There are examples of kids that did make it. I coached a kid in youth football that has 9 brothers and five sisters. He was the baby. I was a soph in hs and his oldest brother was a senior that year. His mom was a saint. His dad was a good man that was a long distance truck driver. Mom stayed at home and raised all those kids. They lived in the middle of one of the most drug infested areas of the city. I used to take him home after practice. The first time I took him home the drug dealers stood in the middle of the street and would not let us pass. When they walked up to the window they saw this young man in the car and they said "Hey thats Pierre , Hey Petey hows it going." Pierre told them I was his coach. "Hey man dont mess with Petey his mom dont take no BS." They never messed with us again. She raised all her boys and girls in that small house in the middle of that neighborhood. Many of them went on to go to college and several were outstanding athletes. Pierre went on to win three national titles as a LB with App State University.
They were able to rise above it but it took a strong parent figure in the home and strong older siblings like John who I went to hs with. So it can be done. But incidents like this are too few and far between. When kids tell me how tough they have it I tell them about Pierre Banks. It can be done.
One of my best friends in college was from the ghetto. Not only was he the first high school graduate in the family, he was the school valdedictorian. He called it the equivilant of being the best skier from the Bahamas. His family accused him of "going whitey" on them when he went to college. Because he didn't want to go home he went to summer school and graduated PBK in three years. I asked him where the motivation came from. He said he wanted what the people on TV had.
Let me tell you a little story about a man I knew. He was the second youngest of 8 boys and he had four older sisters. He was the first person in his family to graduate from hs. He did it while he was in the Army. He later rose to the rank of Command Sergeant Major. He raised four boys who all went on to earn HS degrees and three, College degrees. He was the son of a share cropper. And he was the greatest man I have ever known. MY DAD!
Stories like Coach May's and RJM are inspirational and we need more of them. It also shows how terrible drugs are because it's easy to look at the lower classes and "expect" them to be doing it. I agree with Coach May that environment is a HUGE factor in why kids get into it. Sometimes I think it might just be hardwired into people to be addicted to something.
My sister is 4 years older than me. She had tood grades, great personality, very popular, band member, cheerleader, pageant winner. All kinds of positives but she always found the wrong people to be friends with and the worst boyfriends. In high school she started drinking and partying and dated real POS's. After she graduated high school she went to a local community college and worked a part time job. She became good friends with this girl who was a real loser. She convinced my sister to move in with her and it was a dump. My sister started dating a guy who was probably one of our area's biggest drug dealers. For a couple of years she was a "recreational" user. There was nothing we could ever do to convince her to stop. She lost two jobs because she would refuse to take the random drug tests. Somehow she could get hired (I guess she got clean enough to get the job and then went back on it).
After a couple of years of this she cleans her act up. She meets a guy who is probably the best she has ever been with to this point. They get married and have a little girl. Now all this is taking place in West Virginia where she and I grew up. About two years after I move 6 hours away from home to where I am at now my brother in law gets a job in North Carolina and they move down there. So my mom is in WV, my sister is in NC and I am in western KY.
She gets down there and the only person she really knows is her husbands brother. He is a big junkie with a family. He introduces her to his drug friends. Find out her husband is a recreational alcoholic - he only drinks on weekends and gets plastered. He believes the only reason to have a weekend is to get drunk. After a couple of years of this she gets back into the drug lifestyle.
This time she loses a couple of more jobs. She leaves her husband (not really that bad of a thing because he did hit her a few times) and gets deep into the drug life. She loses several jobs, she loses her car by leaving it on the side of the road because she can't pay for it and she knows it's going to get repossessed. She starts dating one of the biggest drug dealers in the area she lived in. She moves in with him and its a run down trailer that is nasty and disgusting. She has her daughter in this mess. She has her daughter with her while she is using drugs and various other things which I won't say. Her ex husband sues for custody and wins so now she has lost her daughter. It drove her deeper and deeper into drugs.
For about two years I didn't speak to her and it was killing my mom. For the longest time I was mentally ready to prepare a weeks worth of lesson plans so I could take off and go to NC for a funeral. She was that bad in it.
One night she was in a very depressed mood and started thinking about suicide. She walked to this bridge and stepped up onto the side and was inches away from stepping off and killing herself. She said at the last minute her daughters face went through her face and she backed off. She went directly to her ex husbands house where her daughter was. He took her in and helped her get admitted into a hospital under suicide watch. While I don't think he is good for her I do respect him for helping her. It would have been very easy to turn her away.
She got into rehab and met a guy in a Narcotics Anonymous meeting. They are now married and expecting their own child. Thankfully her daughter is a well balanced and happy child.
My parents were good hardworking people. They taught us right from wrong. We were middle class people with middle class values. We were taught to stay away from drugs and alcohol. My parents never drank alcohol in front of us.
The oldest child went down the wrong path and lived in a world that should never exist. Thank the good Lord that He helped her out of it. She has had some relapses in using drugs but overall has kept clean.
