Recruiting Services

Fungo

I think what has happene is that so many services have popped up lately, there seems to be a new one every day, that coaches are tired of it.

How many letters and resumes can a college coaching staff read ?

How many are credible in the sense that many have never even seen the kid play.

Many just regurgitate HS stats and HS coaches info.

I think the college coach is more apt to speak to the respected travel team coaches about the kids they are interested in because the respected travel team coaches have their finger on the pulse of the player.

The sad part is that the parents getting into the recruiting process are uninformed or ill informed about things and there is a new group every year coming into the picture.

It depends entirely of the rep of the person or group recommending the player being promoted. If they have a good track record and provide accurate info on prospects, college and mlb scouts very much appreciate the help.

Good example a dad called me up and emailed me and told me his son could run a 6.7 60 YD,throw 1.8's release time and threw 92 mph, all state in football and provided a list of mlb scouts that would recommend him. Not like I had not heard that stuff before, but he provided additional info that after checking it out he was a legit prospect. Dad exaggerated a little on the times.

After chatting with a few mlb scouts, none had heard of him, a few acted like they had no interest in bothering to checking out the player.I asked one mlb scout why would a cross checker give out his phone number to a player he did not think could play. he responded good point, gonna check out the player.

A few said they would go see him, if he was legit they would invite him to east coast pro showcase.

Which the player attended and was later drafted in the top ten rounds.

There very well could be some good honest recruiting services out there. Here is our experience.

As a college coach I would receive information from recruiting services. At that time, it came in big stacks of papers or long lists. At first I read through all the info and once I actually followed up.

I saw a report on a 6-4/190 RHP from Northern Minnesota. The information gave glowing stats and claimed he threw a 93 mph fastball. It went on to say he had great control and was unknown by scouts because of the area he lived in. I called the high school coach and he assured me this was the best pitcher he had coached in his 20 year career. I called the parents and they expressed interest in our small college program.

Well… I made the 11 hour drive (each way) up north to see and try to recruit this young man. Their game was rained out, so that cost another day on the road. The one thing I did notice (I’m 6-4) is this kid was more like 6-1 at best, not the biggest deal, but the literature said he was 6-4.

The next day, I got to the park early and watched him warm up. I knew within minutes that this was a wasted trip. Sticking it out, mostly out of politeness, I watched him pitch 2 innings. No real need to, but it seemed like the right thing to do.

In the first inning… first pitch fastball… I got a whopping 77 mph on the gun. This ended up being the best fastball he threw in 2 innings. I actually felt sorry for this young guy, none of this was his fault. He was a nice kid, but got caught up in a complete falsehood.

Needless to say, that was the last time I used a recruiting service. The information that came in was promptly filed in the waste bin.

Then many years later we started Perfect Game. Times were tough trying to stay ahead of the game. One of our people thought it would be a great idea to start a RECRUITING SERVICE. Against my better judgement… We did!

We advertised this service to players in our home state. Several signed up, even some talented players. Then one day I was looking through our files and saw a player I knew. Nice kid, just couldn’t play baseball worth a darn.

I asked our people… How can we promote this kid to colleges? What could we say, that would be honest and cause this kid to be recruited? They looked at me and said, I don’t know, but the parents want to spend the money.

That was the end of the PG Recruiting Service. I told our people to tell the parents we are out of that business.

Once again, there very well could be some excellent recruiting services out there. My suggestion for those considering using a recruiting service is as follows.

When “applying” tell them you are 5-2/110 lbs, run an 8.5 – 60, and you’re a RHP with a 68 mph fastball. Tell them you have a 1.9 GPA with a 14 ACT. I'm exagerating but... If they still want to take your money, RUN away as fast as you can. If they tell you they’re sorry, but they can’t help you, you might have found a good one!

Or you can simply ask a college coach you know and trust, what he thinks about all of this.

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
I think the college coach is more apt to speak to the respected travel team coaches about the kids they are interested in because the respected travel team coaches have their finger on the pulse of the player.

TR, you probably should have added that college coaches are just as apt to contact the high school coaches. There are many reputable HS coaches who often do just as good or a better job of helping than do the travel team coaches.

TR.....you are right about how many of those profiles coaches get......a staff can't really spend time looking at all that come in the mail each day. I have been there, and I used to have my student workers go through them and keep the ones that I could possibly see play without traveling more than a few hours one way. Then I would look at the kept ones to see if I knew their coaches or somebody else who may know about them.

