9th grade team = developmental team for the future
quote:9th grade team = developmental team for the future
Have them sign a contract that they will not leave for the duration of their HS career and your point is made. Otherwise, you play with what you have from year to year.
Contracts mean nothing-- Just more PC mumbo jumbo
I still develop the kids I EXPECT to be here not the ones I know for a fact WILL NOT
I still develop the kids I EXPECT to be here not the ones I know for a fact WILL NOT
The kid's enrollment/tuition entitles him to earn anything the school has to offer this year. From a varsity/development perspective the sixteenth ranked freshman player, who gets cut is more unlikely to ever make varsity than it is for the stud kid to change his mind and stay at the school. If the stud kid is cut you're guaranteeing he transfers.
For those who would cut the kid .....
A talented freshman moves to town who projects to be a solid varsity contributor by junior year. The father is in the corporate world. You find out the family has been transferred and moved every two years for the past ten years. Do you cut the kid on the assumption he won't be around junior year?
A talented freshman moves to town who projects to be a solid varsity contributor by junior year. The father is in the corporate world. You find out the family has been transferred and moved every two years for the past ten years. Do you cut the kid on the assumption he won't be around junior year?
For those who would cut the kid ....
Your school receives a freshman Dominican exchange student. He'll only be at the school one year. He's in the US to learn from the experience. Student exchange programs are about new experiences and good will. Do you cut him from the freshman team?
Your school receives a freshman Dominican exchange student. He'll only be at the school one year. He's in the US to learn from the experience. Student exchange programs are about new experiences and good will. Do you cut him from the freshman team?
Difference---this kid has papers for transfer already in the works according to TCB
Just had a conversation with a top college coach regarding this situation and asked him what he would do--his answer was simple--the kid does not make the team--in fact this year he has cut seniors because he has freshman better than they are
Just had a conversation with a top college coach regarding this situation and asked him what he would do--his answer was simple--the kid does not make the team--in fact this year he has cut seniors because he has freshman better than they are
quote:I still develop the kids I EXPECT to be here not the ones I know for a fact WILL NOT
quote:Contracts mean nothing-- Just more PC mumbo jumbo
So, if the kid says, guess what I'm staying. Then what do you do? Do you still cut him? The point is words are just that. Kids can come and go, your job as a HS Coach is to work with what you have. If you don't like it, then Coach a travel team and get out of Coaching HS kids where you have no control over who is available from year to year.
RJM - agree.
quote:Just had a conversation with a top college coach regarding this situation and asked him what he would do--his answer was simple--the kid does not make the team--in fact this year he has cut seniors because he has freshman better than they are
Ah - the difference for the College Coach is the incoming Freshman kids are better - That was never conveyed in this scenario. In fact, this kid is said to be better than others trying out.
dub
You totally ignore the developmental aspect which to me is key here
And what does it being a Catholic school have to do with anything, including coaches ethics/ Why do people such as yourself keep going to religion and/or politics in situations like this--it is simply a baseball decision, nothing more, nothing less
You totally ignore the developmental aspect which to me is key here
And what does it being a Catholic school have to do with anything, including coaches ethics/ Why do people such as yourself keep going to religion and/or politics in situations like this--it is simply a baseball decision, nothing more, nothing less
TR - I do get the development aspect and in a perfect world, where kids don't move, get injured or burn out, it works out great. That is why travel teams are easier to Coach - because you have control. HS you do not have that luxury. This kid may decide he loves it at this school, because his baseball experience was great, you just don't know. That is why I think you keep the best.
You can't rely on the kids being there from year to year. The point is, HS Coaches have no control over who will stay, go, or if the the next Bryce Harper will be moving into the district. So you work with what you have from year to year.
You can't rely on the kids being there from year to year. The point is, HS Coaches have no control over who will stay, go, or if the the next Bryce Harper will be moving into the district. So you work with what you have from year to year.
quote:This kid may decide he loves it at this school, because his baseball experience was great, you just don't know.