The youngest child (myself) would be considered a success. I was a good athlete in high school, played baseball in college, got a college degree, have a masters degree, got a great job teaching, head baseball coach, respected member of the community and I have never been drunk in my life. I have never tried a single drug.
Two kids raised the same way and they both take very different paths in life. This shows that if we don't get serious about fixing this problem our society is in trouble.
Addiction has no cure. You don't get medicine or therapy and be "fixed". An addict wakes up every day wanting to get high. They want to go back to their old ways. They just find the strength somehow to "take it one day at a time".
For every kid in a poor neighborhood who gets into drugs for whatever reason there is a middle class kid who gets into drugs for whatever reason. Sometimes your environment pushes you to that world. Sometimes you get bored and want to try it. Sometimes your brain is just "pre - programmed" to be an addict.
This is a battle that is much harder than people realize it is. We have to educate and be proactive to win this battle.
Sorry for the long post.
My sister is 4 years older than me. She had tood grades, great personality, very popular, band member, cheerleader, pageant winner. All kinds of positives but she always found the wrong people to be friends with and the worst boyfriends. In high school she started drinking and partying and dated real POS's. After she graduated high school she went to a local community college and worked a part time job. She became good friends with this girl who was a real loser. She convinced my sister to move in with her and it was a dump. My sister started dating a guy who was probably one of our area's biggest drug dealers. For a couple of years she was a "recreational" user. There was nothing we could ever do to convince her to stop. She lost two jobs because she would refuse to take the random drug tests. Somehow she could get hired (I guess she got clean enough to get the job and then went back on it).
After a couple of years of this she cleans her act up. She meets a guy who is probably the best she has ever been with to this point. They get married and have a little girl. Now all this is taking place in West Virginia where she and I grew up. About two years after I move 6 hours away from home to where I am at now my brother in law gets a job in North Carolina and they move down there. So my mom is in WV, my sister is in NC and I am in western KY.
She gets down there and the only person she really knows is her husbands brother. He is a big junkie with a family. He introduces her to his drug friends. Find out her husband is a recreational alcoholic - he only drinks on weekends and gets plastered. He believes the only reason to have a weekend is to get drunk. After a couple of years of this she gets back into the drug lifestyle.
This time she loses a couple of more jobs. She leaves her husband (not really that bad of a thing because he did hit her a few times) and gets deep into the drug life. She loses several jobs, she loses her car by leaving it on the side of the road because she can't pay for it and she knows it's going to get repossessed. She starts dating one of the biggest drug dealers in the area she lived in. She moves in with him and its a run down trailer that is nasty and disgusting. She has her daughter in this mess. She has her daughter with her while she is using drugs and various other things which I won't say. Her ex husband sues for custody and wins so now she has lost her daughter. It drove her deeper and deeper into drugs.
For about two years I didn't speak to her and it was killing my mom. For the longest time I was mentally ready to prepare a weeks worth of lesson plans so I could take off and go to NC for a funeral. She was that bad in it.
One night she was in a very depressed mood and started thinking about suicide. She walked to this bridge and stepped up onto the side and was inches away from stepping off and killing herself. She said at the last minute her daughters face went through her face and she backed off. She went directly to her ex husbands house where her daughter was. He took her in and helped her get admitted into a hospital under suicide watch. While I don't think he is good for her I do respect him for helping her. It would have been very easy to turn her away.
She got into rehab and met a guy in a Narcotics Anonymous meeting. They are now married and expecting their own child. Thankfully her daughter is a well balanced and happy child.
My parents were good hardworking people. They taught us right from wrong. We were middle class people with middle class values. We were taught to stay away from drugs and alcohol. My parents never drank alcohol in front of us.
The oldest child went down the wrong path and lived in a world that should never exist. Thank the good Lord that He helped her out of it. She has had some relapses in using drugs but overall has kept clean.
The youngest child (myself) would be considered a success. I was a good athlete in high school, played baseball in college, got a college degree, have a masters degree, got a great job teaching, head baseball coach, respected member of the community and I have never been drunk in my life. I have never tried a single drug.
Two kids raised the same way and they both take very different paths in life. This shows that if we don't get serious about fixing this problem our society is in trouble.
Addiction has no cure. You don't get medicine or therapy and be "fixed". An addict wakes up every day wanting to get high. They want to go back to their old ways. They just find the strength somehow to "take it one day at a time".
For every kid in a poor neighborhood who gets into drugs for whatever reason there is a middle class kid who gets into drugs for whatever reason. Sometimes your environment pushes you to that world. Sometimes you get bored and want to try it. Sometimes your brain is just "pre - programmed" to be an addict.
This is a battle that is much harder than people realize it is. We have to educate and be proactive to win this battle.
Sorry for the long post.
Coach thank you for sharing that. I have never met you but I feel like I know you. You are one hell of a great guy. Your honesty and your passion to do the right thing speaks right to my heart. The world needs more people like you. Your post shows that we are all human and we are all vulnerable. We all have problems and we all carry burdens.
"But for the grace of God ,there go I."
Who are we to judge anyone? It could be your son , my son , your sister , my brother, or you , or me.
We should all try to be people that think of others first. Others need our help , our sympathy and our understanding.
