What was the best part/experience for your son when he played in a summer league and what was the worst part/experience?
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Lots of games, good competition. Bad side: Almost no days off, travel on buses until 2-3 in the morning, bad food at games and the town shut down about 9:30 so nothing open for food after games. Pitchers had to attend all games even through starters only pitched every 7 days.
Huge discussion of this last year:
https://community.hsbaseballwe...-they-are-a-changing
Best: games every day, learned a lot about baseball, saw new parts of the country, met players from all over
Worst: he didn't say much that was negative, has been lucky I guess
First year son(RHP) played in the Hampton's League, and then NECBL for 2 weeks. He enjoyed the NECBL, taking a ferry to Martha's Vinyard. Was not thrilled with the Hampton's League but I think a lot of that had to do with it being during Covid and sharing a basement with 5 other players.
This year my 2022 son is playing in the Hamptons league, and is assigned to the team with the D1 female player. Anticipating a circus!
Kid is playing the same local league he did last year. 4 games a week and the comp will be good enough for him to get more reps to improve his fielding and work on improving his outside hitting. More importantly he will be able to work 4 days a week as his savings has been depleted. His very kind and too generous parents have subsidized his summer gym fees.
My son said the best part and worst part were essentially tied to the same thing. Playing six days a week was fun. Playing six days a week and the travel left little time for anything else.
Playing two summers near his grandfather allowed them to spend the most time together ever. Grandpa got to see him play more ball than ever before.
The schedule, road trips by bus, road trip food and cheap hotels convinced him if not drafted in the top twenty rounds (position player) he wasn’t interested in signing (there were forty rounds when he turned twenty-one).
The amount of games is designed that way to keep them busy. No drinking or going to parties.
The travel part is designed to let players know what milb is like. If your sons don't like games almost every night, no place to stop and eat they won't last long in proball, although it's gotten better.
TPM
seven days a week and Bob Gibson is your opponent. Why time off from your favorite game. Every inning, every pitch every day you learn a lesson. Paint a railroad bridge over the Missouri River teaches history and $$$.
Bob
@Consultant posted:TPM
seven days a week and Bob Gibson is your opponent. Why time off from your favorite game. Every inning, every pitch every day you learn a lesson. Paint a railroad bridge over the Missouri River teaches history and $$$.
Bob
Agree Bob.
Summer ball is for working on your stuff and getting in the reps or innings that you didn't get at your program. Embrace the opportunity.
Good: Reps, try tweaking some things with no real repercussions, different coaching perspectives. Draft implications in some leagues.
Bad: Very few of the kids actually want to be there. Unless you're in the Cape or a premier league, many are just doing it because their coaches told them to. They would rather be at the lake, the beach, or mostly just sleeping in and playing video games/catching up with home friends. Sometimes you will also be dealing with an inferior coach/staff that are also trying to make a name for themselves.
Fortunately, there are serious baseball players, who will replace the "make believe" players. That attitude will carry to their future career's.
Bob
The good: playing everyday; playing with some very good players from many different schools; free dairy queen whenever they wanted. They would run out between reps/practice to get smoothies. Lunch and dinner, too, when needed. Son said they never got tired of it, especially the ice cream. Son loved his summer experience.
The bad: for me, the turnover. Players were coming and going all season for different reasons (summer school, homesick, etc). I was used to the college constant roster. This also gets them ready for a pro team turnover.
The Bad: for son, the host family. Host family (no cost to player) mom had some cognitive issues starting and the dad maybe thought having players in the house would be additional eyes on her. It was their first time being a host family. However, the players were not around a lot, and sometimes when they would come home late from a game no one would be there. Another family kinda adopted them and let them know they could count on them for any reason, which was very helpful. There were other issues, too.
@TPM, no drinking??? If they are drinkers/partiers, they will find a way, I can assure you.
Dave only played one summer of summer ball and it was for the Falmouth Commodores. It was a requirement to work part time as well as strict curfew on nights off. I mean if you got caught drinking you went home the next day.
Pitcher's job was field cleanup as well as camp counselors during camp weeks. They got paid weekly and that money went to the host family. He lived with 2 of his Clemson teammates in a finished basement. We came up to visit one weekend and the family treated us like royalty and they treated the boys as if they were their own. Dave still corresponds with them to this day but their hosting days are over.
