i'm a highschool sr. and i have had a coach talk to me from a NAIA school. If i decide to go there for a year then transfer to a D-I would i have to be redshirted?
Original Post
Replies sorted oldest to newest
daniel
The worst thing a young man can do is go into a program already thinking about transferring out.
WHY???????
TRhit
The worst thing a young man can do is go into a program already thinking about transferring out.
WHY???????
TRhit
Keep in mind there is a difference between redshirting and losing a year of eligibility
If you think you are going to end up at a Division I program, why don't you begin at a JUCO first instead of an NAIA school. NAIA coaches do not want their programs treated like junior colleges or stepping stones to D-I.
In answer to your question --- you would not "have" to redshirt, if you transferred from an NAIA program to an NCAA DI program. The rules are the same. 5 years to play 4.
It is not common to see players transfer from NAIA to NCAA DI. The primary reason is that the DI schools do not scout the NAIA programs.
You do see some athletes transferring from an NCAA school to an NAIA school. Transfer from NCAA to NAIA allows a player to play the next season. Transfer inside the NCAA can result in loss of one year. Depends on the sport, conference affiliation, etc.
Hope this answers your question.
Bob,
"Doing nothing is still a course of action"
It is not common to see players transfer from NAIA to NCAA DI. The primary reason is that the DI schools do not scout the NAIA programs.
You do see some athletes transferring from an NCAA school to an NAIA school. Transfer from NCAA to NAIA allows a player to play the next season. Transfer inside the NCAA can result in loss of one year. Depends on the sport, conference affiliation, etc.
Hope this answers your question.
Bob,
"Doing nothing is still a course of action"
Iv'e noticed a common theme on this site lately. Kids ask advice about transferring before they are in college and people get upset that they would ever think of doing this.
Everyone talks about keeping your options open, never burning any bridges, getting as much exposure as you can, planning ahead, having a fall back plan, don't eliminate any school until you have check it out and so forth.
I don't know what this young man's plans are, but maybe he has a desire to play Division 1 baseball and isn't getting as much interest as he would like from Division 1 coaches or isn't ready physically or mentally for a higher level or maybe he doesn't have the grades to get into the school he wants yet, maybe his parents cannot finance a D1 school this year. Is going to an NAIA school for a year in the grand scheme of things really different than going to a JUCO or a prep school for a year. Given the fiasco with JUCO credits transferring to NCAA schools with the rule changes, there is a good chance that an NAIA school will offer more classes with better transfer value than a JUCO might, so if your goal was to go somewhere for a year and then transfer, then I would say that an NAIA school might be a better opportunity and a reasonable opportunity.
I have more respect for Daniel recognizing that there are some options and asking for advice, rather than all these kids who simply go off to D1 schools thinking they will be a star and not having a backup plan after they get don't make the team or sit on the bench for a few years. Its' not really my place on the message board to question why someone wants to do something, but to provide him information that will help him make his decision easier.
Everyone talks about keeping your options open, never burning any bridges, getting as much exposure as you can, planning ahead, having a fall back plan, don't eliminate any school until you have check it out and so forth.
I don't know what this young man's plans are, but maybe he has a desire to play Division 1 baseball and isn't getting as much interest as he would like from Division 1 coaches or isn't ready physically or mentally for a higher level or maybe he doesn't have the grades to get into the school he wants yet, maybe his parents cannot finance a D1 school this year. Is going to an NAIA school for a year in the grand scheme of things really different than going to a JUCO or a prep school for a year. Given the fiasco with JUCO credits transferring to NCAA schools with the rule changes, there is a good chance that an NAIA school will offer more classes with better transfer value than a JUCO might, so if your goal was to go somewhere for a year and then transfer, then I would say that an NAIA school might be a better opportunity and a reasonable opportunity.
I have more respect for Daniel recognizing that there are some options and asking for advice, rather than all these kids who simply go off to D1 schools thinking they will be a star and not having a backup plan after they get don't make the team or sit on the bench for a few years. Its' not really my place on the message board to question why someone wants to do something, but to provide him information that will help him make his decision easier.
ghouse
What this young man is seeking is not an option---he is going to commit to a coach who wants him and then bail on him in a year for what he thinks might be greener pastures.
You may not like an approach such as I have taken but better the kid realizes what he is doing then lead him down a rose path.
Perhaps the boy is not Division I caliber --he is apparently not getting Division I offers which has to tell him something.
Another question-- how does he get word to any Division I schools while he is playing his first year of NAIA ball ? Are they going to send scouts to see him?
TRhit
What this young man is seeking is not an option---he is going to commit to a coach who wants him and then bail on him in a year for what he thinks might be greener pastures.
You may not like an approach such as I have taken but better the kid realizes what he is doing then lead him down a rose path.
