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Smitty28 posted:

Arizona Fall Classic Jr in AZ and PG WWBA World Championship in Jupiter are at the same time this year...if you are a 2019 who is interested in "higher academic" schools on both coasts (not necessarily Ivy), which is a better place to be seen and be recruited at?

If your kid is a starter on team going to WWBA, go to WWBA.  Play his ass off, he'll be able to leverage that experience down the road.  Reality, unless your kid is the best position player or throwing 85+ he won't make the evening tournament team at the spring Padres facility, at AZ classic, so given the odds, go do the same at the WWBA and have fun.

The academic schools are looking for the biggest pitchers and hitters as juniors at AZ Fall Classic.....  I would suggest go to a few fall college camps of schools on your son's targeted list to let them get to know your son over a few days.

Get a realistic assessment of where your sons skills are, and focus on the strength and speed over the off season.

pnw2017 posted:

Not sure where you are from, but this would be a west coast perspective. First of all, if you are selected for area code games, you most likely already are committed or have plenty of offers, same goes with pg National and USA TOS. These are the tournaments or showcases I have either attended or heard great things about on the west coast. All have high d1 coverage and Fall Classic and PG World Series have great pro scout coverage as well.

USA Baseball 17u NTC Arizona

Prospectwire East v West 17u California

Norcal World Series

Under Armour Southwest 17u California

Arizona Fall Classic

PG World Series 17u Arizona

PG Evoshield Upperclass Arizona

PG California World Series 

Phil Singer Summer Series 18u California

Elite Baseball Series California

Rising Prospects showcase California

 

 

 

 

 

How would the SoCal scout teams Sunday games in the fall compare?

2019Dad posted:
pnw2017 posted:

Not sure where you are from, but this would be a west coast perspective. First of all, if you are selected for area code games, you most likely already are committed or have plenty of offers, same goes with pg National and USA TOS. These are the tournaments or showcases I have either attended or heard great things about on the west coast. All have high d1 coverage and Fall Classic and PG World Series have great pro scout coverage as well.

USA Baseball 17u NTC Arizona

Prospectwire East v West 17u California

Norcal World Series

Under Armour Southwest 17u California

Arizona Fall Classic

PG World Series 17u Arizona

PG Evoshield Upperclass Arizona

PG California World Series 

Phil Singer Summer Series 18u California

Elite Baseball Series California

Rising Prospects showcase California

 

 

 

 

 

How would the SoCal scout teams Sunday games in the fall compare?

I did a fall scout team which I found to be beneficial but that was in the nw, I have heard great things about some scout ball teams in so cal such as the brewers, yankees, and angels teams I believe. I think most kids will usually do scout ball and then maybe take a week or two to play in Jupiter or pg evoshield. Also, many scout teams go to the fall classic.

My son will be attending the PBR futures games in Westfield IN this weekend. We have spoken to a half dozen college head coaches this summer and all of them speak highly of it, and mention that there are 150 or so college scouts there (games are for uncommitted only). It seems that position players have the best opportunity at the games, since pitchers only get 2 innings each, and for my sons team they are 1 inning each on two different days (out of the 3 games each team plays). They stack the games on 3 fields. I might post my opinion afterwards, but it seems like pitchers will have a hard time showcasing unless they are spot on from pitch 1, and I hope they have enough catchers per team to allow for proper warmups (which they won't, of course. But I can dream.)

I like PBR (Illinois) because they have followed my son this year despite the fact that he only paid for 1 showcase. They have "scouted" him at a regular high school game (actually texted him and asked when he would be pitching) , at the area showcase for Chicagoland top HS players and at the Area Code game tryouts. every time they update his stats on their site. he's never been "the chosen one" or a household name, just a kid grinding it out and getting better as he goes, so I appreciate that PBR is following him along the way.

KilroyJ posted:

My son will be attending the PBR futures games in Westfield IN this weekend. We have spoken to a half dozen college head coaches this summer and all of them speak highly of it, and mention that there are 150 or so college scouts there (games are for uncommitted only). It seems that position players have the best opportunity at the games, since pitchers only get 2 innings each, and for my sons team they are 1 inning each on two different days (out of the 3 games each team plays). They stack the games on 3 fields. I might post my opinion afterwards, but it seems like pitchers will have a hard time showcasing unless they are spot on from pitch 1, and I hope they have enough catchers per team to allow for proper warmups (which they won't, of course. But I can dream.)