No offense dub but here's the flipside to what you just put. This kid has probably been there since August. He's probably met the other baseball players and heard what they think of the program. If that is so and he's still got the transfer papers then he wants out. There is still something not right about the whole situation but he's probably been there long enough to know what he's getting into and he wants out. Obviously all of this could be wrong if the kid transferred in sometime not too long ago but that just makes the whole situation even MORE weird.
Do you really want a kid on the team who doesn't want to be there? The impression I'm getting is this kid wants out and no idea why he doesn't want out now. I just got the feeling (and I'm probably wrong because that tends to happen a lot) that if he's on the team some sort of huge drama is going to happen. By cutting him and letting him work out you help this kid stay sharp but he won't be a distraction. He'll show up whenever he wants, throws, takes some groundballs / flyballs, cuts and maybe some bullpen work but if he becomes a distraction then send him home.
Coach 2709 - I see your point. But still I would air on the side of caution. Why would the kid try out at all if he doesn't want to be a part of the program?
Two things.
1. Cutting a kid that should be on the team (he is one of the top 5 kids) just doesn't sit well with me. Obviously, there is a difference in opinion as whether you are wasting a spot. If he is in the top 5, you are not.
2. Parents shooting their mouth off about whether or not they are staying or going, like the coach, don't like the program is just that. Having been around, I have seen plenty of great kids and players who come from parents who are overly opinionated, and I don't think the kids should have to pay the price for their parent's transgressions. We have yet to find out if this kid even knows about his Mom's intent.
I agree there is something missing.
Two things.
1. Cutting a kid that should be on the team (he is one of the top 5 kids) just doesn't sit well with me. Obviously, there is a difference in opinion as whether you are wasting a spot. If he is in the top 5, you are not.
2. Parents shooting their mouth off about whether or not they are staying or going, like the coach, don't like the program is just that. Having been around, I have seen plenty of great kids and players who come from parents who are overly opinionated, and I don't think the kids should have to pay the price for their parent's transgressions. We have yet to find out if this kid even knows about his Mom's intent.
I agree there is something missing.
quote:Do you really want a kid on the team who doesn't want to be there? The
Isn't this rather presumptive and punitive in intent.
The OP has given the reasons the guy is transferring. Nothing negative toward his present school.
quote:Would that not also be true of seniors who will not be in your program the following year due to graduation?
That is what happened at my son's college. The new coaches told the SRs that their roll was a mentoring roll and they wouldn't see conference action. It was a disaster. He is doing it again this season.
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
dub
You totally ignore the developmental aspect which to me is key here
And what does it being a Catholic school have to do with anything, including coaches ethics/ Why do people such as yourself keep going to religion and/or politics in situations like this--it is simply a baseball decision, nothing more, nothing less
Again, it something you don't understand. Don't worry about it. It obviously doesn't affect you.
quote:We have yet to find out if this kid even knows about his Mom's intent.
dub this is a great point and honestly I was working on the assumption that he did know about the transfer. If he doesn't know about the transfer that does change things in my eyes. I have always tried my best to not let what stupid things parents do affect how I feel about and treat their son's on the team (really hard sometimes).
BHD - after reading dub's post yes it can be presumptive unless the kid does know about the transfer. If he knows about the transfer request then I don't see it as presumptive or punitive.
I also think it's different than the two situations that RJM (I think it was him) that said what about a kid who has parents that have jobs that could force them to move or the Dominical exchange student. In the first case there really isn't a choice by the kid or the parents. The choice is out of their hands and probably a good chance they want to stay. As for the foreign exchange student that is a situation the whole experience is bigger than the individuals involved. It's something the kid will experience that most people he knows will never get. I would probably keep this kid even if he's never heard of the game just to be around the atmosphere of the team.
In the case of this kid he has a choice to stay or leave. He's (or his parents) are choosing to leave. It's tough situation and I'm glad I'm not the one going through it. It's easy for me to sit here and say a bunch of stuff because honestly I'm emotionally unattached to the situation. I don't have to look the kid in the eyes (unless I decide to post a list.....just playing guys) and say you're cut. If I was in this situation I might be going the other way. I have tried to be a little bit devil's advocate also because I think this topic deserves consideration for debate. Overall though this is just a squirrely situation that doesn't set too well with me. There's something missing but no idea what it is.
