Do you really want to commit the time to play college ball?

P5 top 25 program.

Freshman year attempting to be a 2-way player.  School from 8-11:30.  Quick lunch and field ready to go by 1.  Pitching practice and team work until 6-7.  6-9 quick dinner and study hall for 2 hours mandatory.  9-11 or 12 individual hitting workouts to do what the rest of the hitters did during practice.

Now, Junior year.  Everything is the same except he is no longer a 2-way, his choice and no study hall required.  Still at the field from lunch until 7 most nights that they are not playing.  Games during the week are until 9 since they are home for every weekday game this year.  A couple of away games during the week last year due to Covid stuff and they were home at 2-3 in the morning but schedule next day did not change.

On Sunday nights for SEC schedule away games they get back about 11 PM on Sunday.

What about swimming for upper body strength and weight lifting?

Do you really want to commit the time to play college ball?

We make a point of emphasizing this question to anyone asking to be part of our program.  We make it plain that what we do is not for everyone.  We are not a recreational enterprise; we help college-bound players reach that goal (and pro players when someone rises to that level).  What we find is that most players, due to the lack of maturity that is understandable given their age group, think that they want to keep playing forever.  And they see someone they know moving on, and can't imagine a world in which "that guy" plays in college and they don't.  They think that baseball is fun (which, of course, it is) and therefore, why wouldn't I want to keep going?

But just because you might have talent doesn't mean college baseball is for you.  Just like there are hundreds of potential careers, but you might not like but 1 or 2 of them if you're lucky, what goes on in college baseball is more like a job than it is like your youth rec travel team or even your HS team.  There's no shame in saying, "That's not really for me."

And yet, every year kids quit college ball because, no matter how hard you work to drive the nail through the skull, for some they just have to experience the reality before they truly have it dawn on them that this is not what they want in their lives.

I put together a weekly schedule and a year/calendar schedule to lay out for our guys what job it is they're applying for.  We do all we can to make sure we're dealing only with kids who truly want this.  But the best you can do is limit the number of kids who are taking up a team slot that would've been better devoted to another guy.  You'll always have some guys who get to age 18, 19 or 20 before they realize they're on a track that's not right for them.

But then again, who among us didn't change our minds about our plans for our futures between ages 16 and 20?  Most college kids change their plans for their majors at some point.  Many change schools, or leave for a time and then return later.  I don't suppose there's any reason to think baseball players would be so much different from everyone else in this regard.

This was my son’s P5 fall schedule as close as I remember. My daughter’s P5 softball schedule wasn’t much different.

Before breakfast - swimming for upper body strength

Breakfast

Classes - 8 or 9 until noon

Baseball - 1 to 5

Dinner

An hour after dinner - Weight lighting or agility training

9pm until done - Homework

Rinse and repeat

On Saturdays they were encouraged to support the football team after morning practice. Saturday night was free.

On Sundays my son slept late. Then he watched football. After the early game he had early dinner and caught up on homework he didn’t get done during the week or got ahead on the coming week.

He said the worst weekend fatigue wise was during the season. Saturday was rained out. Sunday they played a doubleheader. They left Burger King at 8pm for a ten hour bus ride home. They had to get signatures from their Monday classes after road weekends to prove they went to class.

Its understandable a lot of D1 athletes go undeclared (major) with general studies the first couple of years. My son majored in Econ with a concentration in Quantitative Analytics (essentially calculus and stats).

My daughter is five years older than my son. I learned the deal through her and her friends. I was in the lobby of a Sheraton in Boston early one evening. A UMaryland bus pulled up. I had to check to see if one of my daughter’s friends was on the bus. I was shocked to find out the #1 field hockey team in the country bussed everything up to ten hours.

My daughter’s friend was on the bus. I chatted with her in the lobby. She told me what she did on the field (leading scorer in the country) didn’t matter on the bus. Upperclassmen took up a side of an aisle. Freshman shared seats and carried equipment.

My son's schedule is/was similar.  P5. Weights 5 days a week from 6:30-8am. Class 9-12:30ish. He had to have his arm worked on (pt), so he goes in an hour before practice. To the field at 1.  Practice or skill work until about 5:30 or 6.  Scrimmages Saturdays and Sundays unless there is a home football game. Team meetings 1-2 evenings a week usually. They also have to eat at training table 4-5 times a week.  Homework, sleep, repeat.   I always think its interesting to hear that you have to pick a college you love without baseball because you really don't get to experience much of anything besides baseball.

reading this ... I smile ... as my personal journey as a non-preferred walk-on to the lowest division club rugby program was a lot less effort and yet still a great college experience for me (I'm now 30 yrs into my engineering career).

reading this ... I cringe ... having to decide when to make my 15 yr old 2024 read this ... Should my kid read this before or after Sep 1 of his Jr HS year - when the college baseball coaches will be allowed to call my kid direct with talk of all the trappings and promises?