Boys got to go to Fenway as All Stars and met all of the players.
It was an experience on sons bucket list and one that he will never forget.
If your sons get to play on the Cape, don't pass it up.
We are hosting for the second time. The first time was 3 UT son's teammates. Built a strong connection with the guys. I feel sorry for them because it is a 45 minute drive to field each way. This year we have 1 UT player and 2 MTSU players. We have a finished basement. We have 1 player who was supposed to stay with us but decided to stay at his house. 1 1/2 hour drive each way. I can't imagine doing that by himself when you get home from some away games at 2 AM and have to be back for another away game at 11 AM the next morning. We have offered for him to come stay with our guys on those nights. We always try to provide their favorite foods and hook them up with their favorite things to do when they have time, which is rare. The last group loved to fish so we hooked them up with some good ponds in our area. Some, I have not even been invited to go to. Our problem is we are not here the first week because of SEC Championship but we just let them in the house and tell them where everything is.
Let me add onto last post. If you can, host a summer college guy or a minor league guy if they need them in your area. We have done both and it is a blessing to them and your family. We did the minor league guy when our guys were in HS and it was neat for them also. Most college leagues desperately need host families. If you have been blessed by your son being with a host family, repay the favor.
Anyone have any experience with the Southern Collegiate Baseball League?
Thanks!
@TPM posted:The amount of games is designed that way to keep them busy. No drinking or going to parties.
The travel part is designed to let players know what milb is like. If your sons don't like games almost every night, no place to stop and eat they won't last long in proball, although it's gotten better.
Dramatically better. They were served sandwiches with mold on the bread, stayed in a hotel where the water was brown. There is ticking it out but recognizing that parts of it suck. Ours was worse because the host family was not a good fit for the program. I had no idea (son never mentioned it) until I went to the last game and the director came up and apologized profusely for his experience. Then called me again when we got home and said they would never be allowed to host again. Some kids have great experiences. I would call his valuable but not good. The game part was good and he did well, I just wish I had known about the other parts because I could have assisted with food delivery or something.
Middle son went from dump to luxury pool house one season. The host family had him sleeping in room with 10 year old and wanted him to babysit. Which neither was appropriate. Grandpa also slept in living room in underwear all day. They moved him to a family who lived in Atlanta and had a house there. He lived in luxury pool house the rest of the summer and got to drive their Jeep.
@baseballhs posted:Dramatically better. They were served sandwiches with mold on the bread, stayed in a hotel where the water was brown. There is ticking it out but recognizing that parts of it suck. Ours was worse because the host family was not a good fit for the program. I had no idea (son never mentioned it) until I went to the last game and the director came up and apologized profusely for his experience. Then called me again when we got home and said they would never be allowed to host again. Some kids have great experiences. I would call his valuable but not good. The game part was good and he did well, I just wish I had known about the other parts because I could have assisted with food delivery or something.
I just saw your post. I meant milb is better now than it used to be.
No one should have to go away to play summer ball and have a bad family experience. I am sorry that happened to your son.
Best part, when it was over. Worst part, sitting on the bench because college coaches had made a deal with the head coach that their player would get the majority of the playing time.
Oldest son played in Canada after freshman year, w/ the Hays Larks after sophomore year, and in Wyoming after junior year. Best baseball was in Kansas. Most fun was in Canada and Wyoming (hunting / fishing / hiking). Best family was in Canada, but he didn't have a bad one in Kansas either. In Wyoming they were all in a local hotel so no host family.
Youngest is starting this summer. Staying in his college town to play for his assistant coach to make sure he gets at bats, but also gets refreshed and rest (although he wants to play everyday).
Has a great host family already lined up. She cooked dinner (steak, italian, fajitas) for him several times during the college season. She is letting him store his dorm stuff in her storage facility (so he does not have to move to and from) and has played golf with him and her mid 20's son.
During his 3 weeks home I've seen him in many different college baseball shirts..........and I'm like "where did you get that", and he said XXXX has a closet full of them that she lets her players wear during the summer in case they don't bring enough stuff. Sounds like a good start to the summer. He leaves next Tuesday for 55 games in 2 months, but he's taking off 2 weeks in the middle of the season to go to the beach w/ college teammates and girlfriends (what I don't know won't hurt me, right?), and then we'll vacation for 2 weeks after the season.