TR
I figure what we do with the kids in the summer and fall is a recruiting service except we carry real time information.

All we can do is provide the vehicle, what the player does we he gets off the bus is what gets him recruited. Where we take the bus to is what can matter as much how well he plays. (Whos' see's them play) That's why we keep an eye on the PG site..

grateful

I did not mean to offend the HS coaches in the country

Coach Merc

I dont know about your program but we are not a recruiting service nor do we try to be. We like PG tried it in the beginning days and found it fruitless.

Yes we carry real time information and what we really are is a "Guidance Counselor" for the parent and player.

I played baseball 25 years ago, when there were no Perfect Game USA events, no regional showcases to attend in Rhode Island (yours) that crawl with colleges. We played HS ball and then Legion ball. A recruting service would probably have helped many then. Today, with PG showcases and tournaments and the evolution of high-level travel teams and highly competitive tournaments, recruiting services are unneccessary, as colleges in D-1, D-2 and D-3 all take advantage of the forums provided.

after http://www.google.com
baseball recruiting service

found this link

http://coachnick0.tripod.com/bbd/id19.html

alot of services out there, many are out of business now

Andy, have you ever dealt with James Gamble with the GSB?

gloveman, No

quote:

Originally posted by TRhit:
grateful

I did not mean to offend the HS coaches in the country

TR, I know you didn't mean to offend the HS coaches......there are so many travel coaches and HS coaches, as well as other youth coaches, who do so much for our kids!!

Has anybody ever considered polling the college coaches about their use of recruiting services? Do they use them? Have they ever used them? What level program are they? Are there any they actually recommend?

It seems like the more successful programs wouldn't EVER need them, so what is the point in hiring a service that is sending info to all the ACC, SEC, PAC-10, etc schools? It seems like the only ones that would use them would be the lower level D-2, D-3, NAIA schools. I'm just guessing cause I sure don't know.

My son's an 07 and it seems to me that if I just let him play HS, fall ball, and go to college camps, there will be enough coaches there to see him or recommend him to others they know. Academics will be his biggest hurdle, however.

College coaches get info on players from recruting services all the time. only problem most of the players to be honest cant play.
colleges would love to have accurate info and scouting reports on players, because parents,players, travel teams coaches and HS coaches frequently greatly exaggarate the players abilities.

Once again I will ask what you all think about NCSA National Collegiate Scouting Association

They sure get alot of positive TV coverage.

Any thoughts?

I don't know much about these national recruiting services that are advertised. However I did have some of my players work with a recruiter who gave each player plenty of personal attention and satisfaction. When I was approached by him last fall I was skeptical. He mentioned a few names of college coaches and I responded and call them. When I spoke to Coach O'Sullivan from Clemson, all he said was, "If your son has been asked to go with Mr Holtz*** that's a great thing, we talk weekly and everyone watches when his team plays". Coach Peters from USF immediately invited us for an unofficial visit.

From there, 3 or 4 of my players enrolled with him. Here's what he did for us. Set a directional path for us to take. What events to attend. Save your money and don't attend a camp unless it's your #1 choice. He placed teams in each of the PG fall events and had HIS players showcased, personally coaching the team. He was personally at events in FL, East Cobb and the PG events in NY as well as the National in Ga and East Coast Pro in Wilmington, NC. He worked diligently to get one of my players into the PG National that had not gotten an invite nor was he being considered. Well, he got the invite, played well and as a result was heavily recruited during our Fl and East Cobb trip. Now signed with a top SEC program. I spoke with him almost daily for 8 months about everything up to and including my sons decision. Yes, he intoduced us to the coach from Illinois.
Everyone of these kids has signed early as well as 20+ of his other kids. This is a one man show who spends 15 hours a day on the phone. I know for a fact that he has told many players (ability) and parents (false expectation) that he won't take their kid.
It's not all about the money when it's your passion.... Personal attention, credibility and direction are factors to consider.

Merc, it sounds like you found a big exception to the rule. From what I know of your boys and where they're going, it sounds like he found some quality kids he could work with, and everyone is coming out a winner. I think you've illustrated what a recruiting service SHOULD be like, but they can't make a lot of money if they only represent a small number of players, so he sounds like a wonderful exception out there.