When my son got to high school I started attending college games and chatting up parents. I was in Boston the weekend of the NESCAC tournament. A parent told me at his son’s school if there’s a choice between a game and a test the player won’t be on the bus.

@mjd-dad posted:

reading this ... I smile ... as my personal journey as a non-preferred walk-on to the lowest division club rugby program was a lot less effort and yet still a great college experience for me (I'm now 30 yrs into my engineering career).

reading this ... I cringe ... having to decide when to make my 15 yr old 2024 read this ... Should my kid read this before or after Sep 1 of his Jr HS year - when the college baseball coaches will be allowed to call my kid direct with talk of all the trappings and promises?

There aren’t any promises. There are only the delusions of promises heard by players and parents. A player can blow “you will have every opportunity to start” in one bad practice. Do you think that kid believes he received every opportunity?

You better have him read it now.  Because those conversations can happen before that date.  My son's first offer was before he was a 9th grader.  He had already committed before he was a junior.  If you wait until then to have this conversation, he will be so far behind.  But I'm not a fan of it's their journey let them make the decision on their own.  I believe our role as parents is to help them along the journey.  The final thing is their decision but our part is to guide them.

I think it’s also good to set the expectation that it’s not fun. At least it may not be for awhile.  My son was so exhausted his freshman year. He told me that he just started liking baseball again this year because he had lost the love last year. Part of that was his coach but also it really truly is a grind.  That year was followed by a 3 day drive on May 31s to play 70 games over the summer with 4-5 days off total,  and then 4 days home before reporting back for Fall. It’s a job that he gets to do with some guys he loves.

@mjd-dad posted:

reading this ... I smile ... as my personal journey as a non-preferred walk-on to the lowest division club rugby program was a lot less effort and yet still a great college experience for me (I'm now 30 yrs into my engineering career).

reading this ... I cringe ... having to decide when to make my 15 yr old 2024 read this ... Should my kid read this before or after Sep 1 of his Jr HS year - when the college baseball coaches will be allowed to call my kid direct with talk of all the trappings and promises?

I had a similar experience mjd-dad.  I was a college walk-on to a .500 program that turned it around and began winning conference championships....there wasn't anything better!  We spent 20 hours playing and practicing my sport in season and 5-7 hours per week in the offseason in the early 80s.    I loved college sports, but todays college athlete (at all levels) is expected to do and give so much more than I ever thought possible for a student athlete.

I agree with pitchingfan that you better have him read and understand the committment now.   At 14-15 (ten years ago), my son was being exposed to college recruiting through his travel organization.   He was hearing recruiting things he didn't understand from travel teammates...this was all new to us.   He was also being exposed to new things in the classroom that really excited him.   My wife and I did everything we could possibly do to learn about what was possible for him....he had no idea at the time what those possibilities were.   That would change quickly as the athletic part of the college recruiting  equation  got ahead of the academic part, and college coaches began recruiting him.   You are his sherpa.   Show him the way and he will choose the best path.

Good luck!

My son's experience in the ACC, 2008-2012, was very similar to those described above.  On most weekdays pitchers were generally at the field from noon until 7:00 pm.  Quick dinner, followed by mandatory study hall of 2 hours. (Study hall could be exempted after first semester if your grades were good enough).  Saturdays and Sundays were usually another 4-5 hours, sometimes more.  Mondays were supposed to be "off" but they really weren't.  Even though the team did not officially "practice" there were still meetings, bullpens, and  weights.

Early season mid-week games usually started at 5:00.  But, as the weather warmed up they were pushed back.  It was not unusual to finish a mid-week home game at 10:00 to 11:00 pm.  Mid-week road games usually involved leaving at 2:00 (or earlier) and getting home around 12:00-1:00 am.

The other thing that always got me about mid-week road games was that EVERYONE traveled, even pitchers who had thrown extensive innings the previous weekend.

Weekend road trips usually involved leaving on Thursday.  Sometimes as early as Thursday morning, depending on the length of the trip.  Yeah, there was wi-fi on the bus.  But, good luck studying on the bus if you're anything other than a jock major.  Some of those road trips ended with the bus getting back around 2:00-4:00 a.m. Monday morning.

