What I do believe is that entering Hitler into the discussion is inappropriate and out of line for this message board.
There are a lot of very good European BKTB players. Also Chinese.
The great long distant runners are African because they run as part of their daily routine. Football is an American sport while socer, rugby are the big sports which black and other races are more on an equal level.
Referencing Hitlers ideology is no more less appropriate here than racial profiling.
A good deal pf how kids develop may have more to do with cultural and social economic issues. Kids growing up idolizing certain players may tend to excel in that sport given that they have the innate ability.
The great long distant runners are African because they run as part of their daily routine. Football is an American sport while socer, rugby are the big sports which black and other races are more on an equal level.
Referencing Hitlers ideology is no more less appropriate here than racial profiling.
A good deal pf how kids develop may have more to do with cultural and social economic issues. Kids growing up idolizing certain players may tend to excel in that sport given that they have the innate ability.
Sorry BHD, there is no reason to mention what you did, period. I don't care about your dislike for Daque, that is your issue, but I feel that you are continually baiting him.
For whatever it is worth, this discussion was and should be about travel ball, and if it continues to go astray, with comments that don't belong along with personal attacks, it's going to be closed.
Thanks.
For whatever it is worth, this discussion was and should be about travel ball, and if it continues to go astray, with comments that don't belong along with personal attacks, it's going to be closed.
Thanks.
Show me where I attacked Daque.
The reference was about a belief in superiority of a race and had nothing to do with him.
I really couldn't care less what you like. I think that should be clear by now.
The reference was about a belief in superiority of a race and had nothing to do with him.
I really couldn't care less what you like. I think that should be clear by now.
quote:Originally posted by BobbleheadDoll:
Daque do you have scientific proof of you're suppositions?
You seem to draw conclusions that are not based in fact.
This is IMO baiting, the other comment just didn't belong here.
The warning was not just to you. How about getting back to travel ball?
quote:I believe Hitler was proven wrong with his assertions
How does this attack Daque?
How does this evoke a his nasty response.
TPM you never could comprehend very well.
TPM: From your comments it appears that you have some authority on this board. If so, please delete my name from your roster. I want off of this board and my name removed from your files. Thanks.
quote:Originally posted by Daque:
TPM: From your comments it appears that you have some authority on this board. If so, please delete my name from your roster. I want off of this board and my name removed from your files. Thanks.
I cannot remove anything, only close topics and delete if necessary, you will have to request that from the owner, MN-Mom.
Shame though Daque, I do believe that you have some good things to contribute.
I was only trying to get things back on track, again this was a topic on the good and bad of travel baseball, but has become a ****ing match between you and bobblehead, not by your doing.
I thought Jimmy the Greek had died.
Hey Midlo theres a name for you. Ole Jimmy the Greek. I used to do all his lawn work "before he died." The guy used to leave me a big box of wine and other treats during the holidays outside his garage. I had a couple of conversations with him over the years. Strange individual does not even come close to it.
IMO BHD did not bring this on at all. He just apparently finished it.
IMO BHD did not bring this on at all. He just apparently finished it.
Dirtbags: I do not know who you are referring to. I merely was answering a post directed to me. I answered it as honestly and correctly as I could. Zeich heil!
I am Switzerland.
I guess they moved Switzerland to NC. So be it. This has been an interesting board but is no longer fun. Adios to all.
véale luego
Interesting attitudes with no platitudes !!!!
Am I understanding this correctly?
An overall National Socialist ideology is forming on this web site!
An overall National Socialist ideology is forming on this web site!
Bear
I think it is only in the minds of certain posters
How is Casey doing?
I think it is only in the minds of certain posters
How is Casey doing?
He's got his 'exit' interview, this afternoon
(and prior to the Southern League Playoffs), so I will fill you in on a separate email (rather than this place)
(and prior to the Southern League Playoffs), so I will fill you in on a separate email (rather than this place)
I agree with everything you said. I also believe that your son or daughter should play an array of sports from 4 to 10 or 11, this will help him be a better athlete and by the time he hits 11 you know generally what sports or sport he likes best and wants to pursue. My son is 11 and is now playing travel ball and I can see his advancing (wow - espcially at the plate). Question: He also wants to play LL, should he also keep playing LL or should he stick with travel ball?
quote:Originally posted by CNY2010:
With all of the recent posts, I thought I would chime in with my experiences in my son's journey.
