LakePoint

Do scouts and college coaches pay gate fees/parking fees?  Guess the school picks up the tab if they do, so no big deal for them. For reg folks it can add up.

 

Imo, son played one game at LP yr  after his jr yr in HS, first yr it opened. I'm sure more has been added now. We stayed in hotel about 20 min away.  yes, there were a lot of scouts/coaches there. they were all on ground going from field/field. Sure some have gone to upstairs viewing area, maybe not.  Unfortunately son did not pitch that game, we pitched our P who was committed already to top 5 team, and their P C was there to watch him. no one on our team was "noticed" by anyone at LP that day. Most had their list of players that  they were there to watch.

coach at my sons school saw him P next day at different facility, which my son liked because he hates fake mounds. 

LP is fun to see, but personally I liked facility near Indy better. Wasn't as big, expensive.

guess each his own. I'm old school. Give me good HS field, or sm college, nice weather, and it's all good.

We did  like PG tourn, and enjoyed Atlanta area/trip. 

I suggest that each and every family decide whether any trip or tournament is worth what they might get out of it, if finances are a concern. 

While I can understand the concerns regarding cost of parking, I am extremely surprised by many of the other comments.

 

Why do the lights need to be that good?  Seriously?

 

Don't like artificial turf?  If a player keeps playing he will end up playing on several artificial turf fields.  No bad hops, weather not as big of a concern.  Same field in the 9th inning as the 1st inning.  Same mound every inning for every pitcher.

 

Don't like spending money at concessions if it goes to a corporation?  Wouldn't no concessions get even more complaints.  Either way I guess there is a complaint.

 

Can't bring food or beverage in?  Is this really unusual in baseball?  It is pretty much that way everywhere we play.

 

My player is not someone that benefits from being seen by all the scouts and college coaches?  What does that have to do with LakePoint?  No one forces anyone to play there.  

 

Last year there were only 4 fields.  By far the biggest complaint was from the teams that didn't get to play there.

 

This spring we had several major DI games transferred to LakePoint due to weather issues.  We had top prospect pitchers perform as expected.  The feedback from coaches and scouts was great.  

 

Truth is, I have read more complaints here than anywhere else.  We do take complaints seriously, this, just like last year, there seems to be some piling on here.  Some of the complaints are about the very things we think make LP a special place.

 

So reasonable complaints are understandable.  But as I read through many of these posts  it seems like a lot of unreasonable and unusual complaints.  If you really think it is so bad, don't go there.  We need to spend our time trying to make things better.  We are not going to rip up the turf and bring in dirt.  We are not going to replace the lights with something cheaper.  We "PG" do not control the hotel situation, the parking, the concessions, or the kiosks.  We do control the events and the gate.  

 

I doubt that any good business person would post responses on a message board.  I'm just not that smart!

The no cooler policies at other local fields either don't exist or are routinely unenforced, especially for players and families with small children.  I can bring food and beverages into Turner field, but can't at LakePoint.  

 

People are far more inclined to pay for concessions when it's clear that profit is going to the local HS/park than to LakePoint/PG/Coke/etc.  I don't know why that's surprising given the demographics of the attendees (parents of HS or eventual HS baseball players).

 

The turf is nice for avoiding rainouts, but the "truer" bounces are actually a minor impediment for players not used to the way the ball bounces on this stuff, especially in the OF where the ball can really take off on occassion.  Baseball's supposed to be played on grass, and I don't think that sentiment's going to be easily overcome in the long run.  I've also spoken to a number of pitchers who prefer dirt mounds to the turf, though they do prefer the turf to poorly maintained dirt.

 

Walk around the facility, and you'll hear all these complaints from the attendees, this isn't limited to just online.

 

I don't get why you don't understand that everything anyone doesn't like about LakePoint is going to get laid at PGs feet. Literally every parent I know that isn't aware of websites like this is unaware that PG =/= LakePoint.  PGs name is all over everything at LakePoint, for better or worse LakePoint is PG with regards to anything baseball related to the typical consumer.

Let me reiterate that my post is in no way an attack on PG... I think they do a great job and PGStaff has helped many many kids that not every one knows about....

