HS Coach says "HIS" players can no longer play travel ball

What, if any, is his rationalization? It makes no sense.

I would approach the AD, Principal, and, if necessary, the School Board. The Coach would appear to be putting the kids at a severe disadvantage and as you state he has no jurisdiction. Good luck.

I have heard that the Coach, Principal and AD are close friends which is probably the case most of the time. Even still I plan on contacting them, the School Board, CIF, etc.

quote:

There are a few players from this HS that play for my baseball academy

So they're not his players. They're your players.

quote:

and it is none of the coaches business who guys play with between June and January.

Well from October to January they shoudn't be playing ANY baseball.

Steve,

I would recommend starting with the coach...or at least trying.

'Dear Coach...I've heard this and I am just wondering what the issues are? Can we talk about this?'

There's a chance there is some misunderstanding. If you jump him on step-1, he will probably dig in his heels. And its probably the way you'd want to be treated if the situation was reversed.

I agree with the above. However,if talking doesn'twork and this policy stands, the kid can quit the team and play travel. If he is on a team that won the 17 USA and the PG Natl Champ, he is likely pretty darn good and will be found anyway.Of course, he would lose the pride and experience of playhing for his school. But he may not have a choice if all other options lead nowhere.

Hi Steve,
I am a HS coach. I have also coached travel ball and I have worked many of the non-HS tournaments for some of the larger organizations. FOR THE MOST PART, I agree with your position. For the sake of discussion, I will bring up a few counter-points to consider.

Quote - "Ultimately I want to get this situation resolved for the benefit of the players. That is the most important thing, right?"

Yes, it should be but I have spoken directly to several travel/club coaches that are fighting this fight for the well being of their for-profit organization more so than for the players.

Quote - "The experiences that these guys have had is unbelievable and they have memories and friendships to last their entire lives."

I can certainly say the same for the young men in our HS program. I can also say that I have spoken to dozens and dozens of players who have had bad travel ball experiences. There are good and bad programs on both the HS side and travel side.

Quote - "..HS Coach telling them that they can no longer play travel baseball at any point during the year... I have a huge problem with this because I do not feel that a HS Baseball Coach has the right to tell players where they can and can’t play during the “OFFSEASON”! HS Baseball in California is February through May... and it is none of the coaches business who guys play with between June and January."

Several points to make here...
Most HS programs now have either a summer or fall component. Similarly, if you play HS football, you are expected to participate in Spring Conditioning, summer 7-on-7 passing league and then, the fall practice and game season. The reality is that most HS sports have gone this route. So, to define the HS baseball season as Feb thru May is hardly an accurate depiction. The actual college season is also typically February to May or June but do you think the college coach would be OK with most of his players skipping his fall program?
I certainly agree that there is great value in being involved in a good travel or scout team if you have aspirations to play beyond HS and desire exposure. With our HS summer program, we try to determine how many players will be coming into the program and how many have ties to good club teams. We then try to strike a balance so that all can have the best opportunity to play good competitive ball in the summer and fall if they wish. We encourage participation with good travel organizations. We see this, for the most part, as an advantage for the player and for our program. But, as I have stated in other posts, it is rarely that simple. When we schedule a short summer program, we have to make sure we'll have a team that is competitive enough that other schools will continue to schedule us. Many schools find that they aren't able to field a summer team due to club commitments. The coaches are at a competitive disadvantage if they can't get an early look at incoming players, can't get returners additional game time playing together, can't work with their pitchers, etc., etc. when all other schools in their league are doing so.

Regarding the statement... "it's none of the coach's business who guys play with between June and January." I certainly consider it my business. I don't necessarily feel I have the right to dictate where a player plays but I care enough about the players in our program that I am interested in their well-being, development, academic performance and social behavior beyond just the time we have them at our practices and games. I feel that parents, teachers, coaches and others are all part of the network of caring adults providing good example and structure for our young people and that doesn't stop when we are "offseason".

I am curious to hear what the HS coach's reasoning is that he is not willing to compromise. There are always two sides to a story. I agree that this situation presents many challenges for the players, parents and coaches. We also deal with similar issues within the HS system with overlapping sports.

In many areas of CA the travel s o c c e r clubs do not allow their players to play high school s****r.