Mine started playing organized "coach pitch" at 8 years old. When he was 8 or 9, a coach asked me to allow him to play for his travel team. I initially said no, because he was only 8 and I wanted it to be just fun. Same coach asked me again when he was 10. This time I allowed him to do it, and it was a disaster. Wrong type of coach, and my son was just not ready for that pace of tournament play and competition. I put him back in local league play and the smile returned.
When he turned 11, HE asked to return to travel ball. This time, I carefully researched a team and coach, sent him to the tryout and away he went. This time, he thrived. Throughout the years, I saw good teams, bad teams, and good and bad coaches. I strongly believe that the quality of coaching and competition that he received throughout travel ball best prepared him for high school. I don't think he would be the player that he is today (now a Varsity player) if he just played local rec ball. One of the things that the HS coach raved about was his "baseball smarts" and that he KNEW HOW TO PLAY. I credit travel ball for this. He has also done his fair share of clinics and private lessons. Private lessons are just that. They tweek and enhance what is there, but nothing replaces natural ability, desire and real game experience. So, for a pre-high school player, I would highly recommend the travel route PROVIDED you do your research and pick the right coach and team. Once he gets to HS tryouts, the coach could care less how many AAU/USSSA/etc tournaments that he won. He will care about how he can help his team win, and does he KNOW HOW TO PLAY THE GAME.
Be wary of the private lesson stuff. Remember, that former minor league or college player is looking for income. If he tells you the truth, you won't bring junior back. There are however, former players who will give you an honest evaluation good or bad. Find that guy and use the lessons as an additional tool, not a replacement for practice or real games. Same with clinics. I know a parent who has spent thousands of dollars on private lessons for her son. He has yet to crack the Varsity squad. Why? Because she confused private lessons with valuable real game experience against the best competition you can find. It's easy to look great in a lesson, but no one is swinging at your pitches.
Finally, don't get wrapped up into the whole showcase and "exposure" stuff. College coaches are not interested in players 4 or 5 years away. Showcase what at 10, 11 or 12 years old? Something that MIGHT BE, in a few years? Just have him play, play, play and get valuable experience. Better still, have him learn and play as many positions as possible. Most guys who played SS during travel ball don't even play there now, so don't get wrapped up into the coaches kid playing there. Daddy ball has been with us for generations and is not going anywhere. Also, you don't have to go to Myrtle Beach, Disney, or the Super Mother of End All Nationals each year for him to make his high school team. Keep it realistic and keep it fun and do your research. Remember, it should be HIS dream, not yours. Hope this helps.
Len Len, my younger son has continued to play travel ball and Little League. It is every Little League coach's dream to have a travel ball player on his team and will usually be selected in the first round of the "draft". Your child will have to be at a certain amount(75%?)of games to make All Stars, if that is important to you and your son. It will be frustrating to the other parents when your child misses a practice or game for travel ball and then starts in his LL game when he does show up. We have been there. You will see improvement in your child by all the practice and games...even the weakest Little League player gets better by the end of the season. That said, you will get probably better coaching and game playing with your travel ball team. You get better by playing with/against better teams. But, if you can do both timewise, do it. It wasn't until this year when my younger son, playing at the Junior level in Little League (age 13) felt very frustrated with the level of play on the field since he had already been playing and pitching on the "big" field wiht his travelball team. Also, when he missed a travel ball practice for a Little League game, his travel coach asked me how many hits he got that night...I told him he went 3 for 3 (three hits). I thought that sounded pretty good until the coach told me the other players that did show up for practice got 100-150 hits each in practice. My son may play one more year at the Junior level, and it will be a juggle if he makes his high school JV team. At 11 years old, I would try to continue Little League at least through the Majors level (age 12). We went as a family to Williamsport to the LL World Series this summer and my 13 and 15 year old sons both loved it!
