Did anyone else share this yet?
I'm really sad to lose the spinners but I guess it makes sense that there is not enough room for both them and the Woo Sox.
Will these kids be looking for spots in the collegiate leagues?
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Thank you for sharing CMass.
That is some SAD stuff! Our son played for the Auburn Doubledays. That City needed the team and built a wonderful stadium. The community support was terrific.
We also saw the Lowell Spinners when our son played in the NECBL. Our son played in the field against Team USA. What a fantastic baseball MILB location.
i love baseball but I pretty much detest the “business “ of MLB and their desire to make a $ no matter the impact.
We are thrilled about the experiences baseball brought for our son. On the other hand, we are sickened to know all those people in great communities who made it possible for our son and many sons lose out to put more $$$$ into the pockets of billionaires.
@CmassRHPDad posted:Did anyone else share this yet?
I'm really sad to lose the spinners but I guess it makes sense that there is not enough room for both them and the Woo Sox.
Will these kids be looking for spots in the collegiate leagues?
The Spinners had a bigger problem than the new Worcester Sox. The New Hampshire Fisher Cats are only 35 miles north in Manchester NH. It placed the Spinners in the middle of a 75 mile stretch with three teams. They’re also short season competing against AA and AAA teams. I’ll bet a NECBL or Futures team ends up in the park in the summer. UML uses it in the spring.
Any thoughts on some of these teams going independent?
@RJM posted:I’ll bet a NECBL or Futures team ends up in the park in the summer.
I hope so. Maybe the bravehearts. I know they were pretty disappointed to see the Woo Sox come to town.
I always thought that there were too many levels.
I dont understand why they do not just put all their newly drafted players together and have instruction for everyone and just play baseball, then assign them the following spring.
@TPM Sometimes it is hard to follow how many teams some organizations have. Rookie, short rookie, international rookie, 3 or 4 divisions of A, etc. I hate to see a consolidation as it means fewer players get to continue to chase their dreams. At the same time, some of them should stop and begin their post-baseball careers.
@TerribleBPthrower posted:@TPM Sometimes it is hard to follow how many teams some organizations have. Rookie, short rookie, international rookie, 3 or 4 divisions of A, etc. I hate to see a consolidation as it means fewer players get to continue to chase their dreams. At the same time, some of them should stop and begin their post-baseball careers.
Agree.
Two teams that my son played on are on the cut list. I can tell you both places were terrible. Why would you ever spend money on a player then put them in an economically depressed town with horrible field conditions to play in a stadium with no one there? He was sent there for short season Penn League right after the draft and unfortunetly twisted his ankle in a hole in the outfield during PFP and fortunately sent to Jupiter for the rest of the season.
Had several guys drafted that I went and watched. Felt so bad for some of them in rookie ball. Playing on small fields with less than 25 people watching games. Some later in A and AA ball in bad conditions. I think some did it to see how bad they wanted it.
@TerribleBPthrower posted:@TPM Sometimes it is hard to follow how many teams some organizations have. Rookie, short rookie, international rookie, 3 or 4 divisions of A, etc. I hate to see a consolidation as it means fewer players get to continue to chase their dreams. At the same time, some of them should stop and begin their post-baseball careers.
With 84% of American MLBers now coming from the first ten rounds and 94% from the first twenty rounds a lot of MiLBers are chasing a mirage. They’re Single A roster filler for the legitimate prospects. A position player drafted after the twentieth round is really chasing a mirage.
(Waiting for someone to do the research and find the handful of American MLBers taken after the 20th round. It always happens with these kinds of posts as if it’s the norm.)
Years ago Mojo Network did a series on six D’Back prospects ... Carlos Quentin, Chris Young, Dustin Nippert (called up by Rangers, ended up in Korea) Brian Barden (called up by Cards), Bill Murphy (called up by Jays) and Casey Daigle (called up by D’Backs, married Jenny Finch)
Quentin said it was eerie playing in stadiums so empty he could hear the lights buzz while he was playing.
The funniest line was when Quentin was called up. He tossed his per diem money on the bed and counted it. He said, “Wow! This is more than my AAA paycheck!”
@RJM posted:With 84% of American MLBers now coming from the first ten rounds and 94% from the first twenty rounds a lot of MiLBers are chasing a mirage. They’re Single A roster filler for the legitimate prospects. A position player drafted after the twentieth round is really chasing a mirage.