TCB1 what does the AD say about the situation? How does he feel about your leaning towards cutting this kid?
Jimmy00000
You have no idea whatsoever what I understand, not even close--don't assume that you do--
You have no idea whatsoever what I understand, not even close--don't assume that you do--
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
Jimmy00000
You have no idea whatsoever what I understand, not even close--don't assume that you do--
TWHit:
We all have some some idea of what you understand. You told us in a previous post...[i]"And what does it being a Catholic school have to do with anything, including coaches ethics/ Why do people such as yourself keep going to religion and/or politics in situations like this--it is simply a baseball decision, nothing more, nothing less"[/i*
Has your memory gone the way of your reading comprehension?
If you understood, you wouldn't have had to ask the question.
jimmy0000
You are more condescending then I even imagined--you must be one heck of a teacher do you bring your "attitude' to the lectern and chalkboard in your classroom ?
You are more condescending then I even imagined--you must be one heck of a teacher do you bring your "attitude' to the lectern and chalkboard in your classroom ?
Let's flip this and say coach has rumored that he will not be at the school he is presently coaching next season, does the AD remove him from coaching this season. This is exactly what the coach is doing to player. It would be interesting to see how the coach would handle the situation if he was in the same position as the player.
Not the same thing--
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
jimmy0000
You are more condescending then I even imagined--you must be one heck of a teacher
TWHit, you constantly misread and/or misrepresent what others post. Is it condescension to correct you when you make inaccurate accusations?
Is it condescension to remind you of your own posts when you are make statements contrary to your own previous statements?
Is it condescension to point out that your demonstrated hatred and constant bashing of umpires has grown tiresome?
Personally, I don't think so. But if you do, I can live with that.
I must be confused--I thought we are offering opinions here---
How do umpires enter into this thread--OPEN YOUR EYES--- don't allow your dislike for me to blind you
Your final remark simple shows you thinking and small mindedness towards me and anyone who debates with umpires or you individually
And yes I have never met an umpire , except one group in RI, that I would sit down for a drink with. I have an utter distate for most of them and I am not ashamed to admit it--
I would truly like to bring you to RI and let the guys I use there teach you a thing or two---they do 45 games in 4 days and in all the years I have been doing the event not one team has complained about them--in fact they compiment me on them
How do umpires enter into this thread--OPEN YOUR EYES--- don't allow your dislike for me to blind you
Your final remark simple shows you thinking and small mindedness towards me and anyone who debates with umpires or you individually
And yes I have never met an umpire , except one group in RI, that I would sit down for a drink with. I have an utter distate for most of them and I am not ashamed to admit it--
I would truly like to bring you to RI and let the guys I use there teach you a thing or two---they do 45 games in 4 days and in all the years I have been doing the event not one team has complained about them--in fact they compiment me on them
In the OP TCB1 said that he was going to keep 14 or 15 players:
"However, we have 21 kids trying out for 14 or 15 spots. Kids 17 through 21 probably wouldn't be kept anway based on their abilities. But players 15 and 16 might make the team, depending on the numbers. So do you bump one of them for the more talented player who is here for one year? Or do keep a more marginal kid who might actually be around next year?"
Unless there is a roster limit - and I'd find it hard to believe that it would be 14 or 15 - why not just keep 15 or 16? It is a simple answer to a "problem" that may or may not end up happening. Just because someone asked for transfer papers doesn't mean it is going to happen.
TR, the first words of the post: "4-year Catholic high school." It obviously matters to the OP...
"However, we have 21 kids trying out for 14 or 15 spots. Kids 17 through 21 probably wouldn't be kept anway based on their abilities. But players 15 and 16 might make the team, depending on the numbers. So do you bump one of them for the more talented player who is here for one year? Or do keep a more marginal kid who might actually be around next year?"