 

I personally feel that LP is way over the to..... is it nice yes very nice.... but it has a Disney Land / World feel.... even if you google Lake Point it says The Premier Sports "Vacation" Destination.  This strikes me as odd as well.....

 

It's no secret that in the past 10 years the travel baseball industry has exploded.   When my oldest was starting to play travel baseball you had to travel to get good competition.   We played at high schools and some PG events in Florida... 

 

It just seems that LP is like a Cooperstown or Disney..  With scouts.....

 

Now I'm an old schooler.... I like baseball on dirt and grass.  PGStaff what I mean by my lights statement is LP could have gotten the next level down lights .....

 

I mean why do HS baseball players have to have all the best stuff right now in High School?  LP is nice it's nicer than most college fields and minor league fields.... but is not a college or minor league field.... they do not have enough foul territory to be considered a college or minor leagues field. 

 

Now I understand that a many college teams went and played down there in March when the weather was so bad.... and that's great.... but the reason the turf is at LP is to maximize the amount of games that are played to make money.

 

Now as far as going to PG WWBA and LP and all of that... I have been many many times, my sons team has won the WWBA  18's  

 

Parents when you go to LP/ PG eat before you go.... and take a bottle of water... are they telling people they cannot bring in a personal 16oz water?  If so that is a health issue and should be dealt with... Pay the 5-10 dollars to park.... watch your son play and then leave... never to give LP another thought....Sure it's overblown , sure its commercialized to death.... but it is what it is... be more concerned about you son..and how he plays.

 

I would also add that while PG is great at what they do,  so is Area Code tryouts which is free..... Prep Baseball Report, college camps etc.... remember if you are good enough they will find you , they have to it's their job...

 

They routinely ask people to throw away food/beverages on the way in, including water.

 

It's not especially hard to sneak in food/water if they're not checking bags, which they weren't at this weekend's event as far as I could see.  I know they did at one point check bags last year, and I haven't tried walking in with a cooler bag (just a camera bag this weekend.

Its so crowded that nobody goes there anymore!

 

If my kid is a Stud and LP is where the Studs hang out....we will be there. I'm gonna spend a lot of money so I hope they have nice turf fields and good lighting so we can play all night if there is a weather issue. Everything is expensive these days, you just suck it up and pay the lady.

Is your kid a stud?   What is a stud?  Why would the studs only hang out at LP ?

 

I understand what you are saying ...... but if your son is a stud.... its not a requirement to attend LP or PG for that matter.

 

 I would say that it is easier for scouts to go to one place and see multiple players. keep in mind colleges recruit on need.

PG Staff, I appreciate you interacting with your customers on this forum. I spent this weekend at LP and was very impressed with the facilities. They are as nice as you will ever see. I love the radar gun posting up on the scoreboard and the Game Changer guys are great. The staff all over the park are incredible polite and friendly. My issue is with the nickel and dime types fees after we have paid our portion for the team's entry fee, which I believe can range from$1k to $2.5k, we then have to pay for parking (I know it's LP, but it's a PG event) then pay to get in and then pay movie theater food prices. The point I would make is that I pay my son's travel team their fee which is then paid to you and then you take $15 for parking and $30 from me  for entry to be able to watch my son play. The combination of all costs left me with a mixed feeling about LP/PG because it seems like a cash grab and just because you can do doesn't mean you should. You guys could do nothing and keep things the way they are and leave parents with a mixed feeling about PG,which is a shame because of all the great things you do. 

 

Secondly, while the fields are nice they are rough on pitchers. The balls are taken straight out of the box and very slick. There is no way for a pitcher to rub up the ball or get some dirt on it, which hurts their ability to throw curves and sliders. I saw a bunch of kids struggling with that and doesn't allow them to show their true ability. It will,also force kids to use pine tar and other sticky substances to try and better grip the ball, which we all know would not be a good thing. How about a littel tray of dirt behind the mound to help with that or just having the umps rub up the balls prior to the game. It's an issue that needs to be addressed. 

My sons have played a LP and at Belmont University and Vanderbilt University.  They hate the turf..... not to mention you need to get another set of rubber cleats or turfs since they cannot allow spikes on the turf...

