Great post PG
Coach Chris:
A very wise person once taught me something about relationships that, when properly observed and applied, has served me well in this life. I commend the following thought to you for your consideration:
"People don't care how much you know till they know how much you care."
Think on that.
A very wise person once taught me something about relationships that, when properly observed and applied, has served me well in this life. I commend the following thought to you for your consideration:
"People don't care how much you know till they know how much you care."
Think on that.
TPM,
I do not know how I missed this thread; but I wanted to tell you how very sorry and concerned I am about David. He is in great hands at Clemson and you can rest assured that David will be in my prayers. He is a great looking kid and will come out of this just fine.
Mike
I do not know how I missed this thread; but I wanted to tell you how very sorry and concerned I am about David. He is in great hands at Clemson and you can rest assured that David will be in my prayers. He is a great looking kid and will come out of this just fine.
Mike
PG is right on with his comments. A couple things have become apparent to me with our experience that I'd like to mention. First, the family practice doctor we saw barely manipulated my son's arm at all. He bent it around, barely. He twisted it back and forth, barely. He palpitated several locations on, above and below the elbow, barely. My point is thtat he didn't do anything that remotely resembled what our boys do every single time they throw a ball. The baseball orthopedist first shook my son's hand, and without warning put his other hand under his elbow and straightened son's arm. Not forcefully, but without warning and firmly with support from his own hand. Son just about hit the ceiling tiles. Some of the other manipulations included bending his arm back into a position like one does in their throwing motion just before the arm begins coming forward, and then he gently rotated it just a tad farther. Another visit toward the ceiling! When he palpitated various areas, he put more pressure on each spot than the family practice doc. When he did it over the ligament, yet another semi-religious experience for my son.
The point I'm trying to make with the above illustrations is that the first doctor suspected tendinitis and was going through motions associated with what he normally does with that complaint. He had no concept of what an arm goes through in throwing. The second doc suspected possible ligament problems based on what we told him at the beginning, and approached his exam in a completely different manner. The first doc has no experience with baseball and kept asking how much son has been pitching. First, we told him he doesn't pitch but is a catcher. Second, he hasn't been able to throw a single baseball for a month. A couple minutes later, he asked if he's been throwing too many curveballs! HUH? If anything ever happens to your son's arms, after seeing your primary care doc, you need to insist on seeing a qualified orthopedist early on if the problem is anything more than a moderate injury; that is, if your son wants to keep playing.
One final comment. I'm hoping to take another catcher from a local high school with us when we go back to our orthopedist. This boy has a torn UCL and will likely also require TJ surgery. The issue here is that the boy's family has Kaiser for their health insurance. This boy has been having elbow problems for about 18 months, and the Kaiser docs keep saying that it is tendinitis and he can play through it with no serious harm. He has been trying to play through the pain for over a year, but it just keeps getting worse. Finally, his baseball coach, on behalf of the parents, went to Kaiser with the boy and insisted that they refer him to an ortho. The ortho still didn't think UCL problems, and wouldn't do an MRI. I'm told things got kinda ugly between the baseball coach and the ortho. Finally, they did agree to do an arthroscopic "exploratory" procedure to see if anything serious was going on. During this surgery, they removed a couple bone chips and some sort of "mass" and did find during the procedure that his UCL is in fact torn. They now are willing to do TJ surgery, but the catch is the ortho who would do it has never done the procedure; but assured the family that it isn't that complicated and their son will be fine when he's done. Major red flags here! When I related this boy's story to our orthopedist, he had a completely puzzled look on his face, and told me that what this kid has gona through doesn't make sense to him. He couldn't understand why they'd do an exploratory surgery when they weren't willing to do an MRI. He is willing to see the boy and will decide what to do from there. The point here is that not all health insurance plans will willingly cover your son's injury, and might refer him to someone who is not well qualified to do the procedure. That might make the arm functional, but not baseball functional.
Sorry to be so long winded, again.
The point I'm trying to make with the above illustrations is that the first doctor suspected tendinitis and was going through motions associated with what he normally does with that complaint. He had no concept of what an arm goes through in throwing. The second doc suspected possible ligament problems based on what we told him at the beginning, and approached his exam in a completely different manner. The first doc has no experience with baseball and kept asking how much son has been pitching. First, we told him he doesn't pitch but is a catcher. Second, he hasn't been able to throw a single baseball for a month. A couple minutes later, he asked if he's been throwing too many curveballs! HUH? If anything ever happens to your son's arms, after seeing your primary care doc, you need to insist on seeing a qualified orthopedist early on if the problem is anything more than a moderate injury; that is, if your son wants to keep playing.