Unless there is a roster limit - and I'd find it hard to believe that it would be 14 or 15 - why not just keep 15 or 16? It is a simple answer to a "problem" that may or may not end up happening. Just because someone asked for transfer papers doesn't mean it is going to happen.
TR, the first words of the post: "4-year Catholic high school." It obviously matters to the OP...
quote:And yes I have never met an umpire , except one group in RI, that I would sit down for a drink with. I have an utter distate for most of them and I am not ashamed to admit it--
Ugh. This has turned into what I thought was a thoughtful debate, to childish taunts. TR, you are not improving my view of you. I'm certain you don't care, but I'm just saying if you want to garner respect, you have to show respect.
Coach 2709 - Let's say for the sake of this scenario that the kid does know, but he isn't on board 100%. His mom is the driving force - maybe if he were given a shot on the team, he might convince her otherwise.
I'm with you, too many holes. I get why you want to get on with the kids who stay, but I come back to why would this kid even show up to a tryout if he didn't care? If he puts little to no effort in at the tryout, then cut, but if he hustles and gives a great effort, then it is a clear decision in my mind.
dub
If you think I am concerned about impressing you I am not-- Respect is earned not garnered by being a virtual poster, even though you may think so--
UGH yourself--just stating the facts as they are
If you think I am concerned about impressing you I am not-- Respect is earned not garnered by being a virtual poster, even though you may think so--
UGH yourself--just stating the facts as they are
Getting back to the original question "To Cut, Or Not to Cut", I'm with the posters that say select your team based on the best talent that tried out... period!
Not selecting your players based on skills and attitude related to baseball to me just sends the wrong message. You want to have a reputation of cutting a kid, who you admit is a better player, this year because of where he will/might be next year? So what exactly does that mean. Are you committing to keeping the lesser talented kid on the team for multiple years? What happens next year if YOU get the stud transfer? Do you stick with the original team of players because of your commitment to development and not select the stud kid? What if his parent is in the service and he MIGHT also be gone the following year? Duh, where does it stop. Are you going for the crystal ball approach of selecting a team? Of course not. IMO you re-evaluate the talent you have each year and put the best team on the field, regardless of level!
Not selecting your players based on skills and attitude related to baseball to me just sends the wrong message. You want to have a reputation of cutting a kid, who you admit is a better player, this year because of where he will/might be next year? So what exactly does that mean. Are you committing to keeping the lesser talented kid on the team for multiple years? What happens next year if YOU get the stud transfer? Do you stick with the original team of players because of your commitment to development and not select the stud kid? What if his parent is in the service and he MIGHT also be gone the following year? Duh, where does it stop. Are you going for the crystal ball approach of selecting a team? Of course not. IMO you re-evaluate the talent you have each year and put the best team on the field, regardless of level!
Dub - this thread is starting to take a turn for the worse. I do want to say I've enjoyed picking your brain over this matter though. You have truly made me think on this quite a bit.
As for whether he knows and is not on 100% then I would have to favor the kid but if he's got all these friends on the other team that makes me think he's good with the move. Another question I have is what feeder school did this kid go to before he entered high school? My thinking is each high school has it's own feeder school. Did he go to the feeder school of the high school he's currently at or did he go to the feeder school of the school he's transferring to? I don't know but this whole scenario is just perplexing me.
I've seen many kids try out who didn't care over the years - they might think their feet don't stink, parents want it more than they do, the kid is a bum or whatever. I've seen a lot of crazy things over the years in terms of tryouts.
As for whether he knows and is not on 100% then I would have to favor the kid but if he's got all these friends on the other team that makes me think he's good with the move. Another question I have is what feeder school did this kid go to before he entered high school? My thinking is each high school has it's own feeder school. Did he go to the feeder school of the high school he's currently at or did he go to the feeder school of the school he's transferring to? I don't know but this whole scenario is just perplexing me.