@russinfortworth posted:Oldest son played in Canada after freshman year, w/ the Hays Larks after sophomore year, and in Wyoming after junior year. Best baseball was in Kansas. Most fun was in Canada and Wyoming (hunting / fishing / hiking). Best family was in Canada, but he didn't have a bad one in Kansas either. In Wyoming they were all in a local hotel so no host family.
Youngest is starting this summer. Staying in his college town to play for his assistant coach to make sure he gets at bats, but also gets refreshed and rest (although he wants to play everyday).
Has a great host family already lined up. She cooked dinner (steak, italian, fajitas) for him several times during the college season. She is letting him store his dorm stuff in her storage facility (so he does not have to move to and from) and has played golf with him and her mid 20's son.
During his 3 weeks home I've seen him in many different college baseball shirts..........and I'm like "where did you get that", and he said XXXX has a closet full of them that she lets her players wear during the summer in case they don't bring enough stuff. Sounds like a good start to the summer. He leaves next Tuesday for 55 games in 2 months, but he's taking off 2 weeks in the middle of the season to go to the beach w/ college teammates and girlfriends (what I don't know won't hurt me, right?), and then we'll vacation for 2 weeks after the season.
Is he going to have to leave one of his jerseys at the end of the summer?
Season is 25% in the books and some early observations:
A lot of kids struggle with the wood bats. Some guys who mash with metal are really not doing much with wood.
It's not for everyone. We've already seen a few kids quit the team.
Some of the fields are really nice and some of them are a joke.
I've seen D1 kids struggle and some D3 and Juco kids shine. But other D1 kids stand out too. Biggest difference seems to be the size of the players. But, the skill difference isn't as big.
It's a lot of games and a lot of driving.
The kids/interns working the game broadcasts and streams really work hard and love the game as much as the players.
With wood bats a hitter can’t muscle a fisted pitch over the infield. He’s more likely to end up with a bat handle in his hand.
A lot of times the difference between a D1 and other level isn’t the swing. It’s a combination of metrics. I can think of two local kids who had sweeter swings than my son. In fact, I would have put their swings up against anyone. I saw both repeatedly each year in travel ball and one in high school. One went on to be All Centennial and a D3 All American. The other was All PSAC.
What these players didn’t have was foot speed, strong arms and size. They were both 5’9”. But they were strong and could drive the ball. But if you can only play first in D1 your options will be limited.
The fields are usually somewhat in correlation with the quality of the league.
Back when I played college summer ball I had a teammate who played for a CWS team. He hit .300+ with some power over the college season. He hit about .140 in summer ball. He didn’t want to be there. His coach set him up with the team. He just wanted to go home and relax after the CWS.
Francis and RJM:
To play successfully in a College Summer League a players needs to prepare his mental attitude as to his goals. The selection of the wood bat is important.
"Thin handle" or thick handle; 33" or 34" or 35". Choke the bat, if you are "weak" on inside pitches. Off the plate and focus on opposite the field.
Adjust, adjust, adjust and prepare.
Bob
My kid is in a summer league with a mixture of D1, D2, D3, and JUCO guys.
The D1 guys clearly stand out. They are more athletic and more fluid in their motions, and the ball just comes off their bat “differently”. Really fun for my D3 kid to play with those guys and battle against the D1 & D2 guys on the other teams. Great experience!
My kid is in a summer league with a mixture of D1, D2, D3, and JUCO guys mostly D1 and D2 and my experience is different I believe there is little to no difference between the multiple levels of players.
Dann1122, I have a similar view point.
Remember the game of "BASEBALL" knows NO difference between Divisions. Focus on "improvement" of your son's skills. Is he playing in the Virginia Valley League? West Coast League? Northwoods League? Cape Cod? NE College?
What are his goals? His team's goals? His role on the TEAM? The summer = 4 term papers. Take notes.
Bob
@Dan1122 posted:My kid is in a summer league with a mixture of D1, D2, D3, and JUCO guys mostly D1 and D2 and my experience is different I believe there is little to no difference between the multiple levels of players.
