Vaccination Benefit

Hi Jay, hope all is well.

There are also protocols for players that have had covid, I am sure that you have checked that out as well.

Looks like many universities will not allow students back to school in fall unless they are vaccinated. Get it done.

I had my first dose in January. Now I heard that by the end of the year I may need another shot?

I'm sure like most summer leagues, my son's league is strongly encouraging all players show up vaccinated.

Son gets his first shot this Tuesday when I get my second one.

A lot of college campuses are telling students they can’t return in the fall with being vaccinated. This will settle the issue.

@RJM posted:

A lot of college campuses are telling students they can’t return in the fall with being vaccinated. This will settle the issue.

agreed, it will settle the issue after the courts rule on it...I highly doubt it won't be challenged.

My wife and I are both fully vaccinated neither of our kids are at this time.

Agreed.  There will be a lot of lawsuits.  It isn't approved and they've already pulled one that kids were "highly encouraged" to take.

It’s going to be a hot topic in youth sports. Cooperstown said they are requiring all players to be vaccinated to participate this year. As you can imagine many teams are pulling out and lots of complaints.

@ARCEKU21 posted:

It’s going to be a hot topic in youth sports. Cooperstown said they are requiring all players to be vaccinated to participate this year. As you can imagine many teams are pulling out and lots of complaints.

is there a worse reason to get vaccinated?

@ARCEKU21 posted:

It’s going to be a hot topic in youth sports. Cooperstown said they are requiring all players to be vaccinated to participate this year. As you can imagine many teams are pulling out and lots of complaints.

Are the vaccine's approved for kids yet in that age?  I think they may be jumping the gun.

@Viking0 posted:

Are the vaccine's approved for kids yet in that age?  I think they may be jumping the gun.

Yes, the current administration has approved Socialism for all ages.

This isn't socialism, it's business.  If a college student doesn't want to get vaccinated, find a college that doesn't require it.  If a baseball player doesn't want to get vaccinated, find a venue that doesn't require it.  If there really are that many people who don't want the vaccine, then someone will seek to fill that need.  If you want what someone is offering, you play by their rules; if too many people pull out, they will re-think the rules.

I call that capitalism, myself.

There's also social pressure.  Surely there were social (at least) penalties for being the person who tested covid-positive and caused your team to have to sit out games?

And no, vaccines are not yet approved for under 16, so the Cooperstown thing must be rumor.

I know people whose attitude is, if a have to wear a mask and things are still shut down why bother to get vaccinated. They said when things open up they will get the shot.

I got mine because being 66 gave me priority. It’s a mess now that’s it’s come one, come all. I was never worried about dying from Covid. I’m fit and healthy. I haven’t had the flu since I was twelve. Healthy people who aren’t prone to getting the flu had real low odds of getting Covid. I flew over Thanksgiving and took the train at Christmas. I went to a BBQ last summer. I had ten people over for the Super Bowl.

A friend’s wife hasn’t been out of the house for a year other to get in the car and drive someplace there weren’t people. She wouldn’t let him near me for two weeks after I traveled even though I returned and tested negative.*

I only know one person (early thirties) who got Covid and got real sick. As a prosecutor in another state my daughter is a county employee. Getting vaccinated was optional.

The last year should have been ... Here are the risks. Here’s how you avoid the risk. Make adult decisions. We’re the government, not your mommy.

* I need to go somewhere in public the day after returning on a flight. Testing negative allowed me to be in public. The foolishness of this rule is I could have tested positive any of the following ten days.

@Viking0 posted:

Are the vaccine's approved for kids yet in that age?  I think they may be jumping the gun.

The vaccines are for 16 and older.

@old_school posted:

agreed, it will settle the issue after the courts rule on it...I highly doubt it won't be challenged.

My wife and I are both fully vaccinated neither of our kids are at this time.

Remember the old signs in restaurants..."No shirt, No shoes, No service"?  

Private colleges can do whatever they want but you're right the public colleges may have an issue requiring vaccinations.  

However, as it stands now, elementary schools in all 50 states and DC already require vaccinations for diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis; polio; measles and rubella (49 states and DC also require mumps vaccination); and the varicella (chickenpox) vaccination.  So there is already a precedent for requiring vaccinations...might not be a stretch to add COVID to the list.

SoCal the difference is all those vaccines are approved. The vaccine makers can't be sued but colleges can. Any healthy person under 30 has a far greater risk from the vaccine than they do from the virus.

There is no FDA approval for any of them and you don't have to be vaccinated with any of those to go to school, even private schools that require them.  You fill out a vaccine exemption form and get it notorized.  They require a new one every two years.

I am not arguing a side just Have the opinion that it won’t be agreed upon...

@anotherparent posted:

This isn't socialism, it's business.  If a college student doesn't want to get vaccinated, find a college that doesn't require it.  If a baseball player doesn't want to get vaccinated, find a venue that doesn't require it.  If there really are that many people who don't want the vaccine, then someone will seek to fill that need.  If you want what someone is offering, you play by their rules; if too many people pull out, they will re-think the rules.