I've seen many kids try out who didn't care over the years - they might think their feet don't stink, parents want it more than they do, the kid is a bum or whatever. I've seen a lot of crazy things over the years in terms of tryouts.
quote:Originally posted by TRhit:
And yes I have never met an umpire , except one group in RI, that I would sit down for a drink with. I have an utter distate for most of them and I am not ashamed to admit it--
Honesty at last.
quote:I would truly like to bring you to RI and let the guys I use there teach you a thing or two---they do 45 games in 4 days and in all the years I have been doing the event not one team has complained about them--in fact they compiment me on them
The number of games an association covers says nothing about its level of performance. I have worked tournaments that involved over 60 games in 4 days and was handled by a single association. Still meaningless.
But, it wouldn't surprise me if I learned something from another association. I believe every umpire can learn something or improve his performance regardless of his current level of performance or ball worked.
That's why I attend NCAA clinics and Pro clinics or camps every year. My son, a double AA MiLB umpire, teaches me something every year.
When I think I can no longer get better, I'll retire.
I am absolutely amazed at the responses this post has garnered, and while I think it has gone astray into some personal attacks between posters that don't need to happen, I still think there are some valid points being made.
I will say this to a couple of posts: Dub-L-Play, you are entitled to your opinion of me. But I don't really appreciate your attacks on me, impugning my motives and my religious beliefs. "You know it is wrong, and if you don't you should. You see HS sports is about the players, not the Coach. That is where you and I differ." Really? This is what you KNOW about me from me posting this question and reflecting on the options? Well, certainly is a good thing that you aren't as judgmental as I apparently am.
"You know deep down what you're doing is not in line with the Catholic philosophy, or just a sense of decency towards this kid." Please feel free to quote that philosophy for me.
'Are you going to tell him why he was cut? or Are you going to say he wasn't good enough. That's what I would like to know." Maybe now I am reading between the lines, but I take that as another shot at me and that you are presuming I won't tell him the truth. Sorry, no. If he was to be cut, he would be told EXACTLY why I made that decision. I don't play those kinds of games, though you are free to create your own twisted opinion of the kind of person I am. In fact, you've already "tweaked" the situation to fit the conclusion that you've drawn about me.
"This kid will remember it, his team mates (your players) and future players will not forget it." Unfortunately, every kid I've ever had to cut "remembers" it, now don't they? And most of them DON'T LIKE IT! So what, now I'm supposed to never cut anyone for any reason because they will disagree with my reason for cutting them? I can't do that. I have to make my decision and then live with the fact that whoever I cut will be unhappy with my decision.
"Strange it is that TCB1 has no feelings what-so-ever" -- I'm not sure where you get this. If I had no feelings what so ever why would I be working through this while I consider my options? The point you are missing is that the EASY thing would be to just keep him and not worry about next year; but this has been a program I've built over 15 years and I take it's life and it's future well-being very seriously. I want to do what is, first and foremost, good for this school's program, and the needs of the individuals (mine and the players) comes in after that.
Both you and Dub-L have commented that I've made up my mind and I'm just trying to justify my decision...again, presumptious on your part and completely wrong. I am searching for the answers that will help me make the best decision when the time comes, and I am working through it slowly. What purpose is served by you making a judgment about my motives and my ethics when in fact I have not done anything yet but investigate the situation?
I am asking for no one's permission or blessing; I did ask for people's input. Feel free to give me your input and what you would do, but I'd appreciate it if you'd leave the personal attacks at home.
To feed you all some more information:
Found out today that the player in question has withdrawn his registration fee from our school, and has paid it for next year at the other school. Before some of you get suspicious, the office knows this because the school was asked to simply transfer the funds from our school to the other; which they did.
The player in question went to a feeder school that feeds primarily to the OTHER school where he will be transferring. Although we certainly do get students from that school, geographically speaking most of those kids are closer to the other school and go there. I don't know why his family chose to send him to our school. I know his mom graduated from the other school.
PERHAPS one of the reasons the young man is leaving our school is because another student, who he was friends with, transferred at Christmas break to a local public school. Maybe the loss of one of his friends was the final straw in his wish to move to the other school.