One final comment. I'm hoping to take another catcher from a local high school with us when we go back to our orthopedist. This boy has a torn UCL and will likely also require TJ surgery. The issue here is that the boy's family has Kaiser for their health insurance. This boy has been having elbow problems for about 18 months, and the Kaiser docs keep saying that it is tendinitis and he can play through it with no serious harm. He has been trying to play through the pain for over a year, but it just keeps getting worse. Finally, his baseball coach, on behalf of the parents, went to Kaiser with the boy and insisted that they refer him to an ortho. The ortho still didn't think UCL problems, and wouldn't do an MRI. I'm told things got kinda ugly between the baseball coach and the ortho. Finally, they did agree to do an arthroscopic "exploratory" procedure to see if anything serious was going on. During this surgery, they removed a couple bone chips and some sort of "mass" and did find during the procedure that his UCL is in fact torn. They now are willing to do TJ surgery, but the catch is the ortho who would do it has never done the procedure; but assured the family that it isn't that complicated and their son will be fine when he's done. Major red flags here! When I related this boy's story to our orthopedist, he had a completely puzzled look on his face, and told me that what this kid has gona through doesn't make sense to him. He couldn't understand why they'd do an exploratory surgery when they weren't willing to do an MRI. He is willing to see the boy and will decide what to do from there. The point here is that not all health insurance plans will willingly cover your son's injury, and might refer him to someone who is not well qualified to do the procedure. That might make the arm functional, but not baseball functional.
Sorry to be so long winded, again.
Best of luck to both players and good health wishes to all kids out there as season is beginning.
I completely agree with TigerPaw about seeing an appropriately credentialled doctor anytime significant pain is in the arm.
I am fortunate that my brother in law is an orthopedic surgeon. He gives my HS pitcher son free exams every time the families get together. The one thing that I can pass on from my experience with him, which I don't think crosses the medical advice line, is that one day he was examining my son in a standing position with his shirt off and asked if he had been feeling any shoulder pain. My son said no. I asked why and he showed me that my son's throwing shoulder had drooped about 1/2 inch down and forward about 1/2 inch as compared to his none throwing shoulder. He said this is usually and indicator of a problem. Sure enough about two weeks later he started having minor shoulder pain. We promptly started him on prescribed physical therapy and within a week the shoulder pulled back into proper alignment and the pain was gone. Now I keep a very close eye on shoulder alignment and I would encourage others to do the same.
I am fortunate that my brother in law is an orthopedic surgeon. He gives my HS pitcher son free exams every time the families get together. The one thing that I can pass on from my experience with him, which I don't think crosses the medical advice line, is that one day he was examining my son in a standing position with his shirt off and asked if he had been feeling any shoulder pain. My son said no. I asked why and he showed me that my son's throwing shoulder had drooped about 1/2 inch down and forward about 1/2 inch as compared to his none throwing shoulder. He said this is usually and indicator of a problem. Sure enough about two weeks later he started having minor shoulder pain. We promptly started him on prescribed physical therapy and within a week the shoulder pulled back into proper alignment and the pain was gone. Now I keep a very close eye on shoulder alignment and I would encourage others to do the same.
Barbara and 06 things will work out. You both did the right thing. Too many parents and coaches don't realize how a simple pain is telling you something.
You went for professional help and things will work out.
Chris you have an agenda and care nothing about thye people you advise. Your analysis are garbage in garbage out. I read a couple and you are so ambiguous and fill your work with fluff.
You are a dangerous man who knows no bounds. I am afraid for your sons and those who mibht be fooled by your double talk.
The advice given is to seek proper medical advice when you have pain period and stay away from the QUACKs.
You went for professional help and things will work out.
Chris you have an agenda and care nothing about thye people you advise. Your analysis are garbage in garbage out. I read a couple and you are so ambiguous and fill your work with fluff.
You are a dangerous man who knows no bounds. I am afraid for your sons and those who mibht be fooled by your double talk.
The advice given is to seek proper medical advice when you have pain period and stay away from the QUACKs.
06catcherdad...you have a PM
TPM and 06catcherdad-
Heavy sigh
Thank you both for sharing what must be very distressing moments for both of you. I was so very sorry to read about your sons' recent injuries. We all live day to day knowing that any of our boys are possibly one throw away from this situation. My prayers are with both families that recoveries will be quick with successful results.
Heavy sigh
Thank you both for sharing what must be very distressing moments for both of you. I was so very sorry to read about your sons' recent injuries. We all live day to day knowing that any of our boys are possibly one throw away from this situation. My prayers are with both families that recoveries will be quick with successful results.
TPM,
Sorry to hear about DK. You both have my best wishs for a speedy recovery. DK for his setback and you for a parents anguish. I was so looking foward to seeing DK do well tonight. God Bless both of you and may the days ahead bring great news.
Bobby Cox (MOUNDMASTER)
Sorry to hear about DK. You both have my best wishs for a speedy recovery. DK for his setback and you for a parents anguish. I was so looking foward to seeing DK do well tonight. God Bless both of you and may the days ahead bring great news.
