When teammates are doing drugs

I would tell him to keep his own nose clean and worry about the things he can control and not worry about what others were doing around him. I'd also tell him not to be hanging around those guys or even getting rides from them.

CPLZ I understand your point of view but I disagree.

When my son was 16 he played on a 19u Legion team. They did two tournaments which required major travel. In the letter to the kids and parents it had the language "if you are caught using drugs or alchol you will be sent home immediately."

At the first tournament a handful of the older boys were caught with beer. They had a team meeting and the coach said "it wouldn't be fair to everyone else if we sent you all home; so you are each suspended for one game." So over the course of the next five days one of the offenders sat out each game.

A few weeks later they go out of town again; this time principally the same group is caught smoking dope. Again; same meeting, same consequences.

Roll forward to the end of the season. One of the kids (who was an offender on both occasions)goes to a party, gets drunk and dies in a car accident.

I always believed that if the coach had enforced what he had in the letter to the parents and kids; this kid may have been forced to take a look at consequences which "may" have saved his life.

So when I hear these stories; I want to make sure that anybody and everybody that can help a young person from making a mistake which can kill them should be told. The faster that someone sees a potential problem, the faster resources can be made available which may save a life.

In this day and age of zero tolerance in schools your son needs to be careful to not be alone with these players anywhere. They could get busted in a bathroom or a locker room. My son was nearly suspended from middle school for being in a stall in the boys room when a pot deal was busted.

quote:

Originally posted by CPLZ:
I would tell him to keep his own nose clean and worry about the things he can control and not worry about what others were doing around him. I'd also tell him not to be hanging around those guys or even getting rides from them.

I've basically told my son the same thing. Even being guilty by association can be tragic on one in ways that are very unfair.

7 Seniors were kicked off son's high school team a couple of years ago for getting caught messing with pot. Most of the season it made you wonder why kids were missing balls thrown to them at 1B, missing tons of routine grounders, couldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat, etc. Then WHAM! It all made sense after the fact. It ruined his chances of playing in the playoff's his last year. Kinda sad that he had to go out that way.

I know this subject has been brought up before on here. Tough subject any way you look at it.

YGD

To make such an accusation you have to have rock solid proof---you cannot just they are using--I would recommend just going about your business

Tell on 'em.....Let the Coach know and tell the school principal as well.....

What those kids are doing is illegal...

This is not a tough issue, at all....It's simply about right and wrong....Turn 'em in....

That stuff needs to be handled internally by a captain, not the coach. No way should it ever have gotten to a parent.

ILVBB,
I agree wholeheartedly with your assessment of the coach. If I were a parent, I'd be hugely upset with the coach for not following his own rules in the interest of winning baseball games.

This question however, is not about coach reaction, but player action. To me, they are wholly different. One is a person of responsibility and the other is a subordinate. I can't picture anything positive happening by a teammate "telling" on another teammate for something that doesn't have dire and immediate consequences.

A long time ago, a very wise person told me that I have no right to deny another person their pain. It means, let them make their mistakes without me meddling and then let them learn their lessons themselves. I try and remember this sage advice whenever possible.

CPLZ I respect your point of view and understand it; I fundementally disagree.

I see that you use the Army logo. If this were happening at WP what would the cadets do? I would be surprised of this situation would occur; but just say that it does, what would you expect of the cadets?

I have to agree with CPLZ.

Mind your business and cover your own back.

I would lay odds that the coach knows but accepts this behavior. I've seen it before and eventually that coach's team has an annual habit of dealing with the sheriff's office.

The coach would probably play dumb and then rat the kid out to the users. Especially if the coach is a user himself.

quote:

Originally posted by ILVBB:
CPLZ I respect your point of view and understand it; I fundementally disagree.

I see that you use the Army logo. If this were happening at WP what would the cadets do? I would be surprised of this situation would occur; but just say that it does, what would you expect of the cadets?

To think the drug use doesn't occur at a Service Academy is to be blindly naive. It does happen, and other cadets know about it. Some cadets turn others in, some don't.

