KMOM;
Kudo's to a Very Mature young man you have there.
There's something about a young that can look you in the EYE
and say I can handle it, stay out of it.
Ya Gotta Love Em. The EH
PG,
I think this type reasoning/rationalization is human nature and possibly for good reason. I think these things would likely be more controversial if pointed out while the proponent was actually making one of these rationalizations. I am guessing in your line of work, you hear this type stuff way more than the average person.
One reason this can be a good thing is as you have stated in the past, you can count five tool players on one hand. Thus, if deficient in a tool as most are, it seems it may be a better survival mechanism to come up with a way of compensating or minimizing the impact of one or more deficient skills. Compensating for lack of speed with superior instincts for example.
Of course, if you possess a plus tool, then that would be a crtitical deficiency or black mark against someone who was competing with you - not agreeing with this logic, it just seems human nature to tout the positive and downplay the negative.
I think this type reasoning/rationalization is human nature and possibly for good reason. I think these things would likely be more controversial if pointed out while the proponent was actually making one of these rationalizations. I am guessing in your line of work, you hear this type stuff way more than the average person.
One reason this can be a good thing is as you have stated in the past, you can count five tool players on one hand. Thus, if deficient in a tool as most are, it seems it may be a better survival mechanism to come up with a way of compensating or minimizing the impact of one or more deficient skills. Compensating for lack of speed with superior instincts for example.
Of course, if you possess a plus tool, then that would be a crtitical deficiency or black mark against someone who was competing with you - not agreeing with this logic, it just seems human nature to tout the positive and downplay the negative.
PGStaff, I don't like your opening post.
Craig Counsell, Ryan Freel, Jeff Reboulet, many others have made it big. Some guys aren't that talented but get where they are by being good at everything but great at nothing. Guys like this outwork everyone out there. It makes me sick to see guys that are supertalented, but don't work hard and they turn a great talent into mediocre production. My goal has always been to outwork everyone, everyday. Some people don't stand out, even great players. That's why they don't get that much attention sometimes, but as my dad always tells me...the cream always rises to the top.
Craig Counsell, Ryan Freel, Jeff Reboulet, many others have made it big. Some guys aren't that talented but get where they are by being good at everything but great at nothing. Guys like this outwork everyone out there. It makes me sick to see guys that are supertalented, but don't work hard and they turn a great talent into mediocre production. My goal has always been to outwork everyone, everyday. Some people don't stand out, even great players. That's why they don't get that much attention sometimes, but as my dad always tells me...the cream always rises to the top.
I can speak only for myself , but I was one with mirrored classes on the inside. I thought everyone else was wrong and I was right. Now I just sit back and enjoy the game because whatever I think will not change the outcome. I don't have a crystal ball and by no means can I go out on the feild to change the outcome of anything. What will be, will be. Everyone has different opinions and that is what makes them unique. Just be glad we are all able to sit and enjoy our young playing the best game on earth... 
NateDawg,
Sorry if the post offends you, it really wasn’t intended for players as much as parents. I was afraid it might bother someone a little. Please accept my apology.
Back to the point…
Craig Council was recruited and played at Notre Dame and was a 11th rd draft pick. It took him 3 years to become a Major League shortstop. While his tools might not compare to the best ML shortstops, he does have some ML tools. He has the ability to play several positions and yes, his best attributes are the intangibles.
Ryan Freel was drafted in the 10th round out of high school. That just doesn’t happen without tools. He could really run, hit, and throw. It took him awhile to make the Big Leagues, but he can play several positions at the very highest level. Yes, another example of good intangibles.
Jeff Roboulet was recruited and played at 5 time national NCAA Champion LSU. He was the drafted in the 10th round. He had great fielding tools, good arm, could run a little and could hit. His best attribute is he is so versatile defensively and can play nearly every position. It took him a long time to make it and yes, he too is an example of the intangibles.
Surprised you didn’t bring up the poster boy for these type discussions, David Eckstein. People often think he made it because of something other than his skills. And they are probably right about that, but he did play at U of Florida and was drafted in the 19th round. For those unfamiliar, he could run, field, and hit. His major drawback was his arm. Still he is not without tools. He can run, field and hit with the best. He has gotten more out of his tools than most others have. He is loaded with intangibles.
