Engineering Schools with Baseball

Thanks so far, guys.. answers to questions... he is leaning heavily toward mechanical engineering but some interest in aeronautical.  My son played in same conference as UCSD last year so I think I have a pretty good feel for whether this player would fit at that level.  He is a small LH CF with definite D1 speed, excellent defense, great swing mechanics.  He definitely has the passion and work ethic to succeed with college ball (although I don't know the extent of added difficulty engineering will present) .  Has very good grades but not sure if they quite get him in UCSD.  Physical size and arm strength aren't quite at target level for high D2 baseball but getting there.  I think he would likely sit as a freshman and then have a good shot at contributing as a soph or junior.  Not sure if the size issue would keep him from getting a look with them, in fact I'm pretty sure he has been in front of them - he has played quite a bit with the Trosky program.  So, he is even more of a stretch for Cal Poly, although that would be his dream school.  That's part of why he is considering JC route.  He would be an instant contributor to most decent D3's/ NAIA's.  Ceiling is higher but he is very open to smaller schools and understands that it may work better with his major of interest.

My intention was not to do his work for him , just ask my initial question about the JC issue.  But since questions are coming, I'm glad to answer what I know to help him with information.

ClevelandDad posted:

I am surprised I haven't commented on this yet, but I can offer insight into the JC to Engineering thing. 

Calculus transfers, Chemistry Transfers, English transfers, Physics transfers, along with other classes.  When you graduate from the four-year institution after transferring from the JC, all that matters is what it says on your final degree.  You do well in the above noted classes and other ones you need to at the JUCO, you'll have no problem getting into just about any Engineering school in America.

 

Bingo

cabbagedad posted:

My intention was not to do his work for him , just ask my initial question about the JC issue.  But since questions are coming, I'm glad to answer what I know to help him with information.

I think UCSD used to participate in a transfer program that guaranteed admission, but that's no longer the case. See the "Transfers" section of this page. I would imagine this route is highly competitive, but might be worth the risk for your player. San Diego Mesa to UCSD sounds like a pretty good college experience to me.   

http://www.ucsd.edu/catalog/curric/SOE.html

cabbagedad posted:

So, he is even more of a stretch for Cal Poly, although that would be his dream school.  That's part of why he is considering JC route.  He would be an instant contributor to most decent D3's/ NAIA's.  Ceiling is higher but he is very open to smaller schools and understands that it may work better with his major of interest.

Even if his dream school looks to be out of reach, keep encouraging him to aim high, as it's particularly hard to achieve those dreams otherwise. 

If he's interested in aeronautical he should look into Embry Riddle Aeronautical University.  They are one of the top schools for that discipline in the country.  They are in the process of moving to NCAA Division II.  And the campus is in Daytona Beach, FL.

cabbagedad posted:

Reviving the thread for yet more engineering/baseball questions... 

I'm trying to provide guidance for a player interested in engineering (of which I know far too little).  He is a 2017 here in California, not getting D1 interest but will be a solid player at another level.  He is getting JC interest. 

My question is this... is JC even a feasible option for an engineering major that doesn't want to spend unnecessary years in college?

Saw this and was about to reply with a 4 year school idea, (Colorado School of Mines) but then realized that that's not your question, and that your question has been answered -- yes, it's feasible.

But there's another question that's harder to answer.  What are the chances that a student who matriculates at a JC will graduate from a 4 year school in 4 or 5 years? Those are hard numbers to pin down, in my experience.   I did find this page:  http://www.thebestschools.org/...leges-united-states/

Describing SBCC, which this website ranks as the #2 JC in the country, and which I'm guessing would be on your student's list of JC options,  it says:  

57% of full-time students at SBCC transfer to four-year colleges; more than half of those ultimately earn a bachelor’s degree. Agreements with 76 colleges (in and out of California) guarantee that SBCC credits are accepted for transfer; several schools ensure admission if a student meets academic requirements. 

For me as a parent the takeaway is that a full time student at a highly regarded JC has an approximately 30% of graduating from a 4 year college.  Not bad for a JC, but I do not love those odds when compared to graduation rates from UC's or Cal Poly!

Just a thought....

I can add my 2017 looked into UC-San Diego very closely and had dialogue with the coaches.  Engineering as a major going in was not an option--not even with the coaches support.  They said they could get him in through another major, and then each year there is a competitive transfer request process that he would have to take his chance with against all of the other students wanting to get in, the vast majority of which would not be challenged by playing baseball.  My son agreed that it would be too big of a risk since he is certain he wants to do engineering and would likely have wound up a Physics major for four years and then needed to go to graduate school.

We got the impression that Engineering as a major is so impacted at UC-SD that you would need top of the elite academic credentials to have a chance at the admission stage.  I cannot imagine a JC trying to transfer in during year 2 or 3 would have an advantage versus the students already there who are also trying to transfer in and taking the same courses at UCSD as the JC student was. 

LOTS of great information, guys... thanks again.  I will make sure he gets on here to put good use to all of it!