The LL rule is more than 50% of the games. In the league my son came from is a kid skipped LL games for travel he was not selected for all-stars. It was never an issue.quote:Your child will have to be at a certain amount(75%?)of games to make All Stars
The number is 60% of the games. Missing LL for travel was never a problem for our league.
We are small and want the best players.
We are small and want the best players.
Our league wanted the players committed to LL, not those using LL to play all-stars. It was never an issue. Everyone was told about the league rule. The league is very successful in all-stars. Or at least they were for twenty years before the "feel good" crowd took over.quote:Originally posted by Doughnutman:
The number is 60% of the games. Missing LL for travel was never a problem for our league.
We are small and want the best players.
RJM,
You have it backwards. It wasn't allowed to benefit the kids AS, it was to get more kids in the league. Those kids that play part time still have to pay their fees, do the fundraisers, volunteer the parents. It benefits the league more than the individual player. Trust me, it was a pain in the you know what. We did it for the league. AS in LL is still just LL ball. Not very demanding and the behind the scenes stuff is crazy. 10 times the insanity.
You have it backwards. It wasn't allowed to benefit the kids AS, it was to get more kids in the league. Those kids that play part time still have to pay their fees, do the fundraisers, volunteer the parents. It benefits the league more than the individual player. Trust me, it was a pain in the you know what. We did it for the league. AS in LL is still just LL ball. Not very demanding and the behind the scenes stuff is crazy. 10 times the insanity.
You're trying to speak for the entire country.quote:AS in LL is still just LL ball. Not very demanding ....
Where I live a kid wouldn't dream of not playing LL if it's available and he's good enough to make all-stars. The other kids play Ripken. Kids aren't playing travel over rec ball until 13U. And some of these former rec ballers (their primary teams until they got too 13U) are going on to national programs like UNC, Florida and Wake Forest. Five rec ballers from my son's team when he was eleven should go anywhere from high end D3 to D1. The same thing with the state champion. Not bad for kids raised on rec ball with some community based travel (nothing more than all-stars) as a second program until 13U.
Wow! LL wouldn't have survived without your son and heroes like him! People who think like this crack me up. In our league he would have received zero all-star voters and the team would have won without him.quote:We did it for the league.
RJM.
We are in an area that is declining swiftly in LL. 19 to 13 districts in a couple of years in AZ. Our league consolidated 3 years ago with another. We are down to 4 majors teams. Everybody leaves LL by 10 or 11 to play travel or Cal Ripken. We do not have the luxury to be choosy. We will take any players. More players equals a stronger league. Ours is dying state wide.
So it does help the league. If we kicked out every kid who played travel we wouldn't have any teams past minors.
Your sarcasm isn't necessary. I never said we saved the league. Just helped to make it a little stronger along with 90% of the other majors players and parents who play travel. I believe that LL is growing year to year, unfortunantly, it seems to be only on the international side. The US numbers are probably shrinking very fast indeed. I notice how they never post them.
We are in an area that is declining swiftly in LL. 19 to 13 districts in a couple of years in AZ. Our league consolidated 3 years ago with another. We are down to 4 majors teams. Everybody leaves LL by 10 or 11 to play travel or Cal Ripken. We do not have the luxury to be choosy. We will take any players. More players equals a stronger league. Ours is dying state wide.
So it does help the league. If we kicked out every kid who played travel we wouldn't have any teams past minors.
Your sarcasm isn't necessary. I never said we saved the league. Just helped to make it a little stronger along with 90% of the other majors players and parents who play travel. I believe that LL is growing year to year, unfortunantly, it seems to be only on the international side. The US numbers are probably shrinking very fast indeed. I notice how they never post them.
RJM,
LL isn't very demanding. As long as they have everybody plays and geographical boundaries rules, it will always be just for fun and giggles. Not to mention the rules that attempt to dumb down the game and make everyone equal.
Not very demanding at all.
LL isn't very demanding. As long as they have everybody plays and geographical boundaries rules, it will always be just for fun and giggles. Not to mention the rules that attempt to dumb down the game and make everyone equal.