 

Baseball was meant to be played outside on dirt and grass.... the conditions vary from field to field ....part of the game....

 

I understand the rationalizations... my youngest is playing PG events this summer with two different teams.   I really hope we do not play at LP ... I guess each team will play at least one game there.

 

having a few in college ball, LP reminds me of little league world series or Cooperstown.... not high level 17 and 18 year old baseball

Guess everything is relative. It's been decades since my son's HS has put a dollar into it's field. 520' to CF, over 400' to the alleys, and about 360' down the lines. Chopped up infield and slanted outfield. No dugouts, just a bench behind a fence. Antiquated BP cage. And from a spectator's perspective, horrible sightlines.. Good news is they may, may renovate the field next summer. We'll see.

But he'll be besides himself down at LP. He was that way at ESPN Wide World of Sports in Orlando this spring. So as a dad, I'll pay the few extra bucks gladly, as it will bring joy to my kid.

OK Slider, just so you don't get your feelings hurt too bad....let's say (good baseball) if that is where it's at then that's where we want to go!

 

I assume there will be some upgrades and maintenance someday and these fees will probably be applied. Is there any place to go where you walk out and say.....Wow! that was too cheap!

 

 

Honestly, I can't believe the amount of complaining about LP and PG.  When it comes down to it, the only extra fee since moving to LP is the parking.  PG has ALWAYS charged $10 per day as a gate fee.  Their tournaments have ALWAYS been more expensive than most.  What you are paying for is the opportunity to play in front of more scouts and recruiters than you will at any other venue anywhere.  

 

Used to be people complained that they paid all this money to play baseball and when it rained, PG wasn't responsive enough in getting the fields playable and games were cancelled.  So, they built turf fields so that wouldn't happen.  Now people complain about that.  The main venue used to be ECB.  Their concession prices aren't that much more than LP.  I'm not sure they let you bring in big coolers there either.  Maybe they did, but we usually bought our waters, gatorades and food at the concession stand.  

 

I don't think PG raised their prices for the tournaments or the gate fees at all since they moved into LP.  I don't think they built turf fields just to collect more money.  They did it because everyone was complaining that too many games were cancelled because of rain.  I think the reason they put the good lights in there because they wanted to be a state of the art facility with the newest technology out there.  That's what businesses do as they expand.  I don't think their prices went up at all because of that.  What they have done is in response to consumer demand.  And people still complain.  The consumers are the teams that come to play as well as the scouts and recruiters that come to look at the baseball players.  Everything they do has been to have the best available facilities for them.  And yet people still complain.  Get over it and appreciate being able to play in possibly the nicest facilities in the country.

 

And you don't have to be a top round MLB prospect to be recruited at a PG event.  There are schools from EVERY college level there to see kids play.  Whether it be a top D1 school or an average D3 school.  There are recruiters there from every level.  So, the exposure you will potentially get from attending a PG event could very well lead you to playing in college somewhere.  They don't do the work for you, but they provide a venue to increase exposure for everyone.

 

Like I said in the beginning, the only thing that has changed over the years is the parking fee.  I can't believe there is this much discourse over probably $30 over the week for parking.  Maybe not even that much because very few teams will be playing there for 6 days.  

my feelings are not hurt in anyway.... I was just wondering what a player a stud has to do with going to LP

I said twice that I was not bashing PG...... I also feel there is advantage to playing in front many recruiters from any level of college ball.  It just seems to me that we are giving younger players everything before they earn it....and sometimes false hope

 

When I walked in the tents from Rawlings, under armor etc... was  huge turn-off for me...I did like the fact that they were having an umpire clinic
 

Just remember before you go if you are a 16 or 17 that you are on a few schools lists.... These guys just don't show up to a game and say who is that kid?  They don't have the time for that.... They have a list of the players and what positions they need to fill.

 

Like I said there is nothing wrong with LP .... but it's not a requirement to getting a college offer.... through the years I have heard a lot of parents think that once their travel team gets to WWBA all their worries will be over and all those recruiters and scouts will see jonny for what he is.

 

Chances are most players are going to going to back home and get there mail box stuffed with camp invites.  Most teams will not make it out of pool play.

