https://www.dailylocal.com/new...31-5725e061f976.html
Very sad news.
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This means the PSAC is likely to follow. I’m guessing it’s where some of your son’s interest has come from. It looks like they won’t be out hard at work recruiting.
I know someone at Shippingsburg, they havent heard anything yet, but he's getting nervous.
Not only terrible at this time it would be stupid. Screw West Chester play without them. They are getting killed locally in a fashion from athletics to regular students.
We in PA have an extremely liberal hyper aggressive governor who has been sued and lost in federal court by our legislators and even he is opening things up more not less, Screw West Chester.
Why decide this so early?
@Geezmom posted:Why decide this so early?
West Chester wants to be the gold standard of PSAC, it only takes a few dopes in high positions to send an otherwise reasonable school off the rails Again leave them to play paddy cakes alone
I won’t be surprised if The Centennial Conference does the same thing.
On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 1:48 PM HS Baseball Web <alerts@crowdstack.com>
wrote:
On Thu, Oct 8, 2020 at 1:48 PM HS Baseball Web <alerts@crowdstack.com>
wrote:
Could this just be about money and have nothing to do with health concerns? Maybe they lost so much money over the last seven months and expect to lose more over the next four (or so) that they are looking to cut costs and spring athletics was a low hanging fruit? And, rather than admit it's about money, they are hiding behind the public safety card? Not saying that this is what's happening...just wondering if it could be possible?
@Francis7 posted:Could this just be about money and have nothing to do with health concerns? Maybe they lost so much money over the last seven months and expect to lose more over the next four (or so) that they are looking to cut costs and spring athletics was a low hanging fruit? And, rather than admit it's about money, they are hiding behind the public safety card? Not saying that this is what's happening...just wondering if it could be possible?
The article basically says they are cancelling spring sports because the university decided on remote learning for the spring semester. I would guess the decision is based on that administration's health concerns or other financial considerations NOT related to sports. This decision to go remote this early is surprising. They had more time to watch developments or push back spring start to February or other ideas. I doubt West Chester University will lead to others making this decision in the near term.
@Geezmom posted:Why decide this so early?
That was my question. The Presidential election is less than a month away--and that's considered a lifetime of what could happen news-wise from now until then. And this decision was made MONTHS in advance. A decision for remote learning this early means they think things will worsen I guess. Delay the start of spring term as others colleges have done. I think currently PA is one of the 15 "lower rate/decline" covid states too.
In PA at this time we are playing HS school sports, we are playing professional sports, we have kids attending public schools (some but not all) like live and in person, we are opening HS and professional sport stadiums to fans...but West Chester cancels the spring semester in October? I have 2 kids attending colleges on campus in PA within 50 miles of WC.
How stupid are our colleges in PA? Well somehow they decided to cancel all of the fall seasons but they are allowing the spring sports to do the offseason training and practices. Last weekend I watched 42 kids playing baseball on Saturday and Sunday for fall on a ballfield that is a couple hundred yards away from the football and soccer fields of the teams they cancelled in season! The locker rooms are in between them...and the building is shared! The level of incompetency is mind-blowing.
This is just dumb.
Why and why now? The most skeptical, pessimistic side of me says these are small sacrifices in the big picture where PA is a swing state in a national election, and some very powerful individuals want things to seem as bad as possible for the sitting president
Many college professors are digging in and saying they won't teach in person. They clearly don't understand economics, but they may soon.
Colleges are opening spring registration in the next few weeks, the schedules are already built. Many will continue with mostly online classes, even if their campuses are open. I'm sure they are all holding their breaths to see if students actually enroll, after having experienced online classes in the fall. It does seem early to decide to keep campus closed, but it's very complicated to pivot from open to closed; if you open, you have to have lots of measure in place (which cost money), so I can kind of see the decision right now to keep a campus closed, if it was closed this fall, and if your enrollments didn't suffer too much. If a school relies on money from its football program to support the others, and there was no football, I can see that the sports decision could be taken now, too.