Personally I think it's sad both ways that the high schools and the travel teams can't work together for the benefit of the players.

our HS coach tries to coordinate travel ball with summer ball for pitching.unfortunately the kids tend to pitch more innings than desirable when they get deeper into the tournaments.when the HS coach finds out they have dead arms or cant pitch he benches them and moves onto the next kid.at some point the hs coach will put you on the shee ite list.just remember almost every college will call you HS coach to see what kind of a player and person you are.they rarely call your travel coach for his opinion but the will call you high school coach 90 percent of the time

My son got the same message from his HS coach as a Sophomore. I called him, we talked and son pitched in pro scout and hit with HS team.

Bottom line, HS coach had a hard time saying pitching against boarderline JV HS teams was better than pitching against CC teams. He just wanted son to show up to improve hitting.

My advice, negotiate...

quote:

Please Wait. Your request is being processed...
Reply

I feel very bad for these kids. As a lawyer I wonder how a coach can dictate participation or non participation in an event outside of school? First, in many states there are rules against requiring participation outside of designated time periods. These demands seem to violate these rules. In addition -- if it is a public school -- there may be consitutional protections. I am not saying sue, but I would use this information to discuss with coach and go up the chain of command all the way to the school board. Fair is fair, wrong is wrong.

There are several factors at play here...is the HS season quality? Is travel ball at a higher level? Does the player require more exposure? Does the player even have a chance at playing beyond HS?

Our HS does not do anything outside of the regular HS season. But closer to the big city, they do play summer ball. And I've heard rumors that the HS coaches often say, "play for me in the summer or you don't play in the spring."

In our family, we would have said "see ya HS coach." However, for other players, the HS season is sufficient.

Again, the broad brush might not fit. From the OP, I'd suggest those players might just say sayonara to the HS team and be better off.

I have felt this for the past few years. I am seeing that the level of play and competition in HS ball has declinded and club/scout ball has increased. I think some of these HS coaches are feeling threated by the changing landscape of baseball. I have coached in HS, club and scout ball so I have seen it with my own eyes.

IMO these kids may be better off not associating themselves with a HS coach of this nature.

Lefty

quote:

Originally posted by biggerpapi:
There are several factors at play here...is the HS season quality? Is travel ball at a higher level? Does the player require more exposure? Does the player even have a chance at playing beyond HS?

Our HS does not do anything outside of the regular HS season. But closer to the big city, they do play summer ball. And I've heard rumors that the HS coaches often say, "play for me in the summer or you don't play in the spring."

In our family, we would have said "see ya HS coach." However, for other players, the HS season is sufficient.

Again, the broad brush might not fit. From the OP, I'd suggest those players might just say sayonara to the HS team and be better off.

I respectfully disagree with you..kids especially stand up athletes have a sense of loyalty to their schools.they have been participating there for 4 years and are known by their peers and feel proud to compete for their schools.Again most colleges that are interested in you will CONTACt your HIGH SCHOOL coach to get an opinion on you CHARACTER and work ethic.Iof they are really interested in you they will go out of their way to see you compete with other kids in your conference.I would never encourage a kid to dismiss his high school play for a travel team.

That coach is off his rocker... He's just gonna end up losing good players either physically or mentally or both!

Bad move...

First I don't agree with this coach and I feel he's doing a disservice to his kids. That being said what's wrong with a high school program wanting to have a year round development program? Why is that such a bad thing?

Now I agree there has to be flexibility to allow the guys to play for other teams in the off season and go to showcases / camps. There is some issues of legitimacy when it comes to the knowledge of the high school coach but the same can be said of the "whatever team" coach. If we want kids to improve, get exposure, compete and have fun then why can't a high school year long program to help be part of the process?

Maybe I'm wrong or crazy or it's just my area but I'm starting to see a line in the sand drawn which is going to hurt the sport. Both sides are at fault too.

Would parents be as upset if a travel coach said HIS players couldn't play for the high school?

Club sports have RUINED high school athletics. Plain and simple. It appears that my school is not going to be able to field a freshman basketball team this year which is crazy with almost 900 students in the school. They have 3 players at this point... Apparently the boys in the school district that played last year in 8th grade are "concentrating on baseball" which is not recommended by the high school baseball coach..

