Son shouldn't pass up this opportunity right?

A lot of folks will tell you to let the kid make his own decision. I think that's a bunch of crap. You have earned your title (parent) and if you know what is best for him you should tell him what you think and nudge him in the right direction. If he is a competitive player and baseball is something he wants to do this sounds like a great opportunity.

I don't have ton to add, but what I do may be impactful.  Does your son "project"? Is he tall and have a good "frame"?  These guys all think 3-5+ years down the road.  A pro scout told my son and his team once.  The difference between me and a college coach is this:  I get to think about what you might be in 5-10 years; a college coach has to focus only on the next 4.  I underestimated my sons abilities/projections.  It wasn't until PG saw him and then some high end travel programs started calling and then his fastball jumped, D1s started recruited, etc.  It happened fairly quickly and was a bit of surprise.  He has an ideal frame (6', 3", 210 with thin waist, broad shoulders) and projects for much more which is why I asked my original question.  Bottom line:  yes, I think the college courses can wait and you shouldn't pass up this opportunity.  Have him read some advanced books while on the road, or get online and do some courses (Khan Academy?).  Last summer, my son (a high academic as well), spent umpteen hours sitting in hotel rooms preparing online for his SAT.  Where there is a will, there is a way.  Good luck and congrats.

As another posted. Your son is probably looking to you for guidance. If he's on the fence, you should help him get off one way or another. If you are on the fence, he will likely be as well. I'd say that unless the situation/opportunity is (at least likely) transformative, stick to the original plan and there will be other opportunities. If you feel it is. Go for it. Best of luck regardless.

I think you are asking him the wrong questions....for a cerebral kid like that I would look into what doors baseball can open for him academically.  He needs a plan, and then he has to take steps to accomplish that plan.  If he is analytical, like I suspect he is, he will need to decide if he can accomplish his academic goals without baseball, then calculate if the odds improve WITH baseball in the picture.

 

For example, if he wants to go to Yale (or other ivy school), everyone that applies will pretty much have a 4.0+ and extra curriculars...but baseball WILL set him apart in the application process, and that has a lot of value for his future goals. 

If he decides that baseball can help open up doors for him that might otherwise be only a "maybe" then it would be foolish of him not to get as much experience as he possibly can, like on this scouting team.  But bottom line, if he truly doesn't see baseball as a door opener for him then taking away his summer plans might just kill his love of the game.  Yes you are the parent, but really HE has to decide what HIS goals are outside of baseball.

College courses and work will always be there.  This baseball opportunity is will not.  Take the baseball opportunity and see what happens.  Good luck. 

 

So I guess Dustin Pedroia wouldn't have made it as far as he did with your "projections".  Heart and skill trumps most.

A bit torn on this issue.  The baseball dad in me says it is a no brainer but then there is that realistic practical dad who says that like most questions in life the answer is "It depends".  There are a couple of things in your original post that I would think about.  First he missed last spring due to injury (even if mechanics changes seemed to have helped), and second he WANTED to take the summer off.  If his dream was to play professional baseball I just have a hard time with the idea that he would be good taking the summer off.  I agree with Bucs about his projection.  As a 2017, pro scouts are normally looking at players who will forgo college and project into the pro's. The current PG top velocity for a 2017 is 90 and there are a bunch in the high 80's so it doesn't seem that he would be setting a scouts hair on fire as a pitcher particularly a RHP.  If he is valued as a catcher than I really think you have to LOVE that position and have a special set of skills that normal people just don't possess (My apologies to all catchers if you think I am calling you crazy) His hitting sounds amazing so maybe there is something particular that the scout is seeing.  So the question is what is in the best long term interest of your son.  If the classes he wants to take really won't impact his ability to get into the college program of his choice then I think maybe it is a no brainer.  If those classes will make the difference between being accepted by the top college in his field and a good college then there are things to think about.  I also agree with Caco3 Girl.  It could be that the baseball opportunity is a means to an end and is the perfect chance.  Overall you should have a very strong position just make sure you are looking at the entire picture.