God bless you Coach. Thanks for sharing. I will pray for your sister and her daughter.
"But for the grace of God ,there go I."
Who are we to judge anyone? It could be your son , my son , your sister , my brother, or you , or me.
We should all try to be people that think of others first. Others need our help , our sympathy and our understanding.
God bless you Coach. Thanks for sharing. I will pray for your sister and her daughter.
Thank you coach. Those are very gracious and kind words. If I ever have kids I would be honored to have you coach or teach them.
Hopefully one day we can meet one another and have a sit down and talk. I believe I would be on the edge of my seat just listening to the things you have to say. Just from this website it shows through how good of a teacher and person you are.
God bless you and your family. If I remember correctly your son has signed to play with UNC (I sure hope that is right and if not I am very sorry) and I want you to know they have a new fan in me.
Hopefully one day we can meet one another and have a sit down and talk. I believe I would be on the edge of my seat just listening to the things you have to say. Just from this website it shows through how good of a teacher and person you are.
God bless you and your family. If I remember correctly your son has signed to play with UNC (I sure hope that is right and if not I am very sorry) and I want you to know they have a new fan in me.
Its mutual Coach. And yes he will be a Tar Heel. He is honored to have the opportunity. If your ever down this way let me know. Maybe we can catch a game together. It would be my pleasure.
I typically avoid these kinds of threads, because they usually turn into name calling/arguing nonsense. However, I'm glad someone pointed out to me that this one had great value.
I have/am parenting two HS athletes. While PED or drugs were never a problem that I was aware of with son or daughter's HS teams and my kids never used any kind of drug, I would have had absolutely no problem with any drug testing. I would have only perceived it as additional help in raising my children. The same way as I valued other parents keeping an eye on my kids when they were at some event - just as I would have watched over theirs.
We've had stories of poster's children on here where their lives were wrecked because of drugs during their HS years. CD shared that touching link. Sometimes the best of parents can't or don't have a clue to a problem their children have. Receiving assistance that backs up what we believe to know about our children or getting some help for those that are clueless - can only be a good thing IMO.
Regardless of what anyone thinks, I most sincerely appreciate the thoughts of all here - especially Coach May and Coach2709! Thanks for those personal pictures of your families! Sharing those personal images adds more credibility to a person's beliefs I think.
I have/am parenting two HS athletes. While PED or drugs were never a problem that I was aware of with son or daughter's HS teams and my kids never used any kind of drug, I would have had absolutely no problem with any drug testing. I would have only perceived it as additional help in raising my children. The same way as I valued other parents keeping an eye on my kids when they were at some event - just as I would have watched over theirs.
We've had stories of poster's children on here where their lives were wrecked because of drugs during their HS years. CD shared that touching link. Sometimes the best of parents can't or don't have a clue to a problem their children have. Receiving assistance that backs up what we believe to know about our children or getting some help for those that are clueless - can only be a good thing IMO.
Regardless of what anyone thinks, I most sincerely appreciate the thoughts of all here - especially Coach May and Coach2709! Thanks for those personal pictures of your families! Sharing those personal images adds more credibility to a person's beliefs I think.
When I read these moving stories, can't help but think of Jeff Allison.
Jeff was a kid I really liked a lot and he had the world on a string. A teenage millionaire on a one way trip to the Big Leagues. I really believe Jeff would be a Major League star by now. He was that talented and special.
However, he took a different path that has been well documented. Please don't anyone take this the wrong way, but I sure wish he would have chosen PEDs over Heroin. BTW, his problems all started by taking pain killers.
In our business we have seen many cases of drug related destruction. Some great kids and even great adults getting caught up in a bad way.
I know the subject is mostly about PEDs in baseball, but the title is The problem with HS Drug Testing
If testing ever happens at all our high schools, I'm for all students, all drugs, as often as possible!
Jeff was a kid I really liked a lot and he had the world on a string. A teenage millionaire on a one way trip to the Big Leagues. I really believe Jeff would be a Major League star by now. He was that talented and special.
However, he took a different path that has been well documented. Please don't anyone take this the wrong way, but I sure wish he would have chosen PEDs over Heroin. BTW, his problems all started by taking pain killers.
In our business we have seen many cases of drug related destruction. Some great kids and even great adults getting caught up in a bad way.
I know the subject is mostly about PEDs in baseball, but the title is The problem with HS Drug Testing
If testing ever happens at all our high schools, I'm for all students, all drugs, as often as possible!
When I was in HS I had the honor to play football for a “no-non-sense”, “tell it like it is” coach by the name of Chuck Dickerson, “The Coach”. This man had success at all levels as a player and a coach ending up as the Buffalo Bill’s offensive line coach under Marv Levy. I believe he had a sports talk show in Buffalo after that. Coach had a tremendous impact on me, for life, regarding the responsibility (and accountability) an individual has to his team. Right is right, wrong is wrong, no grey. Believe me learning this lesson, at times did not come easy.