Finally, I still don't get those who say there is no question and you "just keep the most talented players"...I have NEVER just kept the most talented players. I look beyond JUST the talent and look at all the other relevant factors and intangibles. I don't think I would keep the most talented player if I knew he was involved in another activity at the same time and would miss a lot of practices and games....I would keep the less talented player who would be there every game.
Next step is to talk to the parents and find out their plans, and then determine whether their ultimate plans will have any bearing on my decision. Thanks for everyone's input.
I will say this to a couple of posts: Dub-L-Play, you are entitled to your opinion of me. But I don't really appreciate your attacks on me, impugning my motives and my religious beliefs. "You know it is wrong, and if you don't you should. You see HS sports is about the players, not the Coach. That is where you and I differ." Really? This is what you KNOW about me from me posting this question and reflecting on the options? Well, certainly is a good thing that you aren't as judgmental as I apparently am.
"You know deep down what you're doing is not in line with the Catholic philosophy, or just a sense of decency towards this kid." Please feel free to quote that philosophy for me.
'Are you going to tell him why he was cut? or Are you going to say he wasn't good enough. That's what I would like to know." Maybe now I am reading between the lines, but I take that as another shot at me and that you are presuming I won't tell him the truth. Sorry, no. If he was to be cut, he would be told EXACTLY why I made that decision. I don't play those kinds of games, though you are free to create your own twisted opinion of the kind of person I am. In fact, you've already "tweaked" the situation to fit the conclusion that you've drawn about me.
"This kid will remember it, his team mates (your players) and future players will not forget it." Unfortunately, every kid I've ever had to cut "remembers" it, now don't they? And most of them DON'T LIKE IT! So what, now I'm supposed to never cut anyone for any reason because they will disagree with my reason for cutting them? I can't do that. I have to make my decision and then live with the fact that whoever I cut will be unhappy with my decision.
"Strange it is that TCB1 has no feelings what-so-ever" -- I'm not sure where you get this. If I had no feelings what so ever why would I be working through this while I consider my options? The point you are missing is that the EASY thing would be to just keep him and not worry about next year; but this has been a program I've built over 15 years and I take it's life and it's future well-being very seriously. I want to do what is, first and foremost, good for this school's program, and the needs of the individuals (mine and the players) comes in after that.
Both you and Dub-L have commented that I've made up my mind and I'm just trying to justify my decision...again, presumptious on your part and completely wrong. I am searching for the answers that will help me make the best decision when the time comes, and I am working through it slowly. What purpose is served by you making a judgment about my motives and my ethics when in fact I have not done anything yet but investigate the situation?
I am asking for no one's permission or blessing; I did ask for people's input. Feel free to give me your input and what you would do, but I'd appreciate it if you'd leave the personal attacks at home.
To feed you all some more information:
Found out today that the player in question has withdrawn his registration fee from our school, and has paid it for next year at the other school. Before some of you get suspicious, the office knows this because the school was asked to simply transfer the funds from our school to the other; which they did.
The player in question went to a feeder school that feeds primarily to the OTHER school where he will be transferring. Although we certainly do get students from that school, geographically speaking most of those kids are closer to the other school and go there. I don't know why his family chose to send him to our school. I know his mom graduated from the other school.
PERHAPS one of the reasons the young man is leaving our school is because another student, who he was friends with, transferred at Christmas break to a local public school. Maybe the loss of one of his friends was the final straw in his wish to move to the other school.
Finally, I still don't get those who say there is no question and you "just keep the most talented players"...I have NEVER just kept the most talented players. I look beyond JUST the talent and look at all the other relevant factors and intangibles. I don't think I would keep the most talented player if I knew he was involved in another activity at the same time and would miss a lot of practices and games....I would keep the less talented player who would be there every game.
Next step is to talk to the parents and find out their plans, and then determine whether their ultimate plans will have any bearing on my decision. Thanks for everyone's input.
I hope you let him know if you intend to cut him before he sweats his butt off at your tryouts.
