Looking for two players (a view on this kind of ad)

Carry 10 only. Make sure most of your team can pitch. Bat all 9 plus an EH. Someone will have a vacation and you'll have to play with 9 and hope that no one gets hurt.

Keep a few players in reserve. Someone will have a younger brother that plays rec during the week but comes to the games on the weekend. Add him to the roster. Someone will have a friend that plays rec and would love to play up a weekend with the travel team. Add that kid if needed.

One weekend, a kid on our team got sick and left us with just 9. That was o.k for our first game of a four game weekend. Then our catcher got spiked in game 2 on Saturday and had to go to the ER for stitches and was out for the rest of the weekend. We played with 8 and just 2 outfielders for the remainder of game 2. On Sunday, one of the younger brothers played to give us 9.

Yeah it was a headache for the coach, but he preferred the risk of having too few as opposed to the grief he got if he had too many.

A buddy of mine, and I, started a 12u-14u travel team.  We paid ALL team fees.  We had a roster of 10.  Player #10 was deeeep off the bench and he knew it.  He, as with everyone else, paid $0. He never started.  We rotated him around.  He batted at #10 always and he usually got 2-3 innings in field per game at most.  Some games 0-innings.  He was clearly a soft spot in our lineup.  We knew it, HE knew it. 

Year 2 (now 13u)  mom of our #10 player began to forget they were playing travel ball for free (as far as any team fees go) and began to carp a little bit when we didn't bring him for a long road trip BIG tournament we wanted to win.  I think we may have brought in a couple of hired guns and left #10 at home ("uninvited"), as we were playing to win.  She got wind and began saying it wasn't fair?  We no longer "invited" him to play with us again.

Gotta say, playing 12-14u travel ball with 10 was tight.  One championship game we only had 9 to begin with, and had to forfeit when my son got KO'd in CF in a collision, and another of our players was ejected for running the other team's catcher and breaking the kid's collar bone.  We only had 9 to start that game.  We played OF with only two OFs when my kid got medically KO'd, then we had to forfeit when other kid got ejected and only had 7 players left. 

Still, 10 was a great #of players for a roster.  Even if it's 10 studs, ALL paying. 

By 14u my buddy and I were bankrupt and could no longer afford to carry the team.  We settled it by having players 1-9 pay $.  Any players after 9, paid $0 and their PT reflected it.  They were "guests" and played minimally for $0.   We gave them "guest" jerseys on loan, players 1-9 paid for their unis.  Again, usually kids we knew were soft spots, and they knew it most importantly, and just appreciated the opportunity to get some PT on the travel ball circuit with a 44-2 team.  

In 9u and 10u I was required to take twelve. The 11u and 12u teams were LL all star prep. It was mostly about playing better teams and learning an all star position. We had fifteen kids. It was a Sunday DH league. I would tell twelve kids to be there for each game. Some kids played both or only one in a given week. Some kids hung out even if they wouldn't be playing. It all netted out to equal playing time. 13u was thirteen kids selected from the entire LL and CR districts. The least talented kid was talented.

I think in travel ball you should give as much playing time as possible to all players.  Be fair and objective in the analysis -- they all do great things and all make mistakes.  As the kids get older and the funnel narrows, the talent disparity is smaller.  So it should make less of a difference who you play. 

I remember our first year at 10u.  We were in a championship game.  One boy, a golden child, was at second base.  He made multiple errors which almost cost us the game.  Another, was eventually not going to be asked back by the head coach.  We were at bat and needed a run to win.  I looked at the lineup and told the kid, it's going to come down to you, so be ready.  Kid hit a single to score the winning run. 

Play them all and have fun. 

Son's team had 10 guys from 9U-12U, 11 kids at 13U.  14U had 13 or 14.  That was too many.   I ran a team when my son was 15 and 16.  We had 11 guys....plus a couple PO's.  Always worked out ok.  We were pretty good, and by that age all the kids know so many players that if we ever needed a player for a day or a weekend, the guys just called someone to fill in. 