Btw, here's how you deal with the parking. 1st day I drive in with my son. Guys says $5. I say, my son is playing. I thought players get in free? He says yeah but you don't and have to pay parking. I say, so you're telling me that if he was driving we wouldn't have to pay. He says that's correct. So I pay.

Next day we stop, jump out in the Chick-fail-A parking lot and switch sides so my son can drive in and I sit in the passenger seat and we get in free. The policy is arbitrary and run by a bunch of teenagers making up the rules of who they're gonna charge as they go. So if you have a kid who can drive just have him drive in. I think it's pretty stupid that we had to do that because what difference does it make? If I'm driving him he has to get the ballpark as well.

And yes, that is a another complaint. LP  is beautiful and PG runs the best tournaments in the country but it doesn't make them immune from some criticism so to the holier than thou community on this thread, feel free to keep on being the mindless lemmings that enjoy being gauged over trivial fees that are frankly insulting after the amount of money we have to keep shelling out. Yes, this is for the kids, but the parents are the real customers.

bacdorslider, why do you think my comments were directed specifically at you?  There are plenty of people on here bashing PG.  

 

I agree, there is plenty of work to be done outside of the WWBA events if you want to get recruited.  I agree, showing up at a PG event is not a magical formula for getting a scholarship.  But it is the place where more scouts and recruiters will be than any other organization.  If you have some irons in the fire, the scouts and recruiters from those place will most likely be at a PG event to be able to see you.

 

Not directing my comments specifically at you.  I'm directing them to the board in general.  I just think it's crazy how bad PG is getting crucified here.  And it really just comes down to a $5 parking fee. Come on man!!

sorry if I took your comment the wrong way....  I just think that every year parents feel that they are being hit up for more and more... the travel baseball industry is banking on the emotion of the parents. 

What you are saying here is insulting, Rover.  I don't think anyone here who says good things about PG is a mindless lemming.  

 

If you don't like what you are paying for - don't go!!!  No one is making you.  If you are paying the fees now, consider yourself a mindless lemming as well.  That comment just pisses me off.  

Speaking of being pissed off.... LP and PG do not bother me as much as the NCAA ...whew !

Lol.  What a mess that is.  My son plays D2 and the way they run their post season is a joke.  

Bball, I'm an actual paying customer so I get to offer my opinion if I want. Your condescension towards others on this board is a bit on the blowhard side of things and if you're so pissed about the lemming comment I'll apologize for touching a nerve there. I said many favorable things about LP/PG and praised them. They are not the end all of recruiting but offer a nice opportunity for Scouts to come see you play. Just because they can gouge people doesn't mean they should.

As the founder of the Area Code games in 1987, I can relate the experience of the  "promoter" of all "showcases". However I never charged the players for tryouts or the games. The player average signing bonus of $35 million per year.

 

In 1994 we rented the stadium from the San Jose Giants Minor league team.

 

The SJ Giants received all concession revenues and provide parking for the scouts. On the final day they placed a parking fee for the scouts. I countered this and was told this is instructions from management.

 

4 of the Stadium employees approach me in the stadium and they took a swing "rip my shirt" and I "back up" and I pulled both leg muscles.

 

Of course, the pro scouts and parents, including a lawyer observed this conformation. They laugh about this today, as they observed from the upper deck.

 

"THE HAZARDS OF PROMOTION"

 

Bob

"the rest of the story"

 

 

I for one thank PG for opening up their facility to the younger kids this year...my son is in awe of playing where the high school boys play...and the score boards are pretty cool from what I hear.  So, PG you have made a 12 year old boy VERY happy, and I will gladly pay the parking fee, the gate fee, and the concession fee to see him smile this Friday

I don't think anybody is really criticizing anybody.  Lake Point with all of in amenities was/is an expensive project.  Some may thing a little bit overboard.  We get it.  And we understand that it has to be paid for.  But this is marketing 101.  Will people "pay up" to play in a nicer facility?  If you build the costs into the price of the tournaments and let people park or enter for "free" you get the money without all of the complaints.