My expectation is for each to use his own judgment. I know of one case in particular, where the cadet was a regular weekend user of some pretty harsh narcotics. Over the course of time, he never got caught, but did give it up. He eventually was influenced in a positive manner by the people around him caring for him and wanting the best for him. No intervention, no big talks, just a daily example of how good life can be on the straight and narrow.

People are always more influenced by attraction rather than promotion. Be something they want to be, don't shove righteousness down their throats. It's not about right and wrong, legal and illegal, it's about compassion and strength and help and being there for people...even if that means turning a blind eye to their temporary defects and giving them a chance to turn it around.

The drug use, just like illegal alcohol use, is punishable at the academies by a review board of cadets and then approved or disapproved by a commissioned officer. On a first offense, it is usually not a dismiss able offense, although it can be, depending on other mitigating factors of the particular cadets existence.

The Honor Code however, says that a cadet will not lie, cheat or steal, or tolerate others who do. The reality of it is, that if someone were to ask you if you were doing drugs, and you admitted it, you might be allowed to stay. If you denied it, and they found you guilty, you'd most likely be dismissed on the honor violation, not the drug charge.

Even the academies allow cadets to make mistakes. They don't tolerate lying about it though.

quote:

Originally posted by Ben_08:
That stuff needs to be handled internally by a captain, not the coach. No way should it ever have gotten to a parent.

How would you suggest a captain handle it?

The players that are not using need to go directly to the ones that are and let them know that they need to stop and stop now.

If the players do this and it continues then hopefully the coach will pick up on some hints dropped his way and he can step in and handle this situation.

"Coach I didnt tell you this but you need to check up on ___ and _____ there is whacky stuff going on if you know what I mean."

The coach can take it from there. If your looking close enough and you have half a brain you can figure it all out as a coach. And you can approach it as YOU being the one that has heard from outside sources etc etc.

A couple of years back I heard a rumor that one of my players was not only using but dealing pot. I called the team into the dugout and said. "I have information that some of you are using drugs and selling drugs. If I have to I will P test everyone of you. If I have to I will investigate this and I will find out whats going on. So you better get your stuff together or I will do it for you. And you know what that means."

I think this is one of those tough character dilimma's that all people face sooner or later. The right answer for one person may not be the same as for another, but I believe that one's character, or lack therof, will dictate how they would handle this difficult situation.

As someone who's had a family member get messed up on drugs I think it's important that the player says something to the coach. What if this was your son, brother, best friend or whatever using the drugs? Would you want someone to step up and let you know so you could try and do something?

I truly don't know what the answer is and I believe 06catcherdad is right that it's more of a personal thing as to what to do. My sister got messed up pretty bad on drugs but thankfully she got clean and has rebounded very well with her life. I don't know if someone had told me or other members of my family or her husband (of the time and is now an ex due to the problem) would have kept her from getting messed up but it would have been nice to have had that chance but because we didn't know she spent about 3 years in absolute hell and it really took a toll on my mom.

Some say marijuana is a gateway drug to more hardcore stuff and some say it's not a big deal but I have no idea what it is. I do know those who use marijuana end up in 1 of 3 categories.

1 - they try it and never use it again for whatever reason

2 - they try it and continue using it but are able to quit at any time but choose not too

3 - they try it and end up getting on more hardcore stuff.

Do you honestly know which one of these categories someone will fall into? Nope you don't and you can't guarantee that stepping in will help. But those who do use some sort of drugs have family members who would do anything to stop them from using. All they want is a chance to try and help them stop but if someone doesn't tell then they may never get that chance to help out.

I would think the coach and the principal needs to be informed, but know that your baseball team will suffer. Directly or anonymous letter. These kids hang around your son, on campus, at baseball and off campus.... parties and such. One extra person using illegally is one extra person to peer pressure your son.
On the flip side would you rather have your son be exposed to this in HS while he is still under your roof and know he comes home to bed every night. ? or when he is out in college, away from you. Dorms , Frats where you dont know if he has made it back to bed. We all know there is underage drinking going on and to mix it with other stuff is worse.

quote:

How would you suggest a captain handle it?