Not very demanding at all.
quote:LL isn't very demanding. As long as they have everybody plays and geographical boundaries rules, it will always be just for fun and giggles. Not to mention the rules that attempt to dumb down the game and make everyone equal.
I think this is too broad of a statement. My son plays both now. He is a league age 11 now but will be 12 next year in LL. From what I have seen with the travel ball around here (which the difference is 50/70 diamond vs a 46/60 diamond), the talent is no better than LL. The game is just different with leading and such. In fact I will say that the District All-Star teams in our area have better talent than the travel teams. Mainly because kids in our area play both. I think for kids it's a matter of learning the "real" game. We took our new travel team down to Myrtle beach, having practiced only 3 times together prior. These kids were all on a LL District all-star team, and had a week to learn to play on the 50/70. We played in the 12U bracket as league age 11's. We went 4-2. Not bad for a bunch of LL players that had a week to learn to play "travel" ball.
My point is baseball is baseball, no matter what. Playing travel doesn't make you a better player, nor does it "expose" you to better talent. At least not in CT. It does expose you to other parts of the game that are not in LL. Playing travel baseball does not mean your kid is a better player....not even close. Even more, playing travel baseball will not make your child throw better or harder, hit better or further. It simply gives kids a chance to learn the game past LL. That's all.
Pat H,
I think your situation is more geographical because in the big four states of baseball (CA, FL, TX, and GA) it is definately not that way. There is a significant difference in the players playing LL baseball and that of travel ball. (While I say that, it does not mean that there are not travel teams who are worse than the local LL All-star team.)
You can watch the USSSA Elite World Series for 12U and compare that to the LLWS and see the difference.
I think your situation is more geographical because in the big four states of baseball (CA, FL, TX, and GA) it is definately not that way. There is a significant difference in the players playing LL baseball and that of travel ball. (While I say that, it does not mean that there are not travel teams who are worse than the local LL All-star team.)
You can watch the USSSA Elite World Series for 12U and compare that to the LLWS and see the difference.
Could be very true EC. But I wonder, is the difference because the 12U kids in the Elite WS are better players or are they considered better because they are playing on modified field, leading, picking off, etc. Are the Elite kids hitting the ball harder or farther? Are they faster? Are the throwing harder or with more accuracy? I have never watched the Elite WS so I can't honestly compare the 2.
I can say after watching the LLWS is that if my son's team is ever fortunate enough to make it there, I hope the umps tighten up that strike zone. And you can also see that there are teams in the LLWS that play travel. I saw a player from Mexico take off toward first on a dropped 3rd strike. Obviously you can't do that in LL.
I can say after watching the LLWS is that if my son's team is ever fortunate enough to make it there, I hope the umps tighten up that strike zone. And you can also see that there are teams in the LLWS that play travel. I saw a player from Mexico take off toward first on a dropped 3rd strike. Obviously you can't do that in LL.
In our area LL didn't catch on. There is is only one team that I am aware of but there may be a few more. The rules killed it here because it is too much like Rec which serious players wouldn't want to play.
Leading off, pick offs are skills and the sooner you learn the proper techniques the better off you are.
I am sure there are some good players in LL but why would you play LL rules when you have to play regular rules eventually.
Our guys go right from the small diamond to the large on. I have never noticed a learning curve at all. A few practices and all was very normal.
Leading off, pick offs are skills and the sooner you learn the proper techniques the better off you are.
I am sure there are some good players in LL but why would you play LL rules when you have to play regular rules eventually.
Our guys go right from the small diamond to the large on. I have never noticed a learning curve at all. A few practices and all was very normal.
This has become a circular debate. I'm not doing another round. Playing LL has not prevented anyone with talent in our area from playing D1 college baseball because where a kid plays as a preteen is inconsequential to playing college ball.quote:Originally posted by Doughnutman:
RJM,
LL isn't very demanding. As long as they have everybody plays and geographical boundaries rules, it will always be just for fun and giggles. Not to mention the rules that attempt to dumb down the game and make everyone equal.
Not very demanding at all.
