First Impression - overcoming it?

Define, "Layed an Egg".  Was it in a showcase game, or are you talking really bad metrics.  Baseball is a game of failure, striking out, an error, they happen.  Kind of hard to lay an egg on exit velo and other metrics unless hurt or has problems handling pressure.

I'd say of course he can overcome it, depending on how he handled the failure in front of the coaches.  Part of the best recruiting I've heard coaches say is seeing how a player handles adversity, if he can go back and show better next time, it is a huge positive.  If he stomped around throwing gear or telling everyone he's better than that out loud, I'd say he's done there.

Most coaches can tell skill regardless of outcome, kids tend to be outcome based when it comes to evaluating their own performance.

I was sitting in the stands with a D3 coach and we were talking about ranked players in our state. I asked about a large 1B player. He said he talked to this once...he was arrogant and cocky and was immediately crossed off the list. He is not playing anymore.

There are several definitions of " laying an egg".

BaseballJoe,

Not necessarily.   Your definition of laying an egg may be different from a college coaches.  College coaches tend to have more far more evaluation experience than a player or his parent.  They are looking for specific things..hands through the zone, frame, attitude, late pitching movement, etc....  I

I've seen hitters go 0-for the weekend but had incredible bat speed and their hitting discipline was flawless.  One guy I recall was constantly popping up, but he put that pop-up into orbit.  He had a short compact swing with tremendous bat speed that committed to a D1 P5.   I've seen just as many large-framed pitchers throwing 90+ with two pitches with no control thereby plunking hitters at showcases.  Pitching coaches were drooling over these guys.   Again, it isn't always about results at showcases and camps.  Sometimes it is about desirable skills, and what that coach is looking for.

Also, an uncommitted recruit should ALWAYS be focused on other schools/coaches until committed.  Never, ever let up on the recruiting gas pedal.

As always, JMO.  Good luck!

I read a story about a scout going to see Mike Trout play in HS.  That day Mike went 0 for something, but one of the at-bats he hit a pop-up a mile high.  That (and his pre-game BP) was enough for the scout to see he was special.

If a coach came to see him play it must have been due to the recommendation of a baseball person he trusts. If the fundamentals, metrics and proper attitude are visible the coach will likely return for a second look.

I coached 18u Gold softball before becoming a travel baseball coach. One of our players popped up twice and whiffed. One of the college coaches approached me after the game. He told me to tell her not to sweat it. Her swing was just off. He saw everything else he came to see. He said he would be back later that weekend to watch her hit a couple more times.

My advice would be to consume Purina brand chicken feed before attending a showcase. Farmers report no eggs being laid under those circumstances. Problem solved.

He could try Pedro Cerano’s routine …

https://youtu.be/bWdfDsLvm9I

Laying an egg is lucrative now Joe. But seriously, can you elaborate on how poor the showing was?   

Thanks for all of the perspectives shared about this. My kid has only done one showcase. It was at a P5 school. He did fine defensively but could not hit the ball off of machine pitch. That’s the laying an egg part as he’s usually a good hitter. I was actually surprised that they used machine for hitting. Never been a fan of it because it doesn’t replicate real pitching for a batter. I’ve since learned that those camps are basically a waste of time if your son wasn’t specifically invited to attend by the coaches at the school. After the camp I only saw one kid and his parent pulled aside by a coach and overheard them making plans for a return trip.

@BaseballJoe posted:

That’s the laying an egg part as he’s usually a good hitter. I was actually surprised that they used machine for hitting. Never been a fan of it because it doesn’t replicate real pitching for a batter. I’ve since learned that those camps are basically a waste of time if your son wasn’t specifically invited to attend by the coaches at the school. After the camp I only saw one kid and his parent pulled aside by a coach and overheard them making plans for a return trip.

Curious as to who you thought should be pitching?  The coaching staff?  The program's pitchers?

I don't suggest attending a P5 camp or showcase, first,  unless you are ready to show those skills, and then it should be a prospect camp  as it can become a waste of money.

In HS, identified as a top D1 prospect, son attended his dream school camp, here in Florida.

It didn't go well.

One needs to be prepared.

