Bighit...I think a pitcher(only) should take the entire next day off from throwing, with running and stretching in it's place. day 2 would return to light to moderate throwing again mixed with some stretching and running. day 3 would return to regular throwing, long toss, and again his running regimen. day 4 would put him in his bullpen regimen and running regimen. Day 5 would repeat day 3 and day 6 he would pitch again.
This is all predeicated on a starting pitcher that intends to go 6-7 innings each outing. This would be altered if he only went 3-4 innings and under 60 pitches...that would take a day less to recover. During this time, especially in HS, the pitcher needs to continue his weight regimen of 4, 5 or 6 days depending on his schedule. He must continue to build strength throughout the year and into the summer season also.
When you say "100 ptiches would be 7 days rest. lol" my suggestion was 1 1/2 hrs off for each game pitch thrown which equates to pitching on the 6th day...pitch on Tuesday, pitch on the following Mon. NV HS rules allow a pitcher to go 11 innings in a consecutive 4 days. EX..mon 7inn, tue 0, wed 0, thur 4. The new week starts againg on fri which would allow a pitcher to go 11 innings if their coach let them, or any combo of 11 inn over the next 4 days, fri -mon....that is damaging and without regard for the pitchers health.
Highlander Mom is right, it is almost a political topic, but as long as I am involved with my son or pitchers as I continue to coach, I will follow the above agenda. Getting to the next level is a great accomplishment, but staying there without abuse or injury to help the team is the goal.
When you are a pos player and pitch, the rest structure changes dramatically.
Good Luck to all!
"If you can imagine it you can create it. If you can dream it, you can become it". William Arthur Ward
"Baseball is Life"
quote:
Originally posted by TRhit:
"This is like arguing religion and politics-- there is never one right answer"
TRhit
No, there IS one right answer. You ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS err on the side of what is best for the kid. Winning one HS game is never as important as a kid's future.
If that means taking him out 10 pitches too soon instead of 10 pitches too late, that's what you should do. There will always be a chance for "Joe Dokes" HS to get another shot at a county championship, but if Johnny Jones blows out his arm & with it a chance at a pro career or College scholarship... that's tragic.
With all due respect to the profession, on average, the best you can hope for from a HS Coach isn't that he'll teach your kid how to play or inspire him to higher goals... the best you can hope for in most situations is that he doesn't get yout child hurt.
1...2...3... ok all you Coaches out there start your engines & post what an idiotic scumbag I am. But all you Parents who've had a child ruined or know a kid who has been ruined because "Coach Egotist" had to win some stupid trophy raise your hand.
There are many good comment. And some of my comments were taken wrong. In regards to the schools, I am not god, and you are correct the grades are available a number of ways, which you point out. However, I have had a few players drfted in my time as well as more then a handfull go onto college. I can not tell you of one of those players who went to college and we did not speak with college coach.
In regards to coaches not wanting to coach, I hear moe and more coaches that have coached for years, state they can deal with any kids, but the parents are the reasons they are getting out. I also have a a few guys that have had cups of coffee in pro ball and ask them to help get involved and the ones who say yea, come on with this agreement "as long as I do not have to deal with the parents!'
As for the summer coaches having more experience? I understand that in the warmer weather the summer/fall teams play many more games then HS and run awesome programs, unfortunately not many of these type team s exist in the north.
The same is the case in college with coaches hurting kids arms, actually sometimes it is worse, we can rattle off numerous kids who have been hurt by college coaches over use! the name tyler green, is just one!
I'll finish later!
In regards to coaches not wanting to coach, I hear moe and more coaches that have coached for years, state they can deal with any kids, but the parents are the reasons they are getting out. I also have a a few guys that have had cups of coffee in pro ball and ask them to help get involved and the ones who say yea, come on with this agreement "as long as I do not have to deal with the parents!'
As for the summer coaches having more experience? I understand that in the warmer weather the summer/fall teams play many more games then HS and run awesome programs, unfortunately not many of these type team s exist in the north.
The same is the case in college with coaches hurting kids arms, actually sometimes it is worse, we can rattle off numerous kids who have been hurt by college coaches over use! the name tyler green, is just one!
I'll finish later!
Once Again --- the arm going in college does not mean the college coach overused him-- what about the LL coaches, the HS coaches etc before the college scene
An arm going is usually the end result of cumulative damage not just one incident
KIDS DO NOT PLAY CATCH ANYMORE !!!!!!
TRhit
An arm going is usually the end result of cumulative damage not just one incident
KIDS DO NOT PLAY CATCH ANYMORE !!!!!!
TRhit
quote:
Originally posted by TRhit:
"KIDS DO NOT PLAY CATCH ANYMORE !!!!!!"
TRhit
The reality is that kids don't play Baseball anymore. I remember when my Son first started playing Little League. There were kids on his team that had to be shown how to put on a glove & hold the bat.