Perhaps the boy is not Division I caliber --he is apparently not getting Division I offers which has to tell him something.
Another question-- how does he get word to any Division I schools while he is playing his first year of NAIA ball ? Are they going to send scouts to see him?
TRhit
Not an option? Who are you, the counselor for every kids attending college on this board?
You can do anything you want with your life, especially if you are paying for your education. A coach offers you an opportunity to play, you offer the coach your skills and abilities while you are on the team, nothing more nothing less. You are not obligated to stay for 4 years any more than the coach is obligated to play you. College is your time, and while it would be nice to stay at one school for 4 years, it isn't always an option.
I played Division 1 and didn't get division 1 offers! getting offers and being talented are two independent things that don't always coincide.
How do JUCO players get word to division 1 coaches while they are playing JUCO ball?
You think every kid has to attend 10 showcases before someone will want to recruit him or offer him a playing opportunity. There are plenty of ways to show coaches your skills and desires, and playing NAIA ball could be one of them, and there are plenty of walk-on opportunities at every level for kids with the skills and desires to play. It took me 20 minutes at my walk-on tryout to show the coaches I was better than who they had and I started over two other older players on partial scholarships.
You can do anything you want with your life, especially if you are paying for your education. A coach offers you an opportunity to play, you offer the coach your skills and abilities while you are on the team, nothing more nothing less. You are not obligated to stay for 4 years any more than the coach is obligated to play you. College is your time, and while it would be nice to stay at one school for 4 years, it isn't always an option.
I played Division 1 and didn't get division 1 offers! getting offers and being talented are two independent things that don't always coincide.
How do JUCO players get word to division 1 coaches while they are playing JUCO ball?
You think every kid has to attend 10 showcases before someone will want to recruit him or offer him a playing opportunity. There are plenty of ways to show coaches your skills and desires, and playing NAIA ball could be one of them, and there are plenty of walk-on opportunities at every level for kids with the skills and desires to play. It took me 20 minutes at my walk-on tryout to show the coaches I was better than who they had and I started over two other older players on partial scholarships.
Wow, just a bit of a warm response. I took TR to mean that JUCO's plan on a player transferring after two years, by design, and D-1's do scout JUCO's. I'd be very suprised if they scout NAIA, except in a very unusual circumstance, perhaps to see a particular player of whom they were aware,. Hard to date a girl seriously if you already have the next one in sight, and not too nice to girl number 1 either.
Walkons have many times impressed, stuck on a squad and excelled, as has been mentioned many times on this board, just a harder way to start, but not impossible.
Lower the volume on the response a tad, and congatulations to you on making it the hard way.
Walkons have many times impressed, stuck on a squad and excelled, as has been mentioned many times on this board, just a harder way to start, but not impossible.
Lower the volume on the response a tad, and congatulations to you on making it the hard way.
Division I coaches do not 'scout' or 'recruit' players from NAIA teams. The NCAA and NAIA forbid coaches from 'recruiting' from other four-year programs. Division I programs can go on probation, etc., for actively recruiting (calling, emailing, etc.) players from any other D-I, D-II, D-III, or NAIA programs. If a player wants to transfer from one four-year program to another (of any level), the player must make the initial contact and then the coach who is contacted must inform the school that the student-athlete is currently playing for.
I realize that tampering and illegal recruiting goes on, particularly with summer collegiate leagues, etc., but I know over a hundred NAIA coaches, and not one of them would appreciate their players using their program to get noticed by another four-year program.
Students to transfer for various reasons, sometimes valid. But to attend a four-year school and participate in baseball with the intention to leave for a better opportunity later is deceitful. If a kid wants to do that, I can only respect his actions of he is open about his intentions with his coaches.
I realize that tampering and illegal recruiting goes on, particularly with summer collegiate leagues, etc., but I know over a hundred NAIA coaches, and not one of them would appreciate their players using their program to get noticed by another four-year program.
Students to transfer for various reasons, sometimes valid. But to attend a four-year school and participate in baseball with the intention to leave for a better opportunity later is deceitful. If a kid wants to do that, I can only respect his actions of he is open about his intentions with his coaches.
ghouse
For your information many kids in JUCOS are there as draft and follows or have been directed there by Division I and II coaches so as to get the grades up and then move on to NCAA baseball
I am well aware of your dislike for me but last I looked I was able to offer my opinions based on my experience just as you can offer yours based on whatever your experience is.
Also a tip for you-- don't try to read more into my posts than is meant to be--
TRhit
For your information many kids in JUCOS are there as draft and follows or have been directed there by Division I and II coaches so as to get the grades up and then move on to NCAA baseball
I am well aware of your dislike for me but last I looked I was able to offer my opinions based on my experience just as you can offer yours based on whatever your experience is.