No Senior yr HS spring ball, then our boys played baseball all summer and now no college fall ball, only practice. Play Ball! Give the kids something to look forward to!
I am so over this.
This is terrible news and an example of the feckless leadership provided by academia in this area. I live in Chester County PA. Our local school district is still 100% virtual. The decisions to open are based on recommendations and data provided by the Chester County Health Department. The data they are using includes testing results that were done earlier in the spring and summer. The tests had a 55% false positive rate. The county wasted over $20 million of tax payer money on these tests. I wonder if West Chester is also following their lead...................WCU was one of the schools my 2021 was applying to if the right D3 baseball offer didn't materialize......Not anymore, its a bit too close to home anyway.
@High Change Ups Go A Long Way posted:Why and why now? The most skeptical, pessimistic side of me says these are small sacrifices in the big picture where PA is a swing state in a national election, and some very powerful individuals want things to seem as bad as possible for the sitting president
I agree. In some states college sports are being used as pawns in a political chess game (I see you Pac 12). I think it’s been proven that sporting events can safely take place with proper protocol and reasonable caution. Especially outdoor events and especially baseball. Politics have seeped into so many everyday living issues where it has no place. One side is not to blame. Both are at fault.
I think you are all forgetting that colleges are businesses; in fact, that is a complaint of most of the "academics" that you are blaming for being political. Any college that reopens has to take at least some precautions to minimize virus spread, and those precautions are expensive. If a college can make a business calculation that it can keep its campus closed and still get students to pay to take classes, then that's what it's going to do; it's far, far cheaper than opening up (and that would be true in normal times, also). If enough colleges think that they could make money doing online-only education permanently, they will do so - and college sports will disappear.
Some college sports ARE at risk at SOME schools. IMO this is especially true at the D3 level liberal arts colleges. But it also may be the case at any school that loses money as a result of participating in athletic competition. I don’t see any schools eliminating revenue generating sports regardless of the political climate. As for colleges operating as businesses, it’s a good thing for them that they aren’t regulated in any way and are marginally held accountable for the massive student debt crisis they have created as a result of their own greed. Otherwise they would be out of business.
I thought I'd share my experience. Our University (in a red state) opened up on time with accommodations, social distancing, and testing/contact tracing. The virus still spiked when school started up, but after a month, it waned. My kids already attended both a College and HS football game (one plays football as well). I don't know anybody personally who died from covid, but know of a few bad cases. The most vulnerable faculty are teaching virtual (and facluty are required to accommodate students with medical needs remotely as well). In two weeks, our HS is going to all day everyday, so things are seeming to get back to normal, except that everybody is still required to wear masks.
I am an adjunct professor at a college near the HS where I teach. I am one of the 7 out of 70+ courses offered at the U in my department that are fully taught in person (a few students have opted remote). I was SO GLAD when the "covid limit" of my classroom changed so that I could accommodate all 30 of my students. I wanted to teach this way having one student in college (presently) and a second graduating a few years ago. Tuition is $$$ to learn lessons on the computer and have no face to face interaction with the professor. In several cases I am the only in person course for a number of my students. A few students have approached me me after class to converse, seemingly just to have someone to interact with. Another student (same situation, all other classes virtual) said he really looks forward to coming to the class.
This class will go virtual from Thanksgiving break to end of semester, mid December.
My HS teaching is actually tougher under the hybrid model, where you only see half the students at a time, and the others are home zooming. It's a compromise. You cannot neglect the social interaction these teens receive just being around their friends.
@Ripken Fan posted:You cannot neglect the social interaction these teens receive just being around their friends.
College students are getting that, even if there is no in-person instruction.
@Ripken Fan posted:My HS teaching is actually tougher under the hybrid model, where you only see half the students at a time, and the others are home zooming. It's a compromise. You cannot neglect the social interaction these teens receive just being around their friends.
At my wife's school, the teachers have to do every day (versus every other that the HS does) and teach students remotely. It is super tough for them. Just remember to thank a teacher. It doesn't help that many of the virtual kids' parents are complaining that virtual school is too difficult for their kids.