With some exceptions for the most part there’s a huge difference between players in the top ten D1 baseball conferences and the other twenty D1 conferences.
My son's local league is mixed with a good amount of rising freshmen. The baseball is still not pretty after a couple of weekends. These are DH games and it is common only to see the pitchers just show up for their appearance and catchers leave after a game since they only play one game. I recall it was like this last year and there is a good amount of reps for everyone. My kid likes it as the travel is easy and he can work full time and get enough reps without becoming too rusty for fall ball. There is an attitude shift with the players when the play off starts which is good.
My son is currently on a temp contract in the Cape and is enjoying his time. He comes from a D3 school but so far is doing well. He had to fly directly from the World Series to the Cape so he's a bit tired but is having fun. He especially had an amazing time at Scout Day at Fenway Park.
Great opportunity to shine in front of scouts! If you play in the Cape or other top leagues the exposure is key.
As a pitcher there is a lot of down time between game opportunities.
@RJM posted:With some exceptions for the most part there’s a huge difference between players in the top ten D1 baseball conferences and the other twenty D1 conferences.
Those D1 guys D1 guys are included in my opinion.
I value everyone’s perspective.
For me, you don’t see too many 6.5 60 guys in D3. There’s two of them just on my kid’s summer team. And they are mid major D1 guys too. These players would hit .400 and steal 75+ bags a season in D3, certainly in most D3 conferences
My youngest plays in the HCL. Mix of JUCO - D1. A lot of kids from the Ivy's as well as HA D3s. Where I've noticed a difference is in speed and athleticism at the MIF and OF positions. That said the D1 players here are either very young (incoming freshmen or sophs) and/or at the smaller D1s.
The reality is in you're probably not going to see or at least shouldn't see a huge difference in skill difference at these smaller collegiate leagues. Every once in a while you'll see a kid who got his contract pulled in the Cape that comes on is sitting 93 which is fun, but also rare.
I'm sure geography has a lot to do with it as well. If a kid lighting it up in our league, there's a good chance he'll leave and go play in the NECBL or even the Cape.
One is currently in a competitive summer league, living with a host family and 3 other guys. Same league but ended up switching teams last minute as they needed to shuffle with regionals and inning counts played a factor.
In any event he is on a team with a mix of players. The biggest difference to me is the defense. At his mid major, anything on the infield is automatic. There are a lot more infield singles and errors. Especially when they go up against some of the more P5 heavy teams. Catchers have been a bit disappointing as well but I imagine there is going to be a bit of a learning curve seeing 20 new arms.
I would be interested to see that difference PA. Just for the sake of understanding.
@RJM posted:Are you saying you don’t see the difference between a P5 player and a D3 player?
There’s a few kids I used to coach who ended up at a D3 (and are doing very well in D3 too) who absolutely still insist that they are “D1 guys” even though they never got a D1 offer despite spending thousands on PBR and PG events. It’s a common phenomenon these days of players and parents not seeing things the way that Baseball coaches and longtime Baseball people/insiders do.
I think it saves me a big degree of angst or whatever it is, simply embracing reality, but that’s just me…my kid laced a Double against a D1 pitcher throwing 92 last week, that doesn’t make him a D1 guy or “just as talented as a D1 guy”.
@Dadof3 posted:I would be interested to see that difference PA. Just for the sake of understanding.
Head to a D3 game and then head to a D1 game. It has less to do with how it looks and more to do with the speed.
Even at our mid major which is pretty strong, the infield play is significantly inferior to the infield play at P5s. I have one at a mid major and another at a P5. Our guys hit, but defensively they probably run circles around us. Their backups are superior defenders to our starters.
Good example here of the differences in summer leagues and how serious/competitive they can or cannot be. Got these txts from each of my kids about 24 hours apart.
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@3and2Fastball posted:There’s a few kids I used to coach who ended up at a D3 (and are doing very well in D3 too) who absolutely still insist that they are “D1 guys” even though they never got a D1 offer despite spending thousands on PBR and PG events. It’s a common phenomenon these days of players and parents not seeing things the way that Baseball coaches and longtime Baseball people/insiders do.