Explain that people can see what's going on and it needs to stop. If getting high is more of a priority than the team then they need to leave.

If the players won't comply then I can see bringing it up to a coach. Chances are he'll know which guys you're talking about without dropping names.

I posted a subject on "Roommates" recently. Son found out his two roommates were blatant potheads but was stuck with them due to the lease agreement. He went through some rough times, does not condone smoking/drinking. In college many players do pot and you really don't know who they are until you room with them. Many people advised that son get out quick, but lease prevented it. The roommates got tired of living with a non stoner and found another person on the team to take his place. Son moved in with two other teammates who lost one of their roommates because coach found out he was selling pot! Our son is happy now, next year he already has his roommates chosen. We were very concerned son would get caught up in pot bust or whatever. At least in HS you don't share an apartment with these people.

Make sure your son is aware of school policies; I know a girl who was suspended (along with others) for being at a party where drinking was going on. She was in the main house, and the drinking was going on in the barn and she had no knowledge of it. She was in the band and was suspended from participation for the rest of the season.

I would think that playing baseball stoned could be very dangerous. Your reaction time is all off. You could get seriously hurt batting, and not being able to get out of the way of a bad pitch. Not to mention the danger it poses driving.

If my son was on the baseball field with compromised reflexes, I would want to know about it. I would want the opportunity to deal with it before he got hurt, got in trouble with the police, or suspended from school, or worse.

I just feel their is something wrong with ratting on a teammate. If the players come to games high their play will suffer and they are only hurting themselves. The coach can determine if they should be pulled off the field do to poor playing. Maybe the poor playing has nothing to do with getting high.

If you saw them high on the street would you call the cops?
If the other kids saw your son drinking a beer at a party would you want them to turn your son in?

All of this high drama plays out in the end and kids usually get what they deserve and/or earn. For better or for worse. I would tell your son to do what's best for him and stay focused on his goals.

quote:

If the other kids saw your son drinking a beer at a party would you want them to turn your son in?

Yes....

Blue Dog

You continue to peel away the layers of onion skins and your true self is beginning to show

Okay, I have been stalking out here for awhile but never really felt the need to post until this topic.

Why doesn't the parent of the player go talk with the parent of the offending player? If my son was doing something that could get him in trouble or killed and you, as an adult, knew about it and didn't tell me, we would have a real problem.


I speak from experience.... the parent should go discuss this with the offending player's parent now. If they are unwilling or unable to do anything about it, the coach must be informed. Ignoring it or hoping it will go away is wrong.

Is everyone ignoring the possibility that there is no stone cold proof ?

Like what dw8man said as well as many others.

Alot of hardliners posting and some more forgiving.

Question....if the kid is going to go to the authorities (coach, school admin, police) to tell about his teammates doing drugs, would you expect him to stand up in a courtroom, school office, coach's office and testify in front of the accused that he personally saw the drug usuage?

quote:

Originally posted by sandlotmom:
What would you advise your son if he came to you concerned because some of his teammates were using marijuana pretty frequently

Sounds like the kids put little shade on their smoking and maybe offerred the kid a toke.

Most parents would be in denial and demand proof of the allegation.

Not a route worth traveling.

quote:

Why doesn't the parent of the player go talk with the parent of the offending player?

I once went to a friend about his son smoking and dealing pot. We're no longer friends. He didn't believe me.

I found out when my son responded to why he doesn't hang out with the kid anymore. My son knew he was involved. He said the kid was a go to guy for pot at the middle school and high school. I figured if I told the dad he could address the problem before the kid got arrested.

Previous to this situation I asked the dad why the kid stopped playing sports all of a sudden. The dad said the kid would rather hang out in the basement all the time playing his guitar. The guitar aside, quitting sports to hang out in the basement after school every day should have been a tip off to dad. It's a significant behavioral change.

The kid eventually got arrested. He spent time on probation. The few times since the dad and I have crossed paths he's given a sheepish hello.

quote:

Originally posted by dw8man:
Why doesn't the parent of the player go talk with the parent of the offending player?