Wow, a 9u-13u discussion, right up my alley.

1. The looking for two players could mean the top two left.

2. You can't have only 9 or 10 kids anymore.  Pitchsmart guidelines and the way these youth tourneys are scheduled prohibits it if you have a team that may play all 6 games. (I'd rather my kid sit more than throw 100+ pitches!)

3. The rule of thumb is 12 kids at 9u-12u then add an additional kid every year you go up, so 15u has 15, 16u has 16...etc.

4. It can be hard to find pick up players, MANY teams say "If you are part of this team you will not play pick up for another team"....as it was explained to me by the head of a local park "When we give your kid a weekend off from tourneys that is his weekend to relax his arm, not have to wake up early, catch up on school work and in general it's his weekend to just be a kid.  That is not a weekend to go play for another team and then hide that you already pitched 80 pitches on Sunday when we have you slotted for pitching exercises on Monday."

I really wish there was a different format for these youth tourneys, it causes a LOT of problems with arm over-use by over zealous coaches and parents who WANT that special super duper tourney trophy...at 9u!

CaCO3Girl posted:

Wow, a 9u-13u discussion, right up my alley.

1. The looking for two players could mean the top two left.

2. You can't have only 9 or 10 kids anymore.  Pitchsmart guidelines and the way these youth tourneys are scheduled prohibits it if you have a team that may play all 6 games. (I'd rather my kid sit more than throw 100+ pitches!)

3. The rule of thumb is 12 kids at 9u-12u then add an additional kid every year you go up, so 15u has 15, 16u has 16...etc.

4. It can be hard to find pick up players, MANY teams say "If you are part of this team you will not play pick up for another team"....as it was explained to me by the head of a local park "When we give your kid a weekend off from tourneys that is his weekend to relax his arm, not have to wake up early, catch up on school work and in general it's his weekend to just be a kid.  That is not a weekend to go play for another team and then hide that you already pitched 80 pitches on Sunday when we have you slotted for pitching exercises on Monday."

I really wish there was a different format for these youth tourneys, it causes a LOT of problems with arm over-use by over zealous coaches and parents who WANT that special super duper tourney trophy...at 9u!

What I have noticed is at 15 and above there are more weekday games and less double headers.  We played a lot on wendsday and Thursday.  Sunday was usually the top 8 teams who played three to the championship. 

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

 

By 14u my buddy and I were bankrupt and could no longer afford to carry the team. 

you and your buddy paid for a team for 2 years and then you were bankrupt? if you could only afford 2 years of payment the team was destined to fail. You went 44-2 - congrats I guess some meaningless wins are worth more to some then others.

I have a fair amount of experience being both paid to play when I was younger and also by paying for a few of the boys who couldn't afford to do what we did. It is called sponsoring, it is called paying it back to the game, it is a thing anyone with the means who sees a need should be willing to consider...you don't do it to plant some 13u kid on the bench full time so you can win the     "who care 4th of july tournament" in some town and carry a trophy home!

Old School,

Did not want to bore w details of why buddy and I paid all team expenses for two years.  "Team expenses" being tourney entry fees, which been so long I forget but like $600 per event?  Don't recall?  Reason we just picked up the tab Old School was there were several kids whose family's could not afford to pay to play each weekend and therefore would not be reliable on weekly basis, which we needed them to be.  We didn't go the route of organizing fundraisers as partner and I did not have time to do that too. So we just paid the fees for all. 

I have paid for many kids out of my pocket to play ball and go to camps.  I only have one child and any time I sent him to a camp always paid a 2nd tuition for the scholarship fund for a kid to go who could not afford.  Don't mean to get on my soap box but don't say I did this kid wrong.  No other teams were willing to "invite" him to play with them.  The #10 "role" was a role someone had to play.  Perhaps Like a walk-on player?  I didn't take his money and sit him.....he knew the deal when we invited him along. And  he Got the PT he deserved based on his ability and skill level.  We batted 10 players every game, so he got 2-3 ABs per game, he got 2-3 innings in field every game he was present.  Just occasionally we would not invite him for big tourneys, as we did not want to waste his time, as then he would then be riding pine.  That's when mama bear got upset.   Upset to the point it became a "no good deed goes undone" scenario and we stopped inviting him to be our #10 player.