Silly and "cheap shot" comment that smacks of bitterness...both of which we try to avoid here at HSBW.  I only conveyed what I've heard from scouts and shared our experience; wasn't making things up. Was trying to help the OP understand why a pro scout might be showing interest in his son when he himself is not sure of his talent level.  Of course, there are exceptions and of course heart and skill trumps most if not all.  Thanks for stating the obvious in your unnecessary attack. Didn't think it was necessary to point out that "those kids who do project must have the heart and skill to be noticed and advance."  But, for you, I just did.  Also, is Pedroia a pitcher?  Didn't t think so.

Does your son understand the role baseball could play in his admittance to a high academic college?

 

Those scouts could be great contacts, but if he isn't interested in playing college ball, this opportunity may not be of great valuable to him. The fact that he had decided not to play this summer might indicate that he isn't passionate about baseball.

"not completely sure he wants to play baseball in college."

 

This was the most important phrase in your post.

 

What I think the proper role of a parent is in this situation, is to emphasize to your son that the time has come to make some decisions.  Hopefully this is something you have trained him to do as he has matured.  We all have to make life decisions at different points in our lives.  For him, now is one of those times, and he needs to embrace that fact (as opposed to making excuses for not deciding).

 

I don't think you offer your opinion as to what he should do unless he asks you to, and if he does, you take pains to put yourself in his shoes, and not to push him in the direction you want just because you may enjoy the helicoptery aspects of parenting.  Give any advice based on what you think would be best for your son given his preferences, his skill sets, and his desires for college and for life beyond college.

 

The reality is that no matter how talented he may be, if he doesn't want this for his life, pushing him there is a great way to miss out on the other opportunities he may have preferred and benefited more from.  Because if he pursues collegiate baseball, baseball will be the primary focus of his life for the next 6 years at least.  For a lot of us, we can imagine nothing better than that.  But not everyone feels that way, and if your son is one who would just as soon use those years preparing for something else, that is worthy of your respect.

 

P.S.  If someone told you your son had an OBP of .800, that someone does not know how to calculate OBP per the rules governing official statistics.  I once saw someone who gave an outlandish OBP number, only to discover that they gave credit when the kid reached on hitting into a force out, when the kid reached via error, etc.  I suspect something similar is going on in your case.  Either that or Ricky Henderson's records are in jeopardy.

 

 

No one can tell you what to do.  However if I'm reading your comments correctly, it doesn't appear that your son is in love with the game.  The love of the game, the competition, the time and work that it takes, these are the things it takes to reach anywhere near his potential.

 

Some survive just because they are so obviously talented.  Most make it because of dedication and persistence.  So strictly from a scouting perspective, I'm not sure your son would be a high priority... Unless he had rare talent. Wanting to take the summer off is not something I would expect to hear from someone that had the necessary desire.

 

Besides, there sure isn't anything wrong with what he wants to do.  For most all, academics becomes much more important than baseball and more rewarding. 

 

Kid doesn't want to play?  Should you force him or nudge him?  Not the gospel, but I say no!  If he loves a certain girl and you want him to love a different girl, how will that work out?  People tend to be best at the things they love doing.  Sounds like your son likes academics more than baseball.  Nothing at all wrong with that!

 

I have grandchildren that love swimming.  I hate swimming!  I wish they would play baseball.  I love baseball!  They are very good swimmers and when I can, I go to swimming meets, which I hate! One of them is a DI swimmer on scholarship.

---

"not completely sure he wants to play baseball in college."

 

This was the most important phrase in your post.

 

---

 

I disagree.

 

My son is also not sure he wants to play on college. But he's a 2017 who doesn't yet have a clue about where he wants to study, how hard he wants to study, and what he wants to study. 

 

But he loves playing baseball now, and if this sort of opportunity came along for a summer team, he'd be all over it, no doubt about it. There's a big difference between playing a lot of baseball during summer vacation, and playing a lot of baseball while also going to college.

 

And he also recognizes, as has been mentioned, that baseball could open some colleges up for him that he otherwise would not qualify for.  It sounds like this team could really expedite that for your son, assuming he gets playing time.

"helicoptery aspects of parenting"

 

Love it.