(Waiting for someone to do the research and find the handful of American MLBers taken after the 20th round. It always happens with these kinds of posts as if it’s the norm.)
Here is one. Matt Adams aka Big City, currently with Mets, drafted by Cardinals in 2009.
Matt was drafted in the 23rd round out of Slippery Rock University, a D2 in Pennsylvania.
I often think that a lot of success is based upon how good a team is at developing players. Some obviously are better at it than others.
RipkenFanSon played part of last summer on one of the teams on the chopping block. Right when we were set to visit, he was moved up, so we didn't get out west.
He is chomping at the bit to get the season started. When I told him that like the majors, Milb games will likely be games without fans, he said "That's OK. Several of my college games were in nearly empty stadiums."
@Ripken Fan posted:RipkenFanSon played part of last summer on one of the teams on the chopping block. Right when we were set to visit, he was moved up, so we didn't get out west.
He is chomping at the bit to get the season started. When I told him that like the majors, Milb games will likely be games without fans, he said "That's OK. Several of my college games were in nearly empty stadiums."
Any word on what's happening. My son's Clemson mate just got a job as pitching coach for Charleston River Dogs. He is chomping at the bit too.
Most milb don't have large crowds unless they are close to the Big League team. I would rather see less teams and let the players get more money.
If one gets to play in Mexico, standing room only, every night, every town. They even let the convicts out to come watch games, amazing! Puerto Rico just about the same experience!
Nothings for sure. Some say no minor leagues at all this season, though you would think some of the higher levels would be in to be there for big league. I imagine all eyes are on the states that "reopened" earlier (like GA).
@TPM posted:I always thought that there were too many levels.
I dont understand why they do not just put all their newly drafted players together and have instruction for everyone and just play baseball, then assign them the following spring.
I read the article from 538.com and it basically said that 80% of the players in the minors are there to play the 20% that have a shot at the show.
@Shoveit4Ks posted:I read the article from 538.com and it basically said that 80% of the players in the minors are there to play the 20% that have a shot at the show.
Pareto Principle alive + well. Makes sense, thanks for sharing Shove ~
@Ripken Fan posted:Nothings for sure. Some say no minor leagues at all this season, though you would think some of the higher levels would be in to be there for big league. I imagine all eyes are on the states that "reopened" earlier (like GA).
My son has two friends that were drafted early last year. They are both home and said they have heard zero.
@Shoveit4Ks posted:I read the article from 538.com and it basically said that 80% of the players in the minors are there to play the 20% that have a shot at the show.
That's right, but why couldn't the 80% and the 20% have gotten instruction together? Or play together, perhaps not the HS drafted, who did usually get separated with the international players along with late senior signs.
Just a thought that I always had, too late now for that anyway.
Do your players get any benefits?
Teams are going to leverage the current situation to improve facilities, align teams regionally, and to reduce draft bonus offerings. The college Junior getting $100K as a 30th round pick is probably a thing of the past. It will be $20K or take your chance as a Senior. They are just trimming the budgets where there is no MLB players union to stop them. They are taking from the most poorly funded area but a dollar is a dollar. All the cuts don't make up for one bad signing, but it is still real money that the owners can spend to try to generate more revenue or to pocket. Billionaires didn't make their money worrying about the minimum wage employee.
A minor league player has gone through a selection funnel that is keeps narrowing. From High School they either filtered to the minors or were to a college. When at college they demonstrated enough talent to be selected by a MLB team to participate in their organization. It is obvious that the most talented players are in the first 100 picks or so. They just have elite physical skills that set them apart. If a player can afford to be part of the 80% they are still in the .0 something % from the peers they played with in high school. From what I've seen the organizations provide a great deal of instruction and expend a significant amount of funds on trying to improve every player.
Making the Majors is a rare opportunity for most players. Take a look at Baseball Reference and you quickly see that in the top 100 a very small number have more than a cup of coffee or end up as AAAA players. Most players despite draft round have a level of talent of significant value. On a recent podcast I heard a former GM of a two time World Series Champion state he first thought that talent was 70% of the equation and mental was 30%. He learned the opposite was true. Some with more talent simply cannot get over the failures they experience in the game or deal with the grind. This is probably why some of the less talented players do make it to the Majors. Talent, injuries, financial strain, or desire is often the driver leading a player to leave the game. Obviously, if talent is the issue either the organization or a players self awareness tells them it is time to move on.