What I find curious is that volleyball thrives with really no issues.

Club season shuts down during the high school season and picks up in November when the girls are done with their high school season and I don't really hear too many issues like I do with mainly baseball and kickball.

Would agree with other posters that this issue can't be painted with a broad brush. My son's high school coach is a good knowledgable coach. Loved our club in the youth program phase but now as we move to the High School phase I see it as merely a money making endeavor for the director with little to no development and not much to offer the boys.

To Bulldog's point I am not sure you can entirely blame club sports for the issue of not playing more than one sport, etc. Here in TX some of the issue is the desire to overlap the seasons for one and having athletics class for another. My son would like to play basketball for fun but not at the expense of starting baseball an entire month after the season started. I know many kids here who don't play football as a secondary sport as they don't want to deal with the football coach and getting out of his football class at the end of the season. Some football coaches/athletic directors make it very difficult on kids who want to play multiple sports.

quote:

A HS Coach in Southern California had a meeting with his players and told them that they can no longer play travel baseball. This has created a huge issue and needs to be dealt with . I am hoping others out there have been in this situation and can share their experiences. Ultimately I want to get this situation resolved for the benefit of the players. That is the most important thing, right?

It's out of your control. Let it go.

Unfortunately the kids and their parents respectively will just have to take a position. Some will choose Trombly...who has an excellent reputation and clearly provides an experience that allows his kids the exposure they need to meet their goals or a high school team that doesn't.
I think it's blackmail as I assume coincidentally that the high school coach offers a program to replace travel ball.

CabbageDad...how is supplementing the high school coaches income throughout the year any different then choosing to pay a reputable, successful for profit coach? I have nothing but respect for most(not all) club coaches who manage to make a living doing something they love and helping our kids attain their goals. I do not respect less qualified coaches abusing their power by forcing people to play for them.

No coach who anything to offer needs to intimidate kids or force them to play for him because they are captive audience. Sadly, this is happening all the time but often in more subtle ways so the coach can claim deniability.

These are high school boys and their families, if the situation offends them they will have to take a stand and learn the lesson about standing up to bully's for what you believe in.

It's not my experience most kids get their exposure from high school ball. It can be a component but in my opinion is not a significant part of the equation. Good luck Mr. Trombley...I respect your program and the decision would be a no brainer around here.

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
First I don't agree with this coach and I feel he's doing a disservice to his kids. That being said what's wrong with a high school program wanting to have a year round development program? Why is that such a bad thing?

Now I agree there has to be flexibility to allow the guys to play for other teams in the off season and go to showcases / camps. There is some issues of legitimacy when it comes to the knowledge of the high school coach but the same can be said of the "whatever team" coach. If we want kids to improve, get exposure, compete and have fun then why can't a high school year long program to help be part of the process?

Maybe I'm wrong or crazy or it's just my area but I'm starting to see a line in the sand drawn which is going to hurt the sport. Both sides are at fault too.

Would parents be as upset if a travel coach said HIS players couldn't play for the high school?

I am with Coach on this one. My son is fortunate to not have to choose between programs. His HS coach knows that he doesn't/can't provide the type of exposure over the summer that can be gained by a good travel team. He encourages/supports the college prospect players on the team to play travel ball. By doing this it actual creates my "development" time for the kids in the HS program that need more play time.

Now, there have been some good arguments for the HS program in this topic and I was wondering a couple of things..
1) Does the HS coach run the type of off season program the will actual develop the players that show college potential?
2) Does the HS coach put his teams in the exposure type tournaments/games that are going to get his kids some looks?

If the HS coach does not do these things then IMO, he has no right to place limitations on his players.

I am of the opinion that if lefthooks' coach took this approach lefthook would choose where to play, not me and I think I know what he would do

quote:

Originally posted by calisportsfan:
CabbageDad...how is supplementing the high school coaches income throughout the year any different then choosing to pay a reputable, successful for profit coach?

Cali,
We charge enough for balls and umpires for our summer program (usually about $50) and none of the coaches see a dime. In fact, the boys have to pay that fee through the Student Body account so that coaches never touch the money. Our income is definitely not supplemented. Three ex-college players give a great deal of their time for absolutely zero financial gain in return. Also, only the HC makes a very small stipend during the regular season. Those same assistant coaches again donate a great deal of their time. And the HC puts out far more $$ than he takes in on his stipend. To answer your question, that is how it is different for us. If you were referring to the case of the OP, I can't speak for that HS coach - don't know enough about his scenario.