+1.  Well said, JCG.  He may have a completely different outlook after spending a summer with some top notch coaches/scouts who help him see his potential and develop his skill set.  He may think today that he is unsure if he wants to play in college, and he may think the same come September after a summer of very serious, competitive travel ball.  But, on the other hand....Combined with how baseball could help him achieve his academic goals, you never know where it could lead.  It is fact that most very high academic schools (Ivy for sure) turn down anywhere from 2 to 4x the number of students as they admit each year that are as qualified as the students they do accept.  In other words, they could bring in 3 to 5x the number of students that they accept without giving an inch on quality standards.  It becomes a total crap shoot.  Having the baseball coach at one of these schools identify him as 1 of the 7 or 8 they really want in a given year can change a kids life, whether he aspires to play professional baseball or not.  Now, if he enters summer before his senior year not sure if he wants to play in college, that is different, IMO.

Rob...since I am by you....send info on who and team name.

This is great advice...my daughter was a very gifted swimmer but also a high academic.  Over time it became readily apparent she valued the academic more than the athletic.  Instead of heading to the pool, she studied, she substituted dry-land training with researching and sketching her undergrad, grad, and doctorate way ahead.  Let his actions now help guide you with any advice he may seek out.  If like my daughter, he is substituting the academic prep for his baseball prep those actions are speaking loudly.  My son, the baseball player...well that is a story for another day    

AMEN PG!  I hated those darn swimming meets -- would rather sit and watch paint dry!  Today my daughter is happy and doing well; as a parent can we really ask for anything more.

Recently saw an old quote from John Lennon, that essentially said: "When I was young and in school, they gave me an assignment, asking me to write what I wanted to be when I grow up.  I wrote 'Happy'.  They said I didn't understand the assignment.  I told them they didn't understand life."

 

I'm not the biggest Beatles fan, but that's pretty good stuff.

Normally, I would be against pushing, but this is a unique case. I look at it like this. If you sit by and let him pass up the opportunity, how do you think he will look back on this ten years from now? You know him better than us. Do you think a more mature RobT, Jr. will feel like he mssed nothing or will he be thinking "why didn't you make me do it, Dad? I know I've looked back at a few things and wondered why may parents didn't push me more in the direction of my skills.

Good thread.  OP with no easy answer.  Arguments for both sides are strong and hopefully provide helpful insight.  At the end of the day, only the player and parents will know the right direction. 

 

My two cents regarding the argument that this can open doors for higher education opportunities...  I think that only applies if the player has enough passion for the game. The commitment required is very significant.  If getting into a better school is motivating reason #1, it will not be enough.

I've never faced the problem of children facing baseball opportunities that outstripped their desires. Good problem to have.

 

Around the time my kids were the age of your son, I told them I wanted them to pursue excellence at an honorable and worthwhile activity of their choosing. 

 

The downside to my parenting approach is that only one of four sons chose to pursue baseball. So this advice isn't for everyone--and it's especially not for everyone on this board!

 

In your son's case, I would use the invitation as an opportunity for him to clarify his goals and priorities. 

 

On the one hand, choosing not to play baseball the summer before his junior year is a fairly dispositive decision not to play baseball after high school.

 

On the other hand, what seems like a great opportunity to you and me, might for him be a distraction or temptation that keeps him from pursuing something of greater value.

 

He is the only person qualified to make the decision, but you can help him make it carefully.

 

I wouldn't steer him toward a particular choice. 

 

Make sure he understands you love him more than you love baseball and your goal is his long-term happiness and growth. 

 

Make sure he knows does have a choice and you will permit him to make this decision.

 

Be available to make sure he considers all sides of the issue, including the points already made in this thread.

 

Then give him the time and emotional space to sort it out.

 

Best wishes,

 

 

Cabbage:  Agreed, but stuff does happen - one of my best friends was a highly recruited football player  in HS and he chose to go to a small, highly selective New England college, which he was qualified to attend, but certainly had no guarantee of admission without getting a "hook" from the football coach. Long story short, he got injured and discovered girls his freshman year and never played one snap. But he's got that degree, and another one too. 

