Travel Ball - not seeing the value for us

Hi, thanks for all the replies.

I think there is a lot of misconception here, especially around strength and conditioning... this is not weight lifting.  Baseball specific simply means the trainers understand the needs of overhead throwing athletes and how to build a program, age specific, to address those needs appropriately (think cressey and wasserman).  He has had some of this and it has been awesome, until his trainer left and took a job with MiLB. 90% of what he did was with bands and body weight, doing correctives and strengthening stabilizers, core and legs in multiple planes with light weight.  All targeted at specific mobility concerns whether too much mobility or not enough.

To sum up, my son is not big enough now to be an elite level player, to get elite level coaching and elite level development, yet I am expected to pay elite prices for glorified little league coaches.  if you want position specific help, they want you to pay for it above and beyond.  Very happy to sign you up for lessons at $100/hr.  Winter practices are ground balls in a cage the size of maybe 3 hitting tunnels with not enough space to simulate the distance from anywhere but mound to plate, so you never throw the ball more than 60 feet all winter.  Hitting practice consists of funneling 3 teams worth of players from T-work to soft-toss, to machine and then some live BP, get in, get 10 swings, get out, wait your turn again....oh but if you are a catcher, sorry, no hitting, we need you in the cage catching live BP. Oh, you'd like help with your transfers and throws, um we can talk to coach about extra lessons where you can throw into a net 60 ft away....   Spring consists of approximately 30 games plus 2 or 3 3game tourneys (mostly local thank god).  Outdoor practice in season, once a week fungos....  $4000 bucks thank  you.

Again, not looking for recruiting at 14/15yo, when he grows and is 17, we'll see.

I don't mind paying the money, everyone else does... I just want value for it and not feel like i'm dealing with swindlers who are laughing all the way to the bank.  And honestly, now that there are giant corporations buying up all the travel programs, laughing all the way to the bank is exactly what they are doing.

If a coach cannot work the catchers into the hitting drills I think you should look for a new coach. 

I strung a 10x10 net in my garage for winter work at home.  It worked very well for soft toss, T drills and some throwing drills.  There is a lot that can be done at home if you have the space in a yard (pop up net/T work) or a garage.  Team drills are great but it is hard to get enough work in.  Everything is a compromise unless funds are unlimited. 

@Consultant posted:

Hs dad

do you know the history of Sam Fuld?
Bob

I do now. Interesting.  Is there a point to be made or just a cool small town kid who was exceptional since grade school from NH?

Sam played in our AreaCode games, Japan America Goodwill Series at Cooperstown and graduated from Stanford played pro baseball, now VP Phillies.
Moral of story, he never gave up his dreams. Never made excuses, always learn “how to win the game of baseball and life!

physical size does not dominate the heart

Bob

Just added a link to

Navigating Youth Baseball Development and College Recruiting with Walter Beede

HSDAD22 having a newly 14U baseball player with a similar profile (catcher- average size/athletic) you make alot of solid points regarding the travel ball system especially in cold weather states. I wonder why even with good coaching why we have to spend so much money outside of travel ball fees to get development. Around here  professionally coached programs start around $3000 for once a week winter workouts/twice a week in season practices and the summer season.   My son does what he can on his own but we are limited by weather and we spend money on lessons, clinics and the gym. In my area there are only a few programs that offer more than once a week practices. For a player who is good but not elite it's very difficult. But I cannot escape the fact is my son plays because he loves baseball crappy team or good team. That is what he works for all year round. So we spend the money and try to get the best coaching  and competition possible offered to him on a tournament team as well as play on a town team for development. I would hate to take the joy of playing the game away from him. He does want to play in the college but if that doesn't happen at least I know he will have good memories of his middle school and  upcoming high school years. I do wish more travel organizations would offer more in terms of training.

I am curious what you ended up doing with your son last summer. Your post is very thought provoking.

That kind of money at 14 is crazy.  Son started playing at 9U.  Played 60+ games/year with the same team thru 13U.  $450/year included winter, tourneys and at least 3-4 different uniforms.  Team only carried 10-11 players and held a reverse raffle / Christmas party every December that raised roughly $10k a year.   14U payed $700 I think and that included East Cobb.  15U and 16U myself and a couple other guys (one a former minor leaguer) put together a team.  $400/kid both years included 5 jerseys and 3 pants (I did sporting goods as a sideline so got the stuff cheap).  We hosted a 16 team tourney as 15U and 24 teams as 16U at 5 local colleges.  Charged $450/team w/ no gate fees, no hotel kickbacks, etc) and still made good money.  At the end of 16U team was breaking up...every family got $300 back from what was left in our checking account.  15U/16U team ended up with 8 of the 13-14 kids playing in college.  In all the years my son played no coach every got paid a dime.  They were all volunteers...and out of the teams he played with there were probably 15-18 guys who ended up playing in college at some level.  It doesn't have to cost a fortune to have good teams....you just have to look a little harder

My son played LL, LL all stars and in a Sunday DH USSSA league at eleven and twelve. The total cost was about $300.