Bobby Cox (MOUNDMASTER)
A couple of things are very evident here:
1. Good health insurance is a must, which of course is a larger societal problem. It is complicated by the complications of baseball. A good HMO might not even do the trick. Required for prompt proper diagnosis and treament might be a traditional Blue Cross/Blue Shield plan, which nowadays is sometimes hard to come by and very often substantially more expensive.
2. It does not always work out even with the best of preparation and care, at least in a baseball sense. Once again we are reminded how fragile baseball success can be and how important it is to be in a place where life can be great with or without the baseball.
1. Good health insurance is a must, which of course is a larger societal problem. It is complicated by the complications of baseball. A good HMO might not even do the trick. Required for prompt proper diagnosis and treament might be a traditional Blue Cross/Blue Shield plan, which nowadays is sometimes hard to come by and very often substantially more expensive.
2. It does not always work out even with the best of preparation and care, at least in a baseball sense. Once again we are reminded how fragile baseball success can be and how important it is to be in a place where life can be great with or without the baseball.
quote:Originally posted by 06catcherdad:
Insist you inquire about dye injection for the MRI, to aid in the diagnosis.
Begin locating a proven PT guy in So-Cal.
Check out the Curtis National Hand Center in Baltimore, who may know of PT in So-Cal.
Prayers
Good post by PG.
Of course everyone would love PERFECT mechanics (WHATEVER THAT MIGHT BE)
, but simply put, the human arm was not designed to throw a ball overhand.
There are no guarantees in baseball or in life. My son has always had it right when he says "his next pitch could be his last". One just never knows.
Here's hoping for speedy recoveries to DK and 06's son.
Of course everyone would love PERFECT mechanics (WHATEVER THAT MIGHT BE)
, but simply put, the human arm was not designed to throw a ball overhand.There are no guarantees in baseball or in life. My son has always had it right when he says "his next pitch could be his last". One just never knows.
Here's hoping for speedy recoveries to DK and 06's son.
The Importance of going to a Specialist.
I have a daughter who at 1yr old was diagnosed with a disclocated hip bu her new doctor. Sent her to a surgeon who wanted to operate immediately. My wife refused to admit her without seeking specialist 2nd opinion. The surgery would leave her with a limp thye rest of her life.
Brother who went to school with the leading Specialists son called and got us an appointment.
He said no surgery,no limp but a full body cast for almost a year. The other surgeon got mad at my wife and said the other opinions would be the same.
23 YO and not a hint of the limp and can not remember flopping around in the cast.
Get the best advice you can.
I have a daughter who at 1yr old was diagnosed with a disclocated hip bu her new doctor. Sent her to a surgeon who wanted to operate immediately. My wife refused to admit her without seeking specialist 2nd opinion. The surgery would leave her with a limp thye rest of her life.
Brother who went to school with the leading Specialists son called and got us an appointment.
He said no surgery,no limp but a full body cast for almost a year. The other surgeon got mad at my wife and said the other opinions would be the same.
23 YO and not a hint of the limp and can not remember flopping around in the cast.
Get the best advice you can.
Here is hoping that all works out best for both boys. I am sure all of their HSBBW "cyber" parents want to be kept informed as their situations progress, so please do keep us posted.
Since this thread was intended as a learning tool. Speaking from experience, though I'm sure this would not be the case at a fine institution and baseball school like Clemson, D-1s do watch their budget. Some will opt to assume the best and cheaper option rather than assume the worst and rule it out first. Some injuries respond best to immediate attention (see how the pros handle their athletes).
The learning here is you may be, like catcherdad06 the lone or at least best advocate for your son. Don't assume they will rush to spend their insurance companies money and risk premium increases if they can help it.
INSIST on an examination that rules out the worst first - not one that assumes the best!!!!
When you insist and end up being right don't expect them to "give you the love" if you know what I mean. They may take it ourt on your son!
Hate to sound skeptical but I've seen it first hand.
The learning here is you may be, like catcherdad06 the lone or at least best advocate for your son. Don't assume they will rush to spend their insurance companies money and risk premium increases if they can help it.
INSIST on an examination that rules out the worst first - not one that assumes the best!!!!
When you insist and end up being right don't expect them to "give you the love" if you know what I mean. They may take it ourt on your son!
Hate to sound skeptical but I've seen it first hand.
TPM and 06...I am sorry to hear about your sons' baseball setbacks. However, as many posters have said, good for them and you for looking at the bigger picture and attending to the matter immediately. I can't even imagine the disappointment each of the boys must feel, but, hopefully they will maintain their focus and determination to get better and come back when they are able, and not before. Baseball, like lessons in life, is a marathon, not a sprint. Good luck to both of them.
quote:There are no guarantees in baseball or in life. My son has always had it right when he says "his next pitch could be his last". One just never knows.