And as far as winning the trophy?  Yeah, we won plenty of them.  And 90% of the time you know who was the kid always holding the trophy in the center of the team picture?  

#10.

#1, coming from a not so flush background I'm relating to the kid in this post.  I would have been grateful for the chance to play for free, even just being a mostly bench player I would have been grateful....BUT....I would have been very sad and felt like a charity case when I didn't get to go to the big tourneys because I wasn't good enough and I was easily replaced.  There were probably other kids on the team that sat some too and I would have resented that they got to go and I didn't because I was poor and they weren't. You said he would have sat the bench due to skill issues, I would have said going on a trip with a hotel and maybe a pool would have been so exciting, even if I didn't get to play much.

Being the kid who shared an old beater car when she was 16 with my mom and my grandmother because we could barely pay the insurance for three but not buy another car, I have to say that charity with caveats or with strings that highlighted it was charity was charity I tried not to take.

Having a charity spot on the team was a GREAT idea, but if he was easily left behind he wasn't really part of the team, and I'm sure he remembered that.  

To be clear,  this kid was not one of the financial charity cases on the team.  He came from means.  I completely understand how mean spirited it might appear if this kid was was one of our families in need.  Trust me, he was not. 

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

To be clear,  this kid was not one of the financial charity cases on the team.  He came from means.  I completely understand how mean spirited it might appear if this kid was was one of our families in need.  Trust me, he was not. 

Well that does make me feel worlds better, but, still hate to leave any member of the team behind :- (

College sports teams do it all the time.  Just because you make the 35-man roster does not mean you are going to travel to sunny, beautiful Palo Alto, Ca. for the season opener.  I know a kid who plays football at Big State, for example.  He literally plays AT Big State, no where else, has yet to make the travel roster.  So, Let's just say this player did not make the "travel roster" for our big tourneys.  Happens all the time.  He still was a member of the team for as long as it was a mutually beneficial relationship.  And I do believe this young man had a good situation with us.  Not a financial charity case in any way.  But perhaps may have actually been  a "behavioral case?"

For The Record:  The young man in question (our #10 player 12u-14u travel team), ended up playing JV baseball in our 3A HS freshman and sophomore years, then finally made Varsity as a Jr.  Never saw the field.  Ended up being kicked off the team before season was over for not one, but two alcohol related offenses.  2nd offense came during team's overnight Easter break tournament 3 hours away.   Lucky he did not hurt himself or any one else during said offenses.  So in retrospect, maybe we knew this kid needed baseball more than it needed him, but my coaching partner and I gave him a chance.  Even if it was a chance with strings attached.  We still gave him an opportunity.  I'll never regret nor apologize for that, nor apologize for the "strings" we attached to our generosity. 

RJM posted:

When my son was younger (9u to 13u) and reading where these ads would be placed I saw many of them. Here's my translation ... We have eleven players. We play nine. We need eleven to pay the bills. Two kids got pissed of and left because they played little. We need to find two more suckers with delusions of grandeur. 

The same teams run the same ad year after year replacing the two kids who hardly played. I've heard a kid has to earn his playing time. But what kid wants to commit his summer to a team where dad pays big bucks and the kid watches from the bench? These tend to be teams all about winning. They tend not to be about quality instruction.

When I coached these age groups everyone played. The 9u and 10u teams were community kids. They were league all stars. They played at least half the time in five tournaments. In 11u and 12u the concurrent with the LL season travel team was sorting out LL all stars and prepping them for the tournament. It was equal playing time until all stars.

In 13u I put together my first no geographic boundaries travel team. Everyone was talented. Positions were earned. Getting more playing time was earned. But everyone played at least 60% of the time. In any given pool game I felt I could pull the lineup out if a hat and compete.