Also a tip for you-- don't try to read more into my posts than is meant to be--
TRhit
It seems that many D1 programs are relying on JUCOS more and more to supply mature players for their programs. Many people are suspect of the education provided academically by many of these Jr. Colleges . So you are suggesting if a good student/player is not ready for a D1 and is thinking about a D2,3 or NAIA with good academics that would not compromise his academics , he should feel obligated to that school for 4 years .In other words, D1 now or JUCO only to play D1.This is an interesting dilemma for a lot of good players.
All this is assuming the NAIA coach who recruits you is a great guy. What happens if he isn't, are you obligated to stay for 4 years and play for a jerk?
Well ghouse, I will assume when I meet you that you are a great guy, so why wouldn't I assume that about a baseball coach? I suppose if we take the other approach (i.e., assuming the coach is a jerk) then kids might want to transfer immediately.
It seems you are now grasping at straws to validate the idea of transferring from one four-year school to another. We all realize that circumstances may dictate that transferring would be beneficial, but planning to use an NAIA program as a steppingstone to Division I is not a great idea.
It seems you are now grasping at straws to validate the idea of transferring from one four-year school to another. We all realize that circumstances may dictate that transferring would be beneficial, but planning to use an NAIA program as a steppingstone to Division I is not a great idea.
Grateful
If a kid goes to a really good baseball program (D1 or not!) and doesn't play and doesn't forsee any increased playing time and wants to transfer so he has a better "opportunity" to play at another school, no one would say that was wrong. Your position seems to be that, a player should stay for 4 years because the coach was nice when he recruited him?
Because a company hires me, does this mean I shouldn't find the best career opportunity for me and possibly consider a position at another company?? Have you worked at the same job since high school?
This is why the National Letter of Intent is for one year only, not four! Coaches change, kids change, progams change and you need to do whats best for you.
Do you see coaches honoring the contracts they sign when they leave for another school for more money, no, they say, "I enjoyed my time here, but (new school) is a tremendous opportunity"
I never advocated using NAIA as a "stepping stone" I only advocated that you need to consider your options, and ultimately do whats best for your future and find the best "opportunity"
If a kid goes to a really good baseball program (D1 or not!) and doesn't play and doesn't forsee any increased playing time and wants to transfer so he has a better "opportunity" to play at another school, no one would say that was wrong. Your position seems to be that, a player should stay for 4 years because the coach was nice when he recruited him?
Because a company hires me, does this mean I shouldn't find the best career opportunity for me and possibly consider a position at another company?? Have you worked at the same job since high school?
This is why the National Letter of Intent is for one year only, not four! Coaches change, kids change, progams change and you need to do whats best for you.
Do you see coaches honoring the contracts they sign when they leave for another school for more money, no, they say, "I enjoyed my time here, but (new school) is a tremendous opportunity"
I never advocated using NAIA as a "stepping stone" I only advocated that you need to consider your options, and ultimately do whats best for your future and find the best "opportunity"
To be blunt, JUCO is a much better option to get to D-1. There are poor academic JC's no doubt, there are poor academic schools at every level. Do you homework on the JC that you are interested in and go there. Work hard, get better and D-1 schools will see you and hear about you. The NAIA has some serious academic issues as well and a lot of D-1 "kickbacks" who couldn't cut it either academically or socially (ie. kicked off D-1 teams). Do your homework on whatever schools are recruiting you, that is your responsibility.
ghouse
Using your own example: if you took a job WITH EVERY INTENTION OF LEAVING AFTER ONE YEAR do you really believe your boss is going to give you any where near the same opportunities he would if he thought you went there planning to stay?
Of course not. You would not be given any more than the minimal training etc. as the boss would not want to waste any more money on you than necessary. I would imagine a coach would put a bit more investment in a player not PLANNING to leave as well.
There is a world of difference between leaving a place (whether school or a job) that did not work out after giving it a fair chance and planning on leaving before you even walk in the door.
These decisions need to be made with a little more knowledge than just - hey I can do it if I want to. These folks are giving this young man some good information, I hope he listens to them.
Using your own example: if you took a job WITH EVERY INTENTION OF LEAVING AFTER ONE YEAR do you really believe your boss is going to give you any where near the same opportunities he would if he thought you went there planning to stay?
Of course not. You would not be given any more than the minimal training etc. as the boss would not want to waste any more money on you than necessary. I would imagine a coach would put a bit more investment in a player not PLANNING to leave as well.
There is a world of difference between leaving a place (whether school or a job) that did not work out after giving it a fair chance and planning on leaving before you even walk in the door.
These decisions need to be made with a little more knowledge than just - hey I can do it if I want to. These folks are giving this young man some good information, I hope he listens to them.
ghouse wrote:
That is not what I said; this is what I said: "We all realize that circumstances may dictate that transferring would be beneficial..." By the way, I stayed at my last job for sixteen years!