I like PBR (Illinois) because they have followed my son this year despite the fact that he only paid for 1 showcase. They have "scouted" him at a regular high school game (actually texted him and asked when he would be pitching) , at the area showcase for Chicagoland top HS players and at the Area Code game tryouts. every time they update his stats on their site. he's never been "the chosen one" or a household name, just a kid grinding it out and getting better as he goes, so I appreciate that PBR is following him along the way.

I dunno. I think it is a lot easier to scout pitchers. I was talking to a college coach about this, and he said a pitcher might be off one or two mph, and maybe his breaking ball isn't terrific one day, but you can get a pretty good idea of a pitcher seeing him one time. He said he needed to see hitters a lot more -- and he gave an example of recently going to see a hitter, and the kid walked 6 times in his 7 plate appearances!

Agree with 2019dad.  Heck, the RC from the school my son ended up at called for the first time and said "we've seen you pitch a couple times".....and we had never seen him at an event, even though the school is only 45 miles from us.  He couldn't have watched much, but must have liked what he saw.  A school that was looking at my son as an IF came to see him 5 weeks in a row and watched at least 2 games each weekend.  A HS kid throwing 87-88 is a lot easier for an RC to make a decision on in one outing than watching a kid hit 2 singles against a pitcher throwing 83. 

2019Dad posted:
pnw2017 posted:

Not sure where you are from, but this would be a west coast perspective. First of all, if you are selected for area code games, you most likely already are committed or have plenty of offers, same goes with pg National and USA TOS. These are the tournaments or showcases I have either attended or heard great things about on the west coast. All have high d1 coverage and Fall Classic and PG World Series have great pro scout coverage as well.

USA Baseball 17u NTC Arizona

Prospectwire East v West 17u California

Norcal World Series

Under Armour Southwest 17u California

Arizona Fall Classic

PG World Series 17u Arizona

PG Evoshield Upperclass Arizona

PG California World Series 

Phil Singer Summer Series 18u California

Elite Baseball Series California

Rising Prospects showcase California

 

 

 

 

 

How would the SoCal scout teams Sunday games in the fall compare?

2019 Dad, next to Area Code the So Cal Scout league was the best value for time and money we made.  My son was on the So Cal Cardinals (now Giants) and they also went to Arizona Fall Classic. The Academic game is the single best event for high academic players. (along with Stanford camp) 

BOF posted:
2019Dad posted:
pnw2017 posted:

Not sure where you are from, but this would be a west coast perspective. First of all, if you are selected for area code games, you most likely already are committed or have plenty of offers, same goes with pg National and USA TOS. These are the tournaments or showcases I have either attended or heard great things about on the west coast. All have high d1 coverage and Fall Classic and PG World Series have great pro scout coverage as well.

USA Baseball 17u NTC Arizona

Prospectwire East v West 17u California

Norcal World Series

Under Armour Southwest 17u California

Arizona Fall Classic

PG World Series 17u Arizona

PG Evoshield Upperclass Arizona

PG California World Series 

Phil Singer Summer Series 18u California

Elite Baseball Series California

Rising Prospects showcase California

 

 

 

 

 

How would the SoCal scout teams Sunday games in the fall compare?

2019 Dad, next to Area Code the So Cal Scout league was the best value for time and money we made.  My son was on the So Cal Cardinals (now Giants) and they also went to Arizona Fall Classic. The Academic game is the single best event for high academic players. (along with Stanford camp) 

Thanks! Sending you a PM.

PGStaff posted:

SANDIEGOREALIST,

I understand you are just being critical about the All American Classic and not so much Perfect Game. And there is nothing wrong with that opinion. It’s just there is more to it than that. I hope I can write this politely because I’m not interested in fighting about it.

Of course, we want to promote our brand, but don't think everything we do only revolves around promoting our brand. We have an event planned with MLB that will be televised this fall. The problem is, you really don’t know us very well. You don’t know why we do everything. So until you get to know those people who you think you have figured out… Yes, you might as well have fallen off that turnip truck you mentioned.

You have completely missed one fact. This game is not about exposure to scouts and college recruiters. While they might be most interested in watching, they do know these players already. I never said these players need exposure. You are correct in saying they don’t need the exposure. There's just so much more to it than that.