Coaches and college staff will, let's call it exaggerate/sugar-coat the facts.  Son was an engineering major.  During the recruiting process we asked what would happen if he had a test scheduled on a Thursday or Friday during a road series.  We were told by the academic support staff that they could arrange to have the tests proctored at the school they were visiting.  Unfortunately, son's engineering professors never got that memo.  If son had a test scheduled on Thursday or Friday he usually had to take it earlier in the week, before the rest of his classmates.

The NCAA rules regarding allowable practice time are joke.  They are totally ignored at many, if not most,  schools.  As others noted earlier, when you get to the college level, it's a JOB.   College athletes are forced to play way too many games in much too short a time for most kids to get a real education.  With basketball and football it's all about the money.  But, there is no money in college baseball.  With baseball it's driven by the coaches.

Mine was a top 10 national champion D3 program, high academic school, and STEM major.

I don't exactly remember the specifics of his schedule other than he pretty much ran on 4 hours of sleep per night. I would routinely get emails/texts at 2-3AM local time; most of the time to bed at 4AM, up for 8AM classes.  When he was not in class or studying he was throwing pens, hitting balls, on the field, or in the gym lifting.  Weekends were for catching up on sleep (out of season) or a party or two. I have no idea how he did it - but he did. 

Travel was mostly by bus and they always had mid week games and they needed to be at the field by 3:00PM and went until 10:00PM unless they travelled and then they would lose a full Tue/Weds to game/travel and get home after 1:00AM.

Coaches were flexible and basically said "get your work in and perform and we will accommodate you as far as schedules"  He would flex in and out of afternoon practice based on his labs. (which are always in the afternoon) When he was being recruited, Stanford, and the Ivy's indicated they would do the same. One of the only questions I would ask a recruiting coach was "how do you accommodate engineering students who have afternoon labs" and as soon as we heard "....well....you...know...."  boom they were off the list, and frankly that was most D1's.

When travelling, coaches also put STEM kids in the same room so they could get their work done while on the road. That was very helpful.

Most teachers accommodated the athletes since probably 15% of the school's students were some sort of athlete. Some did not and he just dealt with it himself.

Summary: College baseball is hard, VERY HARD, and most HS students have no idea of the demands.

P5. Covid has changed things - the players were encouraged (given orders) by the HC to take asynchronous online classes so they could work at their own pace and because generally it's easier. The schedule two years ago would have looked a bit different.

6:30-8:30 lift/conditioning

9:00 -9:45 breakfast - mandatory as the meals are made for each team at a certain time. They eat in the athlete lounge and are rarely in the normal dining halls which is a great waste of the meal plan they're required to purchase

10-12 - study hall - basically class as 80% of their work is online. Only get out of study hall if you're above a 3.6 which knowing his friends I can't imagine there are too many of them.

12- 1:30 - downtime/lunch

2 to 6+ - practice but they all start strolling in at 1:15-1:30 ish

6: 00 on they're on their own. That includes dinner, homework and any in person classes or online synchronous classes. Yes the entire team is pretty much taking night classes. Mine is in class until 9:45 MWTh.

This is for the Fall

Mid-major over .500 team

staying with grandfather who lives 35 minutes away.

8a-noon class

moon-1 pm lunch

1pm-2pm trainer recovering from TJ

2-6 ish practice

6-8 pm weights

8 pm drive back to grandfather’s

9p-11 or 12 study

repeat

Saving money living at grandfather’s due to good Ol’ baseball 11.7

My son is a freshman RHP, at a D3 school.  This is his spring schedule since Feb 1st.  He's currently undecided but debating between Finance in the Business School or Math.   He does have down time to get work done in the afternoon so he can just "chill" in the evening.

*Monday - class from 9:00am - 12:30pm; mandatory study hall 7:00pm - 9:00p - he says that if you get a certain GPA  (can't remember what it is), upperclassmen are exempt from study hall.
*Tuesday & Thursdays - lift from 8:00am-9:00 am; class from 9:40am - 12:30pm; practice 3:30pm - 6:30pm
*Wednesday & Friday - class 9:00-12:30pm; practice 3:30pm - 6:30pm
*Saturday & Sunday - practice from 10:00am - 1:00pm. (I know they start at 10:00am but can't remember how long he says they last.)

They have a very "easy" game schedule this spring in terms of travel.  The first four series are all at home and either on the weekend or in the afternoon at 3:00pm - so he can be on the field at 1:00pm for a 3:00pm game.  In February, their one away weekday game is about two hours away.  I don't know what the travel requirement is for weekday games for pitchers, especially if he isn't going to pitch.  Then they head to Myrtle Beach for spring break.  After spring break, their one weekday away game in March is at 6:00pm and only about an hour away.  In April, their one weekday away game is at 7:00pm, almost walking distance from campus (they both are city schools.)  So worse case, he'll probably only miss one class all spring.