 

It is like the airline bag fees.  People don't really like them, but they are a revenue producer for the airlines.  The difference being that airlines compete on seat price. So to keep that low, they "a la carte" the bag fees.  I am not sure that the tournament fee at Lake Point needs to be low given the amenities.   

This will be NTGson's 4th year playing in the WWBA, and the experience of playing at LakePoint was the highlight of last year, a vast improvement over East Cobb. It was especially gratifying that he was asked as a 16U to be the extra arm for his program's 17U quarterfinal game.

 

BUT, last year a member of his 16U team experienced a significant injury when he collided with a  teammate while chasing a popup. He suffered a compound fracture of both bones in his lower leg. The medical staff at LP responded quickly, compassionately and efficiently. However, the ambulance crew could not bring their vehicle directly to the field. The scouting tower area and its posts, seats, and other permanently-installed elements left no space for an emergency vehicle. Apparently, access to the field (back right corner) was either extremely limited or so restricted in size at the outfield fence area that an ambulance was not able to make its way directly to the field.

 

Consequently, the injured player was down on the turf, being tended to by LP and PG trainers and medical staff plus the county EMTs for no less than 20 minutes and possibly more while a method of transport was devised. There was no medical transport cart on the grounds. The injured young man had to be gurneyed by hand from the outfield, through the scouting tower area, down the concourse and out to the gate. I would hope that LP has remedied the situation so that emergency vehicles can reach the fields directly to avoid such a delay or has acquired some form of medical transport which can go on the fields.

 

We look forward to our return to LakePoint for the 17UWWBA and hope that NTGson's team plays more than just a pool game or two at the facility.

 

Now, that is a valid complaint/criticism.  Hopefully, this has been addressed since last year.

Oh good. Thanks for letting us know which of complaints are valid.

NotThatGuy,

 

I know this might be hard to believe, but I'm not aware of the situation you refer to.  I wasn't at that event and when I see medical reports it doesn't or didn't include the things you have mentioned.

 

These are the things that are extremely important.  I don't even consider this a complaint.  In fact, it is more of a favor.  I do believe we now have equipment to transport injured players.  I can guarantee you that if we don't, we will have by this week.  In addition, we will see what it takes to get the best possible access for ambulances.

 

We have had the med helicopter land right on the field.  Not sure what the medical staff on site decided in this case.

 

I thank you for mentioning this.  I do wonder why no one brought this up earlier.  Also thanks for the other kind words.

 

On another topic, we (PG) do NOT sell dreams.  That would be dishonest as well as impossible.  We provide opportunity with absolutely no guarantees. The events are very valuable for some and not so much for others.  The parents with rose colored glasses will discover this in a hurry.  We will not magically make a player become a draft pick or get a college scholarship.  Because we have seen thousands of players go on to college and professional baseball we are very good at recognizing talent.  If your player has talent, you're likely to be very happy with us.  If your player lacks talent, you will be throwing your money away.

No problem Rover.  Glad to help.  

NotThatGuy,

 

Thanks again, for bringing that to my attention.  We now have a new high level medical transport cart.  We still will look into ambulance entry way.

I definitely believe that for all players this is a great experience for everyone. I don't think that is the issue.

I understand because we only live 40 minutes from Jupiter so WWBA was never an issue, since we didn't need to stay in hotels, paying extra costs not expected was not a problem or a thought.

I know many players that my son has played with over the years, never attending a WWBA in jupiter due to costs. If you live close by its always a plus.

Dont you live in the area?  Imagine a family traveling from out of state needing to stay at hotels, eat out 3-4 meals a day plus whatever fees they paid for the team. Then all of those extras do add up.  

 

Wow.  This has really blown up in the wrong direction.

 

1) We love Perfect Game.  We love what they do for exposure for our kids and what they have done for travel baseball.  They are simply a vehicle, folks.  They put on tournaments and showcases where the top kids can show what they can do.  If you don't like them or feel you have a better way, don't attend their stuff. I know when the EvoCanes go to PG events, our games are attended by 20+ major D-1 coaches EVERY GAME.  For our kids, this is important.  100 kids in the 2015 class signed to D-1 scholarships have worn the EvoCanes uniform.

