Which type of stride makes the best results for a hitter? Is it the toe-tap? High leg kick? or is it a personal prefrence??What makes them diffrent??Plz Help
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Well, not much going on. So, I'll add my two cents, which might actually be worth less than that.
The type of stride is a personal choice. Some hitters find one way works best for them because it is more comfortable or more easily repeatable. Working with my son who has a knack for developing bad habits, I've found that the stride needs to be able to keep the weight back while moving the mass forward.
By that I mean a lot of hitters push off the rear foot/leg and the weight gets out front too early. So, a hitter has to be able to load the front leg/hip rearward to re-load the rear leg/hip while the body itself is moving forward. With my son, he has experimented a few different ways. Visually, I know he is OK when the front foot touches down, and the center point of his body is at, or slightly behind, the mid-point of his feet. That allows him to shift his weight as/after he gets his foot down when he fires the backside. He has settled on inverting the front leg and pinching the front hip while he is striding (can also "pinch the knees") so that he can land on the inside ball of his front foot.
The keys to whatever you choose: Keep the weight weight back (re-load backside) while striding forward, don't let the hips drift past the mid-point of the feet, land on the inside ball of the front foot, and drop the front foot while firing the backside.
That'll give you a fairly good feel which you can tweak and make adjustments to your liking and for different pitches.
Good luck.
The type of stride is a personal choice. Some hitters find one way works best for them because it is more comfortable or more easily repeatable. Working with my son who has a knack for developing bad habits, I've found that the stride needs to be able to keep the weight back while moving the mass forward.
By that I mean a lot of hitters push off the rear foot/leg and the weight gets out front too early. So, a hitter has to be able to load the front leg/hip rearward to re-load the rear leg/hip while the body itself is moving forward. With my son, he has experimented a few different ways. Visually, I know he is OK when the front foot touches down, and the center point of his body is at, or slightly behind, the mid-point of his feet. That allows him to shift his weight as/after he gets his foot down when he fires the backside. He has settled on inverting the front leg and pinching the front hip while he is striding (can also "pinch the knees") so that he can land on the inside ball of his front foot.
The keys to whatever you choose: Keep the weight weight back (re-load backside) while striding forward, don't let the hips drift past the mid-point of the feet, land on the inside ball of the front foot, and drop the front foot while firing the backside.
That'll give you a fairly good feel which you can tweak and make adjustments to your liking and for different pitches.
Good luck.
I agree that's it's a personal choice and what works best for each hitter.
"Stride to see the ball, not to hit the ball" was something told to me over 40 years ago and is something I tell kids today. Don't want them stridng and swinging at the same time.
Whatever method you use is personal but I have always taught a quiet, smooth stride.
Whatever method you use is personal but I have always taught a quiet, smooth stride.
quote:Don't want them stridng and swinging at the same time.
The term, "striding and swinging" should be dropped from any discussion about hitting.....The term is old school and is not of value in a hitting discussion....It's the same as "linear" and "rotational", which has no value in a hitting discussion....
There can be support given to the theory that the swing is what forces the front foot to the ground....
Bluedog,
Striding and swinging isn't as much a term as seperate actions and purposes. Was not/ is not said in the context you assume.
Explain your theory clearly...as is, the statement is not accurate. Yes, there is credence in what you are attempting to say (poorly) but as is, the statement doesn't hold water in a high level swing.
No, it doesn't have anything doing with the front hip rotating...opening perhaps, but that has nothing to do with the hips rotating. Two seperate actions with seperate purposes in a high level swing.
Wayback,
Not bad...not bad at all. Several good points raised and explained.
Striding and swinging isn't as much a term as seperate actions and purposes. Was not/ is not said in the context you assume.
Explain your theory clearly...as is, the statement is not accurate. Yes, there is credence in what you are attempting to say (poorly) but as is, the statement doesn't hold water in a high level swing.
No, it doesn't have anything doing with the front hip rotating...opening perhaps, but that has nothing to do with the hips rotating. Two seperate actions with seperate purposes in a high level swing.
Wayback,
Not bad...not bad at all. Several good points raised and explained.
quote:Originally posted by BlueDog:
There can be support given to the theory that the swing is what forces the front foot to the ground....
hence the yeager cue let the back leg put the front leg down
quote:.....there is credence in what you are attempting to say (poorly) but as is, the statement doesn't hold water in a high level swing.
Oh, I see.....I didn't know that....
I ask, does this clip fit in with what Abrams is saying about the stride?
