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Showing emotion on the field

justbaseballjustbaseball10,000+ posts
A few days ago Giants rookie pitcher Tim Lincecum took a shutout into the 8th inning against the Cubs. He preserved his shutout through 8 by strking out Daryle Ward to end the inning having allowed just 2 hits and 1 walk at that point. As he struck out Ward, Lincecum pumped his fist into the air on his way to the dugout.

He was working his finest game yet as a pro just days after the death of his grandfather who was apparently close to him.

The next day, the paper described how some of the Cubs players were upset, inflamed, offended by his show of emotion. They said it spurred them on in the 9th where they chased him after 3 consecutive hits to open the 9th and ultimately cost him the game. Cubs Manager Lou Piniella said it should not have bothered anyone...that he was throwing well and was just excited.

But I've heard this countless times before. Players shouldn't show emotion on the field...not after a strikeout, not after a home run.

Fundamentally I guess I tend to agree with that. But not exclusively.

I think if a player gets excited for a moment and pumps his fist or jumps happily after a home run...yet does not direct it at the opposing hitter or pitcher...I think its fine. Actually I enjoy seeing it. I like the "joy of victory" on an athlete's face...even if only for a small moment. Athletes should not be robots. JMO.

Thoughts?
Last edited {1}
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O Orlando1,000+ posts
I agree, to an extent. Showing emotion is a subjective read; what's touching on 'our' team can be seen as showing up on 'theirs', alas.

I imagine the fact that he is a rookie is probably also part of the complaint (as a Cards fan I'm struggling to not do ten minutes on Traditional Cub Whining here Wink) Rooks are expected to keep their head down and do their job....even though they might be just the ones who feel like celebrating the most!
EH Emanski's Heroes1,000+ posts
It is still a game, regardless of the money, drugs, personalities, etc., involved, and I don't see anything wrong with a player having some fun while playing the game. Getting excited and showing some emotion is natural. It can cross the line, but you can generally tell when someone is reacting joyfully and when someone is showing up an opponent. This sounds like an innocent reaction at an emotional time for Lincecum.
PopTimePopTime500+ posts
Remember Hall of Famer Dennis Eckersley? Gosh he used to pump his fist, jump up and down, even yell things at the batter as the batter made the long walk back to the dugout. I'm sure the players didn't like it but, Kirk Gibson not withstanding, most of the time he got you out! I think, in this day and age in particular, it's fair for a pitcher to act that way as long as batters like Bonds, Big Papi, A-Rod insist on styling, and standing at home plate watching/admiring the ball as it leaves the park.
M micmeister500+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by CoachB25:
quote:
Originally posted by TripleDad:
Though I would advise a pitcher to try to contain his emotions until the last pitch.


So the cubbies decided that since L pumped that instead of playing 80% their going to give it
100% cuz their mad!! lol


NOW THIS IS A CLASSIC POST!




I had the same exact thought! Lou gets tossed, they go on a win streak, Lincecum pumps his fist and they decide to give 100%. No wonder they are perpetual losers. They have no heart! And I'm a Cubs fan!!!
Bulldog 19Bulldog 195,000+ posts
quote:
Originally posted by PopTime:
Remember Hall of Famer Dennis Eckersley? Gosh he used to pump his fist, jump up and down, even yell things at the batter as the batter made the long walk back to the dugout. I'm sure the players didn't like it but, Kirk Gibson not withstanding, most of the time he got you out! I think, in this day and age in particular, it's fair for a pitcher to act that way as long as batters like Bonds, Big Papi, A-Rod insist on styling, and standing at home plate watching/admiring the ball as it leaves the park.


Agreed. If the batter's allowed to act, IMO, stupid and show off, why can't the pitcher?

Now, really I see no problem with showing emotion, but it shouldn't be intended to show up someone.
W Will1,000+ posts
The game is played differently and those who play it are different. Back when guys did not flip the bat and stare at their home runs because they knew that the next time up they would get flipped. I think it is a social thing with sports when I coached I never wanted my players to do anything to show up the other team. Taunting etc.

Now everybody high fives. football players do dances in the end zone after scoring.Just the mindset

do doctors do a dance and high five each other after performing a successful surgery. Just a thought
TPMTPMHSBaseballweb Member since 2003
JBB,
Good topic.

I was reading a college baseball board one day when I came across a post about my son. Someone at one game made mention of when my son came off and pumped his fist. It was our biggest rival, so at the time I didn't pay attention to it as being a sore loser (we won).
One of my son's biggest problems pointed out to him by scouts was that he wears his emotions for all to see, that is apart of his personality he needed to change. This year he made that adjustment, no emotion, good or bad, high 5's acceptable only until after the game and things turned around for him.