When he left our HS to move onto the professional ranks, Coach gave us a card with this poem on it. This poem speaks of each generation's responsibilities to its successors. I am not trying to change the subject or distract from the topic, just share something that comes to mind while reading the previous heart-breaking posts on this thread.
THE BRIDGE BUILDER
An old man, going a lone highway,
Came at the evening cold and gray,
To a chasm, vast and deep and wide,
Through which was flowing a sullen tide.
The old man crossed in the twilight dim-
That sullen stream had no fears for him;
But he turned, when he reached the other side,
And built a bridge to span the tide.
"Old man," said a fellow pilgrim near,
"You are wasting strength in building here.
Your journey will end with the ending day;
You never again must pass this way.
You have crossed the chasm, deep and wide,
Why build you the bridge at the eventide?"
The builder lifted his old gray head.
"Good friend, in the path I have come," he said,
"There followeth after me today
A youth whose feet must pass this way.
This chasm that has been naught to me
To that fair-haired youth may a pitfall be.
He, too, must cross in the twilight dim;
Good friend, I am building the bridge for him."
-WILL ALLEN DROMGOOLE
When he left our HS to move onto the professional ranks, Coach gave us a card with this poem on it. This poem speaks of each generation's responsibilities to its successors. I am not trying to change the subject or distract from the topic, just share something that comes to mind while reading the previous heart-breaking posts on this thread.
THE BRIDGE BUILDER
An old man, going a lone highway,
Came at the evening cold and gray,
To a chasm, vast and deep and wide,
Through which was flowing a sullen tide.
The old man crossed in the twilight dim-
That sullen stream had no fears for him;
But he turned, when he reached the other side,
And built a bridge to span the tide.
"Old man," said a fellow pilgrim near,
"You are wasting strength in building here.
Your journey will end with the ending day;
You never again must pass this way.
You have crossed the chasm, deep and wide,
Why build you the bridge at the eventide?"
The builder lifted his old gray head.
"Good friend, in the path I have come," he said,
"There followeth after me today
A youth whose feet must pass this way.
This chasm that has been naught to me
To that fair-haired youth may a pitfall be.
He, too, must cross in the twilight dim;
Good friend, I am building the bridge for him."
-WILL ALLEN DROMGOOLE
I'm sure there's too much of it going on at our high school and the neighboring high school where the parking lot is loaded with hand me down Mercedes, Beemers, Volvos, Lexuses and Saabs coming off their leases. Too much money and too much time can be a recipe for disaster.quote:It also shows how terrible drugs are because it's easy to look at the lower classes and "expect" them to be doing it.
quote:Originally posted by PGStaff:
Please don't anyone take this the wrong way, but I sure wish he would have chosen PEDs over Heroin. BTW, his problems all started by taking pain killers.
There's different drug user categories, as we well know. Allison, like the hundreds if not thousands of alchohol and drug abusers I have personally worked with, was a classic addiction.
It's generally not the drug that intiates the problem, it's the easily profiled package of character defects that are ubiquitous among addicts. To put it in succinct terms, addicts are unhappy with they way the feel about themselves, enjoy the escape from that feeling that the drug provides, and continue to look to maintain or enhance that feeling with rising drug abuse resulting in those character defects multiplying. A classic downward spiral that doesn't end until they hit bottom.
Bottom is a pain threshold, that forces the individual to want to change. Each of us has different pain thresholds. While for one, their bottom may be a DUI, losing a job, or a domestic battery charge, for another on the opposite end of the scale, it may be total destruction of their lives and homelessness and/or prison. Still others never reach it and die addicted. I believe strongly, that none of these people can be threatened or forced, into any form of compliance. They are addicts, and addicts find a way, in spite of the ramifications.
A drug test isn't going to help a Jeff Allison, because he can't stand feeling the way he does about himself and needs a release. That's not to say people like him are without hope until they crash. If they can find a way to begin to feel good about the person they are, they can avoid the crutch.
I know that this is not the whole basis for this discussion, because there are plenty of kids that die and get screwed up just from experimentation and recreational use. Overuse of a drug does not make an addict, it makes a drug user. I just wanted to shed some light on the difference.
My view - compliments of Jim M. - and some poetic license.
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my ankles
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my knee
There's PEDS in the streets in the town of Chicago
PEDS on the rise, it's following me
Think about the break of day
PEDS came and they didnt drive away
PEDS in the hair
PEDS came
PEDS in the streets run a river of sadness
PEDS in the streets it's up to my thigh
The river runs down the legs of the city
And we are crying red rivers of weepin'
PEDS came into town and they didnt drive away
PEDS in the hair
Athletes scattered on dawn's highway bleeding
Athletes crowd the young child's fragile eggshell mind
PEDS in the streets in the town of New Haven
PEDS stains the roofs and the palm trees of Venice
PEDS in my love in the terrible summer
Bloody red PEDS of fantastic L.A.
