OF Throwing Velocities

My 2 cents — long toss, j bands , 

then weighted pylo balls .. but must have  correct Throwing mechanics ..

In the actual showcase setting, he should also look to have at least one throw that's lower to the ground. Having said that, please, whatever he does, make sure he's not a slave to the numbers because that's how injuries happen or how players stop having fun with the game. My son is a 2021 and he saw a 7mph jump from last year to this year. He definitely put in the work in the weight room but a lot of it was just the natural process of growth, puberty, etc... 

I’ve tried not to make it an issue with him and keep him focused but he has mentioned it a few times. He’s seen his 60 time drop to a 7.0 and his Exit velocity increased to 93 but the throwing velocity has not changed at all. It’s so odd to me that his strength training has increased and all other metrics  have improved but not the arm Velo. You see kids constantly getting bumps in Velo from event to event it seems. I really thought his Velo would have jumped this last event since he had worked so hard while we’ve been in lockdown from the virus. He trained really hard these last 4 months with no Velo gain at all. I know I shouldn’t be focused on just the numbers but that’s all you seem to see is the posting of the Measureables. So how do you get past the numbers to get noticed?

A player doesn’t need to have all the metrics to succeed. But the more the better. One jaw dropping metric will draw interest. Big time foot speed (6.6 or better) will do it. The problem with a low velocity arm is it limits a player to left field. So he better hit well, run well and play baseball smart. 

Have you watched Ichiro throw from RF. he is always in forward motion, shoulders to the target. Feet quick. Perfect throwing motion. He was a HS pitcher. Great knowledge of the game, the runners speed and the velocity of the ball hit to him. In Seattle he had the groundskeeper cut the grass short so the ball would get to him quicker. 

There is a different game besides metrics  it is called baseball intelligence.

Bob

I'm convinced there is only so much you can do with arm strength.  Think about the kids you saw at 8U and 9U who had the strongest arms.  95%+ of them still have the strongest arms now.  Understand that large increases are usually not realistic.  And some of it is also time/growth.  I'd spend some time looking into his mechanics.  It's OF velo, so his crow hop might be tweakable and net him some gains that the weight room won't.  My 2021 is right at 5'9" 160.  His OF velo at PBR last August was 85.  At an October PBR is was 88.  February got to 90.  Those gains were noticed by almost no one so there's one example how little it mattered to prospective coaches.   Almost no lifting was done over that period.  Casual lifting, at best.  In my mind, I think it was the mental piece that allowed his velo to rise like it did.  He's continually fighting getting noticed as an undersized guy and he went into those PBR events on a mission.  He wanted it BAD.  But again, the 5 mph he gained in 6 months didn't result in any returned emails or calls, so I am not sure I'd put much time in to it.  Just my 2 cents.

I’m hoping it’s just a matter of growth and maturity. My 2022 is a young 2022. He’s in his summer before Jr year and still 15. Won’t be 16 for another month where as most of his classmates are 16 and have been for some time.  At this point we are just looking to get to the next level, what ever level that may be. I believe his best growth and performance is still ahead of him. 

It's been said here thousands of times.  The 9 best hitters are going to play, at any level.  Especially in the outfield.  Make sure he's getting good hitting instruction and hit the weight room.

@WV2022Dad posted:

I’m hoping it’s just a matter of growth and maturity. My 2022 is a young 2022. He’s in his summer before Jr year and still 15. Won’t be 16 for another month where as most of his classmates are 16 and have been for some time.  At this point we are just looking to get to the next level, what ever level that may be. I believe his best growth and performance is still ahead of him. 

Don’t get caught up with your son being young for his grade. It’s not something you can control. It only gives him a subconscious excuse if he picks up on it. My kids have May and July birthdays. We never discussed it. Even when one was 5’4” playing 14u after 8th grade when he could have been playing 13u. 

Consultant wrote, “ There is a different game besides metrics. It’s called baseball intelligence.”

I can’t echo this loud enough. For those of you that don’t know, Bob is one of the most experienced and knowledgeable people on this board. He is a baseball lifer. He is telling all of us that there is too much focus on metrics and not enough focus on learning how to play the game. He is right. There are only 2 metrics that can open a recruiting door. 90 mph + FB for a pitcher& sub 6.5 sixty time for a position player. Those numbers can create opportunities. Other than that coaches look at how you play the game. Nobody cares about EV unless it’s produced in a game.  The majority of people on this board have players in D3 and you don’t need great metrics to play D3 baseball. You need to be a really good baseball player. Many of your kids would be more recruitable (from a baseball perspective) if you would take Bob’s advice. He founded the Area Code Games for goodness sake! He knows what he is talking about! 

Adbono;

thank you for the "kind" words. Last night, a pro baseball scout visited my home and we discussed the "metric" topic. The game as we know is "rapidly" changing and not to our expectations.

When I "started" the Area Code games in 1987, there was NO competition.

Since I did not charge the players, the pro scouts ID the prospects based on their own experience, CIA training, and personal playing experience. Today, you have machines evaluating and MLB supporting the sharing of info.