At 13u and 14u informed a very competitive USSSA tournament team with three other dads who also played college ball. We weren’t in it for the month. It was $600 for ten tournaments.

At 16u (kids were fifteen) the the kids played free for one year. We were purchased by a new baseball facility for our winning reputation. They added all the age groups.

At 17u (two years) my son played for a subsidized travel team and free scout league team. The travel team was $1,700 to travel from Massachusetts to Florida for six exposure tournaments. I spent another $1,000 on two individual showcases. It cost me more to travel to watch the tournaments than my son to play in them.

Given NPV the cost would be about 35% more today.

I know this thread is old, but it is thought-provoking, as we had some of the same thoughts as our son aged-out of his youth program and we tried to decide on a high school travel program.  What did my son gain from years of play with his youth travel teams, including 14U?  First and foremost - an absolute passion for the game.  After years of playing against other good teams and with other good players, he now sets developmental goals for himself...and has already reached some of them.  It is amazing to watch and he is learning lifelong skills about teamwork, work ethic, dedication, and sportsmanship.  His travel teammates are now his very good friends, and we suspect many will be teammates in high school.

Also, I do not think it's a stretch to say that there are a decent number of players in our area who are doing all of the numbered items AND playing on a competitive travel team.  At least that is the case in our area.

I know this is likely a regional difference to a degree, but how would a young player get the same experience without playing against very decent competition?  Baseball is very popular in our area and there is a huge difference between recreational teams, less competitive travel teams, and more competitive travel teams.  When they get to high school, all of these same players are trying our for the same high school teams, but it is more common to hear of high school players making contributions to their team, who also played on very competitive travel teams as youth players.

@ILoveBaseball04 posted:

I know this is likely a regional difference to a degree, but how would a young player get the same experience without playing against very decent competition?  Baseball is very popular in our area and there is a huge difference between recreational teams, less competitive travel teams, and more competitive travel teams.  When they get to high school, all of these same players are trying our for the same high school teams, but it is more common to hear of high school players making contributions to their team, who also played on very competitive travel teams as youth players.

The kid played on a team entering USSSA Super NIT tournaments from IDK, around 10/11-14. The year before HS at 14 when you went to these events you were facing kids on the mound who were 15 with almost a full beard throwing upper 70's low 80's. The middle school also had a baseball program the kid was playing in. So weekends 70/80's weekdays 50/60's and the kid struggled during the week. The HS coach came to watch him a couple of times and during a later conversation told me the kid can't hit. By the middle of the HS season his freshman year he was playing varsity basketball and a team that was .500 ended up one game short of state thanks to the 2-4/5 runs a game the kid brought to the table. It stands to reason the 3-4 years facing pitching increasingly similar pitching to HS level helped him make a seamless transition to varsity baseball.

It's a little disappointing to see this post. TB was some of the best times our family had together. I miss it, and even though things haven't turned out the way all the parents and coaches around us were sure they would for the kid, I wouldn't change a thing. 

So I saw this thread brought back and figured I'd give an update.

I will also give a bit of background as a lot of people like travel ball but I think many on this site have kids that are at that elite level; My son's goal is to play HS and then a HA D3.  Baseball is one of many talents he values equally.  He is not a "baseball is everything" kind of kid, but is one of the few players his age who is vocal on the field and cares deeply about playing well.

Our HS is Division 1 and every year there is a good mix of D1, D2 and D3 talent recruited from the area, to all levels of each.  There is still no guarantee he makes his HS team as there is no Freshman program and there are a lot of players in his age group that he has always played with, just a numbers game.  Travel teams in the area, at the non-elite level, ie D1 or D2 TB, our HS and others in the league easily beat 99% of them.  the top HS teams can easily beat many of the elite program teams.  I am not talking about the Area code teams or invite only Fall teams, but the normal TB program Elite or Select teams.

Games: He decided to not play for the Travel team that he had been on at large money and chose a smaller program at less than half the cost.  I'm not worried about competition because up here at the non-elite or D1 Travel team level, they aren't all that much better than what town ball used to be.  I expect them to be about what he is used to playing for.  The Travel team will only play local tournaments so no hotels or plane tickets/long drives, no useless 15u trips to NJ, FL or GA. He will also play JR Legion/Prep and will prioritize it over Travel if there are conflicts but Legion plays weekdays.  I broke down and decided to pay for a less expensive travel program because I was worried about getting enough games in especially if he doesn't play HS this year.  Right now S&C is priority over games, honestly, so we'll see if he wants to do a Fall season or not.