You have stated that you know what OUR MOTIVATION IS? You are telling people what PG IS HOPING to gain. You are assuming we are just like any other business. You must not know… I hate business and have never claimed to be good at it. I have been a member here from the beginning. Go back and look at posts from years ago. Not everyone is motivated by money or business. People that know our business know our weakest area is marketing. I have told many, if you lack talent don’t waste your time and money on Perfect Game, because we can’t help you. Why would I come on here and argue about some of the things you are claiming. There isn’t anything you have said that would insult a true businessman. Nothing you have said is harmful and you have said some nice things as well. You simply do not know me and what motivates me. Some of our greatest accomplishments, that I am most proud of, involve kids that weren’t among the best players we see.

Once again, you are assuming we are a normal business. You need to talk to people that actually know me. Not those that claim to know me, because they met me somewhere, but those that really do know me and how I think and what trips my trigger. Then you might be more likely to question my intelligence rather than this other stuff.

We have lots of ideas… Our people come in and present ideas to bring in revenue. Every idea has to pass a test and answer one question. That question is… Is it good for the game? If in our estimation that question isn’t yes… We don’t do it. The PGAAC is one of many things we do that, we are totally convinced, is good for the game. It is even good way beyond the game! Every time a hometown, a high school, a travel team, a coach, pediatric cancer awareness, or anything else is mentioned on national television… It is a good thing!

I’m not special, I’m and old scout and college coach. I am a baseball lifer and a baseball nut. I was shocked when USA Today named me #57 in their list of top 100 most powerful people in MLB. #56 and #58 were Joe Maddon and Brian Cashman. I was the only person on the list that does what we do. I personally know hundreds of people much more powerful than me. An honor yes, but not so much a deserving one. I think it was more about Perfect Game’s position, accomplishments, and reputation than it was about me personally being influential.

Really, other than what I have mentioned above, I have no problem with your opinions, but this comment following your post does truly bother me. Looks like you have a new worshipper based on this statement!

Hallelujah !!  Can I get an Amen ?!

Worshipper ? Really ??  Because I happen to agree with some of his points ? What an absurd thing to say.

Surprised the PG Jr. Nationals were not mentioned, unless I missed it.

Looking back, the following events were impactful:

  • WWBAs (16U, 17U)
  • Jupiter (his 1st; by the time of his 2nd, he was already locked-in)
  • PG Jr. Nationals
  • PG Nationals

 

ECP is a pro event, which was tremendous. He would've gone to the Area Code games, but we were way beyond budget at that point.

FWIW: the regional events, regardless of the host, are effective for regional exposure. The Canes run a combine in the weekend after the regular season and before the conference championships, and it is very well attended by mid-Atlantic schools.

3and2Fastball posted:

From the perspective of someone who lives in Wisconsin, I can say that top players from here absolutely utilize Perfect Game's help in ways that no other organization or scouting service would provide.  For Gavin Lux (1st Round pick - Dodgers), Ben Rortvedt (2nd Round pick - Twins), and Jerred Kelenic (projected Top 10 overall pick in the 2018 draft), they wouldn't have been been positioned to go as high in the draft w/o the Perfect Game National or the All-American Game at Petco.   Living in Wisconsin they just don't get the exposure of playing enough top-flight competition (even if they do play in a few WWBA Tournaments with their travel teams) to get properly slotted in the draft without those elite events.

And Gavin and Ben took advantage of those opportunities and did very, very well.

Bringing this discussion back around to OP's ask: "So, here's my question:  For the kid in a region of the country where the schools of interest are not nearby and the exposure is not as frequent in front of college coaches and they are in a graduation class younger than permitted by NCAA rules for contact from the coaches directly, what EVENTS are the best bang for the buck at getting scouted by the college coaches you are targeting that are making the decisions?"

In that age group of frosh/sophomores, the whole key is to get in a travel team organization that is established and is regularly invited to participate in the bigger travel team events promoted by PG and the others.  Coaches will go to where they can get the biggest bang for their limited travel dollars, so tournaments where the top travel teams play is the best place to do that.  The challenge is not only getting on those teams, but getting a chance to play on those teams, as many of them are stacked with talent and have large rosters.  Those teams not only get invited to play in the big national tourneys, but many of them are invited to play weekend "exhibitions" on the campus of some of the bigger D1s.  My son had a teammate on his HS team who played for a BPA elite team who played a weekend event at a Pac12 school and was offered as a sophomore.  He never had to do any of the personal showcases--it was all because of his exposure on an elite travel team.