That said, I agree with everything else that you said. There is great value in a good travel/scout program and it is unfortunate that HS and travel can't work together for the benefit of the boys. In our area, we try to do so. We run our "offseason" program in a short early summer period that allows for plenty of time for those interested in the peak late-summer, early fall travel/scout ball season. We don't allow winter sports athletes to participate in our early season conditioning until they are done with that sport so that we don't interfere with that coach's program. We also strongly encourage multi-sport participation and don't penalize those who do so.

I'm not saying it is perfect. During that early summer season, many of our kids are being pulled by the basketball and football coach as well. We offer collaboration and try to work with the kids that want to try to juggle a bit. This is not always reciprocated by the other coaches.

quote:

Originally posted by lefthookdad:

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
First I don't agree with this coach and I feel he's doing a disservice to his kids. That being said what's wrong with a high school program wanting to have a year round development program? Why is that such a bad thing?

Now I agree there has to be flexibility to allow the guys to play for other teams in the off season and go to showcases / camps. There is some issues of legitimacy when it comes to the knowledge of the high school coach but the same can be said of the "whatever team" coach. If we want kids to improve, get exposure, compete and have fun then why can't a high school year long program to help be part of the process?

Maybe I'm wrong or crazy or it's just my area but I'm starting to see a line in the sand drawn which is going to hurt the sport. Both sides are at fault too.

Would parents be as upset if a travel coach said HIS players couldn't play for the high school?

I am with Coach on this one. My son is fortunate to not have to choose between programs. His HS coach knows that he doesn't/can't provide the type of exposure over the summer that can be gained by a good travel team. He encourages/supports the college prospect players on the team to play travel ball. By doing this it actual creates my "development" time for the kids in the HS program that need more play time.

Now, there have been some good arguments for the HS program in this topic and I was wondering a couple of things..
1) Does the HS coach run the type of off season program the will actual develop the players that show college potential?
2) Does the HS coach put his teams in the exposure type tournaments/games that are going to get his kids some looks?

If the HS coach does not do these things then IMO, he has no right to place limitations on his players.

I am of the opinion that if lefthooks' coach took this approach lefthook would choose where to play, not me and I think I know what he would do

high school ball at least here is covered by the press.you hear all these BS about tournament ball and are promised exposure but quite frankly when you look around there is No scouts in the stands either.you want EXPOSURe you go to showcases that were meant just for that.college coaches arent going to follow the tadpole travelers but they will be at big showcase events .pay the 200 bucks and go to a few showcases.theres usually 15 to 20 actual college coaches there.thats why you pay

Steve,

Being a HS Coach that deals with this on a regular basis, here is my take on the subject.

We have a Fall and Winter programs, so…. Travel ball, showcase baseball, Scout baseball and High School baseball all need to find a way to make it work. In the end, the kids and the parents are going to play because they all think they need to play every inning of every game, 11 months out of the year (the 14/15’s think this). Whether they have the blessing of their coach (be it HS or TB coach) or not. I deal mostly with JV and FROSH, so my HS players are the prime target for outside programs promising more instruction, playing time, see better pitching, etc. All of my players have played TB in the past, and many still do. Im OK with it AS LONG AS they tell me what team they are on, if they are pitching, and what the schedule is. I also tell my players that they will not be excused without reprisal unless I have a two week notice that they are playing for team XYZ rather than our fall team. This keeps the players responsible and honest and prevents them from playing for every coach that calls Friday night just looking for an arm to throw on Sat.

I think you are doing the right thing by talking to the HS coach about it, and if he is not being reasonable… well. I don’t know what to tell you. He must be living in a dream world to think that his players aren’t going to do it anyway. I talk to the TB coaches of my players on a regular basis. Especially the pitchers.