I call that capitalism, myself.

There's also social pressure.  Surely there were social (at least) penalties for being the person who tested covid-positive and caused your team to have to sit out games?

And no, vaccines are not yet approved for under 16, so the Cooperstown thing must be rumor.

Not rumor. It's on their website. They are even requiring spectators 12 and old to be vaccinated.

https://www.cooperstowndreamsp...m/2021-season-update

They are in NY...i am surprised you are allowed in. 

go here instead, it is a better facility IMO anyway.

2021 Season Update 4/12/2021 :: Cooperstown All Star Village | 12U Family Baseball Resort & Tournament Summer Camp

@ARCEKU21 posted:

Not rumor. It's on their website. They are even requiring spectators 12 and old to be vaccinated.

https://www.cooperstowndreamsp...m/2021-season-update

Wow, well, obviously they don't know what they're talking about!

@Stuckinnewengland posted:

SoCal the difference is all those vaccines are approved. The vaccine makers can't be sued but colleges can. Any healthy person under 30 has a far greater risk from the vaccine than they do from the virus.

Please please PLEASE provide the science and studies backing your claim re: under 30 vaccination risks. Pretty please. With sugar on top.

2021 got vaccinated. We waited months to “let them play”—don’t want a bad illness or the excuse of “contact tracing” to derail the short high school season for 14 days. Same thought for collegiate league that is only weeks long. Oh, and we were at the Angels game Saturday night that got canceled thanks to Twins contact tracing   >

No politics—just want our son to get to play baseball again!

College already require lots of extra vaccinations (meningitis, mumps, whooping cough, etc) for students to attend. I think most college students would trade the very very small risks of a vaccine for a “real” college experience. I know that my students are getting vaccinated as fast as they can, particularly the spring sports players. The Cooperstown website does acknowledge that no vaccines are currently  available for kids 12-15, so their requirement for this age doesn’t apply yet.

@Fan2024 posted:

College already require lots of extra vaccinations (meningitis, mumps, whooping cough, etc) for students to attend. I think most college students would trade the very very small risks of a vaccine for a “real” college experience. I know that my students are getting vaccinated as fast as they can, particularly the spring sports players. The Cooperstown website does acknowledge that no vaccines are currently  available for kids 12-15, so their requirement for this age doesn’t apply yet.

Again, none of those are required.  You always have the option to get an exemption, and it just requires a form from the state that you have a notary sign. I think a lot of students would like to have the choice as to whether or not to put an unapproved vaccine in their body.  Having a normal college experience isn't an either or in regards to getting a vaccine.

Sounds like the courts are going to be busy. Medical exemptions are actually pretty hard to get (doc got to sign off on it), but religious exemptions is a completely different animal. I'm curious to see how this one ends up. Either way, it will be good times for lawyers.

Always is!!

Thing about lawyers is you hate them until you need them...then you still hate them but need them!!

@ARCEKU21 posted:

It’s going to be a hot topic in youth sports. Cooperstown said they are requiring all players to be vaccinated to participate this year. As you can imagine many teams are pulling out and lots of complaints.

The problem is cooperstown is a tournament for 12U teams, as of this time there is not a vaccine available for 12 year olds.  Our home town team pulled out because thats alot of money to risk for something that may not be available for you....

@SoCal OG posted:

... as it stands now, elementary schools in all 50 states and DC already require vaccinations for diphtheria, tetanus, and pertussis; polio; measles and rubella (49 states and DC also require mumps vaccination); and the varicella (chickenpox) vaccination.  So there is already a precedent for requiring vaccinations...

Huh... sounds like we, as a country, have done some pretty good things with these types of serious illnesses, pandemics, diseases, etc.  Hard to imagine the countless deaths and debilitating illnesses that have been spared since some of these have been put in place.  Add to that the heavy restriction and warnings about smoking which have saved many more millions of lives.  (I only wish, for my parents and grandparents sake, the smoking part would have happened sooner.)

There have certainly been mis-steps and I will often be quick to point out what I believe to be over-steps along the way.  But, historically, government actions in times of significant medical and safety emergencies/catastrophes has often been very effective and beneficial overall.

@baseballhs posted:

...I think a lot of students would like to have the choice as to whether or not to put an unapproved vaccine in their body.  Having a normal college experience isn't an either or in regards to getting a vaccine.

Which unapproved vaccine are you referring to?

@SoCal OG posted:

Which unapproved vaccine are you referring to?

All of the Covid vaccines, that are approved for emergency use.  There hasn't even been time to look at possible long term side effects.  I am perfectly fine with anyone who wants to have one, getting it, not at all ok with being told I have to.

@baseballhs posted:

All of the Covid vaccines, that are approved for emergency use.  There hasn't even been time to look at possible long term side effects.  I am perfectly fine with anyone who wants to have one, getting it, not at all ok with being told I have to.