Travel teams are better because they recruit from far and wide versus LL being restricted to small boundaries.quote:Originally posted by Pat H:
Could be very true EC. But I wonder, is the difference because the 12U kids in the Elite WS are better players or are they considered better because they are playing on modified field, leading, picking off, etc. Are the Elite kids hitting the ball harder or farther? Are they faster? Are the throwing harder or with more accuracy? I have never watched the Elite WS so I can't honestly compare the 2.
I can say after watching the LLWS is that if my son's team is ever fortunate enough to make it there, I hope the umps tighten up that strike zone. And you can also see that there are teams in the LLWS that play travel. I saw a player from Mexico take off toward first on a dropped 3rd strike. Obviously you can't do that in LL.
At 13U my team was thirteen of the best players from the LL district. Go figure they pounded LL Jrs teams in tournaments. At 14U we merged with another travel team who did the same thing. We had some of the best players for forty miles.
Most of the kids on LLWS teams have played travel. But the teams are still limited in construction by small geography. The LL we came from had boundaries smaller than the (suburban) school district. My son played against some of his school friends in LL all-stars.quote:And you can also see that there are teams in the LLWS that play travel.
Nice try RJM. I never said anything about college. Just that LL isn't very demanding. That is all I said. You keep bringing in other factors. LL may be tough in your area, but it isn't relevant in a lot of places. Average travel teams in our area will stomp most LL AS teams. It is pretty true in most areas of the country.
Like I said, it isn't very demanding. Just for fun and giggles and playing with your friends.
Like I said, it isn't very demanding. Just for fun and giggles and playing with your friends.
At Major Bantam we had a LL team from the Buffalo area want to start a regular series with our AAA city OBA team. We had boundaries but played regular rules like leading off. Running on dropped 3rd strike , full size diamond etc. After the 1st game that was too obvious it wouldn't work. They were way behind our players.
Please try to comprehend this ...quote:Average travel teams in our area will stomp most LL AS teams. It is pretty true in most areas of the country
Travel teams are better than LL teams because they draw from a wider area. They don't have the geographic limitations of a LL. Why do pro preteen travel people have such a difficult time grasping this. If a travel team loses to a LL all-star team they should do one of two things, disband or recruit the pitcher who mowed them down.
My son's LL all-star team did not play for fun and giggles. In fact I find the comment condescending and insulting. They worked their tails off every day they didn't play. From a reps standpoint it was some of the best baseball practice time my son had as a preteen.
Some of these kids are now committing to major programs like Florida, UNC, Wake. Obviously playing LL didn't set them back as you constantly trumpet.
Sorry I struck a nerve RJM. But LL is just for fun. When kids can bat .990 and average 12+ K's a six inning game it is a little silly. When you lose perspective, you might want to check your logic. And read the posts. I mentioned the geographical boundaries. I am glad it is strong in your area. But I bet it is weaker than it was 10 years ago and in 10 more years, who knows. Arizona has grown around 3 times in population in the last twenty years and there are less kids playing LL now if you go by the loss of districts. You can really see the loss in the higher levels. You start with 15 T-ball teams and end up with 5 majors teams. JR's is about dead and I have never seen the next level play in LL. And all three of my kids played LL. The last one finished this year.
LL is in a tail spin.
LL is in a tail spin.
When I talk about LL I'm discussing the preteen years. Once thirteen a kid should be looking for the highest level of ball he can compete. The pecking order here is travel, Junior Legion, Connie Mack and LL Juniors/Babe Ruth. My son was placed on a Connie Mack roster as an emergency player at thirteen and fourteen. He called the few games he played mid week BP.quote:JR's is about dead and I have never seen the next level play in LL.
LL is still strong here. But all the good programs have their potential all-stars playing in the USSSA Sunday doubleheader league now. It became very popular in our district after I formed the travel team and the all-stars proceeded to win two districts (lost sections to the state champion twice). It became very popular on this side of the state since the team that went to the LLWS when my son was twelve played travel ball on Sundays.
At 13U I reorganized the travel team with four players from our all-star team and added nine of the best former LL players from the district. The following year the team was merged with another team. To watch the evolution of teams from 13U to 15U was interesting. Many teams folded by 15U when daddy discovered his kid couldn't play the game couldn't make the high school freshman team.