When I found out that one of my former players was drinking at parties, that's exactly what I did. The dad and I are still friends, he appreciated hearing from me. He knew from our years of coaching his son, my only interest is seeing his son succeed.

RJM had a different experience.

I would do the same thing again.

quote:

I once went to a friend about his son smoking and dealing pot. We're no longer friends. He didn't believe me.

Twice I have had to discuss with parents their son's possible use of illigal drugs. In both cases, I knew the player and parents for a number of years. I had no idea how either conversation would turn out, but I knew I couldn't stand by and watch their son doing something that could do long term harm to themself.

In both cases, I never accused their son of doing drugs but pointed out who they were associating with and the fact that they were known drug users. I also didn't say anything before I confirmed what was going on. In both cases, other players as well as other "friends" knew who the young men were hanging out with and knew what they were doing.

The first conversation didn't go too well as the parent refused to accept that their son could possibly be doing something wrong. Shortly after our conversation, their son dropped out of baseball and soon starting failing school. While I couldn't stop it from happening, I know that I did the right thing by talking with the parents. After two years, the young man finally entered rehab and is working on getting himself staight.

The second conversation had a much differnt outcome. The parents accepted that there might be something going on and tested their son. He came up hot and admitted he started doing drugs. Thankfully, it appears that he had just started and the quick intervention by the parents has helped him make better decision. He did end up leaving our program and school but is playing for another one and doing very well.


I also know that my son has learned from my actions. I have shown him how to stand up for someone who needs help, and that I can't fix everything.

Some here are concerned solely about the legality issues. Some are are concerned with stopping the kid's habit and getting him help before a major problem occurs.

Does anybody have concerns about false accusations or suspicions voiced by players or parents towards another player?

Does the accused player have the right to confront or question the accuser?

Personally, I prefer the parental approach such as dw8man and others have tried. I also make sure my son understands he is judged by the company he keeps, guilt by association and never be afraid to stand his ground about doing what he believes is the right thing.

quote:

Originally posted by S. Abrams:

Does anybody have concerns about false accusations or suspicions voiced by players or parents towards another player?

The guys are around each other enough off the field to know when they are stoned and may have even been offered something by one of them. They know who does what.

I can see that a false accusation could happen though. Last year while chatting with another parent, she accused a player of wrong-doing but I took it with a grain of salt because he was a starter in the same position her son wished to play. I generally don't believe anything I hear, especially when it's a negative about someone. That was about the same time I started sitting on the hill to watch the games.

It's interesting how the responses are so contrasting. Some say let it go and others say act immediately. I like the idea Coach May had on how the coach should handle it. Still wonder how captains could handle it though...

quote:

Originally posted by dw8man:

The first conversation didn't go too well as the parent refused to accept that their son could possibly be doing something wrong. Shortly after our conversation, their son dropped out of baseball and soon starting failing school. While I couldn't stop it from happening, I know that I did the right thing by talking with the parents. After two years, the young man finally entered rehab and is working on getting himself straight.

This couldn't have been pot. Everyone knows it is harmless and not a gateway drug.

Yeah, right.

I can tell you if you approach a friend and tell him you have heard a "rumor" and you want to inform them that you have heard a "rumor" LOOK OUT! Its not going to be pretty in many cases.

Most parents are going to go off. They are going to defend their child. They are going to ask their child and their child is going to deny it. Then the parent is going to go on the attack against #1 the person that brought this to them.

"Who told you this. I demand you tell me who told you this."
"How dare you accuse my son of doing something like this."
"My sons reputation has been tarnished and I demand to know who is spreading these rumors about my son."

Then accusations will be flying by them towards other players. They will seek out other parents on the team. They will seek out anything they can grasp on to. It will get ugly. And any friendship you once had will be over. "Did you know that last summer Jimmy and Tommy got drunk while on the Legion trip in the Motel!" "Did you know that you have a player that ______________!" What did anyone do about that!

You never accuse a kid of doing anything you can not prove and you do not know for a fact is a fact. You never single out anyone based on a rumor or hear say.