Side not – This weekend, I will lose the following players to TB Tournaments. (1) Catcher; (2) P/1st; (1) MIF; (1) P/3rd; (2) OF. Those are all freshman. Maybe I should rethink my policy but the backup players are going to love playing tomorrow.

quote:

Club season shuts down during the high school season and picks up in November when the girls are done with their high school season and I don't really hear too many issues like I do with mainly baseball and kickball.

Volleyball coaches are the same often for high school and club. That's a huge difference right there. I will say it again because I believe it fully. Club sports have RUINED high school sports.

Another example of that for you. Football playoffs start tonight in Illinois. School just north of me lost one of their stud receivers last Saturday after he dislocated and broke his ankle... playing in a baseball showcase game.

quote:

Originally posted by lefthookdad:
...I was wondering a couple of things..
1) Does the HS coach run the type of off season program the will actual develop the players that show college potential?
2) Does the HS coach put his teams in the exposure type tournaments/games that are going to get his kids some looks?

#1. Keep in mind that the HS coach is primarily concerned with developing his HS team. Typically, there are only one or two on a HS team who may go on to play college ball. I think most HS coaches are equipped to continue developing all players' skills including those who will go on but they certainly should not focus their efforts primarily on those showing college potential.

#2. No, usually not. The true high-exposure tourneys are usually quite costly, few and far between and out of the realm of the HS program and again, not the primary focus of the HS coach. Now, there are some high profile HS tourneys that do draw some recruiters or scouts.
That said, the majority of travel tournaments don't draw recruiters or scouts either. You really have to be with the right travel/scout program to get that.

quote:

Originally posted by lefthookdad:
If the HS coach does not do these things then IMO, he has no right to place limitations on his players.

I understand your point and agree to a large extent. Just keep in mind that most HS coaches conduct an off-season program with the good intention of helping their teams to be more competitive and, thus, providing a more rewarding HS sports experience for all of their players. I think a bit of collaboration is key.

I can understand both sides of the equation here. Especially if the HS runs a good fall program. However, the most important thing to a high school coach is the actual spring season, I would think. My thought always was that if a player plays for a good, well run travel team in the summer and fall, and works out in the winter with this team, the high school coach is getting a vastly improved player come spring season.

Usually it's the better players playing summer and fall travel ball. This could allow the HS coaches more time to work with the players that need more attention.

I do agree that the player should be honest and upfront with all coaches so his best interest and the teams best interests are met.

Cabbage, I can agree....the key word for me in your last snetnces is "intention"...I would be more worried about if he is "capable". I would hope that the coach refered to by the OP is serious and knowledgable. I can only reference my sons school and the other local schools in my area, but if any of these coaches took that stance they would be doing a huge disservice to the kids

Wogdoggy, it is important to pick the right TB team and tournaments...every tourny lefthook played in this past summer had scouts there, the only games we played in that had no one in attndance were last minute dbl headers thrown together in between tourny's.

quote:

My thought always was that if a player plays for a good, well run travel team in the summer and fall, and works out in the winter with this team, the high school coach is getting a vastly improved player come spring season.

Yes and no. The key is having a good team that is coached properly and playing the game right. My HS team is playing with wood in the fall/winter, and some of the teams my freshman players are playing on are using -5's. I talked to my players about that one...

quote:

Usually it's the better players playing summer and fall travel ball. This could allow the HS coaches more time to work with the players that need more attention.

Usually. But remember, some of the players that are not seeing the amount of playing time that they think they warrant often are the ones that seek out any team that will play them.

quote:

I do agree that the player should be honest and upfront with all coaches so his best interest and the teams best interests are met.

Very true. Many players try to hide it (playing for another team), when in reality if they would just be upfront from the beginning there wouldn’t be the problems that Steve is running into. Players need to be honest with themselves and others.

We had the same threat made by our coach. Funny thing is, nothing came of it. The travel ball kids kept playing travel, the other kids played for him over the summer and the next spring, life went on, just as it has every year before. I think any coach is smart enough to realize that he's just asking for his program to fall into a great big hole if he'd follow thru with that kind of mentality. Playing in the USA Baseball Championship or the PG Championship is a huge deal....and there's no way he'd risk losing kids like that from his HS program by making them choose. He may say it, but saying it and actually following thru with forcing them to make a choice are two different things. My guess is that he'll back off real quick as soon as he sees that the choice those kids are making doesn't include him.