Back in rec ball CR played CBO. A player had to be in the field at least every other inning. In LL we played 2/1 MPT. I played everyone at least three innings. 

Giving kids reasonable playing time never affected winning in rec or travel. My feeling was kids who knew they would get in the game practiced and played harder. In travel I did have the power to sit players for discipline and lack of hustle (rarely occurred). What is your feeling on playing time?

 

Now, can we get back to the OP???

Sure hope having one too many free weekends at an impressionable age dind't lead to the problem of the devils brew.

#1 Assistant Coach posted:

A buddy of mine, and I, started a 12u-14u travel team.  We paid ALL team fees.  We had a roster of 10.  Player #10 was deeeep off the bench and he knew it.  He, as with everyone else, paid $0. He never started.  We rotated him around.  He batted at #10 always and he usually got 2-3 innings in field per game at most.  Some games 0-innings.  He was clearly a soft spot in our lineup.  We knew it, HE knew it. 

Year 2 (now 13u)  mom of our #10 player began to forget they were playing travel ball for free (as far as any team fees go) and began to carp a little bit when we didn't bring him for a long road trip BIG tournament we wanted to win.  I think we may have brought in a couple of hired guns and left #10 at home ("uninvited"), as we were playing to win.  She got wind and began saying it wasn't fair?  We no longer "invited" him to play with us again.

Gotta say, playing 12-14u travel ball with 10 was tight.  One championship game we only had 9 to begin with, and had to forfeit when my son got KO'd in CF in a collision, and another of our players was ejected for running the other team's catcher and breaking the kid's collar bone.  We only had 9 to start that game.  We played OF with only two OFs when my kid got medically KO'd, then we had to forfeit when other kid got ejected and only had 7 players left. 

Still, 10 was a great #of players for a roster.  Even if it's 10 studs, ALL paying. 

By 14u my buddy and I were bankrupt and could no longer afford to carry the team.  We settled it by having players 1-9 pay $.  Any players after 9, paid $0 and their PT reflected it.  They were "guests" and played minimally for $0.   We gave them "guest" jerseys on loan, players 1-9 paid for their unis.  Again, usually kids we knew were soft spots, and they knew it most importantly, and just appreciated the opportunity to get some PT on the travel ball circuit with a 44-2 team.  

This has to be a parody post...... Right. Such a great coach, outfielders don't communicate and one gets a concussion, thanks for the permanent brain injury coach, another gets ejected for hurting another player. I wouldn't let my kid play for you for free. 

I've seen your type around the ball fields for years, while not as bad as football parents who cheer after a kid is laid out, you're still a piece of work.

Parody it is not. 

Just trying to share my experience with coaching/managing a 12u thru 14u travel team and my experience with roster #s. In no way was I ever celebrating player injuries?  Not sure where you even got that notion from?  Just was an example of the risks of playing with a bare minimum roster number, like 10, which can very quickly become 9..........then 8..............then another inning later 7.  Which resulted in us having to forfeit.

RJM posted:

When my son was younger (9u to 13u) and reading where these ads would be placed I saw many of them. Here's my translation ... We have eleven players. We play nine. We need eleven to pay the bills. Two kids got pissed of and left because they played little. We need to find two more suckers with delusions of grandeur. 

The same teams run the same ad year after year replacing the two kids who hardly played. I've heard a kid has to earn his playing time. But what kid wants to commit his summer to a team where dad pays big bucks and the kid watches from the bench? These tend to be teams all about winning. They tend not to be about quality instruction.

When I coached these age groups everyone played. The 9u and 10u teams were community kids. They were league all stars. They played at least half the time in five tournaments. In 11u and 12u the concurrent with the LL season travel team was sorting out LL all stars and prepping them for the tournament. It was equal playing time until all stars.

In 13u I put together my first no geographic boundaries travel team. Everyone was talented. Positions were earned. Getting more playing time was earned. But everyone played at least 60% of the time. In any given pool game I felt I could pull the lineup out if a hat and compete.

