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Originally Posted by CaCO3Girl:
Originally Posted by Golfman25:
Originally Posted by CaCO3Girl:

Admin can we just close this thread already? 

No don't close it.  It's a decent thread. 

 

But I think we all need some perspective.  First, while not indicated, I'm guessing this is a small town school in Indiana (where basketball is king).  So the talent level doesn't necessarily surprise me.  Maybe the kid has the talent to play at this school, maybe he doesn't.  None of us really know.  The dad is obviously frustrated by what he perceives as a lack of "fairness."  Yes life isn't fair.  His question was how to deal with it and he has gotten some good advice, between "attacks."  Hopefully his eyes are opened and he can move forward.   

The dad is questioning why his 11th grade son who bats singles and has a .360 against maybe 75 mph pitching isn't on varsity....I'm amazed the board has held it civil this long.....me thinks it's gonna blow!!!!

That would make Varsity at most schools in our league. 

If you look at my original post I was looking for insight on what a V coach is looking for.  Instead I got hammered because his arm is less than average because he pitches when I never asked about pitching at the V level.  I know he is not quite ready.  Even though the V coach used two pitchers just the other day that are slower than my son by 2-3 MPH and they failed which is why I said hes not ready.  Never said anything about 1st and was beat up over that because V coaches look for power at the corners.  He will play 1st at JV because he is the best they got.  On the V team the 1st baseman is a junior as well and is really good there and proven just about impossible to take that position away from him.  I said hes not slow and then everyone says he slow.  He is about 7-8 as far as speed on the total team V and JV.  I put him at 11-12 as far as rank overall but the 7-14 guys are all very close.  Each has their good points and each have their weakness.  ie one has a good bat ok arm but is slow.  My sons arm in that group is average some a little better some a little worse.  My sons bat is one of the better ones and getting batter.  It just really frustrating watching some thing happen for example a kid went out this year and hasn't swung a bat or thrown a ball in 3 years and because he played for the HC coach 3 years age on a travel ball team he is on V.  Logic would tell you ease him in with a few JV starts so he gets the feel of the game again and lets see how her performs.  NOPE first at bat in 3 years up at V. Just defies logic and really I feel bad for the kid because he is a nice kid and all the coach did was really set him up to fail.  He really didn't have a chance.  Just a lot of thing in HS baseball defies common sense.  So I give up with this board even though I did get some good thoughts and will sit back and watch and see what happens.  

Originally Posted by Irondad:

If you look at my original post I was looking for insight on what a V coach is looking for.  Instead I got hammered because his arm is less than average because he pitches when I never asked about pitching at the V level.  I know he is not quite ready.  Even though the V coach used two pitchers just the other day that are slower than my son by 2-3 MPH and they failed which is why I said hes not ready.  Never said anything about 1st and was beat up over that because V coaches look for power at the corners.  He will play 1st at JV because he is the best they got.  On the V team the 1st baseman is a junior as well and is really good there and proven just about impossible to take that position away from him.  I said hes not slow and then everyone says he slow.  He is about 7-8 as far as speed on the total team V and JV.  I put him at 11-12 as far as rank overall but the 7-14 guys are all very close.  Each has their good points and each have their weakness.  ie one has a good bat ok arm but is slow.  My sons arm in that group is average some a little better some a little worse.  My sons bat is one of the better ones and getting batter.  It just really frustrating watching some thing happen for example a kid went out this year and hasn't swung a bat or thrown a ball in 3 years and because he played for the HC coach 3 years age on a travel ball team he is on V.  Logic would tell you ease him in with a few JV starts so he gets the feel of the game again and lets see how her performs.  NOPE first at bat in 3 years up at V. Just defies logic and really I feel bad for the kid because he is a nice kid and all the coach did was really set him up to fail.  He really didn't have a chance.  Just a lot of thing in HS baseball defies common sense.  So I give up with this board even though I did get some good thoughts and will sit back and watch and see what happens.  

You asked in your original post "What is a varsity coach looking for?  Just don't get it"...so let me spell it out for you.  I know of at least 5 TWELVE year olds throwing in the low 70's.....yet you are talking about your kid playing in college and getting instruction from a D1 coach...THAT is what you are missing and what others on here have been skirting around.

Irondad - you pointed out that your son was a lefty.  Assuming he is not ready to pitch, that essentially leaves 1B, OF and DH.  From your comments it sounds like 1B and DH are not options at this point either (I did ask you to provide a scenario of where you see him playing and used 1B as an example given he is a lefty).  If you agree so far, that leaves OF.  Based on your comments about speed and possibly arm strength, would you rule out CF and RF also?  If so, we are down to LF which generally is a lesser talented outfielder but someone who has decent power or perhaps in your case someone who can get on base.