PEDS streams through our brain as they chop off our fingers
PEDS have been been born in the birth of a nation
PEDS are the rose of mysterious union
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my ankles
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my knee
There's PEDS in the streets in the town of Chicago
PEDS on the rise, it's following me
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my ankles
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my knee
There's PEDS in the streets in the town of Chicago
PEDS on the rise, it's following me
Think about the break of day
PEDS came and they didnt drive away
PEDS in the hair
PEDS came
PEDS in the streets run a river of sadness
PEDS in the streets it's up to my thigh
The river runs down the legs of the city
And we are crying red rivers of weepin'
PEDS came into town and they didnt drive away
PEDS in the hair
Athletes scattered on dawn's highway bleeding
Athletes crowd the young child's fragile eggshell mind
PEDS in the streets in the town of New Haven
PEDS stains the roofs and the palm trees of Venice
PEDS in my love in the terrible summer
Bloody red PEDS of fantastic L.A.
PEDS streams through our brain as they chop off our fingers
PEDS have been been born in the birth of a nation
PEDS are the rose of mysterious union
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my ankles
There's PEDS in the streets, it's up to my knee
There's PEDS in the streets in the town of Chicago
PEDS on the rise, it's following me
JEFF ALLISON IS A POSTER-CHILD EXAMPLE OF WHY WE SHOULD TEST HIGH SCHOOL ATHELETS!
We do not know and no-one can say with authority if a drug test would have helped Jeff Allison. Would have, should have, could have… No one can state what was (is) going through Allison’s head but Allison. This kid, 2003 Baseball America High School Player of the Year, in an article in Baseball America stated; "I don't care where you're from," Allison said. "I know where I'm from and I'm going to dominate you. It's a different mentality I've had all my life." Does that sound like a kid who “can't stand feeling the way he does about himself”. He said this in HS! I do know that one thing; the pain killer OxyContin makes the user feel invincible. Was it the drug talking? Connect the dots…
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/leagues/HS_amateur/03_AllisonPOY.html
Carlos Frias, a Palm Beach Post staff writer on Wednesday March 16, 2005 wrote; “The pride of Peabody High was a drug addict and nobody could help him. The adults closest to Allison never caught on. Lifelong friends who suspected a problem couldn't make him stop. Those using drugs with him spoke out only when it was too late.”
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/content/sports/epa...a1c_allison_0315.htm
The above links can be used to reference these quotes but they are also compelling reading.
Addiction is complicated. There is not a single cause and to state that it is a result of a “character defect” is overly simplistic and unfair to addicts. This implies that the addicts, given their defective personalities, are to blame for their illness (and BTW it is an illness). However, I do agree a HS student athlete may have a psychological vulnerability, a predisposition that makes a pattern of drug abuse more likely to begin. It can be one of many contributing factors. Who but a trained professional can recognize this component of drug addiction during the stressful, hormonal, self-loathing adolescent high school years? Any bet he/she would order a drug TEST to confirm. One thing addicts do well is hid their addiction. One thing adolescents do well is hid information from their parents. A drug addicted adolescent or one habitually using is a tough one to pick up on, for parents and teachers.
One component of addiction is habit. That’s why they call them “habit forming” substances. Where are most of our life long habits formed? Any parent will tell you they start loosing authority in high school. By junior or senior year, for the most part, they are thinking for themselves (this is a good thing, part of growing up). What if your son or daughter is developing bad habits, really bad habits like drug use, and concealing it from you. Is that their right? Come on people this is not rocket science. Jeff Allison’s parents & coach didn’t pick up on his drug use and his friends who new were not going to come forward. How can anyone say that a HS athletic drug testing program would not have helped this kid? The sad truth is we will never know.
This is my own self educated opinion. I am not an expert on addiction and do not have any professional credentials on this subject to speak with authority. However, my father died of complications due to alcoholism at a very young age and our family has struggled with my 26 year old niece’s addiction to heroine (since the age of 14) clean and sober for 2 years.
I beg to differ with anyone who thinks that a HS drug testing program/policy would not have helped Jeff Allison. I guess we will just have to “agree to disagree”.
What 800 pound gorilla… shhhhhh maybe it will go away.
We do not know and no-one can say with authority if a drug test would have helped Jeff Allison. Would have, should have, could have… No one can state what was (is) going through Allison’s head but Allison. This kid, 2003 Baseball America High School Player of the Year, in an article in Baseball America stated; "I don't care where you're from," Allison said. "I know where I'm from and I'm going to dominate you. It's a different mentality I've had all my life." Does that sound like a kid who “can't stand feeling the way he does about himself”. He said this in HS! I do know that one thing; the pain killer OxyContin makes the user feel invincible. Was it the drug talking? Connect the dots…
http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/leagues/HS_amateur/03_AllisonPOY.html
Carlos Frias, a Palm Beach Post staff writer on Wednesday March 16, 2005 wrote; “The pride of Peabody High was a drug addict and nobody could help him. The adults closest to Allison never caught on. Lifelong friends who suspected a problem couldn't make him stop. Those using drugs with him spoke out only when it was too late.”
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/marlins/content/sports/epa...a1c_allison_0315.htm
The above links can be used to reference these quotes but they are also compelling reading.