Back in rec ball CR played CBO. A player had to be in the field at least every other inning. In LL we played 2/1 MPT. I played everyone at least three innings. 

Giving kids reasonable playing time never affected winning in rec or travel. My feeling was kids who knew they would get in the game practiced and played harder. In travel I did have the power to sit players for discipline and lack of hustle (rarely occurred). What is your feeling on playing time?

 

When I see those ads, I assume the team is looking to upgrade its roster.

Maybe two kids have left or maybe two kids will be asked to leave if they find two better players.

In my area, it would be much more likely you would attend an "open" tryout and then find out they were only looking for starting pitchers.

From what I saw, the teams that survived year to year were the teams that upgraded their rosters when adding players.  The teams that added to the bottom of their rosters fell apart.

RJM posted:

When my son was younger (9u to 13u) and reading where these ads would be placed I saw many of them. Here's my translation ... We have eleven players. We play nine. We need eleven to pay the bills. Two kids got pissed of and left because they played little. We need to find two more suckers with delusions of grandeur. 

The same teams run the same ad year after year replacing the two kids who hardly played. I've heard a kid has to earn his playing time. But what kid wants to commit his summer to a team where dad pays big bucks and the kid watches from the bench? These tend to be teams all about winning. They tend not to be about quality instruction.

When I coached these age groups everyone played. The 9u and 10u teams were community kids. They were league all stars. They played at least half the time in five tournaments. In 11u and 12u the concurrent with the LL season travel team was sorting out LL all stars and prepping them for the tournament. It was equal playing time until all stars.

In 13u I put together my first no geographic boundaries travel team. Everyone was talented. Positions were earned. Getting more playing time was earned. But everyone played at least 60% of the time. In any given pool game I felt I could pull the lineup out if a hat and compete.

Back in rec ball CR played CBO. A player had to be in the field at least every other inning. In LL we played 2/1 MPT. I played everyone at least three innings. 

Giving kids reasonable playing time never affected winning in rec or travel. My feeling was kids who knew they would get in the game practiced and played harder. In travel I did have the power to sit players for discipline and lack of hustle (rarely occurred). What is your feeling on playing time?

 

When I see these type ads, it's usually at a younger age and is almost always a dad run team.  Organizations release everyone at the end of a season, then it is open tryouts for the next.  Then the orgs put together the best team(s) out of the kids who tryout.

castaway posted:

RJM posted:

When my son was younger (9u to 13u) and reading where these ads would be placed I saw many of them. Here's my translation ... We have eleven players. We play nine. We need eleven to pay the bills. Two kids got pissed of and left because they played little. We need to find two more suckers with delusions of grandeur. 

The same teams run the same ad year after year replacing the two kids who hardly played. I've heard a kid has to earn his playing time. But what kid wants to commit his summer to a team where dad pays big bucks and the kid watches from the bench? These tend to be teams all about winning. They tend not to be about quality instruction.

When I coached these age groups everyone played. The 9u and 10u teams were community kids. They were league all stars. They played at least half the time in five tournaments. In 11u and 12u the concurrent with the LL season travel team was sorting out LL all stars and prepping them for the tournament. It was equal playing time until all stars.

In 13u I put together my first no geographic boundaries travel team. Everyone was talented. Positions were earned. Getting more playing time was earned. But everyone played at least 60% of the time. In any given pool game I felt I could pull the lineup out if a hat and compete.

Back in rec ball CR played CBO. A player had to be in the field at least every other inning. In LL we played 2/1 MPT. I played everyone at least three innings. 

Giving kids reasonable playing time never affected winning in rec or travel. My feeling was kids who knew they would get in the game practiced and played harder. In travel I did have the power to sit players for discipline and lack of hustle (rarely occurred). What is your feeling on playing time?

 

 

When I see those ads, I assume the team is looking to upgrade its roster.

Maybe two kids have left or maybe two kids will be asked to leave if they find two better players.

In my area, it would be much more likely you would attend an "open" tryout and then find out they were only looking for starting pitchers.