Jealousy , etc etc abounds in high school. Rumor's are constant. Parents hear all kinds of things all the time. Coaches do as well.

As a coach if someone approaches you with something and they will not or can not prove it then put that into serious consideration before you act. Put yourself in the parents shoes of the person that is being accused.

If a player approaches you and they can prove the accusation and are willing to provide such proof then make sure they understand the gravity of such allegations.

If a player comes to you and wants to tip you off but stay anonymous fine. You call the entire team in and you tell them you have heard rumors and your going to deal with it if you hear anything else.

Be very careful is all I am saying. Parents need to be careful what they say about other peoples kids. Players need to understand the difference in a rumor and fact. And coaches need to understand all of this as well. If you have questions about a kid its not very hard to get to the bottom of it if you look hard enough. But tread very lightly in these matters. It can get ugly very quickly. And it can turn in many directions.

It reminds of the Lady you calls and says "You need to run radar on Maple Street because people are constantly speeding on my street." And then she is the first one to get a ticket and then can not understand how she got a ticket when she is the one that called to report the problem. Stay out of rumors. Stay away from those that will put you in jeopardy. And these things will sort themselves out while you stay out of harms way. JMHO

quote:

Originally posted by infidel_08:
[This couldn't have been pot. Everyone knows it is harmless and not a gateway drug.

Yeah, right.

Please don't state this as though it is a fact that marijuana is a gateway drug. That's simply untrue.

While I respect your right to your opinion, the way its presented here, assumes something not in evidence and at the same time paints those on the other side of the argument, myself and most leading researchers, as idiots and liars for our beliefs.

quote:

Originally posted by sandlotmom:
What would you advise your son if he came to you concerned because some of his teammates were using marijuana pretty frequently and he thought it was starting to effect their game? Would you advise him to just keep his mouth shut and let them do their own damage to themselves? Even at the cost of the team and their season? Would you advise him to talk to his teammates? What about talking to the coach?

My first question would be; has your son actually witnessed his teammates in question smoking marijuana, or is this info coming from other teammates? If the kids are using marijuana, I wouldn't sit idol and keep my mouth shut. How close is the group of kids? Is the team full of players that have grown up together? If so, it's important because the situation can be handled internally by teammates and that's where the Captain(s) can hopefully step in without getting the coach involved.

That's my perspective from the outside looking in. Now, if my son was the user in question, I'd want to know right away and nip it in the rear before it got out of hand. It's sort of a double edged sword, I don't believe in teammates narking on eachother, and I'm being a little two faced...but I guess it's the difference between thinking out loud as a Parent, as opposed to a Teammate!

Ben08, you gave excellent advice.

Often times - the parents who are pointing the finger and spreading the rumors - their kid is doing the exact same thing. My advice - keep your nose clean and stay out of others business unless you have solid PROOF and you know the kid is in danger of harming himself/others.

sandlotmom,

One thing your son is going to learn, if he goes onto play bb after HS, is that this problem is something that is not just happening at the HS level. It happens on the collegiate level, it happens at the pro level.

The best advice I can give you as one mom to another, talk to your son about making good choices, knowing that there can be consequences that one might have to live with for the rest of their lives, that is, IMO, all you and he can do. Mind your own business.

If you have ever tried talking to a parent about the fact that their child is doing something that could harm he/she or unaccepetable, I have found that most likely they are not going to listen to what you or anyone else has to say, because we live in a world of, "oh it's just kid stuff and part of growing up". I have been guilty of that myself at times.

If you go to the coach or admin and it gets out it came from you, your son will be an outcast.

I would imagine that you and your son are close and he shares things, but he also has to learn that some things need to stay to himself and perhpas handled within the team, I know that some might not agree, but he has to learn how to cope with these situations on his own without going to his folks, and the best way is to stay out of it, do what you as a player need to do and hope that someone doesn't get hurt, sounds tough, but it is a no win situation for everyone.

FWIW, many coaches will not interfere in a players life outside of the field unless it affects his team's performance or the player is found doing something while on his watch, so talking to the coach may not do anyone any good either.

JMO.