I think it saves me a big degree of angst or whatever it is, simply embracing reality, but that’s just me…my kid laced a Double against a D1 pitcher throwing 92 last week, that doesn’t make him a D1 guy or “just as talented as a D1 guy”.
You are right. In Legion and college summer ball I owned a pitcher who spent six years in the majors. I hit over .400 against him. It didn’t make me a major league hitter. It made me a hitter who had figured out an excellent pitcher.
Rjm
was his name Bob Gibson?
Bob W.
Son is in a mostly D1 league. Some of the P5 players are very good, but some are not doing well, and some of the mid-major players are doing much better. For hitting, I could see adjusting to the wood bats, but the fielding and pitching are not more impressive either by those P5 players than the others.
P5 schools have much more depth of talent. That being said most Mid Majors have players who would do very well at a P5. There are plenty of Mid Major guys playing professional baseball who bypassed their P5 peers somewhere after committing to their colleges and getting drafted. P5 baseball across the board is stronger but that doesn't mean the entire roster is at the top level. Many P5 guys transfer or walk away after a year or two in the program when reality sets in "I'm never going to play."
Wood bats break many good college hitters.
@BaseballFan1965 posted:P5 schools have much more depth of talent. That being said most Mid Majors have players who would do very well at a P5. There are plenty of Mid Major guys playing professional baseball who bypassed their P5 peers somewhere after committing to their colleges and getting drafted. P5 baseball across the board is stronger but that doesn't mean the entire roster is at the top level. Many P5 guys transfer or walk away after a year or two in the program when reality sets in "I'm never going to play."
Wood bats break many good college hitters.
And also remember, just because a school is in a P5 Conference, doesn't mean it's worthy of the title. There are many schools in those conferences that fit the Mid-Major title better. Many of those P5 conferences are called P5 because of another sport. Honestly I wish people would consider the term Powerhouse schools and take it at that level versus conference level.
@HSDad22 posted:And also remember, just because a school is in a P5 Conference, doesn't mean it's worthy of the title. There are many schools in those conferences that fit the Mid-Major title better. Many of those P5 conferences are called P5 because of another sport. Honestly I wish people would consider the term Powerhouse schools and take it at that level versus conference level.
It depends. There are P5 schools that have caught a lot of flak on this board for their lackluster performances, but if you take them out of their P5 conference and put them in the Horizon League, NEC, WCC, Mountain West, Patriot, etc they walk thru them and we're having a conversation about what a strong mid major they are. It's all relative.
The truth is there are 7 conferences with 50% or more of the teams being pretty solid. Those are what I would consider "tough" conferences.
@anotherparent posted:Son is in a mostly D1 league. Some of the P5 players are very good, but some are not doing well, and some of the mid-major players are doing much better. For hitting, I could see adjusting to the wood bats, but the fielding and pitching are not more impressive either by those P5 players than the others.
When my son was fourteen I was driving by a P5 and noticed they were sponsoring a showcase. I knew they did them on three consecutive weekends in September. I stopped to watch. There were 36 position players. I saw little difference in the defensive drills. Only 4 of the 36 had D1 swings.
@HSDad22 posted:And also remember, just because a school is in a P5 Conference, doesn't mean it's worthy of the title. There are many schools in those conferences that fit the Mid-Major title better. Many of those P5 conferences are called P5 because of another sport. Honestly I wish people would consider the term Powerhouse schools and take it at that level versus conference level.
Top 50 program would be a better description than P5.
All true - but I think at this point I know which teams are which, and I stand by what I said! They are almost all D1, but not all P5.
Another Parent;
Hopefully the players are "learning" the game. How are the Coaches?
The "white ball" has no regard for the player's Division. Question: can he play?
Bob
Summer league is almost over. 30 games done, 3 to go, and then the playoffs.
So far, son has played in 57% of the games. Would have been more but he missed 5 games when they sent him to a NACSB showcase 400 miles away. (7 hours drive each way.) He's also one of 3 catchers on the team and they try to somewhat rotate them and give them rest.
I definitely see how players have to sacrifice their summer to participate in these leagues. While I sense the team feels like they have a legitimate chance to win the championship - and they do - I also sense that some of the players will be relieved when the season is officially over.