While there may be fewer of those teams in other parts of the country, you can research which teams are invited to WWBA and the Arizona Fall Classic and then reach out to those coaches for a tryout.  They may be pricey to join but the exposure is incredible if your son is good enough to play on them.  And even some of the lesser teams that go to the Arizona Fall Classic get you the benefit of being able to try out for the Academic game if you have strong academic credentials.  Of all of the events my 2017 participated in, by far the most scouted was the Academic game at the Senior Fall Classic.  90+ schools watched the tryouts and then attended the game that night.  His phone was lit up for days.  That is later in the process than the OP is talking about, but again it points to the importance of getting on a strong travel team early in the process to open those doors to coach exposure during high school.

adbono posted:
joemktg posted:

SANDIEGOREALIST and ADBONO,

Would you summarize your view of PG? I'm interested, but it's very difficult to ascertain a central train of thought via message board layout.

Thanks.

That's a little forward, don't you think ?  I mean, we don't even know each other!  And you want to hop right in the sack ?? Geez !!!  What is the world coming to ?

Sorry for the affront, but I'm trying to understand your POV. SanDiegoRealist was kind enough to send me a PM, and I see where he's coming from.

And no: I'm very happily married, and I don't swing that way. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

Last edited by joemktg
joemktg posted:
adbono posted:
joemktg posted:

SANDIEGOREALIST and ADBONO,

Would you summarize your view of PG? I'm interested, but it's very difficult to ascertain a central train of thought via message board layout.

Thanks.

That's a little forward, don't you think ?  I mean, we don't even know each other!  And you want to hop right in the sack ?? Geez !!!  What is the world coming to ?

Sorry for the affront, but I'm trying to understand your POV. SanDiegoRealist was kind enough to send me a PM, and I see where he's coming from.

And no: I'm very happily married, and I don't swing that way. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

I saw his PM also. It is well stated.

Here's my own view of Pg from a personal level. Of course, it's one perspective and only anecdotal. My 2018 ended up committing to a school, with a coaching staff, that was a perfect fit. He was fairly well recruited, but often a hard sell due to unusual pitching mechanics. It was through PG exposure, and Perfect Game exposure alone, that we ended up connected to this school and a coach that not only accepts is mechanics, but wants him because  of them. Would he have been recruited without PG exposure? Yeah. However, there's no way this school and my son would ever have sought each other out - never in a million years. My point? Even for kids already on the radar with plenty of opportunities, it greatly expands choices and opportunities. I've also seen plenty of our kids come into WWBA with limited recruiting options and leave with offers from schools they had never been in contact with and never considered, including D2 & D3 levels. 

 

Some of the events listed above are great for the premier player -- the kid going to a Power Five school and getting pro looks.  But many are by invitation only, and so are not realistic for many players.

The point being, you can't really say what the top 10 recruiting events are.  The question is, top 10 events for whom?  If you are a guy who's on that fence between D3 and mid-major, the answer is going to be very different for you than it would be for the player who's going to PG National, Area Codes and such.

Oftentimes a player is best served by sticking to events that are closer to home, so that a coach at a school of interest is able to see him several times and, you can hope, come to appreciate him fully.  Because baseball scholarships are almost never 100%, and often as low as 25% (or zero), looking at in-state public university programs is very important to many if not most players, so far-flung travels are not necessarily a good idea if they take you away from your target audience.

The summer WWBA events have for me lost a lot of their luster.  8-10 years ago, you would see coaches congregate at East Cobb and you'd play there or very nearby most of the time.  Coaches from your state would come to your games, but others would just sort of cruise by to see what they could see.  Because the event is so huge and spread out now, you just don't get that.  Pretty much that event is for coaches who're following your team to see how you stack up against teams from other areas.  If you draw a game 60-75 minutes away from LakePoint, often no scouts will be there unless you hold a top arm to pitch that game.  The scouts aren't going to lose 4 hours out of their day going to see one game, not when they can just wait a couple days and see you at LakePoint later on.