Maybe it does, I don't know.....
quote:Originally posted by BlueDog:
Bluedog,
In regard to his hands, are you opposed to Berkman's tip? Not sure "hinge angle" is the right term here, but he appears to be tipping with a sort of wrist extension. Do you see this? And if yes, are you for or against?
(I'm not asking if you are opposed to the tip, but HOW he tips.)
Yessir, I see it and, no, I'm not opposed to it....
quote:Originally posted by BlueDog:
Yessir, I see it and, no, I'm not opposed to it....
In regard to the sequence and relationship between the tip and the stride, do you feel Berkman is doing this to generate greater "float" and greater batspeed to contact? Or is this more a style thing? I don't see it in the Williams rear view. Is it a teach, a non-teach, or a "try this and see how if feels."
Mr. Tewks, I know I do it in my swing and it's to generate float....I have had several young students who, also, do it, but, I teach with my swing as a visual guide....So, maybe they're emulating me, I don't know....
I would say it's a no-teach.....Some hitters have quiet hands and some have more nervous hands..,,I'm the nervous hand type...
I'd be curious to see if Berkman does the same with similar sequence from the left side. Doesn't he (didn't he?) have more power from the right but better average from the left? I'll try to find some older footage of a similar angle.
quote:Originally posted by BlueDog:
Mr. Tewks, I know I do it in my swing and it's to generate float....I have had several young students who, also, do it, but, I teach with my swing as a visual guide....So, maybe they're emulating me, I don't know....
Do the parents worry about this with your younger players? I think developing this movement pattern at a younger age is great, but a lot of parents seem to prefer a more "simple" approach. Do you feel the float is natural with some players?
Parents don't interfere with my teaching....If they don't like what I'm doing, they just don't bring the player back....That has happened a time, or two.....I don't ask them why as I don't care why.....Same as a player doesn't show me alot of interest in being a good hitter....I won't continue working with him....So, you drop me, I drop you, fair enough....
I don't find players naturally inclined to float the bat.....I, also, find that players struggle with loading the back hip........This stuff needs to be learned, IMO.....
I don't find players naturally inclined to float the bat.....I, also, find that players struggle with loading the back hip........This stuff needs to be learned, IMO.....
Good BP clip of Williams and of Berkmann in HR contest both hitting 65-70 mph grooved fastballs.
You can learn alot about hitting random curves, sliders, sinkers and changeups in BP and HR contests.
You can learn alot about hitting random curves, sliders, sinkers and changeups in BP and HR contests.
Very good....Took you long enough...
You had to figure sooner, or later, this was coming....
You had to figure sooner, or later, this was coming....
And, I will say, I can't say you're wrong....
Hey, Mr. Tewks, looks like my PMing has been blocked by these folks....So, I can't answer your PM...
My e-mail is byyouself@yahoo.com............
My e-mail is byyouself@yahoo.com............
Bluedog,
Sorry about the delay as I'm sure ya missed me. Been up in S.C. visiting a kid at Clemson that I've worked with in the past.
The clip of Williams is classic in that it really demonstrates the "swing flaw" (that Williams readily admitted to) that lead to his slightly longer swing.
Nahh, ain't the stride or hips.
Sorry about the delay as I'm sure ya missed me. Been up in S.C. visiting a kid at Clemson that I've worked with in the past.
The clip of Williams is classic in that it really demonstrates the "swing flaw" (that Williams readily admitted to) that lead to his slightly longer swing.
Nahh, ain't the stride or hips.
BlueDog,
Your PMing is not blocked. I am the person who would need to block your permissions, and I have not done so. I just double-checked your settings and they are the same as other members. If your PM messages seem to be blocked, they might have been blocked by the recipient.
Julie
Your PMing is not blocked. I am the person who would need to block your permissions, and I have not done so. I just double-checked your settings and they are the same as other members. If your PM messages seem to be blocked, they might have been blocked by the recipient.
Julie
quote:Originally posted by MN-Mom:
BlueDog,
Your PMing is not blocked. I am the person who would need to block your permissions, and I have not done so. I just double-checked your settings and they are the same as other members. If your PM messages seem to be blocked, they might have been blocked by the recipient.
Julie
My PMs are not blocked.
Blue, my email is: bobby@abathletics.com
Power, I tried to answer your PM....Couldn't do it....
quote:Originally posted by S. Abrams:
Good BP clip of Williams and of Berkmann in HR contest both hitting 65-70 mph grooved fastballs.