While we dont have a long history with these specific vaccines (Moderna & Pfizer), we do have decades of research on mRNA.  This research has already shown mRNA poses almost no long term effects.  This is good enough for me.

By the way I'm not trying to persuade you or change your mind.  I'm comfortable with the available information and believe the risks (extremely slim) outweigh the negatives.  

I haven't found decades of positive result studies with mRNA...you might have sources you can share.  Articles from 2017 show that Moderna was failing with mRNA and was close to abandoning it.  Another journal article from March of 2019 stated that "Although mRNA vaccine technology has still not extensively tested in humans, publications of preclinical and early clinical tests have emerged in recent years, in which promising results were reported."Front. Immunol., 27 March 2019.

Again, there are people who are going to be comfortable with the amount of testing or believe the potential benefit outweighs the risk. That is fine.  It is also not unreasonable at all to feel that more testing needs to be done and mandating a vaccine that hasn't been tested in the same way that others have is a big issue. I trust my immune system at this point.

@old_school posted:

Always is!!

Thing about lawyers is you hate them until you need them...then you still hate them but need them!!

My favorite is the class action lawsuit. The law firm gets 10M after expenses. 10M customers get a $1 each. In the Vidio settlement I got a whole $50.

@cabbagedad posted:

Huh... sounds like we, as a country, have done some pretty good things with these types of serious illnesses, pandemics, diseases, etc.  Hard to imagine the countless deaths and debilitating illnesses that have been spared since some of these have been put in place.  Add to that the heavy restriction and warnings about smoking which have saved many more millions of lives.  (I only wish, for my parents and grandparents sake, the smoking part would have happened sooner.)

There have certainly been mis-steps and I will often be quick to point out what I believe to be over-steps along the way.  But, historically, government actions in times of significant medical and safety emergencies/catastrophes has often been very effective and beneficial overall.

Covid should have been ... Here are the risks. Here’s how you avoid the risks. Now be an adult.

@RJM posted:

Covid should have been ... Here are the risks. Here’s how you avoid the risks. Now be an adult.

Man, RJM, I REALLY wish a larger majority of adults knew HOW to be adults and we could take that path with most of today's issues.  Unfortunately, decades of repeated behavior of far too many have proven otherwise and forced the need for more and more rules, laws, law enforcement, regulations...

Drugs, crime, abuse, cheating, polluting, driving recklessly, serving spoiled food, neglecting own children, infringing on rights of others, excessive drinking, cheating the government, corporate cheating, extreme unhealthy lifestyles, etc.

And, yeah, I'd love to buy into the conservative thought that we could take things into our own hands with these problems.  But again, far too many of those same people doing the same $h!tty stuff above would also be taking things into their own hands.   

I do believe it all starts at home.  But, hell, the government even has to show 1/3 of society how to be decent parents and spouses.  And probably another 1/3 need help but won't get it or take it.

No easy answers out there.

I was curious about when Pfizer, Moderna, and J&J could get actual approval and not just Emergency Use Authorization.  Apparently you can get EUA with 2 months of data after the second shot, but full approval after 6 months; they also check manufacturing for 4 months.  In other words, Pfizer and Moderna are ready to request full approval, which the data supports, very soon.

https://www.wusa9.com/article/...00-8468-194a6e0a21a4

@cabbagedad posted:

Man, RJM, I REALLY wish a larger majority of adults knew HOW to be adults and we could take that path with most of today's issues.  Unfortunately, decades of repeated behavior of far too many have proven otherwise and forced the need for more and more rules, laws, law enforcement, regulations...

Drugs, crime, abuse, cheating, polluting, driving recklessly, serving spoiled food, neglecting own children, infringing on rights of others, excessive drinking, cheating the government, corporate cheating, extreme unhealthy lifestyles, etc.

And, yeah, I'd love to buy into the conservative thought that we could take things into our own hands with these problems.  But again, far too many of those same people doing the same $h!tty stuff above would also be taking things into their own hands.   

I do believe it all starts at home.  But, hell, the government even has to show 1/3 of society how to be decent parents and spouses.  And probably another 1/3 need help but won't get it or take it.

No easy answers out there.

So the dumb ones don’t make it. It’s the culling of the herd.

https://fb.watch/50w7xsPv89/

@baseballHS,

sorry for slow reply - busy at work today. I did some poking around, and it doesn't seem like every college allows those vaccine waivers you mention. I checked Penn State and U Penn -- Penn State (public) does allow any student to choose to waive vaccines, but U Penn (private) only allows medical and religious waivers, not the more generic waiver you describe. I'm guessing that these rules vary by state, and also by education level (K-12 vs Higher Education). My native state of CA only allows medical waivers for K-12 vaccines. Bottom line --  young folks with strong feelings about vaccines would need to check the policies of the specific colleges they are considering.