One benefit to the every other day at the HS is that it somewhat shows them what it is like at college. I find those who are likely to succeed at college find it a lot of work, while those who are not, usually love the every other day, as they only do half as much work.
@JCG posted:College students are getting that, even if there is no in-person instruction.
This is true in West Chester, where I live and where students are living in off campus houses all around town. Last week the borough had to enforce mask wearing in public because cases nearly doubled in the last 30 days compared to the last 6 months. College kids (and others) are partying in houses and going around town without masks like normal. Chester County Health Department stats show that 68% of the new cases were in people ages 18-22. So maybe if the college kids want to return to in person school and have sports they should act more responsibly. It's a tough lesson to learn, but they did it to themselves.
The same applies to the country as a whole. If we embraced some simple behaviors like wearing a mask when you can't be apart from people, and actually had an effective testing and tracing program that we participate in with personal accountability, we'd have been able to return to something like normalcy already. Businesses would be doing much better already. Canada did it. But we'd rather just ignore it and pretend everything's fine and people are hysterical. Now with cold weather and flu season coming, do you think cases will be going up or down soon? They're already trending up in northern states where it's gotten colder. This isn't rocket science or politics - it's common sense around how viruses work. So tired of all the BS.
I'm sure I'm not changing anyone's mind with this post and I won't be responding since it's a futile argument and waste of my time. But the light of truth has to be shined on all this madness.
@2019&21 Dad posted:College kids (and others) are partying in houses and going around town without masks like normal. Chester County Health Department stats show that 68% of the new cases were in people ages 18-22. So maybe if the college kids want to return to in person school and have sports they should act more responsibly. It's a tough lesson to learn, but they did it to themselves.
Act more responsibly how? By not hanging out with people within that age bracket where it is almost guaranteed nothing will happen to you or your peers?
People act like college kids are getting together with the sole purpose of spreading this. 18-22 year olds aren't hanging out with 80 year olds on a daily basis. If they want to see their grandparents or go home for a weekend all they have to do is get tested first, results are almost all back within 48 hours at this point.
Better yet, if masks aren't required in public - why can't they see friends privately? Tell me how the virus can be so deadly but masks aren't even state mandate? Maybe local government should act more responsibly.
I hate these covid threads, I really do. But what I hate more is when we use the numbers selectively. When we look at all the numbers, we can see that the 18-22 bracket has a 99.997 chance of survival if they come down with it, that number includes pre existing conditions.
I'm not here to argue about covid. But it has to be pointed out that a baseball season was just cancelled for a bunch of healthy bodied young adults who chose to spend their money at that institution when they could've gone elsewhere. So yeah 68% of cases may be college students, but why does it matter, it's virtually harmless to them. I guess 18-22 year olds not enrolled in schools don't socialize?
@PABaseball posted:Act more responsibly how? By not hanging out with people within that age bracket where it is almost guaranteed nothing will happen to you or your peers?
People act like college kids are getting together with the sole purpose of spreading this. 18-22 year olds aren't hanging out with 80 year olds on a daily basis. If they want to see their grandparents or go home for a weekend all they have to do is get tested first, results are almost all back within 48 hours at this point.
Better yet, if masks aren't required in public - why can't they see friends privately? Tell me how the virus can be so deadly but masks aren't even state mandate? Maybe local government should act more responsibly.
I hate these covid threads, I really do. But what I hate more is when we use the numbers selectively. When we look at all the numbers, we can see that the 18-22 bracket has a 99.997 chance of survival if they come down with it, that number includes pre existing conditions.
I'm not here to argue about covid. But it has to be pointed out that a baseball season was just cancelled for a bunch of healthy bodied young adults who chose to spend their money at that institution when they could've gone elsewhere. So yeah 68% of cases may be college students, but why does it matter, it's virtually harmless to them. I guess 18-22 year olds not enrolled in schools don't socialize?