You can learn alot about hitting random curves, sliders, sinkers and changeups in BP and HR contests.
I'm sick of the HR Derby argument. Everytime I hit a ball really well in a game or in practice, I felt like I had perfect timing. In fact, in games I worked really hard to have good timing. (And, IMO, better mechanics will allow your swing to have better timing against a greater range of pitches.) Swinging at strikes helps greatly...
Also, leave your random curves, sliders, sinkers and changeups UP and you'll some BP/HR Derby-like swings. They will look like they are hitting grooved 65-70 MPH BP fastballs.
Bobby,
Sorry to hear you're not feeling well.
Just seen too many .600+ hitters in BP over the years that neede to adjust their cup come game time.
Game film shows me more about the hitter.
Good timing and swinging at good pitches...totally agree with you.
Sorry to hear you're not feeling well.
Just seen too many .600+ hitters in BP over the years that neede to adjust their cup come game time.
Game film shows me more about the hitter.
Good timing and swinging at good pitches...totally agree with you.
quote:Originally posted by S. Abrams:
Bobby,
Sorry to hear you're not feeling well.
Just seen too many .600+ hitters in BP over the years that neede to adjust their cup come game time.
Game film shows me more about the hitter.
Good timing and swinging at good pitches...totally agree with you.
Don't worry, I've seen my fair share of 5 o'clock Heroes and BP All-Americans. Doesn't mean they can do it in a game.
BUT... If I know they can do it in a game, I certainly want to watch their BP swings. I want to see their intent and their adjustments. I've used this analogy before... it would be like watching a jam session of your favorite band. You know they kill it on stage... but how do they get there.
HR Derby swings are just fun. When a guy hits a ball that makes you laugh... Thats pretty special.
PS I was at Yankee Stadium when Hamilton hit a billion balls out. You think his game swing is much different than the swing he used that night?
The stride CATCHES the swing.
Hitters do not stride and land with their hips closed and square to the plate.
Hitters do not stride and land with their hips closed and square to the plate.
Game swing. Now what?
Just bumping the GIF. Hi SB.
Good clip, swingbuilder.
No real argument with what you've said.
Good example of what I have been saying about the front hip opening versus hip rotation. Combined with Williams tendency to stride towards the 2baseman,makes the two movements hard to see. Williams would let the swing finish driving his lead foot heel down (similar to your stride catches the swing); he opens the front knee during the stride to toe touch ( opens the front hip without rotation) and uses the intiation of the swing to drive the front heel down with swing/rotation. Opening the front hip made it easier for him to clear his hips quickly during the swing.
Nice shot of the variance in hip rotation for both swings along with the variance in how open the front foot is at heel plant. Amazing ability to adjust.
In other words, you can open the front hip during the stride without rotating the hips. Rotating the hips before toe touch/whatever while striding is not what you want. Can't say it any plainer than that. The same thing can be done no-stride with opening the front foot and knee when setting the foot down (Pujols will do this).
And yes Virginia, I do teach hitters how to open the front hip into the stride and WHY and WHAT it does for them. The athletic kids usually do it naturally as well as having some degree of bat tip.
Both clips do a good job of showing the loading of the rear hip like Bluedog mentioned earlier.
Loop in the swing is the "flaw" Williams did intentionally to help create loft in the swing (short RF porch in Boston) as he wrote about in his book; made for a longer swing but accomplished what he wanted. He liked holding the bat vertically because he said it made the bat feel lighter in his hands. Williams swing was not one that awed with its raw power but rather with its smoothness, fluidity and precision. The man had amazing pitch recognition ability...probably because he outworked and outstudied the opposition. As a catcher, you see Williams swing and you see the holes in the swing... and then you are shocked as his ability to adjust and close the holes that others can't.
Just imagine being a teenage minor leaguer and having The Rajah as a coach....had to be heaven for someone as fanatical about hitting as Williams was.
BP film is fun to watch but I prefer game film 100% of the time. I want students to see the adjustments on varying pitch locations,etc. and how a hitter makes them. BP does show potential of a hitter but doesn't tell me if he is a really hitter or just a swinger ( which by the way, is one of the areas coaches and swing instructors often clash in opinions).
***You may or may not agree with all the above or anything..that is fine but if all the "specialists" and swing instructors would speak as plainly as I just did above, maybe everybody could get on the same page or at least understand the point. If we are really trying to help the parents and kids who are "the backbone of the game" then we will speak/type plainly. Doing otherwise is merely self serving to the ego of the writer.