Addiction is complicated. There is not a single cause and to state that it is a result of a “character defect” is overly simplistic and unfair to addicts. This implies that the addicts, given their defective personalities, are to blame for their illness (and BTW it is an illness). However, I do agree a HS student athlete may have a psychological vulnerability, a predisposition that makes a pattern of drug abuse more likely to begin. It can be one of many contributing factors. Who but a trained professional can recognize this component of drug addiction during the stressful, hormonal, self-loathing adolescent high school years? Any bet he/she would order a drug TEST to confirm. One thing addicts do well is hid their addiction. One thing adolescents do well is hid information from their parents. A drug addicted adolescent or one habitually using is a tough one to pick up on, for parents and teachers.
One component of addiction is habit. That’s why they call them “habit forming” substances. Where are most of our life long habits formed? Any parent will tell you they start loosing authority in high school. By junior or senior year, for the most part, they are thinking for themselves (this is a good thing, part of growing up). What if your son or daughter is developing bad habits, really bad habits like drug use, and concealing it from you. Is that their right? Come on people this is not rocket science. Jeff Allison’s parents & coach didn’t pick up on his drug use and his friends who new were not going to come forward. How can anyone say that a HS athletic drug testing program would not have helped this kid? The sad truth is we will never know.
This is my own self educated opinion. I am not an expert on addiction and do not have any professional credentials on this subject to speak with authority. However, my father died of complications due to alcoholism at a very young age and our family has struggled with my 26 year old niece’s addiction to heroine (since the age of 14) clean and sober for 2 years.
I beg to differ with anyone who thinks that a HS drug testing program/policy would not have helped Jeff Allison. I guess we will just have to “agree to disagree”.
What 800 pound gorilla… shhhhhh maybe it will go away.
quote:Originally posted by Smokey:
This is my own self educated opinion. I am not an expert on addiction and do not have any professional credentials on this subject to speak with authority. However, my father died of complications due to alcoholism at a very young age and our family has struggled with my 26 year old niece’s addiction to heroine (since the age of 14) clean and sober for 2 years.
I beg to differ with anyone who thinks that a HS drug testing program/policy would not have helped Jeff Allison. I guess we will just have to “agree to disagree”.
We can disagree. Many who lack the experience think they have answers when it comes to dealing with addicts.
Actually Allisons confidence and bravado are classic addictive personality traits. I heard a great definition of an addict once, "an egomaniac with an inferiority complex". We all have character defects, addicts character defects are just very patternable and easily profiled because they are nearly identical from addict to addict. That's why they say it takes an addict to cure an addict...they went down the same road before, regardless of the substance of choice, and have recovered from their desperation and illness.
Please don't mistake my explanation of the difference between drug abuse and addictive behavior as one of ignoring the problem, like your 800 pound gorilla analogy.
I'll give a great example, Brett Favre. Bretts addiction to Vicodin was just that, a person addicted to to an addictive substance. He continued to crave the drug and did so until he got help. An addict, would have escalated his use dramatically (although the time frame in which he does so varies drastically), and in most cases moved up the ladder of addictive substances (ala Jeff Allison). The reason the addict does this, is that those feelings of not liking ones self, eventually always pop through to the surface at some point, regardless of what drug or how much. So the addict needs to continually raise dosages or change to a more effective drug to keep the demon, his self perception, masked underneath. Was Brett an addict, not in the classic sense. He was a drug abuser because of an addictive substance and not from the specific character defects that need to be cured for addictive personalities to recover from their illness.
Your opinion about helping Jeff Allison with a drug test may be right. Mine that disagrees stems from 10's of thousands of hours working with alchoholics and addicts (which are essentially the same), and originates deeper still.
Pardon me… I don’t know how to do the quote things…..
Statement:
Your opinion about helping Jeff Allison with a drug test may be right. Mine that disagrees stems from 10's of thousands of hours working with alchoholics (sp) and addicts (which are essentially the same), and originates deeper still.
Response:
CPLZ we disagree and will leave it at that, period. In your vernacular; mine that disagrees stems from living these issues, alcoholism and drug addiction, 24/7/365.
Given your 10’s of thousands of hours working with alcoholics and addicts, it surprises me that you would be against a tool, testing, as an opportunity to detect this habitual destructive behavior that is so harmful to our youth.
This thread was started to discuss the problems with drug testing HS athletes. I do not find a problem with it. Test away and make the athlete accountable if he fails the test.
“And that's all I have to say about that.” ~ Forrest Gump
Statement:
Your opinion about helping Jeff Allison with a drug test may be right. Mine that disagrees stems from 10's of thousands of hours working with alchoholics (sp) and addicts (which are essentially the same), and originates deeper still.
Response:
CPLZ we disagree and will leave it at that, period. In your vernacular; mine that disagrees stems from living these issues, alcoholism and drug addiction, 24/7/365.
Given your 10’s of thousands of hours working with alcoholics and addicts, it surprises me that you would be against a tool, testing, as an opportunity to detect this habitual destructive behavior that is so harmful to our youth.
This thread was started to discuss the problems with drug testing HS athletes. I do not find a problem with it. Test away and make the athlete accountable if he fails the test.