I said I wouldn't reply, but have to address multiple fallacies. I'll start with the last point you make.
1. Yes, responsible 18-22 yr olds shouldn't be socializing without masks - no one should.
2. You don't know that it's virtually harmless to college kids--certainly not long term effects. There will be long term effects on organs like lungs--there's already cases of that now.
3. It's not all about the mortality/survival rate. This thing is much worse than the flu and again, we have no idea what it will do down the road. Plus, if you get it, now you've got a pre-existing condition, no matter how slight the case. You don't want that.
4. Masks ARE required in public. People are just so inconsiderate of others that they had to be mandated and enforced with fines in order to make people do something for their fellow humans.
5. Tests are not back in 48 hours. My son's took over 2 weeks. That is much more the norm. Meanwhile, asymptomatic kids are passing it around the community and family.
6. Act more responsibly like a responsible adult who considers others besides impact on oneself. Problem is, many adults aren't a good example of that either - as evidenced by many of the comments on this board that put sports and money ahead of academics and health.
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Had an interesting conversation with a dad whose son returned from USMC boot camp at Paris Island about a month ago. His class was the first that was quarantined at the Citadel for two weeks before they started training. Even with the quarantine, they still had a breakout and Covid ran through the Platoon. The trainees were given a choice; go on sick call, get recycled, and start over from the beginning of boot camp or drive on through the illness. They all continued training. The story could be an exaggeration, but if true is a testament to the fact that the virus has minimal effect on 18-21 year olds.
I said I wouldn't reply, but have to address multiple fallacies. I'll start with the last point you make.
1. Yes, responsible 18-22 yr olds shouldn't be socializing without masks - no one should.
2. You don't know that it's virtually harmless to college kids--certainly not long term effects. There will be long term effects on organs like lungs--there's already cases of that now.
3. It's not all about the mortality/survival rate. This thing is much worse than the flu and again, we have no idea what it will do down the road. Plus, if you get it, now you've got a pre-existing condition, no matter how slight the case. You don't want that.
4. Masks ARE required in public. People are just so inconsiderate of others that they had to be mandated and enforced with fines in order to make people do something for their fellow humans.
5. Tests are not back in 48 hours. My son's took over 2 weeks. That is much more the norm. Meanwhile, asymptomatic kids are passing it around the community and family.
6. Act more responsibly like a responsible adult who considers others besides impact on oneself. Problem is, many adults aren't a good example of that either - as evidenced by many of the comments on this board that put sports and money ahead of academics and health.
We live in a town with a D3. Kids came back to campus with a mask mandate. You had to wear a mask outside your room. You couldn't hang out in groups outside of your floor. Classes were held outside, socially distanced or with attendance limits. People took turns going to class in person vs. online. Most activities are online, but they are happening. Football team is practicing in person and the conference is preparing for a season to start in January, all other sports are practicing. Theatre department is preparing a season of virtual performances, national championship debate team is kicking butt online.
High school sports are happening and we've watched athletic directors stop play and announce that the game won't continue until everyone in the student section is wearing masks.
The college has 1,200 students on campus, they've had about 20 cases total since August. Iowa overall is a hot spot, the White House says we should have a mask mandate but our governor refuses. My county of 56,000 people is averaging about 5 cases per day right now with a positive test rate of about 3.6%.
This can be done if people want to.
Not here to advocate for either side, as I cannot pretend to know the answer, but would like to share a personal story. Today is the two month anniversary of losing my father to Covid. He was 71 but otherwise healthy. And while you can never know 100% who you contracted the virus from, we know he did not catch it at our family business (everyone was tested twice) or from our family (everyone tested negative for virus and antibodies), the only person we know for sure who had it was the captain for his (recreational) fishing boat. Who, you guessed it, caught it from his college student daughter. And this is with a “protect the vulnerable” mentality. My father did not go to a public place. It was his own sport fishing boat. He wore a mask when around the captain (who nobody knew he was about to be sick because he hadn’t been around anyone “sick”) but they didn’t think about potential aerosolized virus being in the cabin from when he was preoaring the boat (maskless as he was alone) leading up to my father’s arrival. And while it is sad that my father passed. It is also distressing to hear of the trauma his passing has caused for the captain and his daughter. She knows she likely played a role in someone’s passing AND her father is about to be unemployed (the boat will be sold, it’s not worth the overhead since none of us enjoy deep sea fishing the way dad did).