All players are in the same boat. Either move up or move out. I know of a recent player (pitcher) that was released after three (somewhat successful) seasons in the minors. He was around the 100th pick and received a $500K bonus. I don't think he thought his initial road would end as it did. Meanwhile I know a 20th round pick that was a Senior College sign consistently have excellent seasons and move up every year. He would fall into the Matt Adams type of sign. A guy with talent but nothing off the charts, just a guy that can play baseball at a very consistent and high level.
My view is you play as long as you can (financially, talent, etc...) and as long as you enjoy it. When you no longer enjoy playing the game or the work required then get a real job. Hopefully, the players have a plan B because plan A will work out only for a few.
Nicely put Baseballfan1965, gave a glimpse into the MILB journey. I agree with " On a recent podcast I heard a former GM of a two time World Series Champion state he first thought that talent was 70% of the equation and mental was 30%. He learned the opposite was true. I've said it a few times that IMO my son is not physically gifted in height/weight/speed/strength but it's his mental approach and understanding of the game is what makes him have the success so far. This helps him have the ability to execute during games and not rely on talent alone. Put both together and it gave him an advantage over talent alone players. MILB besides being a talent weeding out process, it also gives a glimpse for both player and organization who can handle tough situations, non-ideal playing conditions, being income depressed, etc. I've met and seen a few of my son's teammates who on the outside have all the physical tools to make it to the bigs. However, for unknown (to me) reasons they can't get out of the minors or have been released. Another factor that plays into it is the have/have-nots. A player not only requires proper training but also must take care of their body/mind. Proper place to live, bed, nutrition, personal trainer, personal gym, all require $$. Unless the player was a high pick with a big signing bonus, wealthy parents, etc. many MILB can't afford these "luxuries" that high picks can tap into. It is unfortunate that many players will be forced to move on from their baseball dreams. I enjoyed watching and meeting players/parents from each level and being part of their dreams, rooting for them to have a great game, to move up level by level.
@Trust In Him posted:Nicely put Baseballfan1965, gave a glimpse into the MILB journey. I agree with " On a recent podcast I heard a former GM of a two time World Series Champion state he first thought that talent was 70% of the equation and mental was 30%. He learned the opposite was true.
There you have it. How any times have we heard Bob (Consultant) talk about the 6th tool on HSBBWEB?
5 round draft with severely reduced number of pro teams will have a lot of 6th tool, 30/70 guys wasted😐
@TPM posted:Here is one. Matt Adams aka Big City, currently with Mets, drafted by Cardinals in 2009.
Matt was drafted in the 23rd round out of Slippery Rock University, a D2 in Pennsylvania.
I often think that a lot of success is based upon how good a team is at developing players. Some obviously are better at it than others.
Ha! Family member teaches there.
Perhaps there will be a rise in Independant leagues? Our local team, the St. Paul Saints, has a beautiful new stadium. The one in Fargo for the Red Hawks is nice, too.
I think it made sense to cut the minors some as mlb already had by far the biggest player dev system of all major sports. It just doesn't make sense to draft lots of players who only have a 1% chance to make the majors from day one. A 20 round draft would fit that well too.
Sure some stars were drafted later than 20th but with 20 rounds teams would look harder in rounds 15-20 who at least has mlb tools even if it is a long shot and draft less fillers, seniors and undertooled weaker conference performers. College trackman data can help them with finding those guys (high game EV, high spin rate...). I could even see a further contraction later to 3 teams per franchise (90 teams instead of 120) with drafted players going to an extended camp with lots of training and intrasquad games instead of rookie ball.
I just hope this saved money really goes into better facilities, better training environment, better nutrition and player salaries.
Also sucks for the communities and the young fans.
Not baseball but tennis was contemplating helping lower ranked players (like 200-700 in the world) and Austrian tennis player dominic thiem who is a top 5 player currently rejected the idea saying I played at those lower levels and found many of them were not professional not living 100% for tennis and instead he said this money could be spent better.
I think this is a problem the minor leaguers have, the guys who made it through romanticize that time and say I made it through so you can.