By the way, your dad is very wise! The cream usually does rise to the top! I like your attitude and especially your goal of out working everyone else. However, I do have to say, it definitely does NOT make me sick to see those who are super talented. Why does it bother you?
Once again, the post was about what parents say, not what players do. Pretend that I am the “casual observer” in the examples. That’s pretty close to the way it really is!
Best of luck
Sorry if the post offends you, it really wasn’t intended for players as much as parents. I was afraid it might bother someone a little. Please accept my apology.
Back to the point…
Craig Council was recruited and played at Notre Dame and was a 11th rd draft pick. It took him 3 years to become a Major League shortstop. While his tools might not compare to the best ML shortstops, he does have some ML tools. He has the ability to play several positions and yes, his best attributes are the intangibles.
Ryan Freel was drafted in the 10th round out of high school. That just doesn’t happen without tools. He could really run, hit, and throw. It took him awhile to make the Big Leagues, but he can play several positions at the very highest level. Yes, another example of good intangibles.
Jeff Roboulet was recruited and played at 5 time national NCAA Champion LSU. He was the drafted in the 10th round. He had great fielding tools, good arm, could run a little and could hit. His best attribute is he is so versatile defensively and can play nearly every position. It took him a long time to make it and yes, he too is an example of the intangibles.
Surprised you didn’t bring up the poster boy for these type discussions, David Eckstein. People often think he made it because of something other than his skills. And they are probably right about that, but he did play at U of Florida and was drafted in the 19th round. For those unfamiliar, he could run, field, and hit. His major drawback was his arm. Still he is not without tools. He can run, field and hit with the best. He has gotten more out of his tools than most others have. He is loaded with intangibles.
By the way, your dad is very wise! The cream usually does rise to the top! I like your attitude and especially your goal of out working everyone else. However, I do have to say, it definitely does NOT make me sick to see those who are super talented. Why does it bother you?
Once again, the post was about what parents say, not what players do. Pretend that I am the “casual observer” in the examples. That’s pretty close to the way it really is!
Best of luck
By being "sick by those that are freakishly talented"...that's not really what I mean. It makes me sick when the freakishly talented don't work hard, and don't make the most of their talents. I have worked for everything that I have gotten, that's why it upsets me when people don't use the God given talents that they have.
I do understand where you are coming from on this. I just have some differing opinions based on personal experience, because I know people that are more talented than me, they don't work hard, and don't make the most of their abilities.
As for Jeff Reboulet, I know someone who was his teammate in summer ball, way back in the day. He said that he was the type of guy who really wasn't that impressive, but he just didn't have weaknesses. I'm just hearing this by word of mouth...and I have met Jeff and fielded ground balls with him. Real neat guy.
I guess I could identify with "Just Enough"...David Eckstein. I have a good arm, not a great arm. It does surprise me that he was able to go to a place like Florida, because looking at him on first glance, he wouldn't impress many people. Once again though, I'm sure it took some scouts out there a while of watching him, day in and day out...to appreciate him as a ballplayer. Once again, that phrase "The Cream Rises to the top."
I'm not upset with you, just some loose emotions based on personal experience. I hope you haven't taken my comments as offense.
I do understand where you are coming from on this. I just have some differing opinions based on personal experience, because I know people that are more talented than me, they don't work hard, and don't make the most of their abilities.
As for Jeff Reboulet, I know someone who was his teammate in summer ball, way back in the day. He said that he was the type of guy who really wasn't that impressive, but he just didn't have weaknesses. I'm just hearing this by word of mouth...and I have met Jeff and fielded ground balls with him. Real neat guy.
I guess I could identify with "Just Enough"...David Eckstein. I have a good arm, not a great arm. It does surprise me that he was able to go to a place like Florida, because looking at him on first glance, he wouldn't impress many people. Once again though, I'm sure it took some scouts out there a while of watching him, day in and day out...to appreciate him as a ballplayer. Once again, that phrase "The Cream Rises to the top."
I'm not upset with you, just some loose emotions based on personal experience. I hope you haven't taken my comments as offense.
Not at all upset here Natedawg, and thanks for clearing up that thing about the super talented. Now that I understand what you mean, I totally agree with you. Have seen it first hand several times. It does take more than just talent alone.
Listen to your dad and keep outworking everyone. You're light years ahead of many others who may or may not be more talented.
Listen to your dad and keep outworking everyone. You're light years ahead of many others who may or may not be more talented.