Here's another component, if the high school coach mandates year round participation the kids who feel they don't get a fair shake or have conflict with the coach don't get the opportunity to play happily in another environment. That's not right.
Additionally, if all your needs are being met by your high school coach and his program is reasonable, I suspect the decision is easy.

Any coach who must mandate off season participation is doing so because his players don't want to play for him by choice...wouldn't it be better all around to concentrate on making your off season team one that people want to play for?

My son's experience is that his high school coach had an "optional" fall and summer team that cost nearly as much as his phenomenal travel coach who had worked for years to differentiate himself in the club business. Yes, it is a business but I was in control of whether the experience and coaching was worth the expenditure. My son played for a man who made an impact on the kind of man he will be and it was worth every penny. Our program has berths in all the tournaments that matter, the AZ classics etc. Many tournaments that matter are NOT available to teams just because they have the 1000 to sign up, they must have the credentials to belong and that's why they are scouted heavily. Those are the tournaments this Trombly team not just played in but won. Additonally, there were multiple coach scouts at all our weekend games and often the mid week ones too. Every kid on this team went off to play college ball at some level, the majority D1.

Flip side the high school coach who collected far more for a 2 month summer program then his entire salary and required the team to fly off on expensive tournaments that were the type of send your check and participate, (no scouts!) The program was expensive, it was a waste of money to spend thousand's of dollars for the poor quality tournaments that required travel they attended and honestly, foremost, I would CRINGE if this negative bully were the only coach my sons had experience with.

Life is only as complicated as we allow it to be. Make the choices that make sense for your family/kids and teach your kids who to stand up and be willing to accept the consequences of their priorities. Both my sons learned a lot from this. The situation only affected my youngest but his high school experience was TERRIBLE, yet he absolutely does not regret his choice to remain loyal to his travel coach, a man who he respects and has taught him a great deal about baseball, hard work, life and values (being a man).

I think it was all great because my son knows how to stand up for what he believes in and not let adversity effect the end result. There is no premium on being loyal to your high school over being loyal to a coach supplying a service who has exceeded your expectations for many more years then the four year high school experience. Loyalty is earned, not forced or it doesn't exist. I suspect my son will wear his college colors proudly through out his life. Most people who go off to college really leave high school behind and it is not for the college athlete the high light of their lives.

Nobody should be forced to play anywhere under any situation. Freedom of choice is a founding principal of this country....why should a baseball coach elevate himself beyond that principal? Pretty telling what type of person he is in my book.

I really appreciate those of you who have posted on this thread. I have taken the time to read all of the comments and they are all very helpful.

There are specific things I could list here that would give more details on the situation, but I can't do it for important reasons.

The sad reality is we will be doing a travel team during the Spring this year because of coaches like this who give their players no other option. My goal isn't to do a Spring team because I believe that HS Baseball is awesome and something that guys should do and experience. There should be a way for players to play both HS and travel baseball. Unfortunately this isn't the case is some situations. Many people will argue that Spring travel leagues are growing because of greedy travel coaches looking to make money, but that simply isn't the case. I don't want to do a team, but have numerous players and parents asking me to do one.

IMO, you shouldn't even offer a spring TB team unless there is no HS program. The HS coaches deserve that much and shouldn't have to be concerned abuot a player getting hurt or used up while playing fopr someone else. There shouldn't even be TB tournaments offered during this time, they are the profiting from this knowing you guys will come if they put one on.

Yet in our case, I would have loved an alternative in the spring that didn't require my son to be abused and belittled for his stand every day for 4 months.

I would have been satisfied simply by great practices given by a coach with knowledge. If you are on a good club team you don't need the 25 games of high school ball. Last, Spring leagues aren't being created by travel coaches to shut down high school, they are being created because of coaches like this high school coach.

I think the specifics of these situations are very important.

Think of it this way: In some communities Little League (or similar leagues) reign supreme. In these places, Club/Travel teams may even go on hiatus during the spring season. In other communities, leagues – dreaded rec-leagues – are the scourge of the earth; reviled as egalitarian, dare I say socialist (since the best players have to share their runs with the low quality, undeserving, scrubs on their team). In these communities, ‘real’ players are left with no other option but to band together in mere hope of keeping mediocrity at bay while each waits on their call from Boras; bound to the annoying, yet unavoidable, process of getting incrementally older only one day a time.