I have recommended 55 players to colleges, all either are playing college ball or signed pro contacts . 35 being drafted out of hs or college, One reached the Majors.

The key is being able to recognize talent and to properly promote it to colleges and mlb scouts

It's also important that who you are dealing with has a credible reputation with the "powers that be"...ie. coaches, recruiters, scouts etc. There are those out there that claim to be "baseball guys", whose word/recommendations are worthless because it is known by anyone with any kind of baseball sense, that they are self-serving to promote a player from his team, thus promoting himself. They in turn speak poorly of a talented player because they were not part of his "program".

Web-based services often don't provide much exposure
Stu Whitney
Argus Leader

published: 8/31/2004

On a Web site for the National Collegiate Scouting Association, Augustana College freshman football player Mike DuFrane is listed as a "success story."

The NCSA is a Chicago-based recruiting service that charges families as much as $1,500 to help high school students find college sports scholarships.

DuFrane, a defensive lineman from Hortonville, Wis., hired the company to promote his abilities to coaches. But he says the group had no role in his recruitment by Augustana, and he's surprised that he's being touted as a recent NCSA success.

"That would pushing the truth a little bit," says DuFrane, adding that he learned about Augustana from high school teammate Jayson Winterfeldt, who signed with the school in 2003.

Says Augustana head coach Jim Heinitz: "We didn't get (DuFrane) off a service at all. You can't rely on those things."

But as more players and parents chase athletic scholarships, these services have become big business. There are more than 200 such sites on the Internet, and NCSA founder Chris Krause says his company currently has about 5,000 families enrolled.

Critics say the services prey on the hopes and wallets of gullible parents by promising things they can't deliver - like credibility among college coaches. Simply sending out highlight tapes and player profiles typically isn't enough to produce a scholarship offer.

"We don't put a lot of stock into those things at all," says University of South Dakota head football coach Ed Meierkort. "Most of them end up in the trash can, to be quite honest."

Meierkort says the legitimate scouting services are ones that charge coaches, not kids. Like most area football coaches, he subscribes to Collegiate Sports Data, a Nashville-based service that lists prospects from every high school in the country.

That information is gleaned from high school coaches, whose opinions carry weight in the initial recruiting stage. But most players on that list won't get scholarships - something other Web-based services don't always tell their clients.

"You recommend a kid, and a lot of those for-profit sites will call his parents and try to make money off it," says O'Gorman High School football coach and athletic director Steve Kueter. "It's a huge problem. From what I can see, the only legitimate ones are the ones that don't ask for money."

Recruiting networks such as Rivals.com and Insiders.com rank football and basketball prospects and charge subscribers to view news. But they aren't in the business of marketing athletes to coaches for a fee.

Krause, who founded the NCSA in 2000, defends his company by noting that athletes need an extra edge in a competitive recruiting environment with expanding opportunities.

"Since Title IX, there are so many more programs available, and most coaches don't have the budget to recruit on a national basis," says Krause, a former scholarship football player at Vanderbilt University. "In my 15 years in this industry, I've never had a student-athlete tell me that they started too early or that they had too much help."

As for Augustana's DuFrane, Krause says that the NCSA helped him draw interest from Division I-AA football programs such as Butler and Holy Cross - but he chose to play Division II football in Sioux Falls.

"If we can give a student-athlete more schools to consider, in addition to the one he had contact with, at least that gives him options," says Krause, whose minimum start-up fee is $395. "If he looks at the other ones and still ends up at that school, it's not like we're going to talk him out of it."

Other recruiting sites use an interactive system to help athletes and coaches find each other - usually in non-revenue sports such as golf, s****r, tennis and swimming.

"It works like a dating service," says Ryan Spoon, a former Duke swimmer who founded BeRecruited.com in 2000. "Athletes create a profile with qualifications, while coaches create a profile based on need - and we try to match the two. They can also search the database if the match isn't suitable."

Of course, none of these sites can help athletes if they aren't taken seriously by college coaches. Most experts say it's better for prospects to personally contact a school to get the recruiting process started.

"It's nice when a kid has done some research and has genuine interest in your program," says Augustana women's s****r coach Steve Burckhalter. "But if it's just some Internet service sending out profiles to every school in the country, it's almost like chasing your tail."