They will be taking buses to all of their away games - other than the Myrtle Beach trip, the farthest game is a four hour drive.  There are only two Sat/Sun weekends.  All the others are either at home or just DH's on Saturdays.

I can't wait for the first game - just 11 days!

After I got off the baseball field at dark thirty yesterday I stopped on my way home to get some dinner. At the restaurant I ran into an acquaintance that has a kid that starts at 2B for TCU. We got into a discussion about how HS players and parents don’t understand the time commitment involved in playing at a ranked D1 program. Chris said that Gray’s day starts at 6 am and ends at 10:30 pm. Every minute in between is full of baseball and academic activities. None of that is groundbreaking news. But he also said that Gray told him (just yesterday) that he never would have been successful (and he has been a 3 year starter) at TCU if he hadn’t played 2 years of JuCo ball at Blinn College first. And that, right from the mouth of a current D1 starter at a ranked program, may be enlightening to some of you. It reinforces what I say on this board (over & over) that hardly any 18 year old freshman is ready for top 30 D1 baseball.

Agreed Adbono.  But I have learned over the years that I think it is easier for the kids who do not think they should be there. They know going in that they are going to have to work their tails off academically and athletically so they go in with the mindset that they are going to have to work harder than anybody else to earn a spot.  Mine knew he would never throw 100 so he and others like him knew they had to outwork the gifted ones.   He knew the same thing in the classroom.  He also used every intangible attribute he possessed to his advantage also.  

@PitchingFan, a player like your son (that fills an immediate role) is the rare exception. Nothing is absolute. I tend to speak in general terms that apply to the vast majority. If I say something that applies to 95% of HS players (or even more) that still leaves a fraction that can take issue with my comments. I also assume that there are very few people on the HSBBW board that fall into that fraction but you are one of them.

My son didn’t play freshman year. He was a late recruit due to injury. He was actually recruited for the following year. He was invited to walk on the first year. He was beat out by a pitcher who is now in the majors. He did catch bullpens and got to take BP. My daughter was so afraid about (softball) eligibility she sacrificed sleep and social life for studying and got a 4.0.

I believe my son’s slow immersion into competitive college ball was beneficial. He also arrived at 6’1” 175 and was 6’2” 190 and a lot stronger the next season.  He also got a shock fall semester with a 2.7. The spring semester more focused on academics got him where he belonged (3.5). He would have lost his 50% academic ride without a 3.0.

Transitioning to college can be overwhelming enough for regular students. I’m all for freshman not being eligible or not being on travel squads. Not that it will ever happen.

@PitchingFan posted:

I have learned over the years that I think it is easier for the kids who do not think they should be there. They know going in that they are going to have to work their tails off academically and athletically so they go in with the mindset that they are going to have to work harder than anybody else to earn a spot. 

Kids who do not think they should be there?  You mean there are kids out there that actually feel this way? I'm sort of joking, but I can't think of a single kid I know (or even know of) who has thought this way. In fact, every kid (and parent) I know, even where the kid gets offered late in the process, still FIRMLY believes the kid should be there.

A 2022 catcher my son played with committed to an SEC team in August.  Obviously very late for an SEC catcher to get offered, but in no way, shape or form does he or his family feel he's a stretch player for that team.  They most certainly feel he should be there.  Here are the number of C commits for the program.  He was the 3rd (of 3) 2022 C's to get offered. They already have 2 Cs in their 2023 class and even one for 2025.  I wouldn't want my kid in this kid's shoes.  Sure, you get to say you're a P5 SEC commit, but how long do those warm, fuzzies last?

2021 - 2

2022 - 3

2023 - 2

2024 -

2025 - 1

I guess I largely thought that almost no kid thinks they shouldn't be there until after they got there and it was obvious due to the choices the coaches were making.

@adbono posted:

@PitchingFan, a player like your son (that fills an immediate role) is the rare exception. Nothing is absolute. I tend to speak in general terms that apply to the vast majority. If I say something that applies to 95% of HS players (or even more) that still leaves a fraction that can take issue with my comments. I also assume that there are very few people on the HSBBW board that fall into that fraction but you are one of them.

This was poorly worded on my part and would be easy to misinterpret. What I meant was that your son is in the fraction that my comments don’t apply to. In reading my comments again (after the fact) I can see that my intent was not so clear.

@fenwaysouth posted:

Do you really want to commit the time to play college ball?