I tell this story because this isn’t just about college kids. It’s about the people they come in contact with, and the people those people come in contact with. But, at the same time, it is also about living a life worth living. I am am so grateful that less than a week before his initial hospitalization my father was able to do the very thing that brought him the most joy in his semi-retirement. (I don’t think he would choose to live another decade if he had to be holed up in a bunker) I have the same hope that college athletes will be able to partake in the activity that likely brings them that same kind of joy.
Just some food for thought.
@Iowamom23 posted:This can be done if people want to.
"If people want to". That's the key.
@baseballhs posted:Many college professors are digging in and saying they won't teach in person. They clearly don't understand economics, but they may soon.
fire them
@2019&21 Dad posted:I said I wouldn't reply, but have to address multiple fallacies. I'll start with the last point you make...
I'm not going to go thru point by point, I don't care enough. But I'm not sure how you can correct my "fallacies" when you yourself said you don't even know what the effects will be.
Covid aside, my gripe has more to do with these schools than it does with the students. They'll take your money at the same rate and provide a fraction of the resources and extra curricular opportunities that lured students to the school in the first place. Nothing has changed from July to now that would suggest baseball cannot be played in 2021. You want to cancel the season, fine. Don't do it a month into the semester when the bill is already paid and you have no options.
@2019&21 Dad posted:I said I wouldn't reply, but have to address multiple fallacies. I'll start with the last point you make.
1. Yes, responsible 18-22 yr olds shouldn't be socializing without masks - no one should.
2. You don't know that it's virtually harmless to college kids--certainly not long term effects. There will be long term effects on organs like lungs--there's already cases of that now.
3. It's not all about the mortality/survival rate. This thing is much worse than the flu and again, we have no idea what it will do down the road. Plus, if you get it, now you've got a pre-existing condition, no matter how slight the case. You don't want that.
4. Masks ARE required in public. People are just so inconsiderate of others that they had to be mandated and enforced with fines in order to make people do something for their fellow humans.
5. Tests are not back in 48 hours. My son's took over 2 weeks. That is much more the norm. Meanwhile, asymptomatic kids are passing it around the community and family.
6. Act more responsibly like a responsible adult who considers others besides impact on oneself. Problem is, many adults aren't a good example of that either - as evidenced by many of the comments on this board that put sports and money ahead of academics and health.
damn feeling high and mighty are we! I don’t ever want live in the world you describe without it being a necessity....And it certainly isn’t that cause of science and all
I am so very sorry for your loss @LousyLefty
Re: college professors
Why would a college professor have to get within six feet of a student? They’re in front of the class. Don’t let any students approach the desk. Tell them if they need to talk stand ten feet away or call on the phone.
My son is on campus, but all of his classes have been on line. I'm not too happy about this as we were told there would be a hybrid model with smaller classes in person. On the bright side, the baseball team has an academic advisor with whom he meets once a week in person. The advisor goes over his classes with him in depth. He also knows the classes well enough to know what topics have given players trouble in the past, and he will assign a tutor to go over a specific topic when necessary. Overall I'd have to say that I'm pleasantly surprised with the effectiveness of the on line experience.
@PABaseball posted:I'm not going to go thru point by point, I don't care enough.
That's kind of the point - people don't care enough, about others. Until it hits them in the face.
I swear, if we look up and lose baseball this spring while the MLB is playing, while the NFL is playing, while college football is playing, while basketball is playing - I will not understand and will absolutely lose my crap at the university and the conference where my son is enrolled. He is in his senior year and to have some paper pushers dictate from a lofty perch how unsafe baseball is -- I'll just lose it.