From what I saw, the teams that survived year to year were the teams that upgraded their rosters when adding players.  The teams that added to the bottom of their rosters fell apart.

The well coached non Daddyball ((even if dad is coaching) typically does not have to look for players. The good players come to them. Or they only have to ask a specific player if he wants to be on the team.

That is a true statement RJ. The well coached teams attract the players looking to be well coached. It happens at the HS level as well. I don't care to get into a debate about how that is not fair, etc. But the fact is if a team is well coached people want to be a part of it.

I coached an AAU team 11-12 year olds for 3 years, years ago. I carried 12 players only. I rotated everyone. I rotated positions and batting order. Everyone started everyone didn't start, everyone played, everyone sat. If you hit in the 9 hole in this game and were in the line up the next you didn't hit in the 9 hole the next. You might hit in the lead off or 3 hole, etc. The only exceptions for this was if a player was disciplined for a poor attitude. But I can't remember that happening.

I never allowed a player to be replaced. We didn't kick people off for upgrades. If a kid decided to move on we replaced them. That was the only way we added a player in those 3 years. Instead of telling parents "We will play the best 9." I told them we are going to play our team. This is about learning the game. Learning how to win. Developing the players and having fun. So if you want your son to play SS hit in the 3 hole and pitch, don't want him to ever sit and can't handle that this is not for you.

We won the State AAU Championship finished in the Top 5 in the AAU Nationals twice and had a lot of fun. Several were drafted. All but 2 played in college. One played college Lacrosse and the other played basketball in HS and didn't play sports in college. My goal was to help develop a love of the game. Hard to do that at 11 and 12 riding the pine. My goal was to help them get a jump on the competition in HS. Hard to do that when they have been playing and you have been sitting. My goal was to develop baseball players not 2 baggers. Hard to do that when the only position you have played is 2b and you get to HS and you have never played another position.

I don't believe youth sports is about sitting on a bench. Unless it's your turn to learn to sit the bench and study the game. I believe youth sports should be about building a fire, teaching the actual game, having fun learning how to compete and what it takes to win. When they get to school ball they can learn about cut's and line up's etc. But too many imo are cut in youth ball. And they don't even know it.

Coach_May posted:

That is a true statement RJ. The well coached teams attract the players looking to be well coached. It happens at the HS level as well. I don't care to get into a debate about how that is not fair, etc. But the fact is if a team is well coached people want to be a part of it.

I coached an AAU team 11-12 year olds for 3 years, years ago. I carried 12 players only. I rotated everyone. I rotated positions and batting order. Everyone started everyone didn't start, everyone played, everyone sat. If you hit in the 9 hole in this game and were in the line up the next you didn't hit in the 9 hole the next. You might hit in the lead off or 3 hole, etc. The only exceptions for this was if a player was disciplined for a poor attitude. But I can't remember that happening.

I never allowed a player to be replaced. We didn't kick people off for upgrades. If a kid decided to move on we replaced them. That was the only way we added a player in those 3 years. Instead of telling parents "We will play the best 9." I told them we are going to play our team. This is about learning the game. Learning how to win. Developing the players and having fun. So if you want your son to play SS hit in the 3 hole and pitch, don't want him to ever sit and can't handle that this is not for you.

We won the State AAU Championship finished in the Top 5 in the AAU Nationals twice and had a lot of fun. Several were drafted. All but 2 played in college. One played college Lacrosse and the other played basketball in HS and didn't play sports in college. My goal was to help develop a love of the game. Hard to do that at 11 and 12 riding the pine. My goal was to help them get a jump on the competition in HS. Hard to do that when they have been playing and you have been sitting. My goal was to develop baseball players not 2 baggers. Hard to do that when the only position you have played is 2b and you get to HS and you have never played another position.

I don't believe youth sports is about sitting on a bench. Unless it's your turn to learn to sit the bench and study the game. I believe youth sports should be about building a fire, teaching the actual game, having fun learning how to compete and what it takes to win. When they get to school ball they can learn about cut's and line up's etc. But too many imo are cut in youth ball. And they don't even know it.