My son is lucky because he's on a winning team. (They have won 20 of 30 so far.) Credit goes to the guy who put the team together and the players for playing well. But. There's at least half the league where the teams have struggled this season. Some of them lose 60+% of the time and get pounded by the good teams. That has to be a miserable summer. And, I have noticed their dugouts getting less crowded. I suspect their players are checking out.
Overall, I feel that it's been a good opportunity and experience for my son. Validating positive in some ways but also humbling and providing challenges and learning lessons in others. He also got to play with some very talented guys.
@Francis7 posted:I definitely see how players have to sacrifice their summer to participate in these leagues. While I sense the team feels like they have a legitimate chance to win the championship - and they do - I also sense that some of the players will be relieved when the season is officially over.
This is 100% true and that's for a local league if I'm correct. Now imagine living away from home in a town most people work for the opportunity to leave.
Francis:
Sorry for your son's sacrifice. Baseball is a "teaching" opportunity to learn the game and about yourself. Is he prepared for the College Fall practice?
Maybe he should consider the Northwoods League.
Di you know that the Madison team {Northwoods League] average attendance is 6,080 per game.
Bob
@PABaseball posted:This is 100% true and that's for a local league if I'm correct. Now imagine living away from home in a town most people work for the opportunity to leave.
I don't disagree. Personally, at 19, I don't think he would have been able to do that situation.
As I read this, I realize that what you are talking about is what my son experienced when he played with the Northwoods, and is very similar to what he is seeing now in high A ball. Players come in and out as they are moved up or down, cut or in the next couple of weeks, traded. He has faced some guys who lived up their hype, and struck out some top prospects in embarrassing ways. Some of the towns they visit have been high quality, some have offered the visiting squad porta potties and a trailer for their clubhouse.
I feel like almost every experience every player has is valuable. It teaches you what things look like when they're good, what they look like when they're bad, and hopefully some skills on how to cope with each and even better, how to make a bad situation better. Great lessons for a baseball career, and for life.
Outstanding evaluation.
Best wishes to your son. He has "earned"his success with the 3 P's [patience, persistence & pride].
Bob
One thing I noticed in my son's commuter summer league is pitchers leaving games - I mean physically leaving the premises - as soon as they are done with the game.
They had a doubleheader this weekend. Opposing team's starter in Game 1 only went 2 innings. In the 3rd inning, he was in the parking lot heading home.
I understand that it's the summer and a weekend. And, some of these kids have long drives home. But, part of me thinks it's a bad look. But, I'm old.
Francis, they are NP’s
Bob
@Francis7 posted:One thing I noticed in my son's commuter summer league is pitchers leaving games - I mean physically leaving the premises - as soon as they are done with the game.
They had a doubleheader this weekend. Opposing team's starter in Game 1 only went 2 innings. In the 3rd inning, he was in the parking lot heading home.
I understand that it's the summer and a weekend. And, some of these kids have long drives home. But, part of me thinks it's a bad look. But, I'm old.
My oldest came back from playing on the west coast and got some work in in the league your son is in (in the NY division, not NJ). He was able to do this. They told him when he could pitch, he showed up and pitched. He's older at this point and played for the team's owner in summer ball in HS so maybe it's different. I'm not sure he left mid game, but definitely didn't' stick around for an entire DH. That is the culture of that league (ACBL) though.
Does this league play in front of paying customers? or is it more like a travel team league, with no-one but maybe family watching?
@anotherparent posted:Does this league play in front of paying customers? or is it more like a travel team league, with no-one but maybe family watching?
The later.
Back when dinosaurs roamed the earth and I played college summer ball most starting pitchers only showed up for their starts. They stayed the entire game. But they didn’t hang around for second games of doubleheaders.
It appears to be fairly common with position players as well. I understand why it's a bad look but these guys really don't care if the team wins or not. Staying around to stand with the team doesn't mean much when the outcome of the game will not sway your mood one way or the other. All these kids would rather go 4-4 in a blowout loss than go 1-4 in a win.
@RJM posted:Back when dinosaurs roamed the earth and I played college summer ball most starting pitchers only showed up for their starts. They stayed the entire game. But they didn’t hang around for second games of doubleheaders.