Practice: Besides the travel team practice (starting this month), we found a great hitting coach and he has been loving it, the money here is so worth it.  This guy often spends extra time with him, I think because of how hard he sees my son works preparing for the lessons. The lessons go beyond mechanics as they discuss all facets of hitting, strategy, types of pitchers, pitches, what to expect and when, and situational hitting, all of which is great as it helps with his catching also as they can have a two way conversation on it.  They began working on hitting all types of pitches as well. It makes the years of Travel ball hitting practice look like daddy ball cage work.  And it's great to have someone who is not me telling him what needs work.  he will be ready for HS pitchers, his hitting coach expects no less.

Catching:  A friend set him up to catch a local Jr college lefty who typically throws mid to high 80's with plus breaking stuff,  It is so important for him to catch someone who can pitch.  He does that once a week.  For years on Travel the best I can say about the level of pitching he's caught, is,,he's became great at blocking.  he jokes he could recite the alphabet backwards waiting for the ball to be delivered, I think the fastest he caught on any of his teams was low 70's.  He caught his brother at that 4 years ago and continues to catch him now when he's home.

Strength and Conditioning.  He reached out to his old S&C coach he worked with before who is now with a MiLB team and he sent a program for my son to follow, The coach was happy to do it for him Free of Charge. We have all the equipment at home (Olympic weights, bands, racks, kettle bells, medicine balls, if it's related to baseball workouts, I have it) and he works out diligently between all his school responsibilities.

Overall he's got most of the boxes checked, he'll fit in HS captains practices when they start also.

Combined I am paying about the same but what he gets out of it is light years ahead of what he had as he gets real personal attention from both his hitting coach and the coach who set him up to catch bullpens (both with MLB experience) who love to talk baseball with him.  It was a lot of leg work finding the right coaches for lessons and trying to work out other situations, next year I'll try harder for finding alternatives for the games, but hopefully at that point he is playing HS and will eventually join the Sr Legion team.  There are also some HS level fall programs that are pretty good.

Clay

I should add that because we are in the NE, and my son plays a specific position, travel ball doesn't fill the practice or training like it would if he were an infielder, where winter practice is spending 1.5 of the 2 hour practice taking ground balls.  and .5 hours catching Bullpens.  And one practice catching BP and not getting much hitting in.  If you are an infielder, I think you get much more out of travel ball than any other position.

As a parent of a catcher I have definitely noticed that catchers really don't get reps in practice. My son ends up often catching for the coach and will generally get excluded from infield practice even though he plays 3rd and 2nd occasionally.  At 13U I had to resist the urge to beg the coach let him practice throwdowns from home to second with the starting 2nd basemen. There were so many close calls over the summer that could been outs. He of course practiced this on his own.

It's sounds like you are developing a nice off season program for him. The only thing I would add is you should incorporate general fielding skills to increase versatility in case there is a better catcher so he can still get on the field. Might make the difference between making the HS team or not. My son was basically told by his coach to work on his secondary position in preparation for hs.

As far as catching my son went to several catching boot camps. Usually once a week for 8-12 weeks with a small group of 5-8 kids his age. They worked them hard (lots of reps in a short period of time) and being in a group motivated them. He improved greatly from the experience.

@BB328 posted:

As a parent of a catcher I have definitely noticed that catchers really don't get reps in practice. My son ends up often catching for the coach and will generally get excluded from infield practice even though he plays 3rd and 2nd occasionally.  At 13U I had to resist the urge to beg the coach let him practice throwdowns from home to second with the starting 2nd basemen. There were so many close calls over the summer that could been outs. He of course practiced this on his own.

It's sounds like you are developing a nice off season program for him. The only thing I would add is you should incorporate general fielding skills to increase versatility in case there is a better catcher so he can still get on the field. Might make the difference between making the HS team or not. My son was basically told by his coach to work on his secondary position in preparation for hs.

As far as catching my son went to several catching boot camps. Usually once a week for 8-12 weeks with a small group of 5-8 kids his age. They worked them hard (lots of reps in a short period of time) and being in a group motivated them. He improved greatly from the experience.

Thanks  for the suggestion, he's an outfielder otherwise.  But that doesn't practice well in winter here either. He usually splits games behind the plate and in center during double headers.  he could track a fly ball from the time he was little.