Jupiter players are largely committed by late October of their senior years, so that is more and more a pro scouting event and less and less a college recruitment event.  Underclass players fortunate enough to get on a roster there can benefit, though. 

Of the PG events, I see the Junior National Showcase as one that can really ignite recruiting for the high-level player who may not yet have been "discovered," so to speak.  The last several guys we've sent there from our program have done well there and as a result, seen an immediate spike in interest from numerous programs; most have ended up committing within a month. 

The WWBA 17u at Ft. Myers is also still very good due to its being concentrated at a very few sites that aren't too far apart.  But there are still a few venues there that may leave you playing for an audience of team parents.  I hope that event doesn't grow so large that its value gets lost.  For now, it's a great scouting venue open to pretty much anyone.

Midlo Dad posted:

Some of the events listed above are great for the premier player -- the kid going to a Power Five school and getting pro looks.  But many are by invitation only, and so are not realistic for many players.

The point being, you can't really say what the top 10 recruiting events are.  The question is, top 10 events for whom?  If you are a guy who's on that fence between D3 and mid-major, the answer is going to be very different for you than it would be for the player who's going to PG National, Area Codes and such.

Oftentimes a player is best served by sticking to events that are closer to home, so that a coach at a school of interest is able to see him several times and, you can hope, come to appreciate him fully.  Because baseball scholarships are almost never 100%, and often as low as 25% (or zero), looking at in-state public university programs is very important to many if not most players, so far-flung travels are not necessarily a good idea if they take you away from your target audience.

Besides "events close to home", are there any bigger events/Showcases that you would recommend for the player who is on the fence between a D3 and mid-major D1?

If you're a high academic kid, the Headfirst Honor Roll Showcases are great events.  We had a few of those held in Virginia but alas those were discontinued.  I think they are usually either up in the northeast or down in Jupiter these days.  You'll get places like William & Mary, Georgetown, George Washington, Penn, Lehigh, Princeton, but also Washington & Lee and other high academic D3 options.

In Virginia, the Commonwealth Games are that sort of venue if you can get there. 

Beyond that, there are still a lot of D3 programs who rely on fall tryouts to fill most of their rosters, so the idea of choosing the school for non-baseball reasons and then giving it your all at a fall tryout is still on the table.

3and2Fastball posted:

Besides "events close to home", are there any bigger events/Showcases that you would recommend for the player who is on the fence between a D3 and mid-major D1?

Seems like the vast majority of baseball players go to colleges within a few hours drive of home. The notable exceptions being premier players from the north, and high academic kids. I don't think there's anything like HF for the "between a D3 and mid-major D1" player simply because most of those coaches believe that their limited time and resources are best spent recruiting within their region. Now if the player makes the effort to go to the school, the coach is certainly going to give you a look, but a mid-major school like Delaware isn't going to travel to a national showcase looking for talent. Now they will travel to something like a WWBA, simply because there are thousands of players there, including most of the top guys from their region.

I think PG is the best with special emphasis put on WWBA, but you have to be pitching the right game or be a top player to gain the attention.  My son had 20-30 Major D1 scouts behind home plate for both games this year with one starting at 12:15 in the morning and going until 2 am. 

Prep Baseball Report Futures Games is becoming a hotspot for the East.   It is played in Indiana and they play on three adjoining fields with no more than two games going at any given time so coaches don't have to travel all over the place and can see the action.  200 Colleges represented and reasonably priced.  The smaller PBR events are not as big but this one is becoming something big.  All upcoming sophomore and juniors who are unsigned.

Agree with Fan about PBR Future Games but it is an invite only event and you are picked to play for your state team.  My kid attended a small PBR showcase in RI (for $50 - peanuts!), did well and was invited to the Future Games as he was leaving the field.  Attendance at Indy worked out well for us and for at least two others we know. Registration fee for Future Games is also $50 - can't beat it.  

BaseballinCT posted:

Agree with Fan about PBR Future Games but it is an invite only event and you are picked to play for your state team.  My kid attended a small PBR showcase in RI (for $50 - peanuts!), did well and was invited to the Future Games as he was leaving the field.  Attendance at Indy worked out well for us and for at least two others we know. Registration fee for Future Games is also $50 - can't beat it.  

and for that $50 you got a nice pair of cleats!

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