“And that's all I have to say about that.” ~ Forrest Gump
while jeff alison gets all the press. his hs was over run with occycotone problems. kids with schoolly's for other sports.hockey players girls lacrosse ,football etc. even some of the coaches kids had the monkey on their back. some lost the fight.unfortunatly not much interest in giving a hoot about it until it was someone of notoriety .
things like this should make parents concerned enough to take action. when you need help is not the time to act. even if you feel, as we all do that your son or daughter wouldn't do this stuff. maybe your neighbors kid would? a urine test is a start,but a caring community helps as well.
sorry but it reily is an overlooked problem, most of us hold our breath it doesn't happen to us.
things like this should make parents concerned enough to take action. when you need help is not the time to act. even if you feel, as we all do that your son or daughter wouldn't do this stuff. maybe your neighbors kid would? a urine test is a start,but a caring community helps as well.
sorry but it reily is an overlooked problem, most of us hold our breath it doesn't happen to us.
I don't mean to sound ignorant or anything. What do you do if you suspect someone of "drug use". Do you tell the parents? The school? The kid? And then what? When do you get concerned? What if your kid comes home and mentions something about kids using steroids in the high school locker room? And one of the kids is the assistant principal's son? Or the principal's son is rumored to be on cocaine? What about casual pot smoking?
Really, what do you do? And as a parent who is told that, what do you do? Confront the kid? And if it's a "yes", then what do you do?
I know it's a problem everywhere, and this thread is rich in stories about just how difficult and explosive it is. But take it all the way down the ladder--- What if there is high school drug testing and your kid tests positive. Then what?
Really, what do you do? And as a parent who is told that, what do you do? Confront the kid? And if it's a "yes", then what do you do?
I know it's a problem everywhere, and this thread is rich in stories about just how difficult and explosive it is. But take it all the way down the ladder--- What if there is high school drug testing and your kid tests positive. Then what?
play baseball,
I don't know that answer, I guess no one has the answers. I don know that as a parent, for my own kids, I educated myself in what I was told to be signs of drug use that one should differentiate between noraml teen behavior and a drug problem. I never was the "not my kids" type. I just knew that there are times when some experimenting turns into dependancy and I wanted to be prepared for it if it happened (yes this can happen to anyone's child). It was a bit easier back then, alcohol was more assessible than drugs for both my kids but there seems to be real problems these days.
I was asked to participate in an awareness campaign for a problem going on in our schools, if any of you are aware or not. Pieces of candy are being laced with highly addictive meth and passed out at school for free. I understand that there are many cases where that ONE piece of candy can cause addiction. It's not a space out drugged feeling but one of happiness and peace of mind. With that in mind the next piece of candy is 2 dollars and bought 10 or more at a time. The use becomes more freguent as it is laced on the candy and not unpleasant tasting and the person selling it is now making a bundle and the person using is now an addict. Meth addicts are hard to spot until it's too late, so they tell me.
I confronted one of my son's friends parents (I had known her for upteen years) regarding a bottle of vodka found in my son's closet
that supposedly belonged to her son. I poured it out and then son's friend was mad at him. She kind of brushed it off and told me she would speak to him. A few months later he crashed his car into a pole that collapsed and missed him. She was so happy he was not arrested for DUI. 
This also was my son's friend who tested positive at his school and had to leave the bb program knowing the coach would never give him a chance to make that team on that alone. Transfered to another school, I understand he was out partying hardy while others were observing curfew. He got cut.
As a parent of this players good friend I did what I thought was best, it didn't help.
This was very hard for my son to watch, but a good lesson, he tells me to this day when he watches the top ranked pro hitters at bat, he knows his friend could have been much better at the plate, but he will never have that chance to prove it. Sad really.
I don't know that answer, I guess no one has the answers. I don know that as a parent, for my own kids, I educated myself in what I was told to be signs of drug use that one should differentiate between noraml teen behavior and a drug problem. I never was the "not my kids" type. I just knew that there are times when some experimenting turns into dependancy and I wanted to be prepared for it if it happened (yes this can happen to anyone's child). It was a bit easier back then, alcohol was more assessible than drugs for both my kids but there seems to be real problems these days.
I was asked to participate in an awareness campaign for a problem going on in our schools, if any of you are aware or not. Pieces of candy are being laced with highly addictive meth and passed out at school for free. I understand that there are many cases where that ONE piece of candy can cause addiction. It's not a space out drugged feeling but one of happiness and peace of mind. With that in mind the next piece of candy is 2 dollars and bought 10 or more at a time. The use becomes more freguent as it is laced on the candy and not unpleasant tasting and the person selling it is now making a bundle and the person using is now an addict. Meth addicts are hard to spot until it's too late, so they tell me.
I confronted one of my son's friends parents (I had known her for upteen years) regarding a bottle of vodka found in my son's closet
that supposedly belonged to her son. I poured it out and then son's friend was mad at him. She kind of brushed it off and told me she would speak to him. A few months later he crashed his car into a pole that collapsed and missed him. She was so happy he was not arrested for DUI. This also was my son's friend who tested positive at his school and had to leave the bb program knowing the coach would never give him a chance to make that team on that alone. Transfered to another school, I understand he was out partying hardy while others were observing curfew. He got cut.As a parent of this players good friend I did what I thought was best, it didn't help.