MTW.....you write that "The NAIA has some serious academic issues as well..." and referred to guys "who couldn't cut it academically or socially (ie. kicked off D-I teams)." You really shouldn't be critical of the NAIA in that way. When I was an NAIA head coach, we had a player who WE kicked off the team and had social difficulties and he went and transferred to and played baseball at an NCAA D-I school. It goes both ways so please don't knock the NAIA when you don't have the big picture.
quote:
Your position seems to be that, a player should stay for 4 years because the coach was nice when he recruited him?
That is not what I said; this is what I said: "We all realize that circumstances may dictate that transferring would be beneficial..." By the way, I stayed at my last job for sixteen years!
MTW.....you write that "The NAIA has some serious academic issues as well..." and referred to guys "who couldn't cut it academically or socially (ie. kicked off D-I teams)." You really shouldn't be critical of the NAIA in that way. When I was an NAIA head coach, we had a player who WE kicked off the team and had social difficulties and he went and transferred to and played baseball at an NCAA D-I school. It goes both ways so please don't knock the NAIA when you don't have the big picture.
The NAIA institution that my son is going to next year had academic standards that were higher than a lot of D-1 schools.
MTW
are you referring to a specific NAIA or just those schools in general? there's a very good NAIA in Lubbock with a good baseball program and very good academics...just curious as to where you got your info/impressions of NAIA
are you referring to a specific NAIA or just those schools in general? there's a very good NAIA in Lubbock with a good baseball program and very good academics...just curious as to where you got your info/impressions of NAIA
My point was to paint any entire group of schools with a broad brush is not fair. There are some lousy NAIA schools academically as there are some good ones. Just as there are some good JUCO's academically and some bad ones. You need to look into each school specifically. The second point I was making was there are guys who go from Division 1 to NAIA due to a variety of reasons more often than the other way around.
well thanks for the info. But The NAIA school i'm talking about isn't my first choice its just an option that i'm looking into. But i mean Who isn't going to try to play at the highest level they can. I'm going to work my tail off if i do go to this NAIA school so i can get better and go to a Divison I. I mean i'm sorry if i hurt anybodys feelings for transfering but i have to do whats best for me.
daniel
I dont think you have hurt anyoners feelings but if you do end up at the NAIA and the coaches or players get wind of your looking to transfer after one year, you could well ride the pines for a year and ruin your D-1 chances.
Even worse they could get wind of it before you get there and they could pull their offer to you.
Never forget that the baseball world is a very small circle and word gets around-- if you have posted your feelings here it is possible you mentioned your feelings to others
Good luck in making your choice but just be careful how you approach the situation.
TRhit
I dont think you have hurt anyoners feelings but if you do end up at the NAIA and the coaches or players get wind of your looking to transfer after one year, you could well ride the pines for a year and ruin your D-1 chances.
Even worse they could get wind of it before you get there and they could pull their offer to you.
Never forget that the baseball world is a very small circle and word gets around-- if you have posted your feelings here it is possible you mentioned your feelings to others
Good luck in making your choice but just be careful how you approach the situation.
TRhit
I'll never forget what my son's future coach told him during a recruiting visit this summer. He said to be careful what you tell other coaches during the recruiting process. "We sometimes talk with each other about area recruits," he said. He said that he knew of two players in the previous year's recruiting class who had been black-balled by area coaches because they were caught "talking behind the coach's back."
Playing for a college and coach is a privilege, not a right.
Playing for a college and coach is a privilege, not a right.
For starters, it's impossible to pigeonhole NAIA schools as to academic quality. In fact, many NAIA schools are some of the finest academic colleges in the country.
It looks to me like Mr. House is merely stating the obvious.....that player transfer in college baseball is fairly common, and transferring from NAIA to D1 is possible and not necessarily deceitful. Logistically, as others have pointed out, it is a very rocky road.
Having said that, I too have problems with anyone who enters a program with the thought of transferring before he even gets there.
I'd also like to point out that many D1 baseball programs want no part of the NAIA teams on the field.
Teams like Lewis-Clark, Oklahoma City U., Biola et. al. can flat out spank the majority of D1 teams in the NCAA.
It looks to me like Mr. House is merely stating the obvious.....that player transfer in college baseball is fairly common, and transferring from NAIA to D1 is possible and not necessarily deceitful. Logistically, as others have pointed out, it is a very rocky road.
Having said that, I too have problems with anyone who enters a program with the thought of transferring before he even gets there.
I'd also like to point out that many D1 baseball programs want no part of the NAIA teams on the field.
Teams like Lewis-Clark, Oklahoma City U., Biola et. al. can flat out spank the majority of D1 teams in the NCAA.