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Questions for those that know.

RB rosin bag10+ posts
Hello everyone.I have a couple of questions that I would like to try to receive some answers to and to make sure I am making the best decisions in helping my son out. First of all, I have a son who is now a sophomore in high school. He has played baseball ever since he was 5 years old. He is 6'3" weighs 175 lbs and is a LHP that throws in the mid 80s with a very nasty change up and a "fast" ball with a lot of movement.Yes he was clocked at 84 -86 mph. He faced a 17 U select team ( all their players had already comitted to D1 schools)last summer at the University of SC as a 15 year old and had a very good showing allowing only 1 earned run in 6 innings. This spring he is batting .727 for his high school team (6A school) 16/22 at the plate and is playing outfield and continues to pitch very successfully.Which position should he play or can he go somewhere where he can continue to play both positions in college? I have already looked at the recruiting timeline of what he should be doing this summer. Question number #1...
As well as playing baseball this summer, my son is scheduled to go to a one day camp to the University of Alabama I know it is a money making opportunity for the schools and their programs. However, my reasoning was it was a good chance for my son to at least visit the school he was interested in and meet the coaches and possibly see if the coaches may see something in him. Yes... it is a school he is interested in. Good idea or not, I hope it is? Later this summer as the timeline suggests my son is planning to go to a Cincinnati Reds pro tryout camp. I thought since it was in town, might as well check it out and it is free. A 17 U team has also asked him to go along with them to a couple of showcases later this summer after he plays with his current 16 U team this summer until July 1st. Are there any other suggestions for what else I need to do for my son during this upcoming summer between his sophomore and junior year in high school? Thank you so much for your time and and suggestions.
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RB rosin bag10+ posts
Thanks Bum. He's is throwing a pretty crisp curve ball these days and his change up will slow down and break into the right handers under their hands and his two seamer fast ball breaks out to the outside corner for righties. He mixes it up pretty well for his age.That is a good suggestion for a Pefect Game Showcase. I was thinking that was more so for between his Junior and Senior year of high school. However, do you know the procedure in getting him "invited" to one of their showcases?
fenwaysouthfenwaysouth10,000+ posts
Welcome to HSBBWeb Rosin bag. My two cents......

Answer #1 - Your son stands a much better chance of making any baseball team as a lefty pitcher than a position player. Half of college teams are pitchers. If he was a position player, he would be limited to 1st base or outfield. Whether or not he is a two way player will be determined by the level of baseball, and the coaches philosphy. For example, the higher levels of D1 baseball have fewer two way players than mid to lower levels. Truth be told, many high school two way players think they can be two way in college. It is very difficult to do for many reasons.

Answer #2 - Absolutely expose him to as many programs and opportunities as possible that make sense, and you can afford. If the Alabama camp is his first, I think it is a great place for him to learn what to do & what is expected at these camps and showcases. It will give him a frame of reference. As time goes on, and you feel more comfortable with this process then I think you should target specific camps & showcases based on what your son wants to get out of hsi college years. I was partial to PG Showcases, PG National events and HeadFirst Showcases as they fit the baseball and academic goals my son had set.
birdman14birdman141,000+ posts
Hey Rosin Bag: Welcome to HSBBWeb as well. It sounds like you have some fun times ahead of you by the sound of your son's ability. I don't really have any specific advise to offer as far as where to get your son "seen." It sounds to me like your plans will lead to other opportunities, as well as some of the other good advise and ideas being offered by other posters.

As the parent of a 2-way player, IMHO I would say, don't limit him and let him do both. He has ability at both. Let the scouts and coaches who decide these things make the decision for you. Soon enough they will.

Enjoy the ride and best of luck!
Rob KremerRob Kremer1,000+ posts
Sounds like you are right on top of things getting him the exposure he needs.

As for the two-way question: that will be answered by the coaches who recruit him more than your or your son. He will obviously play both ways in high school since he is such a good hitter. In showcases there is no problem with presenting as a two way player. In travel/tournament situations, that will be up to the coach.

When he gets into full swing recruiting wise, coaches will make their own judgment as to whether his bat can compete at their level. A lefty pitcher at his age throwing mid/high 80's will get noticed, and as others have said, is easily the quickest way to a roster spot.