To me, this would make sense, for the pitchers. Don't make a kid show if he's not throwing. Don't have him sit through the second game if he pitched in the first. But, at least stick around for the game you pitched in, since you were part of it. But, most don't. And, I guess I get it...especially if it's late and they have long drives or it's near rush hour and they want to avoid traffic.
My son played in Norhwoods during COVID, including the first year when they were pretty much the only ones playing. He showed up for his games only just cause they didn't want too many people hanging around the dugout and he lived two hours away, so they didn't have to provide housing. When he was there, he stayed for the full game and helped with field work after.
They took him on the road if he was scheduled to pitch. On nights he wasn't pitching they often had him in the radio booth chatting with the announcer. After about the third time he was in there, I said "they must think you're good at the broadcast stuff."
Nah, he said, they needed my game pants for another player.
I'm sure I've told that story before, but I feel like it pretty well summed up summer collegiate ball.
My kid has playoffs tomorrow. He is hoping for an early exit as does some of his team mates. There were so many weekday games this season the dugout was a revolving door of players (mainly pitchers and catchers) leaving between innings and games to go to work. He will likely not return and just train next year and do live ABs with some pitchers he knows.
My son is playing his first year in the Northwoods League after his first year at a Wisconsin juco (pitcher). His experience between juco travel and NWL has been very different. For juco, only pitchers that were available to pitch traveled. For his NWL team, you are on the bus whether you are pitching or not. So even unavailable pitchers travel with the team. That means a lot of days getting to the park at 12:30, riding a bus for 2 hours, warming up, sitting in the bullpen for a 2-3 hour game, and then taking a 2 hour bus ride home with no expectation of playing. Every day, rinse and repeat.
I have seen a lot of what others have seen. Most pitchers are 86-89 with some topping 90+. Mix of players. Lot of transfer portal guys who did not play and trying to get reps/seen, guys who were contributors using NWL to ramp up, and juco guys knowing this upcoming year is their last chance.
Shane,
did your son use his time to create a scouting book on the opposing hitters. He will see them again.
Bob
Not for personal use but the pitchers keep the scoring book but add notes based on what the hitters did for each pitch. That info is then shared. So a joint book I guess.
Shane;
my "book" will show the tendencies of the hitter, where he stands, how he adjusts, what he thinks, the "sound of the bat", angle of the bat. Does he "choke" the bat on fastball, curve.
Bob
@Consultant posted:Shane,
did your son use his time to create a scouting book on the opposing hitters. He will see them again.
Bob
If we're talking about the 40 year plan vs. the 4 year plan.. It seems that in this scenario pitchers should/could stay behind and work, workout, etc. Assuming most of the NW players are D1 or will be, Synergy has most of the data you need (I am being told that by my kids, I haven't seen it).
I know summer ball isn't going away, but I do think the meat grinder of leagues like the NorthWoods are contributing to less participation overall.
Quite honestly, I think the experience Shane is describing is exactly what my son is seeing at High A. He says his life is very weird now. Goes to bed around 2, gets up around noon or 1 and goes to the field and does his work. Game starts about 6. On nights when he doesn't pitch he spends a lot of time watching the hitters to see what they swing at, what they don't, and kind of plots out what he might do when it's his turn. Game ends around 10 p.m., he goes to find food, plays video games, generally winds down and gets to bed. Rinse and repeat the next day. Monday is the only day off and lately it's been a travel day.
He pitches five innings a week roughly. That doesn't mean he isn't working the other 43 or so innings his team plays.
If you don't like being a pitcher in the NWL, you should stop now.
Thanks for pointing this out, Iowamom. Of course pitchers need to watch hitters in games when they are not pitching, because they will face them at some point. That's why I don't understand not sending all the pitchers to all the games.
In pro and college ball, they almost always play series. There are strategies about who pitches in what order, and how they see lineups. It's obviously also more convenient for travel, and so they have to take the whole team.
In the Northwoods and some of the other summer leagues they play 3 or 4-game series, so all the pitchers obviously have to travel to the away series.
Some summer leagues schedule single games instead of series, which I find odd. In fact, it's been bugging me all summer, and now I know why. If the non-eligible pitchers don't go to games, then when they eventually face those batters, they will not have seen them if they weren't at the away game. It seems different from the way the rest of baseball operates.
One thing about leaving games early, the pros do it all the time in Spring training. I know it is a little different, but it's still kind of the same thing.
