but never in excess that he may get injured.
I am with swampboy. This wasnt about any concern that he might get hurt or over used or he may not be having fun. OP has stated multiple times in multiple topics he loves the game and wants to play beyond HS. This was about the player having to sit while pitching and being unhappy about it. This is not a good team attitude for someone who is supossed to be one of the best players on the team.

The OP also has stated that they play serious travel ball. This is not a casual  rec team.

If he is as good as the OP has stated he is, then he should learn now that humility is also a very important attribute to being a good ballplayer and that in the recruiting process unless the player is one of the best in his class coaches dont want an "its all about me" mentality in a player.

Start teaching your son to be a leader and make him understand that there is no i in the word team.

Even if he is 12.

I truly didn't mean for this debate to get sooooo heated.  Yes, he's one of the best players on the team, any position any time, but he is also 12. He doesn't think about lasting affects this decision may cause, and that was what had me wondering if it was even my business.

 

I talked with him last night and expressed the 2 over riding views.

1. If you don't WANT to pitch you shouldn't have to, you can make your own choices and if you don't really want to be there Coach likely won't make you.

2. If coach doesn't like that a 12 year old is trying to tell him what he will or won't do he might kick you off the team, or not invite you back next year.

 

He decided he is going to keep his mouth shut about pitching. This is the first time he has had a coach even mention arm care and why he sits pitchers.  I don't think he was trying to be a brat or showing an ego; he never said he refused to sit, never pouted when it happened, never said a bad thing about coach, happily warmed up the next pitcher, never showed poor body language...he simply saw cause and effect and asked a "what if" question to a parent. I think he's just growing up and thinking through a new situation. *shrug* he's 12!

Ditto for my 2015 RHP.

 LOL....please...A good spirited debate in the offseason is exactly what we needed!  I am pretty sure that is one thing, and maybe the only thing, that we can all agree on

Agreed.  Vigorous exchanges of opinion with good will are what this site is all about!