Frank,
Being around so many "patients" at that level, they DO wonder from time to time when and if that day will come.
I always forget to reread my posts before i hit "post now" apparently I wrote over the first part.
I wish both boys the quickest possible recovery but I know they have one thing in common so I'm not worried. They have someone who'll make sure everything that can be done will be done!
I wish both boys the quickest possible recovery but I know they have one thing in common so I'm not worried. They have someone who'll make sure everything that can be done will be done!
Thanks everyone for your emails and posts.
The normal course for any injury is an immediate wait and see attitude. If there is major inflammation, you have got to wait for that to subside. I have spoken to both coach and trainer and they are on top of things. The ortho is in charge right now and they will follow his instructions. And above all else, son did do the best thing by not trying to be macho man. This is one of those times I spoke about in a post. You put on your parent listening ears and give support.
The purpose again of the post is to let parents and players know that anything can happen, anytime to any player.
For those asking, I have sent a pm to Dr. Coach Chris, coach of 11 year olds and seeker of answers to mechanics and injuries. He has offered to call son's pitching coach to give his observations, but I respectfully have declined his kind jesture, due to his limited experience.
I am hoping all of yours have a GREAT baseball weekend! Now begins an unusul opening day of a double header, due to very poor weather expected this weekend.
The normal course for any injury is an immediate wait and see attitude. If there is major inflammation, you have got to wait for that to subside. I have spoken to both coach and trainer and they are on top of things. The ortho is in charge right now and they will follow his instructions. And above all else, son did do the best thing by not trying to be macho man. This is one of those times I spoke about in a post. You put on your parent listening ears and give support.
The purpose again of the post is to let parents and players know that anything can happen, anytime to any player.
For those asking, I have sent a pm to Dr. Coach Chris, coach of 11 year olds and seeker of answers to mechanics and injuries. He has offered to call son's pitching coach to give his observations, but I respectfully have declined his kind jesture, due to his limited experience.
I am hoping all of yours have a GREAT baseball weekend! Now begins an unusul opening day of a double header, due to very poor weather expected this weekend.
Sorry to hear of the arm problems. Hope that y'all's boys have quick recoveries.
TPM & 06catcherdad,
Sorry to hear of your sons' arm injuries but gladdened to by the stance that you have both taken as parents to insure that they minimize the damage done and get the proper care.
If I can be of any assistance, call on me.
My thoughts are with your families for a total and quick healing.
Sorry to hear of your sons' arm injuries but gladdened to by the stance that you have both taken as parents to insure that they minimize the damage done and get the proper care.
If I can be of any assistance, call on me.
My thoughts are with your families for a total and quick healing.
TPM and 06CD-
Thanks for sharing your stories.
My thoughts are with you and your sons for a full and speedy recovery.
Thanks for sharing your stories.
My thoughts are with you and your sons for a full and speedy recovery.
hers to a speedy recovery,our prayers are with you all'
I had been away from the posts for a few days and all this happens. My thoughts go out to both TPM and 06....I will be in touch and please keep us informed.
Another point to be made ..... in spite of doing all the right things, injuries will happen, especially to pitchers. The 'dream' can vanish in an instant. Keep things in perspective. Encourage your child to be a student first, athlete second. Sometimes this is hard to do with all the attention that comes with being a star athlete (and the attention that parents receive too). Wishing speedy recovery and much success to DK (and CU).
Very best wishes to both boys
on successful and speedy recoveries.
on successful and speedy recoveries.
TPM and 06,
Hope all goes well for both of your boys and they recover quickly.
Hope all goes well for both of your boys and they recover quickly.
TPM and 06Dad:
Best of luck to both of your sons - and I'll keep my fingers crossed for a full and speedy recovery.
Best of luck to both of your sons - and I'll keep my fingers crossed for a full and speedy recovery.
TPM-
Your son showed such amazing maturity. Thanks for sharing as you always do. Hope the problem is minor and he'll have a speedy recovery. Please keep us posted and hope for a speedy recovery.
Your son showed such amazing maturity. Thanks for sharing as you always do. Hope the problem is minor and he'll have a speedy recovery. Please keep us posted and hope for a speedy recovery.
TPM, here's praying for a speedy recovery and that this is only a minor setback.
I've also been away for a few days and only just read the thread. Thanks for thinking to post this, Barb, at a time when you must be very worried.
All kinds of good mojo heading to David and Our 06 Catcher from here in Florida. It's early season; they have time to recover and still contribute. I know you two will keep us updated.
All kinds of good mojo heading to David and Our 06 Catcher from here in Florida. It's early season; they have time to recover and still contribute. I know you two will keep us updated.
TPM and catcher,
As a parent of another injured player, I feel your pain and wish your sons my best.
As a parent of another injured player, I feel your pain and wish your sons my best.
Hoping your sons have a speedy recovery