 

Would you start him at any of the varsity OF positions today?  If not, what does he need to improve upon to start at any of the OF positions?  My 2017 is a lefty and had a hard time understanding that once he got done with park ball his infield days (other than 1B) were history (he played occassional SS in park ball - fun to watch).  Now in high school, he realizes that he is probably not the best fit for 1B.  While he plays a wonderful 1B and has a pretty good bat, there are others that play a decent 1B but have much more power.  As a result, he now concentrates on OF and LHP (with an occassional 1B when the balance of the lineup requires). 

Originally Posted by CaCO3Girl:
 

You asked in your original post "What is a varsity coach looking for?  Just don't get it"...so let me spell it out for you.  I know of at least 5 TWELVE year olds throwing in the low 70's.....yet you are talking about your kid playing in college and getting instruction from a D1 coach...THAT is what you are missing and what others on here have been skirting around.

This is funny, you are beginning to sound like TPM here..lol!  

 

It doesnt take long before one realizes that there are some that come here and even after 4 pages of good advice,  that they just dont get it.

 

And if you tell it straight up, well than you are perceived as being mean!

Originally Posted by Irondad:

If you look at my original post I was looking for insight on what a V coach is looking for.

I'll make this short and sweet.

No one aside from the V HC will know what the V HC is looking for.  We can guess all day long, but it will depend on what he "has" and what he perceives he needs.

 

Period.  End of story.

 

Go enjoy your son playing ball.

Originally Posted by TPM:
Originally Posted by CaCO3Girl:
 

You asked in your original post "What is a varsity coach looking for?  Just don't get it"...so let me spell it out for you.  I know of at least 5 TWELVE year olds throwing in the low 70's.....yet you are talking about your kid playing in college and getting instruction from a D1 coach...THAT is what you are missing and what others on here have been skirting around.

This is funny, you are beginning to sound like TPM here..lol!  

 

It doesnt take long before one realizes that there are some that come here and even after 4 pages of good advice,  that they just dont get it.

 

And if you tell it straight up, well than you are perceived as being mean!

LOL I actually thought while writing this "Crud, I really sound like TPM here but dangit this guy is just being SOOOO thick skulled!"  I mean how many pages will the board allow here on a topic that is clearly NOT getting through?

Originally Posted by Irondad:

If you look at my original post I was looking for insight on what a V coach is looking for.  Instead I got hammered because his arm is less than average because he pitches when I never asked about pitching at the V level. ... Never said anything about 1st and was beat up over that because V coaches look for power at the corners.

 

Irondad, you did say in your OP... "his sophomore year he batted... and played RF, 1st, and Pitched." so most replies were, in part, an effort to cover those positions for YOUR benefit.  Lack of arm strength and power are given as likely reasons behind the coach decision regarding your son.  Nothing about this is "defying common sense". 

 

 I said he's not slow and then everyone says he slow.  He is about 7-8 as far as speed on the total team V and JV.

 

It is a reasonable assumption that when you say he is not slow, he is likely not one of the fastest, which is the case.  The point being made was that if he were to stand out among his teammates for V opportunity and he doesn't have power or arm strength, he would need to be one of the fastest, not middle of the pack.  Again, not hammering you but stating likely reason behind why he may not be getting that opportunity based on the info you provided.  And again, this does not defy common sense.

 

 It just really frustrating watching some thing happen for example a kid went out this year and hasn't swung a bat or thrown a ball in 3 years and because he played for the HC coach 3 years age on a travel ball team he is on V.  Logic would tell you ease him in with a few JV starts so he gets the feel of the game again and lets see how her performs.  

 

We have a senior in our program this year.  He came out last summer.  He hadn't played since middle school.  Great character kid, great speed and natural athleticism, busts his butt 100% of the time.  In spite of this, we figured there was no way he would be able to catch up with baseball skills - we'd eventually have to cut him.  He took every opportunity to work hard and get better.  At one point, he made us recognize that he could, at least, be very valuable as a situational baserunner.  We considered having him on board just for that role - pinch runner.  That's not the type of thing you generally do to a JV kid who needs to play and get AB's.  Then, he started to prove he can track balls down in OF with the best of them and be smart about defensive situations.  Then, he started showing he had very quick hands and could battle at the plate against pretty good V pitching.  He stuck by working extremely hard, having above average athleticism and standing out.  He stuck by forcing us not to cut him.  It would have done zero good to have him ease into things by playing a few JV games.  He had a specific role he would fill with the V team.  He would get ramped up for that role much more quickly at our V practices and inter-squads than in a few JV games.  I'm not saying this is the same scenario as the player on your team but I hope it opens your eyes to some possibilities.    