There is NO machine that can duplicate a hitter facing a Bob Gibson "fast ball" in the 9th inning with the bases loaded.

Today, I ask myself how would I adjust to the current situation.

Bob

I think the arm is important and it shouldn't be 68 mph of course but statistically the range and ability to catch balls (and of course hiting skills) are much more important.

I mean how many competitive throws does an outfielder make per game? He might get to make 5 or 6 throws per game with at least half of them being routine lobs without a play (say routine single where you lob the ball into second).

I mean if the arm is super weak like below 70 opponents might abuse that but I wonder if a plus arm really saves that many runs over an average arm (say low 80s)?

Don't get me wrong ideally you have a strong arm but I think statistically the ability to get to balls and of course ability to hit are way more important.

There is NO machine that can duplicate a hitter facing a Bob Gibson "fast ball" in the 9th inning with the bases loaded.

Especially given the first pitch might be a waste pitch under the chin just to up the “on edge” ante. 

Don't let age be an excuse... my 15 year old 2022 wont be 16 until November. He was mature enough to go to a high academic HS and fought hard to get stronger and faster. He did try to make an issue with his relative age but there was no oxygen in our house for it. Have your kid long toss and do run and gun throws up hill. Have a professional assess his throwing, mostly it is inefficient sequencing, especially considering the metrics you provided. Med balls and plyo balls help a lot with my kid with better timing his lower to upper half transition in addition to uphill throwing and long toss. 

@Consultant posted:

Have you watched Ichiro throw from RF. he is always in forward motion, shoulders to the target. Feet quick. Perfect throwing motion. He was a HS pitcher. Great knowledge of the game, the runners speed and the velocity of the ball hit to him. In Seattle he had the groundskeeper cut the grass short so the ball would get to him quicker. 

There is a different game besides metrics  it is called baseball intelligence.

Bob

I spent an hour with my son recently showing him Ichiro highlights on YT.  He was blown away the outfield throws, particularly given his size.  Ichiro is a legend. 

WV2022Dad

Everybody has different ideas on how to improve arm strength.   All three of my kids were big on long toss and Jaeger bands.  It worked for them, and it is easy to find and adjust a tailored program that works for them.   Flexible arms and a strong core and legs are key.

Ichiro is a great example.   Also, I had the opportunity and pleasure to watch Jackie Bradley Jr workout and practice CF to Homeplate throws when he was playing travel baseball at about your son's age.   He's not that much bigger than your son.   Yes, he has God-given talents but he worked extremely hard at it.  He was clocked over 100mph from the outfield at a showcase I attended.  At the time, my jaw dropped as I'd never seen anything like it.    Check out some JBJr throwing videos on YouTube too.   Bottom line is to keep working hard to develop throwing, running and hitting skills for the next level.

My son which is a 5’10” 170  2022 has been stuck on 80MPH OF throwing velocity for over a year now.

He has been very dedicated on weight training and has seen big increases in all four major lifts (Squats, Dead lift, Hang clean and Bench press).

Okay, but what is his routine like? What exercises does he do? How much weight, how many reps, how many sets? How challenging is it for him? 

Has anyone else experienced this plateau of arm velocity? Any suggestions on how to improve?

I would look at what he's doing, training-wise. I mean that both in terms of baseball, specifically throwing, and in terms of working out. I would look at his mechanics to see if there's any really egregious looking motion, but if there's not it would not be the first place I looked to try and make a change, it would be the first two things mentioned.

My 2018 was also an Ichiro fan. We used to live in Seattle, and that was the first player he ever followed. Small(5'9", 165), but very athletic and coordinated. From the time he was 15 till the summer between Junior and senior year in HS his OF velo went from 81, to 86, to 91mph. A lot of it is technique. He uses his quick twitch legs to hurl himself in the direction of his throw, almost like he is thrown out of a cannon. All his momentum seems to aid the path of the ball. Since he has gone to college he has added more "good" weight(185 now), and has hit 94-5.

    I would disagree that hitting 90 doesn't attract attention, even if it's from the OF. As soon as he did, he started to get a LOT of attention from schools. Not P5's or anything, but smaller schools looking to convert him to a P. 

   He started to play long toss regularly from the time he was 16. That's where you can build up arm strength, and work on technique, and coordination. He and a teammate(a P5 recruit) used to throw foul pole to foul pole after practice for about 20 minutes. 

   I also have a 2022, but he is blessed with good height, though he is still wiry. He was a P/OF, had elbow problems, and had to completely reinvent himself after it was determined that technique was the problem rather than structural issues. Long toss has been part of his new regimen. Last fall he was maxing out around 240', with pain. Now, he can throw around 320'. No idea what his velo is from the OF...I do know that his technique is not where his brother's is. I would guess he would top out around 85...is 81 from the mound? In both places, his technique is probably hampering him. Strength is great, but it's all for naught if you don't have technique, and your body is fighting itself. Talent is another thing, too...some guys just have it.