Joe, my son was an Olympic level egg layer with the machine. His mean coach (me) only used it for gauging velo, seeing the different ball flight shapes. I guess I never wanted him to be a hack attack warrior and wanted his focus on timing the release on the hand of the pitcher or front tosser. Summer of his rising frosh year, we did transition to the hack because he knew the HS tryout coaches uses machine BP and he wanted to rake with his sequencing intact. It took about 5 sessions. Good hitters will adjust. Make pitching machine BP part of his "routine" and he will be fine. One showing will not make or break your kid. As Mom stated you should only attend these showcases if you have metrics the colleges are interested in. I am not sure how close by that P5 is from you, but If you want to get a baseline metric and some showcase experience for your son, that is fine but the local colleges have them too.

@BaseballJoe posted:

Thanks for all of the perspectives shared about this. My kid has only done one showcase. It was at a P5 school. He did fine defensively but could not hit the ball off of machine pitch. That’s the laying an egg part as he’s usually a good hitter. I was actually surprised that they used machine for hitting. Never been a fan of it because it doesn’t replicate real pitching for a batter. I’ve since learned that those camps are basically a waste of time if your son wasn’t specifically invited to attend by the coaches at the school. After the camp I only saw one kid and his parent pulled aside by a coach and overheard them making plans for a return trip.

I was driving by a D1 park one Saturday and decided to stop and watch. I knew the school was running showcases four straight weekends. My son was fourteen at the time. I figured it would be a good education. The team’s players were helping out. I knew one. I had a conversation with him.

There were 36 position players in attendance. After watching them all field and take 8 swings I had observations. I mentioned to the player I knew all thirty-six looked like potential D1 players with the glove and mobility. But, I only saw four with D1 quickness with the bat. I pointed out which four.

The player told me those four were at the showcase on the house. They were seen earlier at a PG event and invited. The other players were paying to be there and helping finance the spring trip.

Your post took me back a few years to this https://community.hsbaseballwe...ic/after-you-blow-it

I’ll say it didn’t end up mattering much if at all. He had a lot more opportunities where he did well and ended up with a lot of options. Everyone blows it sometimes. It seems bigger now than it is.  And any coach that writes you off after one bad outing probably isn’t one you want to play for anyway.

@baseballhs posted:

Everyone blows it sometimes. It seems bigger now than it is.  And any coach that writes you off after one bad outing probably isn’t one you want to play for anyway.

You are 100% correct.

Hope that your player is doing well.

I think if you have really good tools the bad game won't matter all that much if you can do it better next time.

So for example if you have a bad game with 2 KS and a pop up that's not good but if you hit two bombs the next game it shows that you have potential and maybe just need a bit of consistency.

Would be better without the bad game but at least you have shown how it works if everything goes right.

On the other hands if the tools are more mediocre the lack or consistency might be held a little more against you because you show the downside and upside isn't as high.

I think many of the parents going through this for the first time really don't understand how it all works.

Coaches who are good recruiters will watch a player in the dugout as well as at batting practice, at the plate, in the field, in the bull pen and on the mound.

There is a lot more to this than folks realize.

Lots of good wisdom here! Now that 2025 has had his first camp experience, we're going to regroup and attend a couple showcases over the summer with multiple schools attending.

@BaseballJoe posted:

Lots of good wisdom here! Now that 2025 has had his first camp experience, we're going to regroup and attend a couple showcases over the summer with multiple schools attending.

Be aware that NCAA rules may prohibit paid D1 coaches  from attending some showcases. The Volunteer Assistant was the guy that would attend, probably more for the $ since they had no actual salary.

Although no one knows how camps and showcases will be affected, I suggest you actually ask whoever is promoting the event, who will attend for the program.

As a 2025 your son should be playing in tournaments this summer.

JMO

@TPM posted:

I think many of the parents going through this for the first time really don't understand how it all works.

Coaches who are good recruiters will watch a player in the dugout as well as at batting practice, at the plate, in the field, in the bull pen and on the mound.

There is a lot more to this than folks realize.

And, if they know who they are they watch the parents.

Off-topic, but players will be well-served by learning to hit off machines. Current machines can be configured with the exact pitch arsenal of opposing pitchers. The Giants won 107 games in 2021 taking pre-game on-field BP off machines operating at game-speed with the arsenal of that game's pitchers. Several aging hitters had career years.

Just like analytics/sabermetrics revolutionized how players are evaluated, game-speed training will revolutionize how players practice. Game-speed training is a big part of Driveline's programming, and coaches like Donnie Ecker and Andrew Cresci are taking that programming to MLB. Old habits die especially hard in baseball, but it's only a matter of time before any team that can afford it will be using machines for much of their BP.