His coach was about the same age as I am & told me on the side that by the time we were 9, we had played 100's of backyard games. These kids, if they play at all, it's more likely to be Nintendo Baseball than the real game.
Also, it's not like nobody ever hurt their arm when we played either. I think nowadays it's more a case of more kids playing more games in more leagues with less qualified coaching at the "youth league" level. Too many instances of "daddy ball" coaches putting too much emphasis on winning without proper training.
As in 8U, 7U and 6U elite travel teams with ads in the newspapers fro tryouts !!!!
TRhit
TRhit
A prime example of abuse and why I support my statements...this kid will pitch in 3-4 days ...I bet!
http://perfectgame.atinfopop.com/4/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=114295945&f=6174069131&m=33810481
Clements comes back to win
Clements 0 0 1 0 0 4 2
Elkins 0 0 1 1 1 0 1
WP Morgan
LP Dahlman
Clements 7 12 2
Elkins 4 4 2
Morgan lasts the distance, w/ 13K's and 8 bb's (146 +/- pitches) holding the bats of Elkins down giving up only 4 hits. The Rangers come alive in the 6th after Polier (5ip, 9 k, 3 bb) is relieved by Dahlman. Dahlman lasts only 2/3's of the 6th ,giving up 3 hits, and surrendering 4 runs.
HE SHOULD BE FIRED TODAY!
"If you can imagine it you can create it. If you can dream it, you can become it". William Arthur Ward
"Baseball is Life"
http://perfectgame.atinfopop.com/4/OpenTopic?a=tpc&s=114295945&f=6174069131&m=33810481
Clements comes back to win
Clements 0 0 1 0 0 4 2
Elkins 0 0 1 1 1 0 1
WP Morgan
LP Dahlman
Clements 7 12 2
Elkins 4 4 2
Morgan lasts the distance, w/ 13K's and 8 bb's (146 +/- pitches) holding the bats of Elkins down giving up only 4 hits. The Rangers come alive in the 6th after Polier (5ip, 9 k, 3 bb) is relieved by Dahlman. Dahlman lasts only 2/3's of the 6th ,giving up 3 hits, and surrendering 4 runs.
HE SHOULD BE FIRED TODAY!
"If you can imagine it you can create it. If you can dream it, you can become it". William Arthur Ward
"Baseball is Life"
Baseballcoach,
Naming a player on this site for negative reasons is a no no,IMO. It can be harmful for his future, his parents, his college and even HS coaches. If you have info to support a particular player, then make comments, give examples without naming names. Injuries come from years of overuse. A perfect example is Starzz's link to PG website on the game where the pitcher threw 140+ pitches. And of course all the recent topics on this site regarding poor judgements in coaching, parent responsibilities,and player responsibilities as well.
Many are familiar with this player and your comments can damage a fine school's reputation.
Naming a player on this site for negative reasons is a no no,IMO. It can be harmful for his future, his parents, his college and even HS coaches. If you have info to support a particular player, then make comments, give examples without naming names. Injuries come from years of overuse. A perfect example is Starzz's link to PG website on the game where the pitcher threw 140+ pitches. And of course all the recent topics on this site regarding poor judgements in coaching, parent responsibilities,and player responsibilities as well.
Many are familiar with this player and your comments can damage a fine school's reputation.
BASEONBALLS50...If I understand your last post, you are saying I shouldn't have linked that site as a reference to this thread? My post and the link are in no way detrimental or negative towards the player. It was in reference to the topic and validation that pitch counts and a pitchers future mean nothing to a coaches ego to win at all costs. I would like to hear from his Dad, and then the coach. If the Dad is OK with it, then so be it. It is MHO that it will make a difference.
Years of overuse start with an outing like that. Let's see how many days off he gets..or if he's played a position already. I hope your not defending the coach and the program in this instance. It is overuse and it is detrimental to the player. IMO it is not a fine school if the coach emulates this conduct.
"If you can imagine it you can create it. If you can dream it, you can become it". William Arthur Ward
"Baseball is Life"
Years of overuse start with an outing like that. Let's see how many days off he gets..or if he's played a position already. I hope your not defending the coach and the program in this instance. It is overuse and it is detrimental to the player. IMO it is not a fine school if the coach emulates this conduct.
"If you can imagine it you can create it. If you can dream it, you can become it". William Arthur Ward
"Baseball is Life"
Starzz,
No not you, sorry for the misunderstanding. There was a comment made about Tyler Green, that I found to be out of place. Said the college ruined his arm, I stated it comes from years of overuse, pointing out the article of the kid pitching 140 plus pitches you posted.
Forgive me, you are always right on! Baseballcoach was out of line, IMO.
No not you, sorry for the misunderstanding. There was a comment made about Tyler Green, that I found to be out of place. Said the college ruined his arm, I stated it comes from years of overuse, pointing out the article of the kid pitching 140 plus pitches you posted.
Forgive me, you are always right on! Baseballcoach was out of line, IMO.