This was very hard for my son to watch, but a good lesson, he tells me to this day when he watches the top ranked pro hitters at bat, he knows his friend could have been much better at the plate, but he will never have that chance to prove it. Sad really.
Smokey,
Look down at the botton of the post where you want to quote and loggesd in hit that folder with teh " and the post comes up in quotes. You can delete the parst you don't want to quote in your post.
Look down at the botton of the post where you want to quote and loggesd in hit that folder with teh " and the post comes up in quotes. You can delete the parst you don't want to quote in your post.
play baseball what you put isn't ignorant - it's a very important thing that MOST people ask themselves. Things don't happen becaue people don't know what to do OR when confronted with problems people stick their head in the sand or don't take it seriously.
TPM that is a sad story and I am glad your son learned a lesson by it. Also, try to take comfort in the fact that you did all you could to help the boy. Based on what you said about your friend brushed it off I am going to make the statement that this parent failed her child. If I am wrong and this parent did eventually try to do something then I apologize.
I guess a generic answer to "what to do" would be...
Preventitive actions
EDUCATION - early on teach kids (schools, parents, coaches etc...) that drugs are bad. Figure out an age for kids to be told / shown real stories of people who became addicted. Show them the dirty truth. Need to be careful not to do it too early in a child's development but early enough they should learn from it.
TESTING - start at the middle school / JR high school level. Test them at this age - 12 - 15 years old. There are a lot of kids who get started at this age so get them early. The earlier you can get someone help the better the chance of fixing the problem.
EGOS AND IGNORANCE - eliminate these problems as best you can. Teach soon to be parents tips, techniques and strategies of how to avoid the drug problem with their kids. I think the ego will be the hardest to eliminate. Parents have to get their head out of the sand and face potential problems.
Current Users
TESTING - if someone is a confirmed user test them weekly. Eliminate any free time they could have to use.
COUNSELING - AA type meetings with other users are successful so make them mandatory. Mandatory meetings with a private counselor / psychologist to help with emotional problems. Scared straight programs to show people where their life is probably heading. Take them to jails and homeless areas and talk to these people. Open eyes.
LAWS - drop the hammer on dealers and manufactuerers of drugs. Make getting caught something they don't want to do.
DON'T WORRY ABOUT FEELINGS - if getting someone help or opening someones eyes to a problem their child has hurts their feelings then tough ****. Do something.
Problems
1. You are not going to catch everyone. Sad but it's the truth.
2. Paying for it. This is going to be expensive. All money taken from drug related arrests or confiscations go directly into this program. Plus, we finally go to a federally subsidized health care program. Go see how other countries do it and copy them.
I know others will have better / other ideas that will be much better than mine but hopefully this could be a start.
While I don't agree with her politically Hillary Clinton said it best: "It takes a village to raise a child"
TPM that is a sad story and I am glad your son learned a lesson by it. Also, try to take comfort in the fact that you did all you could to help the boy. Based on what you said about your friend brushed it off I am going to make the statement that this parent failed her child. If I am wrong and this parent did eventually try to do something then I apologize.
I guess a generic answer to "what to do" would be...
Preventitive actions
EDUCATION - early on teach kids (schools, parents, coaches etc...) that drugs are bad. Figure out an age for kids to be told / shown real stories of people who became addicted. Show them the dirty truth. Need to be careful not to do it too early in a child's development but early enough they should learn from it.
TESTING - start at the middle school / JR high school level. Test them at this age - 12 - 15 years old. There are a lot of kids who get started at this age so get them early. The earlier you can get someone help the better the chance of fixing the problem.
EGOS AND IGNORANCE - eliminate these problems as best you can. Teach soon to be parents tips, techniques and strategies of how to avoid the drug problem with their kids. I think the ego will be the hardest to eliminate. Parents have to get their head out of the sand and face potential problems.
Current Users
TESTING - if someone is a confirmed user test them weekly. Eliminate any free time they could have to use.
COUNSELING - AA type meetings with other users are successful so make them mandatory. Mandatory meetings with a private counselor / psychologist to help with emotional problems. Scared straight programs to show people where their life is probably heading. Take them to jails and homeless areas and talk to these people. Open eyes.
LAWS - drop the hammer on dealers and manufactuerers of drugs. Make getting caught something they don't want to do.
DON'T WORRY ABOUT FEELINGS - if getting someone help or opening someones eyes to a problem their child has hurts their feelings then tough ****. Do something.
Problems
1. You are not going to catch everyone. Sad but it's the truth.
2. Paying for it. This is going to be expensive. All money taken from drug related arrests or confiscations go directly into this program. Plus, we finally go to a federally subsidized health care program. Go see how other countries do it and copy them.
I know others will have better / other ideas that will be much better than mine but hopefully this could be a start.
While I don't agree with her politically Hillary Clinton said it best: "It takes a village to raise a child"