TPM and Rjm;

You maybe interested in the words of Tim Fortugno, Pro Scout

@BaseballJoe posted:

Thanks for all of the perspectives shared about this. My kid has only done one showcase. It was at a P5 school. He did fine defensively but could not hit the ball off of machine pitch. That’s the laying an egg part as he’s usually a good hitter. I was actually surprised that they used machine for hitting. Never been a fan of it because it doesn’t replicate real pitching for a batter. I’ve since learned that those camps are basically a waste of time if your son wasn’t specifically invited to attend by the coaches at the school. After the camp I only saw one kid and his parent pulled aside by a coach and overheard them making plans for a return trip.

My kid also didn't perform well off of machine pitch (in batting cage) at a D1 camp but hit much better when they were hitting live off of the pitchers outside. Some coaches only saw inside, some only saw outside...just gotta hope for the best in that situation I think and let it be a learning experience. I think nerves play a big part in everything as well.

My son went to a couple P5 camps/showcases.  If you weren't "invited" meaning already being recruited, there was absolutely no reason to attend other than being able to say you helped fund the program and put some money in the Volunteer Assistant's pockets lol.

@Buckeye 2015 posted:

My son went to a couple P5 camps/showcases.  If you weren't "invited" meaning already being recruited, there was absolutely no reason to attend other than being able to say you helped fund the program and put some money in the Volunteer Assistant's pockets lol.

I think gaining experience in "camp" situations and under pressure is important. If families can afford it, it could be beneficial to attend one 1x/year. But I also agree with you about putting money in their pockets. It's a business and they usually know who they're wanting to see.

@BaseballGhostMom posted:

I think gaining experience in "camp" situations and under pressure is important. If families can afford it, it could be beneficial to attend one 1x/year. But I also agree with you about putting money in their pockets. It's a business and they usually know who they're wanting to see.

Absolutely agree.  My son's first camp was at an AAC school when he was in 8th grade (maybe 4'7 and 75 lbs at that point).   We were the first ones to check in.  He was amazed and thought he was king of the world lol.  Then the "big boys" started coming in.  T-shirts/jerseys from all the biggest HS's in the state.  Next thing I knew he was standing back against a railing just watching these guys come in.  Ended up being put in with some of those guys on his first rotation, which was IF.  A P5 coach was there.  He started talking to my son....threw him right into the fire at SS and pretty much stayed with him the entire day.  He came up to me afterwards and said he was impressed how well my son did, especially being his age/size and with who some of the big time guys were that were there.  From that day forward my son never had one bit of nerves at any camp he ever attended.

That's awesome! And also proof that if a kid is worth looking at, he will be noticed, and they'll recognize him in the future. They're looking at talent, yes. And the big guys get a lot of looks. But my experience is that they also want a peek at the later bloomers and to see who has skills, a good foundation, and a great attitude. Potential. Sidenote- I have an early(ish) bloomer that got a lot of good looks as an 8th grader. Now he's a sophomore and I find myself thinking about his projection and constantly wonder if mine will plateau while the late bloomers pass him up or if he will continue to grow and improve. Only time will tell and each player is different.

@BaseballGhostMom posted:

That's awesome! And also proof that if a kid is worth looking at, he will be noticed, and they'll recognize him in the future. They're looking at talent, yes. And the big guys get a lot of looks. But my experience is that they also want a peek at the later bloomers and to see who has skills, a good foundation, and a great attitude. Potential. Sidenote- I have an early(ish) bloomer that got a lot of good looks as an 8th grader. Now he's a sophomore and I find myself thinking about his projection and constantly wonder if mine will plateau while the late bloomers pass him up or if he will continue to grow and improve. Only time will tell and each player is different.

All a player can do is put forth his best effort to get bigger, faster, stronger, more skilled and baseball smarter. Everything else is wasted energy worrying about issues that can’t be controlled.

Lol ok this is bothering me... hitting sky high pop ups is looked highly upon by recruiters and scouts? If so, I wasn't aware of that but find it very interesting

@edcoach posted:

Lol ok this is bothering me... hitting sky high pop ups is looked highly upon by recruiters and scouts? If so, I wasn't aware of that but find it very interesting

Not sure where your comment is coming from as I didn’t see that said in this thread. But maybe it was and I missed it. But hitting sky high pop ups is NOT looked upon highly by recruiters and scouts. Especially if it’s a regular occurrence as it would indicate issues with the bat path.

Adbono it's above by fenwaysouth. I agree with your bat path assessment