 

(not saying anybody should plan it this way, but it does happen)

Sounds too me like the kid has some degree of talent, but no real hunger.   Talent without hunger will only take you so far.  Can't really imagine a 2017 kid with genuine hunger to keep playing at next level or even to just get better for the next HS season wanting to take the entire summer off from baseball activities.  Kids like that, no matter how much raw talent they have, usually get left behind by some kid who is out there busting his chops over the summer and into the fall.

 

Don't really know what that adds up to in terms of advice.  But my gut feeling is that it's time for your son to decide what he really wants from baseball and how much he is willing to give of himself to get whatever that is  out of it.  If he really has no hunger to play beyond high school and if he has what feels to him like bigger fish to fry in terms of academics, etc,  then he should go with that. And more power to him.  I don't think he should do this summer thing just as an exercise in resume building.   Won't do him much good, if he isn't really all in. 

 

I started a thread awhile back about "where has all the hunger gone."  I've seen a fair number of talented kids, not really be all that passionate about the game.  I'm thinking of  guys who are pretty good to very good but could be better.  But they can  just sort of take  or leave the game and are content to be what they are.  I don't mean to suggest that these are loser type guys.  Rather, they are often guys who have many things going for them and to  whom for one reason or another it doesn't make a ton of sense necessarily to over invest in improving their game.   Nothing wrong with that in a HS age kid. Like I said,  It's often the sign of a kid who has many other things going for him and many other things  he wants to do.  Your son sounds like he might be one of those.  

 

So I second those who say you should help him way all sides, but really and truly let him decide and applaud his decision, as long as it is made carefully and reflectively with due attention to all sides of the issue. 

Guess I feel like saying this to unqualify my advice earlier.

 

Rob T,

 

I am no expert parent.  I am not an expert at anything.  I am not even very intelligent.

 

So please don't take my advice seriously.  This is your son, you know him better than I do.  You love him more than I do.  So who am I to suggest what to do.  You do what you think is right and never look back.  

 

Best of luck to you and your son, no matter what direction you take. FWIW, I hope he plays!

If you son is focused on the academics then perhaps a more analytical approach will help - by removing biases and emotions.

 

What is his top goal?  A certain school?  Career? i.e. Doctor, Law, Finance or Baseball etc.  Put those two together.  Does he have the grades to get to the school that let's him pursue that?  How does that fit the family money?

 

If a career in Law is the goal and he wants to go to Yale and the grades and money are not an issue then congratulations you have a wonderful plan in place.

 

If any of that is not all lined up and baseball opens the doors for it...if he is as bright as he seems then he might conclude all on his own that keeping that door open is a sensible thing even if he is not in love with baseball.  On the other hand if baseball is of no help and he is spending the time pursuing the goal with something that does, then you should accept and support that.

 

The road that gets tricky is if he has a girlfriend that he wants to spend weekends with or some other socially based reason that is being covered by the schoolwork claim.  If that is the case...it won't be easy because now you are in a conversation where he is already being deceptive for his reasons and will be very hard to work with because retreating means admitting that.

 

Never underestimate a girl complaining that he is never around.  The prettier she is, the worse it is.

 

.

Thanks for the thoughts so far.

 

To clarify a little...

 

My son is an extremely practical kid.  He knows the stats and realities - and the overwhelming odds are that he will not be playing any type of professional ball.

 

With that in mind, he knows that it will be his academics that will carry him on in life. When discussing playing in college he has said to me that he would do it, but only if it got him into a school he wanted to go to, and he got some financial benefit out of it. Otherwise he doesn't think it is worth the trade off in time it takes.

 

As for this summer, he was willing to play as a fill in - but really didn't want to commit to the full summer grind.  We're within a few hours driving distance of many of the bigger summer tourneys. He really just didn't want to spend one day pitching, and another 3 days or so waiting around for his next start.  I can kind of understand his point I guess.

 

Since last spring when he started rehabbing until now, I can't think of a time where he went more than 2 days without working out, practicing, playing in games, or doing something baseball related.  He's got practice and games six days a week until at least the end of April.  In all honesty, I'd love for him to be able to take a few weeks off and just relax.