Two out of three of my son's said "no thank you" to college baseball.   They saw what their older brother went through at a D1 HA known for scheduling 42-44 games a year with additional flexibility around practices, classes and travel.   By no stretch of the imagination was his D1 experience comparable to a D1 P5 and yet he spent 30-40 hours a week in season and 15-20 hours a week off-season on college baseball  (away from studies).  My two younger sons wanted no part of it.   I give them a lot of credit for knowing what they wanted to get out of college, and knowing they weren't as passionate about baseball as their older brother.

Clearly they got their decision making smarts  from Mom...

@PitchingFan posted:

Agreed Adbono.  But I have learned over the years that I think it is easier for the kids who do not think they should be there. They know going in that they are going to have to work their tails off academically and athletically so they go in with the mindset that they are going to have to work harder than anybody else to earn a spot.  Mine knew he would never throw 100 so he and others like him knew they had to outwork the gifted ones.   He knew the same thing in the classroom.  He also used every intangible attribute he possessed to his advantage also.  

I didn't want to start a separate thread on this topic, and don't want to derail this one, but why does it seem like in other college sports like football and basketball kids are ok with being a backup....to a backup and not playing at all? Besides the love of the game and culture is it because an even smaller percent go on to play professionally? It just seems like so many are just content with being on the team.

And imposter syndrome is real. Just as there are kids that get into college and are shell shocked at the competition, there are many that get there and don't feel they belong.

@DanJ posted:

Kids who do not think they should be there?  You mean there are kids out there that actually feel this way? I'm sort of joking, but I can't think of a single kid I know (or even know of) who has thought this way. In fact, every kid (and parent) I know, even where the kid gets offered late in the process, still FIRMLY believes the kid should be there.

A 2022 catcher my son played with committed to an SEC team in August.  Obviously very late for an SEC catcher to get offered, but in no way, shape or form does he or his family feel he's a stretch player for that team.  They most certainly feel he should be there.  Here are the number of C commits for the program.  He was the 3rd (of 3) 2022 C's to get offered. They already have 2 Cs in their 2023 class and even one for 2025.  I wouldn't want my kid in this kid's shoes.  Sure, you get to say you're a P5 SEC commit, but how long do those warm, fuzzies last?

2021 - 2

2022 - 3

2023 - 2

2024 -

2025 - 1

I guess I largely thought that almost no kid thinks they shouldn't be there until after they got there and it was obvious due to the choices the coaches were making.

I believe some kids and their parents don’t understand the difference between prospect and insurance. If the player turns out to be better the coach is happy. If the player transfers the coach gets his roster spot back.

Either way the coach wins. Winning is 50/50 worse for the player. Chances are a player or two have to fail before the insurance player gets a shot.

I will admit and know my son would say the SEC was a stretch for him but was willing to risk it to see.  He was always a great athlete with strong travel ball experience and success in HS also.  Four year all state player with many state and National records.  but we also knew the SEC was a different animal.  Could have been an ace at most mid majors or even most other P5 conferences but he wanted to compete against the best.  Has had good success and been a part of a fairy tale journey for UT from cellar to Omaha.  

I know most parents and players aren’t as realistic as us.  Next he hopes he gets the chance to see if he can compete in MLB when this journey is over which could be this summer or two more years.  

https://community.hsbaseballwe...09#73669318471779009

I believe the reason kids are "ok" being the back-up player in other sports is because the majority are on a full scholarship.

It's hard to be the back up when you are paying to be there.  Even if the backup is getting partial athletic aid it is not guaranteed the following year (even in P5) - coaches are notorious for manipulating amounts up until the last minute.

@IKETBD posted:

https://community.hsbaseballwe...09#73669318471779009

I believe the reason kids are "ok" being the back-up player in other sports is because the majority are on a full scholarship.

It's hard to be the back up when you are paying to be there.  Even if the backup is getting partial athletic aid it is not guaranteed the following year (even in P5) - coaches are notorious for manipulating amounts up until the last minute.

There are plenty of D3 athletes receiving nothing in any sport and happy to be part of it.

@RJM posted:

There are plenty of D3 athletes receiving nothing in any sport and happy to be part of it.

That is as long as they are playing

Great post.  My freshman D3 son mentioned yesterday that he will likely have 3 midterms the day before they leave for games in Florida.

The team practices 6 days a week.  There is no in-season team lift so he’s in the weight room on his own 5-6 days a week.  There are only so many reps in practice so he’s getting in the cage on his own before or after team practice 6 days a week.

And he’s at a HA school so the academic workload is no joke!