He applied to School of Mines and recently found out he was denied... numbers may not be right but he said something about falling short of the 4.3 GPA they were looking for.   I think he had three or four target schools with the JC route as a backup plan that is attractive to him.  I'm fairly certain that he didn't dig deep enough to have a really good understanding of the specific challenges of the engineering/baseball combo or JC to 4yr w/engineering combo.  So, now he probably needs to to some quick learning, re-evaluation and cast a broader net at the right targets.  

So, what is missing from this thread is a successful JC baseball player who transferred into an engineering program and continued to play D1 or D2 baseball (per CabbageDad post).  If anybody has gone down that path, we'd like to hear from them.

Certainly, I undertand the goals;

1) play baseball in college 2) get an engineering degree from an accredited school  3) only pay for the necessary courses to advance/transfer into an engineering school

My opinion is this is really difficult to pull off not just on its own but there are many moving parts.  Certainly playing baseball in college and majoring in engineering is tough.  Certainly transferring from a JUCO into a engineering program is tough.  But when you mix it all together, do you really want that much excitement in your life.  I think the chances of graduating on time would get smaller...how much money would you really save?  In addition the engineering classes in years 3,4 are going to be much more difficult than the non-engineering classes in years 1,2.  I would proceed with a lot of caution with this approach of doing it all.  Again JMO.

Fenway,  I basically went down that path myself (with minor variations) although it was along time ago.  I only played 1 yr of JuCo and transferred to D1 w/ major of Architectural Engineering, which is not near as demanding as Electrical, Mechanical, etc.  It required an extra year for me to be able to keep a 3.0 GPA and meet the time demands of baseball.  Also, the time demands of D1 baseball have gone way, way up since back in the day.  Its basically a full time job now.  Having said all of that, I still think it is not impractical to think a kid could go JuCo for 2 years and transfer successfully to play D1 or D2 and major in engineering - as long as it's a credible JuCo & planning regarding transfer credits is done on the front end.  However, it isn't practical to think you could do that in today's world and graduate in 4 years.  It would take 5 for most anyone IMO. 

I went to the University of Illinois for Mechanical Engineering, and I knew of and worked with several students who transferred in after two years, and they were successful.  As mentioned, have to do your homework on what's transferable, what the school is looking for, etc.  With the cost of school getting beyond ridiculous, I think this will become a route more take.

Adbono - Good feedback especially on your opinion about taking more than 4 years in todays world.  That makes a lot of sense to me.

FrankJP - were these JC engineering transfers baseball players at Univ of Illinois?

FrankJP posted:

I went to the University of Illinois for Mechanical Engineering, and I knew of and worked with several students who transferred in after two years, and they were successful.  As mentioned, have to do your homework on what's transferable, what the school is looking for, etc.  With the cost of school getting beyond ridiculous, I think this will become a route more take.

Exactly the college I referred to....  a few guys I know did this, one played one didn't.  As mentioned above, probably would turn into a 5 year program these days; there could be a way to leverage any "redshirt" offering because the player is focused on his degree while continuing his play.

fenway - no doubt you have as much experience on this topic as anyone. 

I'd like to add that transferring from JUCO to Engineering school is painless - assuming GPA and course requirements are met.  The first two years of Engineering are basically the courses I outlined in my above post.  They consist mostly of math and science along with some humanities like English.  A student who does well in the math and sciences will basically start their 4 year school as a junior.  The 5 year option is not a bad strategy for an Engineering student even if they don't play baseball.  Obviously, the cost to attend for 5 years is a consideration. 

Statistically the odds are long for a combined engineering and baseball experience and when you put in the additional issues of how a 4 yr baseball program recruits the transferring from a JC to a 4 year program makes it even more daunting.  ... but the JC route is a great way to go to reduce the financial burden of a likely 5 yr process for many. 

fenwaysouth posted:

Adbono - Good feedback especially on your opinion about taking more than 4 years in todays world.  That makes a lot of sense to me.

FrankJP - were these JC engineering transfers baseball players at Univ of Illinois?

No, they were not.  I was referring more to to the question of transferring in and the success they had, especially at a highly rated engineering school.  

Best of luck, can always use more engineers!

After 2020 the discussion on engineering taking 4 years or more may be a mute point.  There has been discussion since 2006 about changing the Model Law (by NCEES) for engineering licensure to a Masters or equivalent (MOE) degree.  It was suppose to take effect in 2016 but got postponed until 2020.  There currently is discussion of extending it further but that is not a done deal yet.  If NCEES adopts the new model law then a four year degree may not be a licensable degree.  Engineering students after a certain date will have to have a Masters or something more than the 128 required hours to obtain licensure.

I know this isn't baseball related but it may help to look at engineering as a 5 year professional program similar to architecture and some others.  I don't know if this helps or changes the thought process but it may make scheduling courses in the spring a little easier if you have longer of course the down size is it's another year in school and more money out of pocket.