Coach the fact that you are asking for advice about this situation tells me you indeed have a heart and you want to make a decision that you feel right about. Of course you want to send the right message to your players in your program and all those that aspire to play in it one day. You want them to know that loyalty to the program and putting in your time is very important. And you don't want them to think that you will cut a kid that will be loyal to the program and keep a kid that is going to transfer the next season. All of these are valid reasons to feel like the best thing to do is remove this player from consideration from your program and give that opportunity to a kid who will be a part of your program the next 4 years.
IMO if you are not going to allow this young man to be a part of your program because he is going to transfer next year then just tell him that. There is no need to put him through a tryout that is pointless.
My point is just because a player will not be in your program the next season for whatever reason does not stop you from helping that player be the best player he can be. It does not stop you from working with him , coaching him , teaching him , mentoring him and making a positive impact on his life and his baseball career. If this young man is talented enough to help his team win this year then you owe it to him and his team mates to allow him to do just that. You rise above the feelings that are only natural in a situation like this. "Scr_w it if he is going to transfer I'm not going to waste my time on him."
The fact is you don't have to cut anyone that you believe deserves to be in your program if you keep him. You show your other players in your program that you are bigger than this situation and you care about every player even if they don't intend to be in your program the next season.
I have helped many players from opposing teams over the years. They don't play for me. I am not their coach. But they are a baseball player and I am a baseball coach. And that is all that really matters. You help them anyway you can and you rise above these petty politics. Coach this is just my opinion and regardless of what you decide to do I wish you well.
IMO if you are not going to allow this young man to be a part of your program because he is going to transfer next year then just tell him that. There is no need to put him through a tryout that is pointless.
My point is just because a player will not be in your program the next season for whatever reason does not stop you from helping that player be the best player he can be. It does not stop you from working with him , coaching him , teaching him , mentoring him and making a positive impact on his life and his baseball career. If this young man is talented enough to help his team win this year then you owe it to him and his team mates to allow him to do just that. You rise above the feelings that are only natural in a situation like this. "Scr_w it if he is going to transfer I'm not going to waste my time on him."
The fact is you don't have to cut anyone that you believe deserves to be in your program if you keep him. You show your other players in your program that you are bigger than this situation and you care about every player even if they don't intend to be in your program the next season.
I have helped many players from opposing teams over the years. They don't play for me. I am not their coach. But they are a baseball player and I am a baseball coach. And that is all that really matters. You help them anyway you can and you rise above these petty politics. Coach this is just my opinion and regardless of what you decide to do I wish you well.
Bobblehead...as I'm trying to accumulate all the information to make a decision, yes, if I decide that he won't make the team BECAUSE he is transferring, I would make that clear to his parents and him.
Coach May,thanks for the kind words. I have always been a coach who kept kids that, in my opinion, most other coaches might not keep. They were "under-talented" but they were hard working and s****** and their inclusion on the team did not reduce anyone elses playing time or make us feel like we had too many kids on the team. That really is MY ONLY concern in this situation (despite the protestaions of posters like Dub and Jimmy, who seem convinced that I have an ulterior motive,and some shocking lack of scruples)
Don't you find it interesting, May, that the same posters who say I am not acting in a Christian/Catholic way and say I have no morals and poor ethics, are the same ones who keep saying: IF HE'S TALENTED YOU KEEP HIM. YOU ALWAYS KEEP THE TALENT, etc?.......Whereas, I think I look at the big picture and try to keep the kids I feel I can RELY on in the future. Can I predict the future? OF course not. But that really is one of the things you have to look at, especially with Freshmen.
Despite what some have said, I think you have to consider MORE than just picking the 15 most TALENTED freshmen. I've found that the majority of kids are not, AS SENIORS, what they were as FRESHMEN....some of the big studs as Frosh were just that because they were bigger and stronger and more mature than the other kids. Some of the smaller weaker players get bigger and surpass those who were physically more mature. So yes, I try to look at those things that don't tend to change as much: work ethic, reliability, stability, good grades, etc......not IN PLACE of talent, but as a very important factor.