But there is no reason to decide at this stage about the two-way issue. In the end, that isn't going to be his decision anyway.
U UticaBrewersGM10+ posts
LHP 6'3 175 as a 15 year old in mid 80's. Your best chance from described is on the mound. I can't tell you accurately since I have never seen him. Need to see how the arm works, depth on off-speed pitches, fade on CH, arm speed and action on off-speed, mechanics ect. to make the best judgment. The statements below should help though:

1. Most organizations draft pitchers between the height of 6'1-6'6. Your son is 6'3 with room to grow.

2. Average MLB FB for a righty is 89-90, for a LHP it is 87. I don't mean touching it 2 or 3 times in a game, it means consistently sitting at 87.

I would make a decision soon on what he would like to concentrate on and work at it everyday if his goal is to play professionally. Hope this helps.
CADadCADad5,000+ posts
Talk to the coaches at the Alabama camp because every camp is different but it is usually better to register as a primary position player and secondary pitcher than the other way around. They are almost always trying to find enough pitching to get through the camp and the secondary pitchers usually get innings. Primary pitchers don't always get innings as position players.
birdman14birdman141,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by UticaBrewersGM:
LHP 6'3 175 as a 15 year old in mid 80's. Your best chance from described is on the mound. I can't tell you accurately since I have never seen him. Need to see how the arm works, depth on off-speed pitches, fade on CH, arm speed and action on off-speed, mechanics ect. to make the best judgment. The statements below should help though:

1. Most organizations draft pitchers between the height of 6'1-6'6. Your son is 6'3 with room to grow.

2. Average MLB FB for a righty is 89-90, for a LHP it is 87. I don't mean touching it 2 or 3 times in a game, it means consistently sitting at 87.

I would make a decision soon on what he would like to concentrate on and work at it everyday if his goal is to play professionally. Hope this helps.


What happens if he never throws any harder as he gets older, yet if allowed to hit and play a position, he completely mashes and develops into a left power hitting outfielder or 1B. Without continuing to do both, you never know...
BumBum1,000+ posts
What does your son want?

We had a LHP two-way player on the same travel team as my LHP son. This kid was recruited to college as a 2-way player but eventually signed and went pro. I wouldn't worry about it. Baseball has a way of deciding things for you.

BTW, I think the summer between the sophomore and junior years is this most important to do a showcase. Do any scouts know about him? Maybe they could recommend him to one of the bigger events. Anyway, do showcase that summer then followup up the next year.
Last edited by Bum
fenwaysouthfenwaysouth10,000+ posts
quote:
but it is usually better to register as a primary position player and secondary pitcher than the other way around. They are almost always trying to find enough pitching to get through the camp and the secondary pitchers usually get innings. Primary pitchers don't always get innings as position players.


CADad.....That is a great insight for those thinking about being a two-way player in college. My son's college coaches never saw him hit at their camp or showcases. My son can hit very well. I know in the back of my son's mind, he is thinking about trying to hit next year.
Last edited by fenwaysouth
U UticaBrewersGM10+ posts
[/QUOTE]

What happens if he never throws any harder as he gets older, yet if allowed to hit and play a position, he completely mashes and develops into a left power hitting outfielder or 1B. Without continuing to do both, you never know...[/QUOTE]

Were talking about a 15 year old. Chances are if he maintains a consistent pitchers training routine and add in the maturity of the body there's a chance he will throw harder if his arm works right. It's tough to say without seeing how his arm works. Scouting is almost always based off projections.( Can he become a big leaguer in 3-5 years?). If for some reason he doesn't throw harder than he becomes a good college pitcher and it will be much easier to find a home than as a position player.

You'd be surprised at how LHP's are drafted and the velocity of many LHP's in HS or college that are now Big Leaguers.

My best example is Pat Misch. Pat was 85-86 at Western Michigan. Was taken in the 7th round in 2002 and is now in the Big League's.

It comes down to how the arm works.
Last edited by UticaBrewersGM
birdman14birdman141,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by UticaBrewersGM:


What happens if he never throws any harder as he gets older, yet if allowed to hit and play a position, he completely mashes and develops into a left power hitting outfielder or 1B. Without continuing to do both, you never know...[/QUOTE]

Were talking about a 15 year old. Chances are if he maintains a consistent pitchers training routine and add in the maturity of the body there's a chance he will throw harder if his arm works right. It's tough to say without seeing how his arm works. Scouting is almost always based off projections.( Can he become a big leaguer in 3-5 years?). If for some reason he doesn't throw harder than he becomes a good college pitcher and it will be much easier to find a home than as a position player.