 

I don't think playing this summer will set him back academically. At the end of this year he will only need 6 credits to graduate so we have that to factor in as well. He's in line for a slot for a program that would have him starting college in the fall, so we've really got to see where things fall over the next few months. 

To be clear -- because I think one person above misunderstood my point -- I'm not saying your son can't or won't play in college, nor that he shouldn't.

 

I'm saying that the time table is such that he is at the point where he's going to have to decide which path he wants. 

 

It may well be that, once he thinks about life without baseball, he'll come to the conclusion that he can't imagine that happening so soon, that he wants to play in college, and that he's therefore willing to do what it takes to get there.

 

But it could just as easily go the other way.  His call.

Yea, the girls issue... Apparently the addition of 30 pounds of muscle elevated his attractiveness to the opposite sex.

 

Fortunately his current girlfriend is an athlete as well, so she doesn't give him any issues about practices and such.

 

Now that I think about it, the few players on the team that I know who have steady girlfriends are all dating athletes. Probably makes sense.

Rob T,

 

Sounds like a great opportunity for a 2017 at this time.  I think your son needs to ask the Coach what his role would be on the team and the commitment needed.  The financial committment is $0 but what about the family time committment?.  That should clarify things for your son and he can figure out if this is something he really wants to do.  I know if this opportunity came up with my three boys I would have got 3 different responses.  This appears to be an opportunity to play at the highest levels.  If that is what your son wants, go for it.  If he has other interests pursue that with everything he's got.

 

For an academically minded kid this could be an opportunity to separate himself from other 2017s by playing at the highest levels and possibly doing the same academically. Stanford, Ivys, and others that I'm familiar with want to see a kid who can compete and succeed at these levels with other D1 recruits.  If that is what he seeks then I would be asking these travel coaches how they can help position him for that high academic outcome.

 

JMO. 

Until my sons hit 18 I referred to girls as "dream killers".  

You sit down with him. Both of you make a list of the positives and negatives playing for this team this summer. If you believe he should take advantage of the opportunity you place some emphasis on the options it opens for only a summer commitment. Then the kid has to decide. There's nothing wrong with telling him you believe he should play for them. But you can't make him.

Wanted to take the summer off. Isn't sure he wants to play college baseball.

 

Now thinking about playing on a team that is coached by guys that live it. Now thinking about playing on a team with other players that live it. Now thinking about competing against other guys that live it.

 

Now what has changed? The opportunity to play on a pretigeous team? The opportunity that this may bring him?

 

I don't know maybe I am just too old school. But why should that matter to a player? If you want to play the game you want to play the game. If you want to take off then you want to take off.

 

Exposure works more than one way. In fact it works in many ways. If a kid is thinking about taking time away from the game at this stage of his baseball life how is he going to fair in an environment where no one would even ponder it?

 

It kind of reminds me of some of the kids I coached over the years that said to me "Coach I want to play college baseball." "But only if its big time college baseball." My answer. You don't really want to play college baseball then son. Because if you did it wouldn't matter if it was in a cow field in Wyoming as long as you got the opportunity to do it.

 

Now I understand every kid is different and every situation is different. But think about it. If a kid is wanting to take a summer off while he is in HS. And isn't sure he even wants to play in college. Does he really want to be on a team that is all in? That doesn't sound like the right fit in my opinion. I only coached all in players. So maybe I shouldn't even be posting on this topic.

 

 

To me, this is huge. If a sophomore is in line to graduate after completing 6 more credits, then he is probably closer to a 2016 graduate and than a 2017 grad. That is a huge accomplishment in itself, but does have an impact on his baseball recruiting and playing timeline. I would let him take the lead on this decision, after a thorough discussion. He does sound very analytical and advanced for his age, so I would think he is capable of making the best decision for his future, along with your guidance and input. 