 

Probably one of the greatest posts ever.  Youth coaches should read it and commit it to memory. 

Coach_May posted:

That is a true statement RJ. The well coached teams attract the players looking to be well coached. It happens at the HS level as well. I don't care to get into a debate about how that is not fair, etc. But the fact is if a team is well coached people want to be a part of it.

I coached an AAU team 11-12 year olds for 3 years, years ago. I carried 12 players only. I rotated everyone. I rotated positions and batting order. Everyone started everyone didn't start, everyone played, everyone sat. If you hit in the 9 hole in this game and were in the line up the next you didn't hit in the 9 hole the next. You might hit in the lead off or 3 hole, etc. The only exceptions for this was if a player was disciplined for a poor attitude. But I can't remember that happening.

I never allowed a player to be replaced. We didn't kick people off for upgrades. If a kid decided to move on we replaced them. That was the only way we added a player in those 3 years. Instead of telling parents "We will play the best 9." I told them we are going to play our team. This is about learning the game. Learning how to win. Developing the players and having fun. So if you want your son to play SS hit in the 3 hole and pitch, don't want him to ever sit and can't handle that this is not for you.

We won the State AAU Championship finished in the Top 5 in the AAU Nationals twice and had a lot of fun. Several were drafted. All but 2 played in college. One played college Lacrosse and the other played basketball in HS and didn't play sports in college. My goal was to help develop a love of the game. Hard to do that at 11 and 12 riding the pine. My goal was to help them get a jump on the competition in HS. Hard to do that when they have been playing and you have been sitting. My goal was to develop baseball players not 2 baggers. Hard to do that when the only position you have played is 2b and you get to HS and you have never played another position.

I don't believe youth sports is about sitting on a bench. Unless it's your turn to learn to sit the bench and study the game. I believe youth sports should be about building a fire, teaching the actual game, having fun learning how to compete and what it takes to win. When they get to school ball they can learn about cut's and line up's etc. But too many imo are cut in youth ball. And they don't even know it.

 

This, is what I'm struggling with lately. Kids team would be perfect if it were done this way, but its not. He doesn't play multiple positions and I really wish he did for when HS gets here and that's in one year.

I had 13u, 14u and 16u (kids were 15) teams where I had roster control. The only roster turnover was a handful of leaving the first year. I had more requests to be on the team in 14u than open spots. In 16u I added pitchers.

The kids had primary positions. But they also played others. When they reached high school I wanted the young kid who could hit to be able to play right or left. The juniors and seniors don't hand over their positions.

The smartest thing I did was have my son play whatever position the pitcher came from for three years. He could play two or three positions per game. It didn't stop him from being the shortstop soph year of high school. He moved to center junior year. It didn't stop him from being the center fielder on his 17/18u showcase team. It helped him in college when he played seven positions. His nickname was Zo (after Zobrist).

Teaching kids multiple positions,  making sure everyone on the roster gets meaningful playing time, having a big roster and playing to win don't have to be mutually exclusive.

Pool Play games, blowouts, and games against weak(er) opponents are all opportunities to move players around.  Same thing with scheduling a variety of tournaments and games.   

I agree that Coach May's post was fantastic.   I also agree with RJM that developing a kid to play multiple positions is fantastic.   My 13U son just played in a 14U Tournament this past week (first time on the 60/90 field) and was very much able to play 2B, LF, SS, RF & CF with ease because he's been trained to do so.   I loved that he got so much time in the OF in the Tournament and thanked the coach for that.  Sadly, the coach was surprised that I thanked him regarding that.  I say "sadly" because it seems most parents want their kids to just play the premium positions.   

The kids that play for me learn to embrace learning all of the finer details of being an outfielder.   Taking the correct routes, learning the right footwork and jumps, making the right throws, backing each other up etc etc.  Either that or they don't play.