You'd be surprised at how LHP's are drafted and the velocity of many LHP's in HS or college that are now Big Leaguers.

My best example is Pat Misch. Pat was 85-86 at Western Michigan. Was taken in the 7th round in 2002 and is now in the Big League's.

It comes down to how the arm works.[/QUOTE]

In the same respect, you miss my point. How do you know at the age of 15 he is not meant to be a hitter. While I agree his best chances for moving forward and playing at the next level would be greater as a pitcher, particularly a lefty pitcher, why not proceed and do both for now.

Within the next couple of years, it will all decide itself, to what he is meant to be.
Last edited by birdman14
RB rosin bag10+ posts
Thank you so much for the suggestions. I don't know as far as the position he will finally settle in with. All I know is the kid can hit and goes with the pitch everytime. They throw it on the outside he drives to the left.Inside he pulls it. However, he loves to pitch too and as a lot of you have said, some of those decisions will be made for him if he continues to keep his passion for the game and he moves on to college. I did sign up for the PG tournament and received an invitation in Lexington. Thanks for your input on that. Well they give him a chance to play as a position player and pitcher at this showcase? Or will he have to decide if he wants to play outfield, 1B, or pitch. Actually, as a kid I told my son to learn to play every position a lefty can and that will confuse the coaches when they see what he can do. Probably, his natural position was 1B until the past 3 years when he was moved to the outfield and of course pitching. Thanks again to everyone for their suggestions and I am so glad have those that know on this board.
RB rosin bag10+ posts
Thanks again everyone. He is keeping pretty even keel about it all these days. It is pretty bizarre when a kid goes 2/4 at the plate the other night and hits a two run homer opposite field and knocks in a total of three runs and his batting average goes down .30 points. I know it can't keep up at this pace but what a great spring. Thanks again guys you mean a lot to this old Dad trying make the right decisions.
Dad04Dad045,000+ posts
Two way players in D1 are rare. I don't why, but they are. Let me see...6-3 LHP 175....mid 80's as a sophomore. I think I smell a pitcher. Sounds like 90+ in 3-4 years. Good luck and get to Perfect Game soon. Not for nothing, but there is a reason they call high averages "high school numbers". After high school literally everybody used to hit .450. Enjoy it though, cuz it's fun as heck. Smile
Last edited by Dad04
GoingwiththePitchGoingwiththePitch100+ posts
I played four years at Binghamton University from 2005-2009 and went through all of the recruiting hoops that the next generation now gets to go through. I can say looking back that for most guys out there that do not stand out ( 95 MPH, 6'6") it is all about a numbers game.

Just as the coaches treat it as a numbers game in the sense that the more kids the see the better chance they have of signing the best, the players need to do the same. I went to tons of showcases and got myself in front of tons of coaches.

The ones I was interested in I emailed before to introduce myself. I also tried to go to showcases where certain schools usually atteneded. I did all the right drills, and of course Binghamton never came up as a possibility up until almost the last showcase.

My point is that the more showcases you go to, not only do you get better that them, but more coaches get to see you and the chance of a bad showcase is not the end of the world, just the end of a few hundred bucks. My other point is keep your options open and if someone expresses interest check it out. It is a lot easier to be recruited than to try to recruit.

( I do talk about my wild and crazy journey that led me to Binghamton in my book if anyone is interested.)

Thank you,
Ken Jacobi - Author of “Going with the Pitch: Adjusting to Baseball, School and Life as a Division I College Athlete”, a firsthand experience into the life of a college baseball player.

For more information on my book visit www.GoingwiththePitch.com
J HJ H5,000+ posts
Utica- Misch turned down the 5th round to reenter college, and was a 7th rounder in '03. In his debut MLB season in '07, his fastball was consistently 87.3 MPH and reached 92, according to PitchFX on Fan Graphs.

A good example of a crafty lefty would be Rowdy Hardy. Hardy was a non-drafted free agent sign and is currently in AAA.

To get back to the OP, you are on the right path, and you seem to have a very talented player on your hands.

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