 

2) I don't think many of you complaining about Lake Point have heard what PGStaff is saying about LP - complaining here solves nothing. PG will listen, interact and make changes based on posts here.  If you have a problem with Lake Point's policies, complain to them.  I plan to contact them regarding the parking fee.  I don't like it and I'm not even a parent.  

 

3) To PGStaff, I think Lake Point is great.  As a coach, I appreciate the facility.  As a consumer, I simply have an issue with making parents reach into their pockets twice before they step foot into the park.  This is not a PG issue but it reflects back on PG to the consumer.  

I talked to my sons about their exp. at LP.... and oddly the older two did not really care one way or the other except for the mounds.... Neither like the mounds... But that is a person preference I guess.  They said that as far as fields they would rather play on grass and dirt... But it was not a huge deal to them.  They also said that they liked the fact that there  were so many goods teams, players, coaches, scouts, recruiters in one place. They liked to watch other games and interact with people they have met over the years... But they are 21 and 20 now... and are used to recruiters, scouts, radar guns , etc...

 

Now the younger two are all about it.... being 2016 and 2018 they and their friends cannot wait to get to LP.... they like the park, the turf, the vendors and all the recruiters... I think it makes them feel like they are "in the game" so to speak... or as important as big brother, or something like that.

 

 

This is the response of an enlightened businessman. What PGStaff doesn't say is that the cart was purchased within hours of my original post at a $20,000+ cost. I wish other businesses would react so decisively. Kudos to PG.

I've been reading the posts here. I don't really like the fees, either, but my take is that the entire "exposure" industry is a business. That is how businesses operate and how they fix their prices and fees. What the market will bear will determine the price. You don't have to like it, but PG and Lake Point aren't required to consider "fairness" when they fix their prices. If use of their services decrease or a competitor offers like services at a lower price, then those prices will move. Bottom line is that it is a business that provides a service and they are entitled to treat it as a business.

Here's a suggestion brought up on another board that I thought was worthwhile bringing up here - particularly for you PG. It was noticed over the Memorial Day Tournament that there was no flag pole with an American Flag at the complex. With the National Anthem being played before pretty much every baseball game, it may be a good idea to have a flag somewhere in the baseball complex.

 

And that is how good things happen!

 

In my background as an Athletic Trainer, I can tell you that this type of situation is almost always forgotten about. Or ignored. I am glad to see that PG and LakePoint have addressed this issue.

 

I encourage others to take a look around your ballparks whether travel baseball or high school baseball. How can emergency crews best access the facilities? 

 

I can tell you that at my first high school, emergency access onto the football field was nearly impossible-- on purpose! There was one gate big enough for a vehicle coming out of the parking lot and into the stadium complex. But to get to the field, you had to drive through the stands to another gate. This gate was literally only inches wide enough for an ambulance (we learned the hard way!). The second school I was at the football field had no direct access. The ambulance had to jump a 10" curb to gain access to the gate onto the field... again, ON PURPOSE! Also, the softball field was unaccessible by emergency crews. The only gate wide enough to think about putting any type of vehicle through required driving through a ditch and alongside the batting cage to gain access to the outfield. The dugouts were built in such a way that a gurney would have to weave through the dugout to access the field.

 

The school I am at now has a designated ambulance gate that comes from the main road onto the football field. The baseball field is accessible by gurney through the third base dugout off the football field or by ambulance through a gate in left field, again off the football field. Problem is, football likes to block that gate with stuff

 

Right now, our Athletic Training Staff has access to a MULE and a GATOR but neither of them are appropriately equipped for patient transport. We are working to hopefully acquire an appropriate transport vehicle in the near future.

Bballman,

Thanks, it is a good idea!  We will take care of the flag issue.  Personally, being a veteran, I still love to see the flag at all ball parks.  It is important and we're going to do It.  Can't believe we haven't already done that.

Well my son's 12u team played at Lakepoint this weekend.  As promised I had zero problem with paying the parking, gate and concession fee...the facility is TRULY amazing.  My only glitch was that I had to pay for my 5 year old daughter...she doesn't care about baseball, she was there because I am her caretaker....that seemed a bit wrong.