We had a kid in the same program who was fast and could cover a lot of ground. He always played first base when he was younger. The HS coach saw him as a CF, and he would have been very good there. He would have competed with my son for playing time. The HS coach had him moved up from Freshman to JV to start working on becoming a center fielder. JV coach wanted to win and wanted to start my son in CF, that is where he saw my son playing varsity. I did not care. But this young mans parents got so mad and pestered the JV coach whenever he put there son in CF instead of First base. They thought all the premium players were in the infield. Eventually the JV coach got tired of it and told the head coach he did not want the kid on JV anymore. The kid was moved back down to the Freshman team and he moved back to first base. They tired him at Cf next year on JV, but by that time my son was entrenched on varsity at CF. There was also a new Head coach, He dealt with the kid and his parents for one meeting. Shortly after that the kid retired from baseball. 

The parents did not understand that CF is a premium position. Some parents do not understand that it is best to learn different positions when young. If makes you more useful when you get older. 

(humble brag)..my son threw a 6 inning one hitter yesterday.....Thanks to a CF who turned four hits into outs, three of them would have been extra bases.  Speed, instincts with tremendous breaks on the ball.

BishopLeftiesDad posted:

 

The parents did not understand that CF is a premium position. Some parents do not understand that it is best to learn different positions when young. If makes you more useful when you get older. 

Freshman year my son started at short on JV. He was the heir apparent to short on varsity soph year. Halfway through the season the cf got injured. Balls started going up the gap. My son was moved to center.

The JV coach apologized to me . He explained he would rather see a few balls go through a less skilled shortstop than go up the gap to the fence. I told him he doesn't need to answer to me for his lineup.

One time he turned to me and said, "Your son just made a difficult play look routine. Anyone else would have got a standing ovation for that catch." It was about the jump he got on the ball to make an easy catch. 

My son was the shortstop on varsity the following year. The next year he was moved to center after the previous center fielder graduated. The varsity coach used the same reasoning as the JV coach. Balls that get up the gap are game changers.

Coach_May posted:

That is a true statement RJ. The well coached teams attract the players looking to be well coached. It happens at the HS level as well. I don't care to get into a debate about how that is not fair, etc. But the fact is if a team is well coached people want to be a part of it.

I coached an AAU team 11-12 year olds for 3 years, years ago. I carried 12 players only. I rotated everyone. I rotated positions and batting order. Everyone started everyone didn't start, everyone played, everyone sat. If you hit in the 9 hole in this game and were in the line up the next you didn't hit in the 9 hole the next. You might hit in the lead off or 3 hole, etc. The only exceptions for this was if a player was disciplined for a poor attitude. But I can't remember that happening.

I never allowed a player to be replaced. We didn't kick people off for upgrades. If a kid decided to move on we replaced them. That was the only way we added a player in those 3 years. Instead of telling parents "We will play the best 9." I told them we are going to play our team. This is about learning the game. Learning how to win. Developing the players and having fun. So if you want your son to play SS hit in the 3 hole and pitch, don't want him to ever sit and can't handle that this is not for you.

We won the State AAU Championship finished in the Top 5 in the AAU Nationals twice and had a lot of fun. Several were drafted. All but 2 played in college. One played college Lacrosse and the other played basketball in HS and didn't play sports in college. My goal was to help develop a love of the game. Hard to do that at 11 and 12 riding the pine. My goal was to help them get a jump on the competition in HS. Hard to do that when they have been playing and you have been sitting. My goal was to develop baseball players not 2 baggers. Hard to do that when the only position you have played is 2b and you get to HS and you have never played another position.

I don't believe youth sports is about sitting on a bench. Unless it's your turn to learn to sit the bench and study the game. I believe youth sports should be about building a fire, teaching the actual game, having fun learning how to compete and what it takes to win. When they get to school ball they can learn about cut's and line up's etc. But too many imo are cut in youth ball. And they don't even know it.

 

I know we have golden threads, and some people have called for golden posts; can we have a golden sentence? That last sentence is it for me. 

You coached a team that allowed kids to truck the catcher at 13u?