Just got back from visiting son in Northwoods league in MN..(my first time up there besides airport)
he was in WCL last year(he no like...) and so far (he went there for 2nd half of season 07/01) it has been a great experience.
I was pretty impressed with how the town comes out and everything was pretty organized and really dialed in .
all games televised with good announcers/camera angles etc...
I way more enjoyed these games vs his college games-where there was never huge attendance -mostly friends and family(now I am sure it would be different if he played in a well attended power 5)
It felt more real I guess - kind of like a fun single A game would be.
all the little kids come onto the field after the game and the kids sign autographs for 30 min.
pretty cute and pretty cool...
kind of like what baseball was meant to be?
competition is decent. just like others have said - it is a broad mix of kids. on his team its probably 2/3 D1. but on others its half or 1/3..
basically what I am saying is.. if your kid needs work and no Cape invite- the Northwood would be my choice.
Fishnsail, I love what you say. When summer ball began for us and my son played on teams that drew large audiences, I started to think about what the point of it all is: is it to improve your craft as a baseball player, or is it to entertain people doing something you are trained to do? Like a singer in summer stock. Obviously it's both, but the entertainment part sometimes gets lost.
My kid is skipping his 2nd round playoff game as he already took off several days of work to play the regular season. He coach was very gracious about it. Hopefully they win today and he can play the semifinals
@2022NYC posted:My kid is skipping his 2nd round playoff game as he already took off several days of work to play the regular season. He coach was very gracious about it. Hopefully they win today and he can play the semifinals
We had a semifinal today and there were definitely kids missing on both teams. It was a reschedule from Tuesday, to Wednesday. And they normally never play on Wednesday. So, I'm guessing maybe they had to work?
When my son was young, and I thought about the future when he was a college player, I used to think "he's going to play in a college summer league EVERY summer." Now that he's done it for the first time, I have changed my thoughts on it.
First, if you are a stud P5 player and a legit major league prospect who has been invited to play in the Cape, YES, you should be playing summer ball.
Or, if you are a freshman who was redshirted or a sophomore who almost never played during the spring with your college team, you should consider playing in a summer league to get those ABs and IP that you missed all spring.
Or, if you are a HS grad who has been offered a chance to play in a college summer league then it might be a good opportunity to see how you fare against some older players.
But, if you were a kid who played or pitched A LOT in the spring for your college team and you are offered a spot in a run of the mill, average, and not prestigious summer college league, then maybe it doesn't make sense to do it and you're better off resting, training, working and enjoying your summer. And, it's not the end of the world to not play summer baseball.
Not saying FOR SURE DON'T DO IT. Just saying that it's MAYBE really not necessary if you got tons of playing time in the spring, maybe could use the rest and recovery, AND if the summer league wasn't a real high end opportunity.
The team won yesterday and have the semifinals this morning. The kid is asking his boss but is likely not going to make the game. Players, coaches and family were upset/disappointed the league would only schedule very few afternoon and night games during the season and only one game in the late afternoon for the whole playoffs. I am sure field and ump availability came into play here.
@2022NYC posted:The team won yesterday and have the semifinals this morning. The kid is asking his boss but is likely not going to make the game. Players, coaches and family were upset/disappointed the league would only schedule very few afternoon and night games during the season and only one game in the late afternoon for the whole playoffs. I am sure field and ump availability came into play here.
Really doesn't also make sense with the heat wave in the area now...unless you are playing at 8 AM before it gets super hot. Better to play when the sun is low or down. Championship game is scheduled for Friday and last time I checked the real feel that day is 104. You really have to play in the dark that day. FWIW, our game last night started around 740 but the players were there since 545.
This sounds like what happened with teams in our youth rec league. As the summer wore on, families planned vacations, and the teams thinned out. By the time of the playoffs, key players were gone. Those of us who remained would complain about this, asking why these people didn't understand that they were committed to a TEAM for the full season. The team that won the championship usually was made up of the kids whose families were, in fact, committed for the season. Many of those families eventually left for travel teams.
Having said that, I agree that morning games are pretty absurd for college-age people. Were players told this when they signedup? If a league doesn't have fields and umpires for evening games, that should be clear from the start.