OK, a little amusement there. But the jist is while all third year High Schooler’s are called Juniors, their experiences are dictated completely by the region, community they are living.

Let me ask someone from the Georgia area: My understanding in the Marietta / East Cobb region, Club teams are the primary baseball participation. High School teams are assembled in February and play through end of May. Club teams operate the rest of year.

I know of a region of Southern California, the Valley (I have a ‘friend’ who lives there), where the high schools are putting together year around baseball programs. Some of the high schools are private and some are public. Some Coaching staffs have no classroom responsibilities; they are truly a fulltime baseball organization attached to a High School. We’re talking about TeamUSA Coaches. Former College coaches who choose (not fired from college) to work for these organizations. Some of these programs even reach down to the youth age-group. It’s now possible to play 9U through High School within the same organization.

I guess my point is we can all see the landscape shifting. I don’t think we’re all (based on location and situation) seeing the same effects and same changes. What will be terrible for one group of players may not be for another.

quote:

Originally posted by coach2709:
First I don't agree with this coach and I feel he's doing a disservice to his kids. That being said what's wrong with a high school program wanting to have a year round development program? Why is that such a bad thing?

It is a "bad thing" coach because the kids are not playing against the best competition, and the current tradition of baseball is for colleges to go to major Summmer events with top Summer programs to locate talent. A couple of high school coaches will not change that. Bottom line, it is not better for a top-level ballplayer to keep him from playing with the best kids in his locale, against the best kids of another locale. You can still have them work on stuff during the week if you want, but don't deprive them of these great experiences.

Football going to 7-on-7 all summer and basketball tournaments year around have driven some HS baseball coaches to the point where they feel like they HAVE to have the kid all year.

Here's the only thing I tell my kids.... "If you can play on a great summer team, do it. But if they want you to hit 8 hole and play every third day it's the wrong group for you. If you want to play a position AND pitch and they just want you to pitch, it's the wrong group for you (never had a 90+ kid or my advice would be different... i'd still tell them that if they want to play a position they need to use that leverage to get the position AND pitch if they want to!!!


that's just my viewpoint... enjoy Game 3 tomorrow folks... the darn season is almost over

I understand how the high school coach is creating turmoil in your program. I get that. But you are wanting to intervene for what purpose? To preserve your program? Because it's not right - it's a philosophical statement? Because you are emotionally linked to the futures of these kids?

Isn't the right approach to just let the families make the decision? You have a prominent program. He has a high school program. He is forcing a choice. Let them make it.

I know it's tough but the most honest approach is the free market example. When the high school coach sees five talented ball players not show up....he will change his rules. I think you just have to call his bluff.

quote:

Originally posted by Bulldog 19:

quote:

Club season shuts down during the high school season and picks up in November when the girls are done with their high school season and I don't really hear too many issues like I do with mainly baseball and kickball.

Volleyball coaches are the same often for high school and club. That's a huge difference right there. I will say it again because I believe it fully. Club sports have RUINED high school sports.



Another example of that for you. Football playoffs start tonight in Illinois. School just north of me lost one of their stud receivers last Saturday after he dislocated and broke his ankle... playing in a baseball showcase game.

Wow and my baseball friends use to give me a hard time for letting my son play football becasue he could get hurt...they said he should not play football and play fall baseball.....you mean you can actually get hurt playing a sport other than football?

quote:

I understand how the high school coach is creating turmoil in your program. I get that. But you are wanting to intervene for what purpose? To preserve your program? Because it's not right - it's a philosophical statement? Because you are emotionally linked to the futures of these kids?

PA Dino,
There isn't just 1 reason why I am concerned, rather several. For example:

(1) I do run my academy as a business. This HS is about 5 miles from our indoor facility and the players at this school are obviously potential customers.

(2) One of the players that gos to this HS has a cousin who played for my academy for 3 years and is now in the major leagues. I am very close with this family and have been for many years.

(3) I have a few friends who have kids that will be going to this HS in a year or 2 and there intentions are play baseball at the HS -AND- play for us. The coaches decisions are causing these families grief as they now must decide to attend a different HS because of the coaches decisions.