Wouldn't it make sense with contracted minors to leave the freshly drafted players, especially HS who are not ready for full season ball to keep them at the complex the first year with lots of training and driveline style live at bats and intrasquad games?
I guess if minors are contracted to 4 teams per franchise that could resolve some of the roster crunch and possibly also develope young players better and give them more reps.
The Orioles have released 37 minor leaguers. With 40 teams cut we can probably expect at least 1000 minor leaguers (33 per team) being released and not replaced by new minor leaguers.
Jack Welch was famous as an executive for cutting dead wood from corporations. Anywhere he went as CEO was a great stock to purchase. Some thought he was ruthless and cold hearted. He told the media when he lets people go he’s doing them a favor. Now they can move on to something they will likely be more successful.
The minor leaguers who will be released by the restructuring of MiLB likely had odds of slim and none of ever becoming a MLBer. They can move on to real life. If they’re not convinced it’s over they can try Indy ball.
Many of the players they cut had past the "prospect" phase. Every year teams sign a large number of <>16 year old Latin players. Some to significant bonus money. They obviously want to give them a few years to mature and develop. It is somewhat beneficial for the teams to bring those players that they think are going to get cut back to Spring Training for one last look. Since Spring Training is not a paid activity the team is out on the room and board which is not that high a cost to double check on an investment. All teams are paying players $400 a week through the end of May I'm surprised more teams have not cut players that are most likely not sticking with the organization. It is a copy cat industry, more teams will follow the Orioles lead. I'm sure in some cases it is a total surprise but for others they see the writing on the wall.
Yeah Sure, you could definitely argue that most minor leaguers are non prospects and the milb contraction reduces the number of guys who are not making it. Maybe with the improved training methods player development is less of a numbers game and you need less quantity and could put more focus on training quality even though some of it will always be just doing well and competition and the best swing, good tools and so on are no guarantee you are going to hit so some guys are just guys who don't stop hitting even of they have mediocre tools or an ugly swing but still just hit. That is not the norm of course but relatively rare cases.
You never know.
If it was still 2019 Mike Yastrzemski might well have been on that list.
"Players to be named later"
a great phase along with the 6th Tool. The pro scouts who scout the Minor League Teams are in a "special" class of Scout.
Long road trips, exchange of information with the Team mangers, the coaches, the "Club house Manager. It is important to recognize that each day 30 scouts are watching the Minor League players for a player to be named later in a trade by the GM.
They are my friends and I have often watched a game with their eyes. We discussed "body language" of each player.
In addition to the MLB scouts there are Pro scouts from Japan, Korea and China
evaluating the players to be named later!!!!
Bob
International Baseball 35 years
Great call on Mike Yastrzemski (Family name probably helped a little) but I thought he looked like a really solid player, you have to like that he stuck it out and had some success. I find it interesting how many players make it to the big leagues at age 28 or so and then have a very solid career. In reality the cost of minor league operations is trivial, however the players union can protect MLB players. So, the unprotected and underpaid end up being sacrificed at minor savings. How many minor league salaries equal one day of Chris Davis' salary?
MLB makes MILB a “brutal “ business.
Of course the players don’t really understand how cut throat or worse it is.
No matter where he is drafted, your sign is a baseball commodity What MLB is now doing is worse than the past. More $$$$ for MLB.
Oakland As have decided they won't pay minor leaguers this year. Definitely sucks for the players but orgs probably also is cash strapped.
Imo both Tampa bay and Oakland need to be relocated, it is obvious their market can't support an acceptable mlb payrol which is a pity as their front offices are really good and make them compete anyway. But the super low payrolls and empty stadiums despite winning records are just bad.
Mlb needs to find a solution for that.
Dominik,
Just like every MLB team, the A’s have never opened their books for profit and loss evaluations.
Their ownership is valued in the billions!
IMO, they do not deserve any benefit of the doubt on what they cannot afford especially for the rounding error MILB salaries would be for billionaires.
This is tiresome.
MILB not getting paid. MLB getting overpaid. College getting cut. Recruiting turned into money ball. MILB contracting.
Maybe it all should just blow up and be done. Its already absurd.
Go back to local mill/town semipro teams. It would probably be better entertainment and more competitive. And far cheaper for a family to attend.