Yogi Berra once said that "when you get to a fork in the road, take it'.  I had an opportunity coming out of HS to go to Europe and play soccer in an apprentice program for Division 1 soccer (early 80's). The decision was my own and  I did not go because of immaturity, girlfriend, never been away from home, and I was scared.  In hindsight everything turned out OK (took the fork to the right). If I would have had been pushed into the decision, who knows what would have happened. I was not mentally ready for that big of a change in my life, but this this turned out to be the only opportunity I had to advance in soccer.  It was time to find a regular job. In the grand scheme of things, either path will work out, it's just a different path.  Hope this helps!

Well, your point of view isn't unreasonable.  It raises very valid points.

 

As a player, he has always been an all in kid.  He busts his butt. He went through months of rehab. You will often find us at the gym at 10 o'clock at night after he has already gone through a full day of school then practice, then homework. I'm sure he would much rather be in bed - but that's the only time we have, so that's when we go. He's the kid that never missed a practice, meeting or game last season even though he couldn't play.  He rebuilt the bullpen mounds one handed because he wanted them to be in good shape when he was ready to pitch again.

 

He's willing to work hard - but he is also trying to be realistic.  Even if you love the game, you can't let it get in the way of the rest of your life.  I don't think he has ever seen himself as being good enough to play professionally - so his focus has always been on academics. Despite loving the game, he's willing to step away from it to secure the rest of his life.  It's certainly not an easy decision because who can possibly know where they will be in three or four years?  He's got to make decisions now that will possibly set a course for the rest of his life. I just want him to be sure to make the smart decision, not an emotional one.  

FWIW - I tend to fall into the PG Staff & Coach May camps, in that it doesn't appear he "lives & dies for the game"....I am not saying that is the end all to all discussions / decisions, however it has (and is) my experience that the highest levels of passion are pretty much a constant for players who are aspiring to play on summer teams such as you described, as well as playing beyond HS.  This may be viewed from a standpoint that - if this once in a lifetime  opportunity has surfaced, and he is on the fence, that could be viewed that his baseball aspirations are not top priority....which is totally fine.  My guess is the roster of the type of team you mention being assembled, did not flinch when given the opportunity, regardless of what their existing summer plans were.

 

Just my ramblings.... I don't think anyone here is able to give you advice on what to / or not to do.... Good luck!

 

But, then you said:

 

Am I to read that him taking the summer courses you are talking about will have him going to college in 2015?  

 

That doesn't leave you a lot of time.  I was going to say that, as a sophomore, a lot can change by the time he is a senior.  But, it sounds much more complex to me.  If your son is wanting to go to college THIS fall, I'm not sure baseball will even be a factor at all.  If I'm reading this wrong, at a minimum, he will be graduating one year ahead of schedule, so he will be a 2016 and not really a 2017.  Sounds like you have one smart kid to be that far ahead of the game academically.  If he doesn't have the passion for the game, and he is this far ahead academically and has a firm idea about what he wants to do with his life - real life - I'm not sure if I would derail his academic goals for the sake of baseball.  But that's just me.  Even if he puts off college until 2016, he will still be a very young freshman and be competing on the baseball field with grown men.  It will be tough.  

 

Maybe I'm reading your posts wrong.  But if it was me, baseball is secondary for my son - unless he has MLB talent right now.  Too much of his academic progress would be disrupted if he were to pursue baseball - especially if he isn't passionate about it.  Sounds to me like he's growing up.

Rob,
Its ok if your son wants to take time off for the summer from baseball. This is just my opinion. Because he needs time off may not mean he doesnt love the game or has no passion. 

Sometimes we all need to take a step back from our everyday routine and take a break.  Most importantly,  always remember its not what we want for them but what be wants for himself.

Not to side track the topic but I know the JC coach very well that cut Pedroia as a freshman and he swears that he would do it the same today.  Says the other guy was better at the time.  A coach doesn't have the luxury of having that player 5 years later.

 

If my kid was willing to put in the work then I would have him do it.  As others have said sports can open doors to high academic schools that you would not have open otherwise.  A local kid that I coached in baseball a few years ago just agreed to play football at Cornell.  Kid is smart and has good test scores but without football never would have been accepted to Cornell.  This young man will have a solid start in life and has no expectation to play beyond college.