 

 So I give up with this board even though I did get some good thoughts...

 

That would be unfortunate.  Some of the posts were abrupt and/or abrasive.  Most of those were because that's what the poster thought you needed to hear.  Sometimes they are correct.  You seem to have a pretty good handle on your son's situation in many ways and in other ways you are being the parent with extra tint on your rose colored glasses.  We've all been there.  This place can help.

 

My youngest son is finishing his sophomore playing year in college.  Pretty good year.  My rose colored parent glasses selectively see that he is at or near the top of the conference leaderboard in fielding %, OF assists, batting OBP (ironically) and fewest K's per AB.  Wooohooo!  Surely all-conference, right?  Not quite.  Looking at all the other numbers, the ones that tend to get the most attention, he is closer to middle of the pack. Despite having an extensive background in the game, I learned much balance and perspective as a parent of a player here at HSBBW.  Getting "hammered" a bit the first few times isn't out of the ordinary.  Be one of the smart ones and hang around.

 

Last edited by cabbagedad
Originally Posted by bballman:

This is going nowhere....

 

I stand by this.  

 

Although I don't think it needs to be closed.  It is still fairly entertaining and has not devolved into the depths of controversy I have seen other threads get into.  If you don't like it, just quit reading it.  Not trying to be mean, just sayin......

Sometimes these topics need to stay open.  It is unfortunate that IronDad has to read all the comments.  But we are not really speaking to IronDad, I have no idea who he is.  Sounds like just another one of us, loves his son and wants the best for him.  We parents are all guilty at times of being a little one sided.  I think that is normal!

 

More important is what others that read these posts might learn, without actually taking any punishment.  I think there are lots of parents that can learn from the topics discussed here.  So I thank "IronDad" for jumping into the fire, because many others might benefit from hearing all the opinions.

 

What would closing the thread accomplish?  Someone might gather some important information if it is kept open.  IronDad, you have done nothing wrong, stay around and you might end up liking it.  I hope you and your son have some great baseball memories. And we all have had some bad baseball memories, too.  We only have opinions and those we have given you.  There is nothing personal!

PGStaff - thanks for the insight about "not really speaking to IronDad".  I cannot begin to tell you how many posts I have read - well after they were written to others - that have either directly answered a question/concern I may have had or made me think about a situation a little differently.  And to cabbagedad for the nice summary and the invitation for IronDad to stick around.  Maybe we should gather up all the threads addressing this type of issue and put under a new forum called "Intervention".

There was some good stuff here.  It really shows that there really isn't a set answer on what a coach looks for.  I have a feeling my son is on JV because the coach knows he doesn't want to sit on the bench.  But he should tell him that.  The way some of the posts sound most of our V team would be JV at the bigger schools, because maybe one or two would fit the mold of a Varsity High School player.  But once again people saying they have sophomores throwing in the low to mid 80's is completely possible but around here not happening.  I have watched a lot of summer ball with 15U and 16U and few around here throw in the low 80's.  A lot throw in the upper 70's. When he played on the 15U team my son only seen maybe 3 or 4 that fast in 25+ games and one was a pickup game against an 17U team.  So that is what I am seeing.  That is why I have trouble with what several posters are saying because I just don't see it around here but of course the world is a big place.  To go back to the D1 coach my son is seeing at least in the off season, can't see him when high school season is happening,  I took him there to get instruction, the high school coach really doesn't work with anyone on pitching, so you are on your own to get instruction to get better. From what I see and have seen around here if you throw 80 you are a prime starting pitcher for V. My sons goals to hit 77-78 by next year which is a big goal but not impossible he has changed a lot in his form.  From there I think he has a chance to play college ball a chance.  Getting stronger is a big thing for his next year as well.  He knows what he needs to do and we will see if he gets there.  

I may have mentioned this before but there were 2 seniors (twins by the way) on Varsity in our town that went to a small college in Arkansas.  One of the kids was a lefty pitcher that average 75 mph. The other kid was a good fielder and hitter.  

 

I believe there is a college baseball program somewhere for most Varsity level players.  

 

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