And I still consider a kid who can ONLY contribute his Freshman year as one who is inherently not as helpful to me as a kid who can play for all 4 years....doesn't mean I will cut that kid, but I think you are short-sighted for not considering ALL the factors of what a kid brings to your program
As for another question...if I told my AD that I was going to leave, and he felt it was best to get rid of me now because he felt is was best for the program, I might disagree, but I would understand and would accept that it was just an advance choice on what was going to happen anyway. Heck, I make less than $1000 a year as a head coach! It might even be profitable for me to get fired!
Coach May,thanks for the kind words. I have always been a coach who kept kids that, in my opinion, most other coaches might not keep. They were "under-talented" but they were hard working and s****** and their inclusion on the team did not reduce anyone elses playing time or make us feel like we had too many kids on the team. That really is MY ONLY concern in this situation (despite the protestaions of posters like Dub and Jimmy, who seem convinced that I have an ulterior motive,and some shocking lack of scruples)
Don't you find it interesting, May, that the same posters who say I am not acting in a Christian/Catholic way and say I have no morals and poor ethics, are the same ones who keep saying: IF HE'S TALENTED YOU KEEP HIM. YOU ALWAYS KEEP THE TALENT, etc?.......Whereas, I think I look at the big picture and try to keep the kids I feel I can RELY on in the future. Can I predict the future? OF course not. But that really is one of the things you have to look at, especially with Freshmen.
Despite what some have said, I think you have to consider MORE than just picking the 15 most TALENTED freshmen. I've found that the majority of kids are not, AS SENIORS, what they were as FRESHMEN....some of the big studs as Frosh were just that because they were bigger and stronger and more mature than the other kids. Some of the smaller weaker players get bigger and surpass those who were physically more mature. So yes, I try to look at those things that don't tend to change as much: work ethic, reliability, stability, good grades, etc......not IN PLACE of talent, but as a very important factor.
And I still consider a kid who can ONLY contribute his Freshman year as one who is inherently not as helpful to me as a kid who can play for all 4 years....doesn't mean I will cut that kid, but I think you are short-sighted for not considering ALL the factors of what a kid brings to your program
As for another question...if I told my AD that I was going to leave, and he felt it was best to get rid of me now because he felt is was best for the program, I might disagree, but I would understand and would accept that it was just an advance choice on what was going to happen anyway. Heck, I make less than $1000 a year as a head coach! It might even be profitable for me to get fired!
Now those are two good back to back posts.
quote:"You know deep down what you're doing is not in line with the Catholic philosophy, or just a sense of decency towards this kid." Please feel free to quote that philosophy for me.
TCB1-
Coach May was much more eloquent trying to help you make your decision. I obviously hit a nerve, which was meant more to provoke thought and compassion, not to poke at your integrity.
The Christian saying of do unto others as you would have them do unto you came to mind. I was thinking of how upset I would be if my son came home and said he was cut and it was my fault because of talking to the AD. I was thinking if you work hard at something and do well, you should be on the team. And I said that the kid will remember it.
When I said you had no feelings what so ever - I was just quoting you saying you were not angry at the boy. You even said you held no hard feelings... I think you misunderstood my statement.
You asked for feedback and you received it. Mine was never meant to be unthoughtful, and I apologize if you took it that way. I thought I could help.
Kids do jostle around in our county a bit... I've lost a few to transfers you could see coming a mile away. This year I gained a really good one. I don't cut into their playing time or status on the team. Usually it is parent driven by forces that are not controllable.
Best wishes to you all... my arm hurts like helk... ain't it great to be back on the fields.
Best wishes to you all... my arm hurts like helk... ain't it great to be back on the fields.
quote:my arm hurts like helk
You should feel my knees right now. I should have been a first baseman instead of a catcher. Stupid cold weather - Al Gore and global warming......yeah right.
My knees are the only thing holding up... my right arm is sore from throwing and left bicep is sore I guess from fungos... you young guys go ahead and laugh now; I used to...
What a couple of wusses! 
I throw just as hard as I did thirty years ago. The ball just arrives much later now.
I throw just as hard as I did thirty years ago. The ball just arrives much later now.