The game of baseball is about humility. You can be up one game and way down the next. I think fist pumping is perceived as showing up the other team and players don't like that. I have heard people say this is your job, you should show the same emotion in good games and bad games and leave out the fist pumping.

Is one fist pump more acceptable than another?

I think a lot has to do with the fact that this is a very young pitcher, who has been successful in his first year in MLB and may not be showing the humility that has to be shown by rookies. I suppose he has to pass the "is he for real" test first.

Strange set of "unwritten rules" in this game of baseball. Eek
B brod100+ posts
A strikeout in the 8th to end the inning with men on in a 1-0 game after your grandfather died in your first year of MLB could logically warrant a fist pump by a young pitcher. But, I agree with TigerPawMom that it is BECAUSE he is a rookie he should have left it alone. "Showing up" the other team is something to keep away from at all levels if baseball. That is why it is so unusual when it does happen. My son and I were watching the game when it happened and we both had the same reaction - "Uh-oh - he shouldn't have done that"
S spizzlepop1,000+ posts
The late Bill Walsh used to preach to the 49ers about playing "nameless, faceless opponents." This strategy was effective in keeping his team business like and free of personal baggage when performing their craft on the field. The great Yankee teams of the 40s and 50s were also commonly described as being business-like and outwardly dispassionate while beating their opponents brains in.

Times have changed, and our entertainment values have changed as well. Fans demand to see flair and demonstrative passion on the field. It sells.

The fist pump is not a strategy, but rather a reaction to your own performance. It's personal. Is it effective to have such a reaction? Walsh would probably say no, it didn't really help Eckersley in '88, when Kirk Gibson got the last laugh pump. It's obvious now that it didn't help Lincicum get through the 9th inning against the Cubs either.

Tim Lincicum surely learned something that day. If nothing else, I'd bet he learned to let sleeping dogs lie. He'll have plenty more opportunities to express his emotion down the road. I hope he does it often, after the last out is recorded.

BTW- Do the Cubbies lose Karma points on this one for feigning anger?
Last edited by spizzlepop
TRhitTRhit10,000+ posts
I like emotion one the field from our players---I am not concderned about the opposition being upset because our guys are "pumped"and they never do "in their face" BUT they never get emotional with the umpires---that is the coaches job


Being Italian I think emotion is great---it is the person--why bottle it up ?
06catcherdad06catcherdad1,000+ posts
I didn't think there was anything wrong with the way Lincecum handled himself that night. I didn't perceive his emotion to be aimed toward the Cubs at all, rather he was riding emotion at how strong he finished the inning, the deepest he's gone yet as a big leaguer.

In the 9th, he left a few pitches up, location mistakes, and they got banged. I don't attribute that to the Cubs suddenly focusing more at all, they didn't suddenly decide to dial it up, they were going full throttle the whole time. Lincecum simply failed to finish what he's created, and that'll happen to him again and probably not too far in the future.

I have to say, at this point, it looks like the Giants may have gotten the steal of the 2006 draft. He's pretty incredible so far.
mythreesonsmythreesons500+ posts
There's a radio ad running right now in Chicago, with Derek Lee talking about how much he enjoys playing with Carlos Zambrano. It's all about the emotion that Zambrano brings to the game, how he gets really excited when things are going good and really aggravated when things are going bad and how that carries to the rest of the team. So it's ironic that it would be Cub's players who were annoyed by a show of emotion from Lincecum.

We've always taught our own boys that you don't want to let the negative stuff hang out there for the other team to see - you don't want them to think they're getting to you. And you certainly don't want to be in their face when things are going your way... but a smile on your face or showing some excitement is a good thing. And, hey, if the opponent uses your reaction to light a fire under themselves, then good for them - it goes both ways.
coach2709coach270910,000+ posts
I don't think there really is a completely true answer - with one exception which I will explain later.

You have people who are emotional and have a hard time "bottling it up".

You have people who are "business like" in everything they do.

Neither one is right nor wrong - that is who that person is and that is how they act.

The things I see which could be a problem is when you do show emotion which does taunt the opponent. That is wrong. Celebrate what you and your teammates do but don't celebrate the opponent failing. That is bad karma - like putting the helmets up in the bottom of the last inning and you have a 3 run lead. You will lose that game.

Also, I hope the celebrattions don't become what they are in the NFL and NBA. The last man on the team celebrates throwing away the papercup when he drinks water on the bench. I would hate to see a shortstop start jumping up and down running around the infield high fiving all the IF when he gets a two hopper, waist high and throws the runner out by 10 steps.

I would puke and drive to the game to punch him in the face if someone ever did that.

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