Funny seeing the catcher's position/stance and how the strikezone has changed over time. Looks like Ted took a pitch on the corner to left/left center.
No real argument with what you've said.
Good example of what I have been saying about the front hip opening versus hip rotation. Combined with Williams tendency to stride towards the 2baseman,makes the two movements hard to see. Williams would let the swing finish driving his lead foot heel down (similar to your stride catches the swing); he opens the front knee during the stride to toe touch ( opens the front hip without rotation) and uses the intiation of the swing to drive the front heel down with swing/rotation. Opening the front hip made it easier for him to clear his hips quickly during the swing.
Nice shot of the variance in hip rotation for both swings along with the variance in how open the front foot is at heel plant. Amazing ability to adjust.
In other words, you can open the front hip during the stride without rotating the hips. Rotating the hips before toe touch/whatever while striding is not what you want. Can't say it any plainer than that. The same thing can be done no-stride with opening the front foot and knee when setting the foot down (Pujols will do this).
And yes Virginia, I do teach hitters how to open the front hip into the stride and WHY and WHAT it does for them. The athletic kids usually do it naturally as well as having some degree of bat tip.
Both clips do a good job of showing the loading of the rear hip like Bluedog mentioned earlier.
Loop in the swing is the "flaw" Williams did intentionally to help create loft in the swing (short RF porch in Boston) as he wrote about in his book; made for a longer swing but accomplished what he wanted. He liked holding the bat vertically because he said it made the bat feel lighter in his hands. Williams swing was not one that awed with its raw power but rather with its smoothness, fluidity and precision. The man had amazing pitch recognition ability...probably because he outworked and outstudied the opposition. As a catcher, you see Williams swing and you see the holes in the swing... and then you are shocked as his ability to adjust and close the holes that others can't.
Just imagine being a teenage minor leaguer and having The Rajah as a coach....had to be heaven for someone as fanatical about hitting as Williams was.
BP film is fun to watch but I prefer game film 100% of the time. I want students to see the adjustments on varying pitch locations,etc. and how a hitter makes them. BP does show potential of a hitter but doesn't tell me if he is a really hitter or just a swinger ( which by the way, is one of the areas coaches and swing instructors often clash in opinions).
***You may or may not agree with all the above or anything..that is fine but if all the "specialists" and swing instructors would speak as plainly as I just did above, maybe everybody could get on the same page or at least understand the point. If we are really trying to help the parents and kids who are "the backbone of the game" then we will speak/type plainly. Doing otherwise is merely self serving to the ego of the writer.
Funny seeing the catcher's position/stance and how the strikezone has changed over time. Looks like Ted took a pitch on the corner to left/left center.
HA...you might open that lead leg but you ain't opening that lead hip without that rear hip also responding.....now you have an argument 
You have to think of it in this way.....
Good hitters, like Ted, turn to go forward.
That lead hip isn't doing jack without that rear hip doing something.
You have to think of it in this way.....
Good hitters, like Ted, turn to go forward.
That lead hip isn't doing jack without that rear hip doing something.
quote:Originally posted by S. Abrams:
Good clip, swingbuilder.
No real argument with what you've said.
Good example of what I have been saying about the front hip opening versus hip rotation. Combined with Williams tendency to stride towards the 2baseman,makes the two movements hard to see. Williams would let the swing finish driving his lead foot heel down (similar to your stride catches the swing); he opens the front knee during the stride to toe touch ( opens the front hip without rotation) and uses the intiation of the swing to drive the front heel down with swing/rotation. Opening the front hip made it easier for him to clear his hips quickly during the swing.
Nice shot of the variance in hip rotation for both swings along with the variance in how open the front foot is at heel plant. Amazing ability to adjust.
In other words, you can open the front hip during the stride without rotating the hips. Rotating the hips before toe touch/whatever while striding is not what you want. Can't say it any plainer than that. The same thing can be done no-stride with opening the front foot and knee when setting the foot down (Pujols will do this).
And yes Virginia, I do teach hitters how to open the front hip into the stride and WHY and WHAT it does for them. The athletic kids usually do it naturally as well as having some degree of bat tip.
Both clips do a good job of showing the loading of the rear hip like Bluedog mentioned earlier.
Loop in the swing is the "flaw" Williams did intentionally to help create loft in the swing (short RF porch in Boston) as he wrote about in his book; made for a longer swing but accomplished what he wanted. He liked holding the bat vertically because he said it made the bat feel lighter in his hands. Williams swing was not one that awed with its raw power but rather with its smoothness, fluidity and precision. The man had amazing pitch recognition ability...probably because he outworked and outstudied the opposition. As a catcher, you see Williams swing and you see the holes in the swing... and then you are shocked as his ability to adjust and close the holes that others can't.
Just imagine being a teenage minor leaguer and having The Rajah as a coach....had to be heaven for someone as fanatical about hitting as Williams was.
BP film is fun to watch but I prefer game film 100% of the time. I want students to see the adjustments on varying pitch locations,etc. and how a hitter makes them. BP does show potential of a hitter but doesn't tell me if he is a really hitter or just a swinger ( which by the way, is one of the areas coaches and swing instructors often clash in opinions).
***You may or may not agree with all the above or anything..that is fine but if all the "specialists" and swing instructors would speak as plainly as I just did above, maybe everybody could get on the same page or at least understand the point. If we are really trying to help the parents and kids who are "the backbone of the game" then we will speak/type plainly. Doing otherwise is merely self serving to the ego of the writer.
Funny seeing the catcher's position/stance and how the strikezone has changed over time. Looks like Ted took a pitch on the corner to left/left center.
I was just wondering...where did Ted hear about the "Kentucky Stretch"?
Power,
You got me...have not a clue nor can I say I've ever heard the term ( embarassing to a trivia/historian type).
Swing,
Don't confuse hip opening with hip rotation. If you are thinking hip opening as when the front hip actually moves away from, lets say homeplate as a reference point, then that is part of hip rotation and absolutely the rear hip is very involved. As I said, hip opening to me is the knee/front foot opening which is caused by rotation within the hip socket with no rotation of the pelvis/pelvic girdle/ hips (plural). You can actually do this while rotating the hips/pelvis/pelvic girdle in the opposite direction.
The video you show looks like either Arod or Soriano and neither opens the front hip quite like Williams did. In the video, does the rear hip fire before toe touch? No. it doesn't which is what I was saying earlier about not rotating until toe touch.This hitter is rotating into the stride (no problem). As a test, check your hip rotation with keeping your lead/stride foot 90 degrees to the plate then check at 45 degrees and then 30 degrees and tell me which position allows easier,smoother hip rotation. Much of how much of an angle is a personal preference; I wasn't as extremme as Williams and was about 45 degrees; 90 degrees felt too binding to the hip rotation.
Trying to speak plainly. Maybe should have called my hip opening a knee opening even though the pivot point is the hip socket. Others have called this action hip rotation which it definitely is not.
I'm a rear hip guy but the front hip can screw things up also. JMO.
Call me old fashioned, but I really dislike the high knee lift. Just believe there are easier, smoother ways to accomplish the same thing. To each his own. At least they're not trying to be Mel Ott.
You got me...have not a clue nor can I say I've ever heard the term ( embarassing to a trivia/historian type).
Swing,
Don't confuse hip opening with hip rotation. If you are thinking hip opening as when the front hip actually moves away from, lets say homeplate as a reference point, then that is part of hip rotation and absolutely the rear hip is very involved. As I said, hip opening to me is the knee/front foot opening which is caused by rotation within the hip socket with no rotation of the pelvis/pelvic girdle/ hips (plural). You can actually do this while rotating the hips/pelvis/pelvic girdle in the opposite direction.
The video you show looks like either Arod or Soriano and neither opens the front hip quite like Williams did. In the video, does the rear hip fire before toe touch? No. it doesn't which is what I was saying earlier about not rotating until toe touch.This hitter is rotating into the stride (no problem). As a test, check your hip rotation with keeping your lead/stride foot 90 degrees to the plate then check at 45 degrees and then 30 degrees and tell me which position allows easier,smoother hip rotation. Much of how much of an angle is a personal preference; I wasn't as extremme as Williams and was about 45 degrees; 90 degrees felt too binding to the hip rotation.
Trying to speak plainly. Maybe should have called my hip opening a knee opening even though the pivot point is the hip socket. Others have called this action hip rotation which it definitely is not.
I'm a rear hip guy but the front hip can screw things up also. JMO.
Call me old fashioned, but I really dislike the high knee lift. Just believe there are easier, smoother ways to accomplish the same thing. To each his own. At least they're not trying to be Mel Ott.
quote:you ain't opening that lead hip without that rear hip also responding.....
Swing, not so....
You got two hips....They work independently of each other....
